Why not regular light bulbs instead of T8/12

[kmacht]

I am getting ready to start wiring the lights in my garage. It is 24x24 with an 8.5' ceiling downstairs and a gembral roof upstairs. I was originally going to put in a bunch of 4' fixtures but then noticed going down the aisle at HD today that you can still buy the ceramic type fixtures that fit on top of a electrical box and use a regular light bulb. These things were cheap at about $1.50 each. The 4' fixtures were $17 each. I could put in a heck of a lot of 1 bulb fixtures for the cost of one 4' fixture. Any reason not to do this? I could still do the energy savings thing down the road by putting in flourescent bulbs instead of incandescant. Thoughts?

Keith

 

[csp]

What's your time worth installing all of those boxes and wiring it up?

How will it look with a crapload of incandescent bulbs sticking out of the ceiling?

The incandescents won't put out the nice white light that the flourescents do either.

In the long run they will cost you more.

 

[kbs2244]

The argument is more even light distribution and lower electric usage with fluorescents.
But how much time do you spend in the shop?
The lower electric consumption means something in a store or factory where the lights are on 16 to 24 hours a day for days on end.
But if you are only out there for 2 or 3 hours a day I doubt the ROI is there.

And, with enough bulbs you can get pretty even distribution.
Look at all the High Intensity lighting in warehouses and factories.
Those are single bulb installs.

What you are describing is the way in was done for generations.
And it seemed to work.
I would get the screw in reflectors that go between the fixture and the bulb.
They work real well.

 

[bobadame]

I have 39 of those small keyless fixtures in my ceiling. Each one has a 23 watt compact florescent "bulb" that gives off light equivalent to a 100 watt incandescent. These fixtures are arranged into 9 individual circuits which let me dump a lot of light into the area I'm working in. They were cheap and easy to install, don't cost much to run and they put out a lot of light. With the individual fixtures I also have the option of using different wattage bulbs if I want more or less light in an area. So far I'm very happy with the way it all worked out. The size of the room is 39" x 63" with side walls 10' high tapering up to 13' in the center bay.

With electricity at 10 cents per kilowatt hour, each circuit costs about a penny /hour to run. That's light equivalent to 4.3, 100 watt incandescents at about 1/4 the cost/circuit.

 

[Gary S]

Incandescent lamps are power hogs and generate a lot of unneeded heat in the summer.
This might not be an issue for you, but the CFLs I've bought aren't low temperature rated and work poorly in the winter IF they light at all. The 4' and 8' tubes can be had with 0 degree F and -20 degree F ratings and they do work at low temperatures.
So, for me, the 4' tubes ended up being my best choice.

 

[Falcon67]

If I read right, incandescent bulbs are on their way out. Meaning not long until you can only get CFLs.

Also two things - heat and power consumption. Remember the Easy Bake Oven used a light bulb, you'd be building a big heater.

 

[oldgoat]

In my garage with 9ft ceiling I put in outlets in the ceiling so that I could move fixtures around if I found I didn't like the lighting there. Also it makes it so that I can put a drop cord that is out of the way. I have three rows of 4ft fixtures in the garage and have each row on a switch so that I can just turn on what I want. Like was said though incandescent bulbs are going away. I have CFL in all my fixtures in the house so far and I have seen 23 watt CFL for outside light fixtures. I might try some of them in the garage and see if I like it.

 

[dankicksass]

2012, no more incandescents. I have ceramic box fixtures in the front working part of my garage right now, with 65W (13W) CFL bulbs in them. They are disappointing, but there are only four of them. I'm sure in the 70s when the garage was rewired somebody thought that was sufficient... working light comes from "500W" CFL work lamps and 26W CFL drop lights. I need to rewire the whole garage, but it's one project at a time right now.

 

[drcheap]

The argument is more even light distribution and lower electric usage with fluorescents.

This is something that will be a significant factor.

In a room that size you won't be putting a whole ton of those cheap sockets (well you could, but it would look silly), so you are going to have a handful of point light sources. This means a lot of shadows, which are really annoying.

It was for this reason that I went with 10 4ft T8 dual tube fixtures for my space which is about 20'x35'. I split it into two circuits, 3 fixtures & 7 fixtures respectively. So I can go with "enough light to see" or "a fairly bright amount of light" or "holy **** that's a lot of light" as needed.

 

[z28toz06]

I temped my garage with chicken lamps. ceiling is 11 to 16 feet high. I will eventually use 8 foot fixtures of some sort, but I have to say with 4 chicken lamps with 300 watt (equivalent) CFL'S in them it's F'n bright!

So bright in fact that I was considering just using the cfl's in fixtures. It wouldn't really be any different than using low bay Metal Halides really, except a lot cooler and cheaper to run.

 

[Greatbear]

For a work area, such lighting is not practical. Even if you install CFL lights in the sockets for energy savings, the main issue with such lighting is that it's point-source. Despite placing a gridwork of ceramic sockets and lamps, each fixture will tend cause shadows to be cast in every direction there is a light. The advantage of tubular (4 or 8 ft) fluorescents is that the point-sourcing of light is minimized, casting an even amount of light over a far greater area per lamp/fixture. Shadowing, with a proper amount of fixture, is eliminated. It's something to consider if you plan on doing any sort of work in the space.

 

[kursplat]

i'm starting to look at LED's for garage. some cool stuff
http://www.ledtronics.com/

 

[drm4633]

i used the ceramic fixtures in the middle and angled fixtures (outside light type) on the sides. it works great. i really only need 3 of the 9 depending on where i am working.
it may not look the greatest but it was priced right.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=586505#post586505

 

[jkeyser14]

i'm starting to look at LED's for garage. some cool stuff
http://www.ledtronics.com/

Compare lumens per watt of a LED fluorescent replacement bulb to a regular fluorescent bulb and you'll be disappointed. Regular t8's are much cheaper to run than LEDs for the same light output, even after factoring the difference in expected life.

 

[gatchel]

If you ae going to use LED's you might want to look at cree's LED products. Much better color and quality IMHO.

 

[kbs2244]

Wasn't the orginal question was about ROI?
I haven't seen that adressed.

 

[djb2]

Compare lumens per watt of a LED fluorescent replacement bulb to a regular fluorescent bulb and you'll be disappointed. Regular t8's are much cheaper to run than LEDs for the same light output, even after factoring the difference in expected life.

I'll point out that "white" LEDs are really using the same approach as fluorescent tubes. The only difference is starting with UV from a LED instead of UV from a gas discharge. Since UV LEDs aren't especially efficient when driven hard and reflected UV light isn't used on the "other side", the gas discharge tubes win for overall efficiency.

The reason LED lights can win for efficiency is that they are inherently directional. If you only want a cone of light, e.g. for task lighting, they win by not generating light in other directions.

 

[LEVE]

I was originally going to put in a bunch of 4' fixtures but then noticed going down the aisle at HD today that you can still buy the ceramic type fixtures that fit on top of a electrical box and use a regular light bulb. These things were cheap at about $1.50 each.

Here's my lighting configuration FWIW.

I had originally considered 4' florescent boxes for my 1100sqft garage. I bought four, four foot square boxes (4 2' tubes) and four, eight foot long boxes (4 4' tubes) off Craigs list. None of the boxes came with lamps, though were tested and working. When the electrical inspector came to inspect the wiring he sarcastically said: "Think you got enough lights here?" I had six ceiling lights on two switched circuits. I said: "No, I'm planning on adding more." I like light when I'm working on a car.

I've used them in the past a always like the light they put out. I was going to overkill on the light. As I was musing over installing these boxes a friend came over and mentioned those little ceramic light bases. He suggested using those, along with CFL's would cost less than what would be needed to install the flourcent boxes and buy good tubes for them... as well as cut down on electrical costs. He explained the downside to the CFL's were that that had a small "warm up" period before they put out full light.

I went down to HD and purchased nine of those bases along with CFL's and installed them. It took less time, money and hassle than the long tube florescent boxes. The first time, at night, that I switched them on I was impressed. It was like daylight in that garage. It's been over a year now and I'm very satisfied with them.

One of the long 8' tube florescent boxes was mounted on the end of one of my shelves in the maintenance bay. It shines light where the engine would be being worked on. A second box 4' box is mounted on a cheap Harbor Freight hand truck. I can move that box anywhere I want where the hand truck will fit. It's nice to have. I use another of the long tube boxes (4 4' tubes) as a source of light when I'm working on the underside of the vehicles. I slip it under the vehicle when it's up on jack-stands. It easily bathes most of the underside in good light and I'm not always staring at the drop light.

I also was going through drop light bulbs (Heavy duty...not the normal bulbs) like water as I am always dropping that dang light. I switched the bulb to a CFL... and haven't had an issue since. The drop light is now much more robust and gives a more even and usable light.

I have 10' ceilings and built a tire storage rack over my workbench. On the underside of that rack I have installed three of those ceramic bases and CFL's that give great light over the workspace.

I'm so glad my friend mentioned those little ceramic bases... a year after the install was finished I'm still glad I made the switch from the long tube boxes.

 

[Steve_P]

I just rewired and replaced the lights in my ~26'x32' garage. Previously I had ~13 of the old style 4' double bulb T12 fluorescent fixtures that were hard wired in. It was definitely not enough light. I pulled them out and put in 25 of the new T8 4' double bulb fixtures. Like another poster, I put outlets in the ceiling. I have it divided into two zones ~12 lights per switch and breaker. I can switch off lights individually if I want as they have pull cords for on/off. I bought the fixtures from HD, they're the grayish powder coat shop use ones, ~$20 ea. I did the install one side at a time.

You do not want T12 IMO, they're old technology (don't think they even make the fixtures anymore), and forget incandescent. The new T8s are great- no buzzing/humming ballasts, instant starting, ok for cold weather etc.

 

[Boiler]

My garage is small and the only light I have at the moment is a floor standing halogen worklight...yeah I know.

Well, it heats the garage in the summer, which is not good. Might consider heat from bulbs in your equation as well.

 

[sneezer41]

I pondered this for my next project, the 4 footers I put in my last garage were spotty, on bulb would not light sometimes etc. the 'sears' one I bought in the late 80's are still going strong at my old house. cfls have proven dead reliable, and easy and cheap to change. They also do work in cold weather, but with decreased output and life.

led bulbs are not cost effective yet, but I wonder on the lumens if there is an issue with the outputs. I have some 2 and 4 watt par bulbs that are brighter than their output would suggest

 

[ddawg16]

Let me put it this way....

Incandescent vs Fluorescent....you will need 5x the current and larger wire for the incandescents...and you will replace that indescent bulb about 5 times or more before a comparable CFL would burn out....the last time I looked at bulbs....a box of 4 incandescents was running about $1.50 to $2/box. On sale, you can get CFL's for about $1/bulb...not on sale...maybe $2/bulb.

So, on pure ROI terms....you will spend more on incandescents than CFL's....and that is without factoring in the eletricity cost.

If your hell bent on being cheap....go ahead and use those porclean fixtures....but a CFL will still work in them....

But after you break a couple of bulbs swinging a 2x4 around, you will wish you used recessed fixtures....

I'm running 16 6" recessed fixtures with CFL's in them arranged in 3 zones. The recessed fixtures cost me about $6 ea at HD...