Wire nuts vs Wago vs push-in

[rick carpenter]

In trying to allow better access/more space inside a box for new work or re-work, I'm looking at using Wago lever lock connectors or Ideal push-in connectors. In 2008 and 2012 threads here, these were pretty much poo'ed upon. Maybe time and mfr's upgrades have made them acceptable?

I bought me some of the Ideals today to play with. I understand that re-use of push-in connectors is a no no, but that's no big deal for me. The big deal is, if I understand correctly, a 'clean' wire is the best. That makes cutting and re-stripping wires that you will re-use for push-ins necessary. That's not a consideration on a wire nut. I don't know what Wagos like but i assume they'd like clean wire also.

Other than that, thoughts anyone?

 

[Eric29]

I have a friend who is a building inspector and he says all the electricians in the area love them, particularly Ideal.

 

[LMS]

I uses the push in's when in the same situation as you - needing more working space in an existing box that I can't replace with a bigger one. Also, once in, they stay in, unlike when using nuts if I don't twist them right.

Disclaimer - I am not a licensed electrician, so take this FWIW.

 

[Zaxxn]

Been using Wago connectors for decades, originally back home in Germany. Never an issue. Wire nuts are absolutely not my thing. In all reality, when I moved here and saw them still being used I kind of was shocked. Stay away from cheap Chinese knock-offs though.

Sent from my moto x4 using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[Stuart in MN]

There was just a discussion sometime in the last few weeks about them, I believe most comments were positive.

 

[dkroth]

In all reality, when I moved here and saw them still being used I kind of was shocked.

I see what you did there.....





.

 

[NUTTSGT]

I bought a box of Wago nuts at Menard's last fall for the utility room remodel and some rewiring in the attic.
https://www.menards.com/main/electr...o-6-wire-wall-nut/773-166/p-1444445999945.htm

I had two of the wires pull out in some of the attic connections and had to go back and figure out where the problem was. Whether it was me or a bad box that got through QA, can't tell you but what I do know is the box went in the trash.

 

[Bert_]

If your going to to use them spend the money on good ones. I have used a few on occasion but 99% of the time I use wire nuts.

 

[Dagny]

Never took a lever type apart but the push in ones remind me of backstabbed receptacles of which I have repaired many. That being said I have probably repaired many more poor connections made with wire nuts. But that isn't fair because there are many more of them.

Most old electricians have a favorite nut and should avoid using other brands or use more care in making connections with something new especially on something that draws a lot of current.

 

[jkeyser14]

The push in connections all make very small line contacts on the wire. They are just like those backstab outlets that are notorious for making weak connections and arcing. I would avoid them at all costs unless it is being used for the last item in a run and it is something low current like a LED light fixture.

I have already had to troubleshoot a few of these connections in my brand new house. They aren't worth the minute they save you on each box.

 

[ishiboo]

I use the lever nuts now, but I have a lot of the push ins in use with no issues. I pretty much only use the twist-on wire nuts for issues where there isn't a level lock solution. LOVE them.

 

[Crazyjake8493]

I'm not a fan of push-in connectors, although I've never had an issue with the ones I've used (all Ideal brand). I do love Wago 221 series lever nuts, but due to cost I use wire nuts 95% of the time. I like the 5-port lever nuts when I would have had to get 4 or 5 wires in a single wire nut in a tight area. I use the 2 or 3-ports occasionally if space is a premium or the connection is temporary.

 

[Stuart in MN]

The push in connections all make very small line contacts on the wire. They are just like those backstab outlets that are notorious for making weak connections and arcing.

I don't think the push in connectors on cheap backstab receptacles are in the same league as the Ideal connectors, they're built much better than that. Having said that, I think the Wago style is probably a better choice.

 

[matt_i]

The Wago 221s save a lot of time but of course at the cost of buying them.

I trust them, I have run my heat gun for quite awhile (a serious load) on the last of a string of 10 outlets all controlled by a GFCI and it all works without a hiccup. So all the Wagos are conducting current thru the chain.

 

[m32825]

A couple things I like about Wago 221 series lever nuts...

It's easy to make connections with different gauge wires, and also solid/stranded combinations. I know you experts can make those work reliably with wire nuts, but for mere mortals like me...

When you've got five wires going into a lever nut and you're trying to get it into the box the way you want, you can lift all the levers, rotate the connector to the orientation you want, then close the levers. Less wrestling.

-- Carl

 

[Jim greengo]

I'll stick with wire nuts.

 

[pbon]

I just wired about 30 lights and outlets using wago lever connectors. I had wanted to try them. In 25 of the 30, nuts would have been no problem due to the space. The wagos probably save a few seconds in addition to the space. I liked them. I am also just a diyer and not trying to save every penny. I’ll keep on using them and will be using nuts less.

 

[Double J]

I used Wagos for every electrical connection in my shop build. For added security I ran a small piece of electrical tap across the levers and around the back. Never know if you'll accidentally flip a lever while you're stuffing wires back into a box...

 

[PhysicsDude]

I installed a bunch of cannless LED lights and used Wagos to connect the 22ga or whatever stupid small wire it is for the LEDs to 12/14awg wire. They work really well for that. I used 50+ Wagos and haven't had any issues whatsoever for 2+ years. That being said, they are pretty pricey if you're doing a whole house or garage with them. I replaced every single outlet and switch in my house, probably similar to what you're planning on. I thought the Wagos would make it easier, but I didn't end up using any for the outlets and switches. Wire nuts worked just fine, even in small cramped junction boxes with smart switches.

I never cared for the push-in connectors. Apparently they're popular on the east coast. Maybe if you're used to them they're OK, but I'd rather use wire nuts. More versatile and better connection when you pre-twist the wires.

 

[Crazyjake8493]

One thing I'll add to my previous answer, about the only push in connector I'd regularly use are the inline splices for when there isn't enough workable wire inside a box.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/IDEAL-10-Pack-Plastic-In-line-Wire-Connectors/50101794

 

[rharman]

I'll agree with others that the push-in kind seem iffy - just like back stabs.

I bought various combos of the WAGO (2,3,5 conductor) - I think the 20 pack of each - some time ago. I've tried to use them and they just never seem like the right solution. Pretty bulky and I just can't convince myself to trust them.

Wire nuts for me...

 

[kaffine]

I have just started using them for low voltage signal circuits at work (less than 24V). So far they seem to be working well. Some are complaining about them being larger than what we were using. The built in test point that comes in handy for our use and one of the main reasons we switched to them. The other is we had a high failure rate of the other connectors due to techs not paying attention. I would guess around a 2% failure rate with what we had been using. So far we have only had to redo 2 of the Wago connectors both due to techs not fully inserting the wire.

 

[pbon]

Wago has a smaller lever nut now. Not as bulky.

 

[Crazyjake8493]

I'll agree with others that the push-in kind seem iffy - just like back stabs.

I bought various combos of the WAGO (2,3,5 conductor) - I think the 20 pack of each - some time ago. I've tried to use them and they just never seem like the right solution. Pretty bulky and I just can't convince myself to trust them.

Wire nuts for me...

Other than the 5-ports, the lever nuts really aren’t any bigger than a wire nut.

 

[mobiledynamics]

Wago 221.

I've got Ideal Tans, a full suite of $$3M with the extended rubber boot. Hands down Wago 221 for me if the application suffices for it.

 

[Git]

I am sold on the Wago 221 (lever) also. I picked up a nice assortment from Amazon

 

[Git]

One thing I'll add to my previous answer, about the only push in connector I'd regularly use are the inline splices for when there isn't enough workable wire inside a box.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/IDEAL-10-Pack-Plastic-In-line-Wire-Connectors/50101794

That is what I love about Lowes and their 'My Lowes" card. Those connectors looked like they could come in handy and are only $4 for 10. 'My Lowes" has free shipping, even on a single $4 item like this, and the military discount covers the sales tax. So a pack of 10 are on their way to my house, thanks

 

[rburke65]

I’m on the same train of thought, about the blade contact....just like the back stab outlets. I’ll keep my wire nuts, thank you.

 

[tonyciambrone]

I've never actually seen a wire nut fail, but I have seen poor connections made in wire nuts by people who have no idea how to use them.

Wago's are more user friendly, but in my personal opinion, a much less safe design.

I had a remodeling company use the wall nuts doing LED lights...I replaced 4 of them about a week after they finished. If there is any tension on the wires at all due to box fill/ routing etc they seem to just pull out over time. I opened the box up and as soon as I moved the nut a wire or two just kind of fell out. They were stripped the correct length. I pushed them in but they just came right back out...

I will continue using Ideal and 3M nuts in 99.5% of cases

 

[Crazyjake8493]

I am sold on the Wago 221 (lever) also. I picked up a nice assortment from Amazon

That's the same pack I ordered to try them for the first time. I just re-ordered a bunch of the 5-ports since I used those up quicker. I also picked up 3 big jars of red Ideal wire nuts for $3.50 each on clearance at HD a month ago, so I'm stocked up pretty well with everything at the moment.

 

[Matt Matt]

I use wago for low-voltage stuff. I use real wire nuts with two sided soft rubber tape, finished with electrical tape for my vibration applications. I use Ideal Marettes for medium to low vibration where I want a solid connection. I also Electrical tape them. I don’t use backstabs after having a couple problems. I learned from my mistakes.

Yes that yellow Marette will be taped.

A wire nut connection is a wire nut connection, these are crimped on, with a nut and bolt through a hole.

A Marette is not really a wire nut. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twist-on_wire_connector#History

If anybody is really interested in the original patent, I’ll show one of them too.

 

[rharman]

I've never actually seen a wire nut fail, but I have seen poor connections made in wire nuts by people who have no idea how to use them.

Wago's are more user friendly, but in my personal opinion, a much less safe design.

I had a remodeling company use the wall nuts doing LED lights...I replaced 4 of them about a week after they finished. If there is any tension on the wires at all due to box fill/ routing etc they seem to just pull out over time. I opened the box up and as soon as I moved the nut a wire or two just kind of fell out. They were stripped the correct length. I pushed them in but they just came right back out...

I will continue using Ideal and 3M nuts in 99.5% of cases

I've never seen a wire nut fail either but I have had a couple of instances of a wire-nutted connection that one of the wires just pulled out when you tugged it. Both by licensed electricians.

I always always check before buttoning up the box.

 

[Git]

I had a failure where one of our outlets stopped working so I checked the previous outlet on that circuit. The electrician had wire nutted a couple of neutrals together and it looked fine, but when I looked closer, one of the wires was actually broken - right where they started to strip the insulation off. Since the wires were twisted together, it kept the broken wire in place and would be pretty easy to miss.

 

[ishiboo]

I've never seen a wire nut fail either but I have had a couple of instances of a wire-nutted connection that one of the wires just pulled out when you tugged it. Both by licensed electricians.

I always always check before buttoning up the box.

I think this is key... installation consistency. I think both the wire nuts and the lever nuts are pretty darn reliable when installed correctly. But the lever nuts are much easier to get correct. I like the clear ones as they make it 100% apparent you've done things correctly. I use them for a lot of temporary low-voltage work as well.

I do a lot of work where I plan on adding/modifying in the future... for example I might install a 3-port switch box and only use 2. When it comes time to add a switch, it's great to open up a lever and stick another wire in.

 

[Jim greengo]

I had a failure where one of our outlets stopped working so I checked the previous outlet on that circuit. The electrician had wire nutted a couple of neutrals together and it looked fine, but when I looked closer, one of the wires was actually broken - right where they started to strip the insulation off. Since the wires were twisted together, it kept the broken wire in place and would be pretty easy to miss.

that's why you give em a yank before closing things up.

 

[tonyciambrone]

that's why you give em a yank before closing things up.

Yea definitely agree with what other posters have said. I twist until the wires themselves twist and then give a pull.

I have seen them installed wrong tons of ways... Mostly instances where two conductors are twisted around each other and one or two conductors are just jammed in there, and they come out looking straight. I know I have done it right if I can take the wire nut off, and all the conductors are still locked together.

 

[mobiledynamics]

For those not recommending Wago 221, have you used them ?

I have had two fridge circuits, and a couple others on them on 24/7 (when i did my gen panel)

Don't knock it if you haven't tried it. Wago 221 now come i a slightly larger size that will accomodate 10AWG. It's nice stuff

 

[Evan(CA)]

Obviously non of you are contractors because the cost difference between Wago's and wire nuts is huge.

 

[Crazyjake8493]

Obviously non of you are contractors because the cost difference between Wago's and wire nuts is huge.

They would never replace Wire Nuts due to cost, but for use here and there when you have to join 4 or 5 conductors the Wagos come in handy.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Obviously non of you are contractors because the cost difference between Wago's and wire nuts is huge.

You also have to take into account the time required to install each type. On a big project that will tend to equalize the cost.


As for this particular conversation, it's obvious most people here are talking about personal use so it's not really relevant anyway. Using a handful of them in a home or home garage is not going to make much difference in the overall cost of the project.