Wired door bell help- old school ding-dong

[Kuma601]

The door bell stopped working at the in-laws house so did some testing. At the push button there is 12.03V, at the chime it reads 7.04V and barely is enough to move the plunger, not even close to the strike chimes. Is this a transformer issue? From the button to chime it is about 15' of distance.

Went looking for the transformer and couldn't find it. There is a closet just on the other side but there is no access panel. No transformer behind the chime either. I tried to look in the attic but way to much insulation to see anything. The builders would not put this between drywall would they? Any tips on how to find it?

 

[The Cobbler]

are the contacts on the button clean?
transformers can be anywhere. buried over the years . here they are often on a basement light box.

 

[iron block]

Could be bad contacts on the button? Might be worth trying to place a jumper lead across the leads where they screw to the button terminals, just to see if the chime responds to that.

Edit: Hah! The Cobbler beat me to it.

 

[FredWanaker]

there is no camera at the doorbell, correct? If so then it may be that device. In the last few houses I have lived in, the transformer is in the garage, and they can go bad.

 

[nadogail]

If you are reading 12.3 volts at the open switch (push button), your next step should be checking the output of the transformer with and without the load connected. You might find a bad connection in the Low Voltage wiring.

 

[pbon]

Keep looking for transformer. As noted might be mounted to an electrical box. Could be a junction box in an attic or basement or closet. Might be buried under insulation if attic is right above, especially if insulation put in later.

 

[nadogail]

Are you reading the 12.3 volts through the switch or from line to line upstream from the switch? Applying Kirchoffs law for series circuits leads me to wonder if the switch contacts are good and clean.

 

[Kuma601]

An old school door bell, not for a camera.

I removed and re-stripped both ends of the wire that connected to the button and to the chime. The wire was fairly brittle so I wonder if age may be part of this drop for the run. The 12.03V at the switch was read with the wires taken off the switch and reconnected to the switch. Also to see if the switch may be a failing point to this, this didn't appear to be. I'll have to keep poking around for that transformer location. Checked near the panel and through the garage but couldn't locate it.

With the chime out I manually moved the plunger and it feels fairly stiff almost gritty. It is embossed to not use any lubricant so it was put back and the plunger still had the same range of travel following.

I suspect the transformer is somewhere in the attic space which will not be a fun search. May ask one of the neighbors if they have a hint as to where the builders may have placed the transformer for the door bell.

One of those supposedly "simple" tasks...

 

[rawen2]

The transformer for mine is mounted on the gas furnace. In previous houses it was mounted on the outside of the main electrical panel or in a closet. Good luck! And let us know where it is when you find it.

 

[CJ7VFR]

are the contacts on the button clean?
transformers can be anywhere. buried over the years . here they are often on a basement light box.

That's exactly where mine is. Mounted to the metal box for one of the ceramic single bulb light sockets in my basement.

Jim

 

[iron block]

One more comment about the switch:

If it is not too hard to get to the doorbell switch contacts again, try measuring the voltage across them with your meter set to AC volts. With the button released, it should read 12 volts (to match what you reported in the original post). When the button is pushed, the voltage should read a fraction of one volt. If it reads more than that, the push button is bad internally. (If it happens to read 5 volts, then that would explain the 7 volts you see at the chime.)

If the voltage across the pushbutton is not the problem, then the possible causes are:

1. You have a high resistance fault in the wires themselves, or
2. There is a high-resistance fault in the internal windings of the transformer, or
3. The chimes have some fault that causes them to draw more current than the transformer is rated for. Could be a mechanical fault. You could try swapping in a new set of chimes ($30 at Home Depot), but the new ones seem to call for 16 volts, not 12 volts. If you ever find the transformer, you might want to replace it with a 16 volt unit just to get a little more margin.

FWIW, the transformer here is the garage, on an outlet box up by the ceiling. Odd place, but at least it is easy to get to.

 

[FredWanaker]

I would not expect it in the attic unless it is very old home. It requires a wall box to mount it. If there are shelves in the garage with boxes on them, or anything that could block the view look behind them, If there is a low voltage house number outside it could be near that. Mine powers both that light and the doorbell. Typically will not be down low.

 

[vwpieces]

My transformer is also in the basement, mounted on the side of an octagonal ceiling mounted box for a light fixture. It is the closest light to the front door.
My chime also says not to lubricate. But I did need to use WD40 to free and clean up the solenoids. I also needed to use a contact cleaner to remove the WD40 after because while they started working they weren't very loud.

And 1.5 years after cleaning and making the door bell work the solenoid went bad. I replaced it because I like the the real Ding-Dong sound, no simulated sound. Sound carries throughout the house too and its a 5br house.

 

[Bruce Amacker]

We have two "dingers" because it's a big house. Acted up ever since we moved in, one day I took the time to figure it out, the transformer was a single bell unit and we had two. New HD transformer and all is well.

 

[sparky 1971]

I've seen several transformers mounted to the panel, seen quite a few others laying inside of it. I'm going to take a stab and guess there isn't a basement, which is where most of the transformers here are, mounted to a box on the ceiling in the utility room. When I was in Dallas, there were no basements, the transformers were mounted in the attic, on or near the switch for the furnace, which was also in the attic. I've also installed them in a closet that houses a water heater. It's there somewhere, and unless it was added after the fact, it will be in a place that will make sense after you finally find it.

Also, did you check the voltage at the chime while someone was pushing on the button? You won't get much for voltage without the circuit being completed. Depending on the transformer size, it should be somewhere between 12 and 20 volts while the button is depressed. If you have that much, the chime is probably bad, it happens.

 

[FredWanaker]

I had to pull our chime, clean the plungers and sprayed them with silicone spray. Instead of ding dong it is now DING DONG.

 

[mrvm]

Following this thread for tips as the rental property door bell no longer has ding-dong; it just has ding. I’ll be looking for the transformer this weekend and tracing some wires.

 

[nadogail]

My doorbell transformer is located in the same room as the house Sub Panel, the Main Panel is on the rear wall of the Garage, in the alley.

 

[sparky 1971]

Following this thread for tips as the rental property door bell no longer has ding-dong; it just has ding. I’ll be looking for the transformer this weekend and tracing some wires.

If it just has ding, and used to have dong, it's probably a bad chime, but a good cleaning could fix it. When the button is pushed, the plunger is activated and hits the ding bell. The spring on the plunger pulls it back down fast enough that it hits the dong bell. It could also be wired on the "back" terminals at the chime. Ding dong for the front door, ding for the back door. There will be three terminals, front, trans, and back. One wire will always be on trans, the other will go to either front or back.

 

[The Cobbler]

Following this thread for tips as the rental property door bell no longer has ding-dong; it just has ding. I’ll be looking for the transformer this weekend and tracing some wires.

also seen where there's rubber isolation grommets in the sound bar that goes bad & gives erratic chime

 

[Walkers]

I have seen a lot of transformers by water heaters and furnaces.

 

[BillK]

Did you check the voltage at the chime with the wires connected or disconnected ? Try checking them disconnected and see what you get. If the chime is crudded up it might be loading down the voltage.

My transformer is in the attic mounted directly to the side of one of the trusses in a box.

 

[Kuma601]

Great tips! I took a reading with the button pushed and disconnected. Will recheck at the chime. Only measured during the button push which resulted in 7V.

The transformer on these slab foundation home is located with the heater/A/C unit. That is where the builder for this tract placed them. Some homes are configured with these units inside and others in the garage. Either way it is at an easy access location and consistent to locate.

Will be going there Sunday so hopefully I find it.

 

[AP514]

7V AC might not be enough......

 

[Kuma601]

Follow-up. I had polled my neighbors how the builder here placed the door bell transformer, all were positioned in proximity to the A/C-heater. Easy access at that. At the in-laws I did another hunt going through closets looking for an access panel, nope. Called one of their neighbors who said that theirs was placed in the garage by their A/C-heater. The in-law's A/C-heater unit is in the attic. I wasn't inclined to go up there to hunt it down since they've added R-30+ level insulation so the ceiling joists are under 6-8" of rolled and blown insulation. If that was the case we were talking wireless but mo-in-law said she doesn't need nor care if the doorbell isn't working. Initial check I was there 4 hours, came back two additional times Sunday and Monday. What was supposed to be a 15-30 minute easy swap turned into a multi-day hunt because the transformer is not in a place most are located.

Cleaned the chime of 50+ years of dust-grime, stripped back 2" of wire for fresh contacts and it worked. Phew.... I did strip back wire initially but it still didn't work, Conclusion was the grit-dust in the striker was the culprit. I did the trouble shooting thinking the worst rather the simple. <doh!>

 

[FredWanaker]

if it is under the insulation it has no way to stay cool. Won't say it is a fire hazard but I would not want that problem.

Here is one way to find it. Figure out which breaker turns off the doorbell. Then figure what else is on that circuit that doesn't work when it is off. That will be a clue where it is.

 

[Noltz]

Most door bells are 26v transformers as I recall. You're way low on voltage. Mine is mounted to a basement overhead light box, buried in the drywall. Only noticed it when changing the fixture there were small-gauge wires going up. I pulled the nails out that were holding the box in and whodathunkit, there's the transformer.

 

[Kuma601]

I would not suspect it would be at the ceiling joist level though it does have me curious where the builder placed the transformer.
If I have to hunt in the attic I better do it soon as we've latley been having high 70's and low 80's temps. I poked my head up there just so see if I could spot it from the access cover but the A/C unit is to far away to see anything.

 

[Stuart in MN]

Cleaned the chime of 50+ years of dust-grime, stripped back 2" of wire for fresh contacts and it worked. Phew.... I did strip back wire initially but it still didn't work, Conclusion was the grit-dust in the striker was the culprit. I did the trouble shooting thinking the worst rather the simple. <doh!>

Old school doorbell systems are really pretty robust. The one in my house was installed in 1957, and the only maintenance it's required was cleaning out the dust and grime that's accumulated over the years (tip: in the old days many more people smoked; cigarette smoke combined with dust and cobwebs will make a gummy, sticky coating on the plunger.)

 

[sparky 1971]

I would not suspect it would be at the ceiling joist level though it does have me curious where the builder placed the transformer.
If I have to hunt in the attic I better do it soon as we've latley been having high 70's and low 80's temps. I poked my head up there just so see if I could spot it from the access cover but the A/C unit is to far away to see anything.

It won't be buried. It's probably mounted to a box close to the scuttle hole on a vertical truss support. Nobody is going to go in an attic during new construction and mount anything that low. Since the furnace is in the attic, there will be a switch for it, and maybe a switch for the attic light. It might be mounted to one of those, or the light might be a pull chain type and the transformer is mounted to the light box.