Wiring connondrum

[eeprete]

So while installing a new outlet in my basement the other day, I was was reverse tracing the circuit and came across this up in a rafter...

PO of my house installed new baseboards with 1" copper pipe traversing the width of the house within a fairly close proximity to these three cable runs. The hanger for the pipe must have moved back and forth over time creating this hazard. One of these cables feeds the master bedroom, while the other two are on the circuit that serves the oil burner and only traverse appx 1/2 the house, and I am still trying to figure out where these two terminate. While the pic is detailed its hard to tell whether the actual wiring was compromised.

An electrician friend suggested cutting and splicing with junction boxes left and right, with new romex in the middle, but said to plan long term rewiring. Someone else suggested wire splice compound.

As these cables are stapled every 10 or so inches along the main beams of the house, it's going to be a little challenging to ensure the old cable doesn't degrade during moving.

Would the splice boxes arranged like this fail an inspection?

On my todo list was rewiring, small portions at a time, perhaps I need to accelerate this some for at least some of the house.... Hate to throw good money after bad but obviously need to address this now.

Thoughts?

 

[pattenp]

The junction boxes are legal. But they need to be accessible.

 

[theoldwizard1]

After you cut the cable and gently start to lift it, wrap it in electrical tape. This will keep the outside from crumbling.

 

[john8791]

I agree with your friend putting in two junction boxes and running new romex between. I had to do something similar in my basement. Like pattenp said though they must be accessible by NEC code. If it's finished, you will have to put in some kind of access panel.

 

[pattenp]

Actually there is a splicing device for Romex that eliminates the need for a jbox and doesn't need to be left exposed. May not work well with the old wire.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Tyco-Ele...-1-Clam-CPGI-1116377-2/202204326#.Uo7quMQqgT8
.

 

[Kevin C]

I remember reading that repairing the insulator was OK, as long as the conductor was not nicked. Is it just the jacket, or are the individual wire insulators damaged?

If its only the outer jacket, I would be looking for a roll of cloth tape. Same if just the insulation on one conductor was nicked. How does the rest of the wire look?

 

[eeprete]

Thanks everyone for the replies. Really appreciate it.

Actually also had a friend over who is an AC tech and encounters stuff like this regularly. He offered to help me put in a Jbox as well, although I did install the two already but he suggested locating them higher in different spots. As the proximity is so close to the beam though, not sure how it will all pan out.

He suggested we install the job on one of the 2x6s and drill through to pass the wires. Last night, I covered the exposed portions with electrical tape, and he told me that no copper is exposed.

I also traced the full runs of what would need replacing. One line is about a 10 foot section that goes from one living room outlet to another (it appears all my wiring is through the floor and no wall to wall). The second and third cable go to the thermostat and to the emergency oil burner shut off switch at the top of my basement steps. Both of those runs are about 25-30 feet. So I may just replace the runs of cable.

I also saw those Romex splice kits, and read a lot of mixed reviews. Seems to be a lack of clarity on limits of use whether it really should be used for residential and whether or not, its a good fix to put inside walls should that be where the repair is needed.

 

[G_P]

If it is not too difficult I would replace the wires. Better safe then sorry!

 

[eeprete]

If it is not too difficult I would replace the wires. Better safe then sorry!

Oddly enough, two days before even finding all this, I had picked up the 250 ft roll of romex at home depot because the foot cost was so much lower and I figured, well just in case I need to do any new running of wires, I have it....

 

[sberry]

Pulling new wire is a good start if this is a forever house. Some cases even if it isn't.

 

[ishiboo]

As long as it's copper (it may be tinned, so look at the center), junction boxes on either side will be fine. The insulation does break down around the outside, but the individual conductor insulation holds up fairly well... if there are no other metal things rubbing like the pipe I don't think there is a safety issue.

If it's aluminum, I'd replace it. Long term my strategy would be replacement anyway.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Actually there is a splicing device for Romex that eliminates the need for a jbox and doesn't need to be left exposed. May not work well with the old wire.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Tyco-Ele...-1-Clam-CPGI-1116377-2/202204326#.Uo7quMQqgT8
.

I "discovered" those last year when I was remodeling my daughters kitchen. I was able to run new wire and connect it to the (very) old existing wiring in junction boxes.

I would also be concerned with using those with 50yo Romex !

 

[eeprete]

Pulling new wire is a good start if this is a forever house. Some cases even if it isn't.

Forever more than likely, but more importantly its my family and I in it.

Question... Since one line runs to thermostat and one goes to emergency switch, does anyone make a thermostat and emergency switch in one?

 

[joel63]

Pulling new wire is a good start if this is a forever house. Some cases even if it isn't.

Replacing this old and possibly damaged wiring would be my first order of business. ASAP.
I take it one line is for shutting off power to the oil burner?
Now is the thermostat line voltage or 24 volt?

 

[eeprete]

Replacing this old and possibly damaged wiring would be my first order of business. ASAP.
I take it one line is for shutting off power to the oil burner?
Now is the thermostat line voltage or 24 volt?

I replaced one of the lines today, which went between a LR outlet and a poorly wired basement bulb fixture. Replaced two sections of wire along the LR circuit, a few outlets and patched a section of wall I had to open up.

Plan to tackle the other two this week. They should be easier than what I had done today.

Yes t-stat is line voltage.

 

[joel63]

I replaced one of the lines today, which went between a LR outlet and a poorly wired basement bulb fixture. Replaced two sections of wire along the LR circuit, a few outlets and patched a section of wall I had to open up.

Plan to tackle the other two this week. They should be easier than what I had done today.

Yes t-stat is line voltage.

I haven't run into line voltage thermostats for residential use.
The oldest unit I worked on was over 60 years old and had 24 volt control.
If it were mine, I would change it over to 24 volt control.
It shouldn't be too difficult.
Wish I could be more help.

 

[Highbeam]

I have that type of romex in my house, built in 1963. The outer cover is crusty and crappy but the conductors themselves have the same type of coating that modern romex has. So don't worry about moving or rearranging that wire. Do inspect for damage and replace as needed.

I have line voltage thermostats all over the place in my residence, but not controlling an oil boiler.

 

[eeprete]

Thank you both. Highbeam, yes my house is '64 or so. I've really be reviewing a lot of the wires for this type of damage. So far it seems to only be in this one area with another area where there is slight rubbing as well, but not bad. Many thanks to everyone here. Does switching to a 24V thermostat eliminate that one line? My plumbing is set up so I could separate my house zones, but I only have on thermostat. Fortunately my wife likes the house cool so the heating bill hasn't been too bad thus far.

 

[joel63]

Thank you both. Highbeam, yes my house is '64 or so. I've really be reviewing a lot of the wires for this type of damage. So far it seems to only be in this one area with another area where there is slight rubbing as well, but not bad. Many thanks to everyone here. Does switching to a 24V thermostat eliminate that one line? My plumbing is set up so I could separate my house zones, but I only have on thermostat. Fortunately my wife likes the house cool so the heating bill hasn't been too bad thus far.

I'm sure it can be done, but not being able to see the circuit layout, I'm at a loss to say how you can change over to 24 volt control.

 

[eeprete]

Looks like the 24V will be a non event, my wife found a line voltage thermostat, so I will likely use that when I run the new wire.