Woodworkers vise question

[ScottsGT]

Just picked up a Rockler end vise yesterday to mount on my woodworking bench I'm building. I started with a Craftsman 24" X 72" butcher block top and I'm adding 1X4 red oak edging and the appropriate holes for dogs and clamps.
Question is, should I use a hard wood like the red oak for the vise jaws, or simply use pine or poplar so it's a little softer to keep from marring the surface of what I am clamping down?

 

[jimreed2160]

Great project. I vote for red oak because I think it will hold the work better. Most bench work happens before finishing so any dents can be removed downstream.

Check out the Woodworking 101 thread where many ww hang out. We would love to see pictures of your bench.

 

[derosa]

Go for something like beech or cherry. You want the wood strong enough to hold but not so hard it easily dents your projects, whatever you use lightly relieve the edges for the same reason. Doesn't have to be a lot, couple passes with some sand paper will do it.

 

[ez-duzit]

I use plywood so it doesn't split as easily.

 

[ScottsGT]

I was trying to choose between pine or oak because Lowes around the corner stocks it. Anything else will wind up being a search or mail order. Not a whole lot of wood suppliers in my area other than the construction grade stuff. I built my table legs out of simple 2X6 and 2X4 studs. Not pretty, but plenty strong for the beginning wood worker.

 

[gungatim]

I used oak on the face of mine, but the actual bench is wrapped with pine. I think either would work...

 

[exmaxima1]

Go for a tight grain hardwood like cherry, birch, or ideally maple

 

[rlitman]

Go for a tight grain hardwood like cherry, birch, or ideally maple

+1
Most places have maple. The maple at the box stores is not hard maple, but it's ideal for vise jaws.

Oak is an open grained wood. It may leave impressions on your workpiece, and can splinter too easily.

As for practicing what I preach, my own wood vise's jaws are made from baltic birch plywood. That works too.

 

[turbowoodworker]

I've never thought that woodworking vise face material matters as long as it is wood.

 

[rsanter]

I think a lot of people use maple.
I think that pine is a good choice and if it doesn't work out it was not that expensive

Bob

 

[visedog]

3/4" plywood is my suggestion.

 

[ez-duzit]

Vise soft jaws are made to be easily replaceable because they get messed up. These soft jaws should generally be softer than the workpieces being clamped, so that the soft jaws do not mark the workpiece. The suggestion to use some exotic and extremely hard, dense wood is not well thought out.

 

[rlitman]

3/4" plywood is my suggestion.

Plain plywood here is southern yellow pine. Structurally strong stuff, but kind of soft and rough on the surface. What I've seen happen is chips and shavings get stuck to its rough surface and get pressed into it. With a soft workpiece such as white pine (something I've been using a lot of in a few recent projects), that leaves an embossed dent in your workpiece where the chip is sticking out. So yeah, the pine jaws themselves will not damage your finely finished workpiece, but can lead to damage.

I recently found myself wanting to use my benchtop Workmate, which has aluminum jaws. I added leather jaws to it by using screw in snap bases screwed into the plastic side of the jaws, and pressed snaps into a leather belt blank. That is perfectly safe even on white pine, and has fantastic grip.

If you have full grain cowhide available, that would be a great jaw covering, though it would probably get beat up over time more quickly than other options here, and is more expensive too.

Vise soft jaws are made to be easily replaceable because they get messed up. These soft jaws should generally be softer than the workpieces being clamped, so that the soft jaws do not mark the workpiece. The suggestion to use some exotic and extremely hard, dense wood is not well thought out.

Well, from my thoughts above, I'm not convinced on the absolute need to use a jaw that is softer than the workpiece. It is more important that the jaw is smooth (imperfections in the jaw face will emboss on the workpiece) and just the right amount of grippy. A grippy surface (not smooth metal, or ipe for example), will allow you to use a minimum clamping pressure. Too much clamping pressure will emboss the jaw edges on your workpiece, regardless of how hard or soft the jaw is.

I agree that I would rule out the harder hardwoods. Ipe, ironwood, ebony, among others would make lousy choices not much better than aluminum. High quality hard maple too would not be all that good a choice. But less expensive softer maples make excellent jaws.

 

[Shiftless]

Aside from the artificial "look" (bad) what do you guys think about plastic jaws? Like the kind of plastic you see in cutting boards. Would have to be smooth and not textured of course.

 

[Stuey]

+1 for maple

The stuff the big box stores have is pretty decent. Might not be hard maple, but soft maple is still plenty hard, I think harder than poplar, need to check.

 

[ez-duzit]

The embedded hard chip problem can be addressed by insuring that the jaws are clean prior to clamping a vulnerable workpiece. And by replacing the jaws periodically. It should be apparent that too soft a wood will exacerbate the chip embeddment problem. My fine work is typically from teak and mahogany. Plain fir and okoume ply soft jaws have worked well. And I always have a supply of this material.

Plastic is a poor choice because you want to grip the workpiece.

 

[rlitman]

Aside from the artificial "look" (bad) what do you guys think about plastic jaws? Like the kind of plastic you see in cutting boards. Would have to be smooth and not textured of course.

Polyethylene (cutting board material) is too slippery. That would make awful jaws. But I wouldn't completely rule out all plastics.

I have a set of Bessey magnetic soft jaws for my metal vise. They're from a soft polyurethane material. Kind of like a boot sole. Very grippy, VERY tough. Non-marking. They would make a FANTASTIC jaw choice.

Rubber could make a good jaw material too.

 

[beakie]

what are people clamping that they need "soft jaws" as if this were a metal/bench vise?

a good hardwood is just fine, and will work nicely.

"not well thought out"
explain that to the thousands upon thousands of woodworkers over the years that thought otherwise.

 

[ScottsGT]

FWIW, I picked up the red oak last night to use that. At this point I think I'm putting too much concern into something that experience will tell me later. Easy enough to swap out the wood later if need be.
The way I see it, I can always throw in some soft pine between the jaws and the work if need be.
Hopefully with the wife leaving town tomorrow I can get this thing wrapped up! Well, until I decide to build a couple of drawers that is.

 

[pendragon1998]

I use 3/4" plywood lines with a piece of medium weight side leather. I tacked the leather on by two 'ears' on the front of the front jaw, then wetted the leather with alcohol and clamped it in place. When dried, it was formed in place and I can flip it forward out of the way if desired.

 

[ScottsGT]

I just took a look at your restoration thread. That Craftsman turned out great! I thought about doing an older one and restoring it. But damn. Prices on older used ones in need of restoration far exceeded my new Rockler or they are full of rust pitting and beyond a quality restoration by a simple cleaning up in a blast cabinet and a fresh coat of paint.
I guess Garage Journal has people snatching up any old vise they can find these days.

 

[visedog]

The embedded hard chip problem can be addressed by insuring that the jaws are clean prior to clamping a vulnerable workpiece. And by replacing the jaws periodically. It should be apparent that too soft a wood will exacerbate the chip embeddment problem. My fine work is typically from teak and mahogany. Plain fir and okoume ply soft jaws have worked well. And I always have a supply of this material.

I agree. I have never noticed any marking or embedding from the plywood jaws I use in my woodworking vise, even in softer woods. Maybe if one clamps it too tightly (more than necessary) there could be marking on a very soft wood, but I have never noticed it. Instead of frequent replacement of the jaws, one could periodically clean them up with a sandpaper.

 

[pendragon1998]

I just took a look at your restoration thread. That Craftsman turned out great! I thought about doing an older one and restoring it. But damn. Prices on older used ones in need of restoration far exceeded my new Rockler or they are full of rust pitting and beyond a quality restoration by a simple cleaning up in a blast cabinet and a fresh coat of paint.
I guess Garage Journal has people snatching up any old vise they can find these days.

Thanks!
I've seen a few in antique shops around $75, but if you're shipping, you're gonna spend some dough.

 

[exmaxima1]

Aside from the artificial "look" (bad) what do you guys think about plastic jaws? Like the kind of plastic you see in cutting boards. Would have to be smooth and not textured of course.

I use nylon in my vise dog, as it won't ruin my plane or router if I hit it by accident. Works ok, but won't grip as well as a steel dog.

I bought a wood vise recently from a cabinet shop and it had linen micarta jaws. Very hard phenolic plastic that would last forever but (again) won't ruin a plane or router bit.

 

[Stuey]

Aside from the artificial "look" (bad) what do you guys think about plastic jaws? Like the kind of plastic you see in cutting boards. Would have to be smooth and not textured of course.

Plastic can warp. I've got some HDPE flat sheets that were in indoors but not temp-controlled storage and they came out curved.

You really want some nice thick jaws. For non-marring or some conformability, leather strips can be glued on.

You also want wood that's large enough for dog holes or pegs that can clamp workpieces against bench dogs or pegs placed in holes in the bench. Makes the vise more versatile.