workbench woes...

[mykvr6]

So I spent some time this weekend trying to build my workbench. I had some 4x4's and a couple 2x4's my dad picked up from work. Unfortunately they sat outside for a bit, got wet, dried up, etc. One fo the 2x4's was pretty straight but the other one was a bit bowed. I figured once I screwed everything together it might pull it straight. Unfortunately when I made the frame for the top it ended up twisted slightly. Then I thought I if put the legs on it and let it stand up it might sit somewhat level. nope! haha. It ended up with a leg in the air, it teeters nicely lol. geez. My wife came out to the garage and saw my bench, and my wife and couldn't help but laugh. I laughed too.

If there anything I might be able to do to fix this? Or just go buy some fresh unwarped wood from HD and start over. At least I know my new Bosch impact driver works pretty good!

 

[sands35]

a) replace the warped wood
b) tweak the bench so that you add in stress that works against the warped wood
c) shim up the corner and deal with it

 

[matt_i]

3 points define a plane....so if you build it perfectly in one spot it will probably rock in another part of the garage unless the concrete is dead nuts the same all over (unlikely).

Unless you implement some sort of threaded adjuster feet (leveling mounts), I would just use shims.

 

[FORDification]

When in the garage/shop: Do it right...or do it over.

A workbench is the one of the most well-used components of any workspace. If you cut corners with it, you'll never be happy with it. I vote for getting some good straight wood and redoing it so that you're proud to show it off.

 

[mykvr6]

3 points define a plane....so if you build it perfectly in one spot it will probably rock in another part of the garage unless the concrete is dead nuts the same all over (unlikely).

Unless you implement some sort of threaded adjuster feet (leveling mounts), I would just use shims.

well I know my concrete isnt perfectly straight but this thing is definitely crooked. lol. the opposite corner is like two inches off the ground. I'm going to swing by the hardware store and probably pick up some new wood. My dad grabbed me some of this stuff but it was outside getting wet and drying up in the sun, then getting wet again and so on. a couple of the 4x4's were pretty dried up and had started to crack. I thought I could get away with screwing them down but it just tightened up crooked lol.

 

[mykvr6]

on the buying new wood front...what should I look for? pressure treated? dried? I'm just going to use 4x4's and 2x4's, I have a couple sheets of 3/4" plywood I'm going to double up for the top.

 

[Outlander]

What will it be used for? shim the legs if it not for heavy use, otherwise fix it .

 

[mykvr6]

its going to be my main workbench. All sorts of things, working on cars, fixing stuff. Vise will be mounted to it, etc. So I want it kinda sturdy, shooting for 80" long, 30" deep and about 37.5" high.

 

[garagejunkie]

uhh,could you cut down the other 3 legs to make it even?

 

[archirelic]

Start from scratch again. Pointless to handicap yourself at the onset by attempting to fix a bench that was never sufficient in the first place. You'll be much better off and more happy by starting over and building it solid & straight & true.

 

[mykvr6]

uhh,could you cut down the other 3 legs to make it even?

not really because the "frame" that makes up the top is warped. So even if I make the legs sit even, the top will be twisted and not straight. Honestly building this workbench would be much easier with a table saw and a workbench lol. How do you guys build your benchs? Just laying on the floor?

 

[mykvr6]

Start from scratch again. Pointless to handicap yourself at the onset by attempting to fix a bench that was never sufficient in the first place. You'll be much better off and more happy by starting over and building it solid & straight & true.

yeah, I'll be back out tomorrow buying some wood. Starting over for sure

 

[nadogail]

You have discovered and documented the disadvantages of a wooden legged and framed workbench.

Steel legs and frames have different drawbacks, but the legs can be adjusted to accommodate slopping or uneven floors. Two inch thick composition tops can last a long time; I acquired a used top in '76 and it is still holding up.

If I were to build a new bench, I would laminate two 1" plywood sheets together, cover it with Melanite, and hope it would pass to a grandchild.

 

[altersaddle]

Buying dimension lumber for furniture projects is always a bit of a gamble. A lot of the wood will have some moisture in it when it's in the store and on the rack, and it will dry out when you move it inside. Leaving it outside and letting it get wet won't change the nature of the wood that much, just might show off some bad grain sooner.

If you can, choose lumber that is straight on the rack and has the fewest, smallest, tightest knots. Ideally you would be able to select some clear quarter sawn pieces... but good luck finding that in a lumber yard.

http://www.alamohardwoods.com/blogs...versus-quarter-sawn/edge-grain/vertical-grain

My uncle makes oars and must use clear, old growth spruce. To source his lumber, he buys logs and has them milled to his specifications.

 

[Wooden Hot Rodder Garage]

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=498847&stc=1&d=1448258936
Mobile work shop for those sunny So Cal days where you want to work outside.

 

[KEH]

Got any cement blocks or old battery? Put weight on the high side and let it sit for a while.
Need to use it? Take weight off temporarily. and use,then put weight back on. Should be stable in a month.

KEH

 

[maxpower_hd]

I built two smaller wood benches in my basement before I got the garage built. I built the base first and then attached the top. No need for a table saw. One has 2x4 and 2x6 for the top and 4x4 for legs. It has been fine for years. The other one was two wood cabinets with drawers. That one I put a laminated wood top on. It was much easier.

The one in the shop is 16' long and is built on three metal cabinets. I used left over 2x10 for the top of that and it is nice and straight after 10 years. The key is to start with straight material to begin with. I screwed everything together too. I think it is tighter that way.

As far as material goes you should be ok with plain kiln dried lumber. Unless there will be a lot of moisture I don't see the need for PT. Plus the PT I get is always wet. I've even had it spit at me when nailing into it. If you want to use PT I would only use it for the parts that will touch the ground anyway.

Good luck.

 

[mykvr6]

Got any cement blocks or old battery? Put weight on the high side and let it sit for a while.
Need to use it? Take weight off temporarily. and use,then put weight back on. Should be stable in a month.

KEH

I actually sat it upright and threw the plywood sheets on top of it and it flattened out mostly. I left it overnight. I guess Ill see if it tries to right itself, but I'm sure I'll pick up some fresh lumber and start again next week. At least I got some practice in with using my impact driver and saw and measuring and making cuts without a table saw. In my younger days I did car stereo stuff and built subwoofer boxes. But we had big table saws and making accurate cuts was easier

 

[JohnBlack]

Maybe bolt it to the wall, the floor, or both.

 

[nh_yota]

When I built my small workbench (2'x4') I used 3/4" MDF for the bench top and the bottom shelf because MDF doesn't warp like plywood can. The bench doesn't see much abuse so the unpainted MDF holds up just fine.

 

[bczygan]

Get a big *** vise for one corner and a big *** grinder for the other.

Maybe that will help.

Bill

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

Did you put any angled framing or gussets in (front to back, end to end and corner to corner)? They really help to keep things square.
Plywood panels on the back or ends would do the same.
At this point if you can twist it back to square plumb and level you may be able to add the necessary structure.

 

[A**holes Garage]

make one out of steel

 

[KEH]

Well, it's a good learning process for the op at little expense. I agree about making one from steel, or at least make steel legs as someone said, but I don't think it's necessary to throw away the one he has.

Oh BTW, another trick is to shim up the 3 matching legs and leave the high one further in the air, then weight the bench and overstress the high leg. Might speed up the process.

KEH

 

[mykvr6]

here's a pic before I totally dismantled it. I had a 3/4" sheet of plywood sitting on top of it and it almost trued itself up. But as you can see, its twisted. The top "frame" didn't sit flat when I screwed it together. One of the long pieces was warped so it's not perfectly straight when laying flat on its wider axis. But on it's thinner side it sits flat. So I figured when I put it together it would just pull in straight but I guess it actually twisted and bowed the whole thing. Honestly I can't even remember when I cut the cross pieces if one of those end pieces isn't totally square which could also be pulling it into a twist.

Here it is:


So anyway I broke it all down real quick. My new Bosch 12v impact driver made short work of tearing it down. I screwed the 2 long 2x4's together to maybe straighten the one up. I'm gonna lay it all out again on the floor next weekend and see what it looks like and try again. Honestly I may have just tweaked everything when putting it together because I didn't have it laying on the floor. oh well, I'll figure it out lol.

 

[altersaddle]

Before re-assembling (and when buying more lumber), hold the board up to your eye and sight down it to see if the lumber has a bow or a twist.

If it doesn't, carefully check your cuts with a square to see if any are out. You can definitely introduce that kind of twist if one or two cross pieces are out of square.

I made my work bench out of found dimension lumber (driftwood) and a few planks from a buddy who had a mill. It's going to get torn apart and rebuilt a bit smaller. I used 2x6 stringers on the ends to help square them up, and used bolts and dowel pins to keep everything aligned.

 

[mykvr6]

another angle


I'm going to look everything over again this weekend. I really didn't put a whole lot of effort into really looking everything over like I should have. I was rushing a bit. I was at lowes today checking out 2x4's and damn if most of them are warped up. The 2x4's for framing, 2x4x96 studs seemed pretty straight. But all the other 2x4 stock seemed to have a lot of bowed and warped pieces. I'll really have to look them over when I pick up some new boards.

 

[Cato]

on the buying new wood front...what should I look for? pressure treated? dried? I'm just going to use 4x4's and 2x4's, I have a couple sheets of 3/4" plywood I'm going to double up for the top.

You want kilned dried - I think it is marked KL. You can tell it because it is dry to the touch. The cheaper un-dried wood feels wet to the touch. Ask the associate at HD if you aren't sure. Anyway 2X4s and 4X4s are cheap, so buy the good stuff - premium. Make sure you lay the planks out on the ground and pick the straightest and with the fewest knots on the pallet.

You don't need pressure treated unless your bench is going to be outside in the snow and rain.

I always rub some furniture wax on the bottom legs of benches or tables where it touches the ground when I'm done building it so it doesn't take up any water.

Don't feel bad about screwing up your first attempt. Consider it a practice run!

 

[mike_dmt]

Personally, I would start over. But you said wood choices are just as **** too, so...

Is it going against a wall? If it was me, I'd just pop the legs off, and Lag bolt the top frame to the wall(s).

You'll need a 4' level, 6 or 8, 3/8"x3 1/2" Lag bolts and washers.

Pick your height, (make sure the legs are still long enough) make a level, straight line, that represents the top of the bench. Then predrill the frame for lags, and then work the frame into position from one end to the other. Don't start in the middle, or lag the ends first. Start on one end, and work to the other.

Then, level front to back for the front legs, measure and put them back.

If it's still too twisted along the front edge, just anchor some simple "L" shaped brackets into the floor and the legs as needed.

You'll spend about $10 on hardware, and an hour or so manhandling the lumber into a good spot.

 

[Lassen Forge]

When I built mine, I bought all the wood a few months in advance, and put it in the (open beam) rafters to dry... turning it every so often, like once a week. The first couple weeks you would think there was a pipe leaking up there, but it eventually dried out. Looking back at all the PITA I did to make sure that wood dried straight, it seems kind of ****... but for a freestanding bench the length of one wall, on open legs, that had to hve a couple oddball angles to clear doors and walkways, it sits more solid than an anvil... Speaking of which, one sitting on one corner of it.

 

[JohnBlack]

This should be an easy fix.

Twist it back to level using a windlass technique, similar to what's done with wooden fence gates. Drive a heavy lag screw into the end of the bench on the top corner of the highest point. Then drive a screw into the bottom of the opposite leg (same side of the bench). Wrap a heavy steel wire or cable a few times between the two lag screws, then insert an 8 inch 1x2 in the center of the wraps and start twisting it tight. This whole process should take you 15 minutes. Once you have it level run a 2x4 across the same plane as the cable and screw it in place to hold everything level.

 

[pendragon1998]

another angle

Respectfully, you might want to revisit your design and incorporate some stronger construction elements. At least consider some stretchers along the base.

http://www.eaa1000.av.org/technicl/worktabl/tablefig.htm

 

[matt_i]

An idea to add to above redesign, get some flat metal strapping/banding used to secure stuff to pallets, usually fairly cheap and widely available at loading docks all over America. Nail in an "X" brace pattern on the back. Will become even stronger in resistance to racking if side-loaded. However this element would not be useful with original design.

 

[maxpower_hd]

You want kilned dried - I think it is marked KL. You can tell it because it is dry to the touch. The cheaper un-dried wood feels wet to the touch. Ask the associate at HD if you aren't sure. Anyway 2X4s and 4X4s are cheap, so buy the good stuff - premium. Make sure you lay the planks out on the ground and pick the straightest and with the fewest knots on the pallet.

You don't need pressure treated unless your bench is going to be outside in the snow and rain.

I always rub some furniture wax on the bottom legs of benches or tables where it touches the ground when I'm done building it so it doesn't take up any water.

Don't feel bad about screwing up your first attempt. Consider it a practice run!

If you haven't bought the wood yet, go to an actual lumber yard. You may pay a few dollars more but you will likely get better lumber. I go to a local place here for anything that needs to look nice and the quality difference is huge. Plus where I go they have SPF KD studs which are Sprice, Pine, Fur Kiln Dried. The stuff at my HD says SD if I remember right which means surface dried.

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

Respectfully, you might want to revisit your design and incorporate some stronger construction elements. At least consider some stretchers along the base.

http://www.eaa1000.av.org/technicl/worktabl/tablefig.htm

Also notice that the long horizontal members are inset into the legs. The picture shows 2x4s but you can cut pockets into your 4x4s. Again I suggest gussets, panels or diagonal braces to keep everything square. There is nothing wrong with the materials you used.

 

[Richard D]

What part of Houston are you in? I hate the city but may be able to give you a hand welding up a steel frame.

 

[mykvr6]

What part of Houston are you in? I hate the city but may be able to give you a hand welding up a steel frame.

thanks for the thought! I'm in Spring. Complete opposite side of town from where you are.

I'm going to give it another go. I like the plans above. I planned on having some more pieces on the top that go between the front and back long edges as well as braces around the bottom I just didn't go that far since I was having issues. I want to have lower bracing and a lower shelf as well. I just need to make sure the thing is going together square. I'll give it another whirl this weekend if I have time or on my next 4 day weekend. Thanks for all the help and ideas guys!

 

[bczygan]

A rigid structure is all about triangles.

You need to triangulate all three axis of the structure. This can be done in the joints, but it is easier to do with the entire structure.

The easiest way to get big triangles into a structure is with sheet goods.

You do this when you attach a top to a bench. You square it up and attach the top and the top resists racking in the frame in one dimension.

You can do the same thing in the other two dimensions easily with plywood gussets. An even easier way is to just sheet the sides and back with plywood.

You could add a lower frame, as mentioned above, and install a plywood shelf on it for more rigidity near the floor, and then leave the front of the box open for access. Doesn't have to be neat or fancy and no joinery needed. Just fasten the sheets of plywood onto the legs.

Try it.

Glue and screw them onto the frame.

You will have a very rigid and lightweight workbench.

Bill

 

[MarkG]

Well, it's been pretty much covered now, but 'racking' is the problem you'll always have unless you cross-brace them or 'triangulate' is another word.

Even with the lower supports that 'Leaf' showed, you'll still get racking. You need braces going diagonal, or alternatively (what I like to do) screw a sheet of plywood across the whole back to the legs. This will serve the same purpose and give you a back that will keep stuff from falling off the back of your lower shelf as well. If front to back racking is still a problem, you can use 1 x 4 cross bracing. If you get down there by the legs and picture exactly what goes on when the bench 'racks', it will become very clear how cross bracing is so effective!

 

[bczygan]

Here is a fancied up drawing with extra framing inside, but frankly, as mentioned above, just slapping on a piece of plywood, to the sides and back, will keep everything aligned. The plywood doesn't even have to neatly meet at the corners. The legs can show, or the plywood can run past one way or the other. It's really a triangulating brace.

Wooden Hot Rodder Garage has another fancy example above, but it is really the sheeting that does the job. It doesn't even have to go all the way down.