Workshop/Garage receptacles for battery tender, wall warts, etc.

[joseywales]

I'm having a 100AMP subpanel added to my garage and running new outlets on 20AMP circuits. One one circuit, i will have:

- cordless vacuum charger
- drill press, drill press laser, drill press light (3 plugs)
- mini-grinder
- LED overhead light
- Battery Minder for 12V motorcycle battery
So that's 7, plus I'd like at least 1 spare. None will draw continuous, except the vacuum charger and the battery minder.

I'd prefer to not use a power strip, but an 8 receptacle box, with room for wall warts, might not be practical? Are there high quality power strips that could be plugged into a quad receptacle and provide power to the items above without issue? I'm thinking the battery minder might not play well with surge protection. Perhaps a strip without protection would serve. The battery minder is the largest wart, then the vacuum charger.

 

[bikesandcars]

That sounds somewhat nuts from a congestion standpoint. Is it worth spreading them out a little bit just so you aren't tripping over cords?
maybe a 2 or 3 4-gang boxes?

I have the same issue on my work bench in the house garage with needing too many plugs for all the little chargers and stuff. The issue isn't the outlet isn't big enough, it's that there aren't enough evenly spaced in the garage.

 

[510ebl]

Realizing you would prefer a different solution, I use a 4 foot power strip with 12 singles. I find it much easier to plug in wall warts and manage cords when they are spread out a little. Added features are 1200 joule surge protection, a 15A circuit breaker and a switch (the CB) to turn off the whole strip if desired.

There are a few brands out there, but I like these so far. I don’t see why your Battery Minder would be concerned about surge protection in the power strip.

 

[joseywales]

Don't get me started, or I swear, I'll burn this place to the ground and start over!

Nothing in this house makes sense. The garage ceiling is only 7'5", because of a grading mistake found after the foundation was laid -15 years before I bought the house. So there's no overhead space to utilize and lots of aspects throughout the house were changed on the fly. My walls are all poured and not drywall like my neighbors. Hilti is the only way to hang anything. it's a "2 car" garage, that a Ford Explorer is too long for (basement door swings out). So, on my side, I have various toolboxes/benches, my bike, etc. and make the best of it.

The wall where I'm putting this receptacle is actually the front wall, between the garage doors. It's where I've slid in my drill press, hung a Ryobi vacuum, etc. The direct opposite of the room is a freezer, which will have it's on circuit. Between the drill press and the freezer, on the ceiling, I will place another receptacle: dremel, bench grinder, lights. Workbench area will have at least one dedicated circuit, but other than a miter saw, there won't be much going on with the benches.

Actually, you did remind me of something, I can leave some of those items on the 15AMP receptacle that's already there. I don't plan on removing that service. I can leave the lights and the vacuum plugged into those, so that's the solution.

Still, are there any decent, surface mount, receptacles that have space for wall warts, like that Battery Minder? I hate to take up 2 spaces, if I don't have to.

 

[510ebl]

The issue isn't the outlet isn't big enough, it's that there aren't enough evenly spaced in the garage.

This was also a concern of mine, so I installed seven dual receptacle locations along the 2 walls of my 22/24 garage that have boxes or benches. All but 2 locations have something plugged in all the time, most have zero draw unless I am actually working in the garage. Only the fridge and battery chargers run all the time.

Joseywales,

I feel your pain, a residential garage never has the capacity we need. My trucks don’t fit inside of mine either. I spent a lot of time figuring out lights and electric when we moved in.

Based on your other threads, you have a lot going on/moving parts with your garage and generator plans. I don’t know of a single product that will do what you want, but placing four 4” boxes with one duplex receptacle each in a row (column?) joined by conduit may give you the flexibility that you desire for the wall between the doors.

 

[nadogail]

IMHO, All garage workshops are like mine; that is, they are a work in progress. Some of what I thought would be permanent when I did it 20 years ago is being replaced or modified and some of the temporary measures have become permanent.

 

[joseywales]

Thanks. I can't be too upset. I kid you not, part of what directed me to motorcycles is that I can't fit a hot rod in there! I took the motorcycle safety course and 2 minutes on the bike and I knew it was for me. No hesitation, nervousness, imbalance, etc. This will be a lot of fun just doing agility drills in a parking lot. My second day on the bike, I decided to run a couple miles to get gas, basically "forced" to so almost 60MPH...wow. It's a feeling. Experienced riders probably laugh at 60MPH, but it was a Wow for me.

Anyway, yes, a lot going on here at the homestead. I'm trying to plan/prepare, so when weather breaks, I can take action:

- assemble outdoor, ventilated shed, for portable generator (giving up on the home standby for now).

- assemble second Suncast bike shed, to replace existing shed.

- install solar fans in all 3 sheds for better ventilation

I'm sorry, did I mention I'm starting a shed farm? See that's what suburbanites do when they don't have enough flat ground for a real shed. When we bought, location was the primary concern for where the Mrs. worked, so I've been making lemonade ever since. Shouldn't complain though. Did I mention the Mrs. gave me the bike as a gift!

Plan out the NG run to the generator shed.

For the garage, I've decided to do this instead:

- leave the Ryobi and other items on the 15AMP circuit.
- run a 20AMP (4 outlet) and attach that to the ceiling, not the wall. On the ceiling it will be directly above the 2 bikes, so easy access for the battery minders. Oh, don't mention the 2 bike thingy...I haven't broken that to the Mrs. yet.
- 20AMP (4 outlet) on the ceiling above the freezer.
- 20AMP near the workbenches
- but where the heck am I going to mount the subpanel!? I'm out of wall space!!! Anyone ever mount a panel on a ceiling...KIDDING! Back to the dungeon to figure this out.

 

[510ebl]

- but where the heck am I going to mount the subpanel!? I'm out of wall space!!! Anyone ever mount a panel on a ceiling...KIDDING! Back to the dungeon to figure this out.

You mentioned a basement door. Could the sub panel go in the basement and still provide the ease of installation you need?

 

[joseywales]

You mentioned a basement door. Could the sub panel go in the basement and still provide the ease of installation you need?

That is one of my options and perhaps my best. My HVAC unit is there, and when facing that, the wall to the right separates the basement and garage.

My case for putting the subpanel here:

- I intended to move the A/C and Heater circuits to the subpanel. I need the space in the main panel for the subpanel 2 pole, as well as clean up some sins of past owners/contractors: piggyback on a breaker and a tandem, which my box technically doesn't permit.

- It wouldn't be horrible to run that into the basement ceiling, then place a junction box on the ceiling of the garage (assuming that's permitted). It would all be surface mounted to the ceiling. The room above is a finished space, but again, the junction box and all Flex Metal Conduit, etc., would be surface mounted (as long as that's code as well).

 

[510ebl]

I don’t remember if you planned to install a whole-house transfer device or a smaller six or ten circuit transfer switch with your generator, but think ahead to whether any garage circuits should be part of that plan as they may need to be run from the main panel. Also whether your plan to move the heat and A/C from the main to the sub affects this design.

Sorry if I am making things harder and not easier...I can come of as negative at times but do not intend to.

 

[joseywales]

I don’t remember if you planned to install a whole-house transfer device or a smaller six or ten circuit transfer switch with your generator, but think ahead to whether any garage circuits should be part of that plan as they may need to be run from the main panel. Also whether your plan to move the heat and A/C from the main to the sub affects this design.

Sorry if I am making things harder and not easier...I can come of as negative at times but do not intend to.

We might be brothers from another mother... I'm often "read" wrong.

I did think about that, so let me know if my plan is off.

- wire A/C and heat to new sub panel.
- install transfer switch at main panel
- since I'm leaving the existing garage 15AMP receptacles in play, I could add that circuit to the transfer switch and have garage power if needed, just not 20AMP.
- Is there a proper way to move the existing A/C and heat circuit from the main panel to the transfer switch? So, the A/C and heat would get their main power from the sub panel, but could also be powered from the Transfer Switch. My main concern is heat, but if I really needed A/C during an outage, I could temporarily turn off other circuits in the transfer switch, and cool the house. Not sure that setup would be kosher though,

 

[510ebl]

Ok, so some quick math...tell me if I misunderstood.

Your 200A main panel has two more circuits than allowed. One doubled and one tandem breaker to be eliminated.
You need 2 spaces for the garage sub panel.
You need 2 spaces for a generator interlock if you go that direction. The other option is a whole house transfer switch, which would I don’t believe requires these spaces. You will need to go with one of these two options instead of a 6 or 10 circuit type transfer switch if you want any circuits from your sub panel to have available generator power without over complicating.

This means either four or six existing circuits need to move to the sub panel before adding anything. Let’s say six for planning.

1. Furnace/air handler (20a)
2 and 3: Air conditioning condenser (30A?)
4: the 15A circuit in the garage
5 and 6 will probably be something already in the basement for the sake of simplicity.

This leaves the main panel at capacity and the sub panel with plenty of spaces.

BUT it means that you are already running quite a bit through the sub panel when the AC is running, so size appropriately. Others are much better at the finer points of wire gauge and breaker sizes, hopefully they will chime in. They will need to know how far (in feet of wire) the main panel is from the proposed sub panel.

You will need to load shed manually when on generator power.

 

[joseywales]

Thanks. That's really in depth and I appreciate it. I didn't think about the slots for the generator interlock. So, yes, 6 spaces.

I was planning on leaving the 15AMP garage at the main, easier to transfer to generator power. I assumed you moved it to create space, or perhaps to keep all garage power on one panel. Truth is, moving the 15AMP garage might be the easiest circuit to find/move, aside from the A/C and heat. Ugh...

The main panel is about 25 feet from where the sub panel would go. Suspended ceiling the entire way.

 

[joseywales]

Good nights sleep, new plan!

- Portable generator can go on the side of the house, right next to the gas and power meter.

- The main is in a closet and we'll just add a sub panel to the same closet wall. Run wire ~ 25" above suspended ceiling into the garage. Install junction boxes to feed 4 or 5 20AMP receptacles on perhaps 2, maybe 3 circuits. Mine is by no means a full blown workshop

- Powering the Mini-split, during emergency, gives me heat and A/C in the basement, which can be cozy enough if need be, and still permit a 9,000 W unit to power other items in the home.
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