Yes another lighting/electrical help thread

[jeopardy98]

So we are hopefully breaking ground on my new place this week and I'm trying to get my ducks in a row. First thing I must state is that the budget is stretched as far as it can possibly stretch so there are some things that I just will NOT be able to do. That being said, I want to make sure that the things I can't do later are taken care of now before the walls are sheetrocked and all the electrical is run.

My shop space will be 24' wide by 44' long with 1 16' door at the end of the 44' run. I have a lighting budget of $700 for the entire house and I can't blow all of that on the garage but I need to make sure I have adequate light. I HATE not having enough light. All of my work will be on cars, and motorcycles, and the occasional welding/fabrication project. I'm thinking T8 is my most affordable option but how many do I need and how far apart?

I would also like to have them on 2 separate switches so the front half can be lit separately from the back half.

Should I buy the hanging ones or the flush mount ones? Also my ceiling will be 9' to 9 1/2' high.

I'm also curious how many outlets I need to try and have and how many panels in my breaker box. I know I will have a compressor and I plan to add a max jax which I believe runs on a 120v. I also have a welder that runs 220 so I know I need at least 1 220. Should I run 2 so I can have the welder and compressor running at the same time or is that overkill?

Any other suggestions or advice you all can give will be much appreciated. Also is home depot or the like the cheapest place to buy my t8 fixtures?

 

[bczygan]

There are a bunch of really good lighting and electrical threads on this forum.

Read a few and you will have a bunch of answers, but even more importantly, you will have more questions.

Are you having this electrical done, or are you doing it yourself?

Is the $700 for fixtures, materials only? What wiring is included?

 

[bczygan]

Home Depot and Lowes sell cheap fixtures. Look to buying a few at a time with Lowes $10 off $50 coupon code. Use surface mount, hard wired.

 

[jeopardy98]

I believe it is only for fixtures. And you are right. The more I read the more confused I get. Since I work full time and this will be my primary residence I will have to have a final walk through before closing so most work will be completed by the electrician with guidance as to what I want/need and where.

 

[jeopardy98]

Okay surface mount, hard wired. I was thinking 8 fixtures. 4 down each side. Will that be enough light?

 

[bczygan]

Okay surface mount, hard wired. I was thinking 8 fixtures. 4 down each side. Will that be enough light?

Depends.

Just want enough to find your car doors?

What uses are there going to be?

I have a 9 something by 18 something with 8 2 tube Lowes fixtures hung at 9; and I still need a couple fixtures mounted lower at the benches for task lighting. I like it bright, so 6500K daylight bulbs.

Your space is more than 4 1/2 times as big. Even discounting the space where cars will be, I would use at least 24 fixtures, maybe as many as 36, depending on the ambient and task lighting you need and want.

 

[bczygan]

What do the plans show for power and lighting?

At least get all the wiring done, that you might later need for future power and light, even if you don't install all the fixtures right now.

 

[jeopardy98]

Wow. Okay. Like I said, I want plenty of light. I can do a few plug in fixtures at work tables later on. I just need to make sure I have enough 120 outlets around the perimeter.

 

[bczygan]

Wow. Okay. Like I said, I want plenty of light. I can do a few plug in fixtures at work tables later on. I just need to make sure I have enough 120 outlets around the perimeter.

This always happens on homes built for people. We (The builder) give you a lighting allowance that is totally inadequate for the house, and then you have to struggle to find the cheapest fixtures to meet it.

And you probably don't have the circuits needed either.

Can you show what the plans show for the garage?


Bill

 

[bczygan]

You are probably going to need additional circuits, not shown on the drawings, or included in the price of the house for both power and lighting.

The circuits need to be run and wire pulled with drop loops in the wall if you can't afford the finish outlets right now.

The same for lighting. Run all the wiring, install a few lights and install the rest later.

All this needs to happen if you are going to insulate and drywall.

I could see using the entire lighting allowance just on garage light fixtures.

 

[jeopardy98]

Yep. The plan is to do all the wiring so that later I can install more as I get them. I don't know enough about electrical code to aid in that aspect so I'll just have to have a chat with the builder and the electrician before he starts to lay out my future plans.

As soon as the contract is signed I'll get you the plans for the wiring.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

What size in HP comp do u have? Over 3HP needs to be hardwired(no receptacle)...

 

[bczygan]

Yep. The plan is to do all the wiring so that later I can install more as I get them. I don't know enough about electrical code to aid in that aspect so I'll just have to have a chat with the builder and the electrician before he starts to lay out my future plans.

As soon as the contract is signed I'll get you the plans for the wiring.

Make sure you get they layout you need and want before the contract is signed.

 

[jeopardy98]

Probably a 30 gallon. I won't need it for anything other than air tools and blowing out carb jets. No heavy usage.

That's not what you asked at all. I'm sure a 1 1/2 hp will suffice but I haven't shopped yet. Might be using my pancake compressor for the first year.

 

[jeopardy98]

Make sure you get they layout you need and want before the contract is signed.

Yep, hence this thread. I need to be armed with enough info when we sit down.

 

[jeopardy98]

So it looks like 24 lamps with 2 fixtures each spaced 6 ft apart will give me almost 90 footcandles. Between that and workbench lights plus a drop light or two should keep me out of the dark. Are all t8 fixtures created equally these days?

 

[bczygan]

So it looks like 24 lamps with 2 fixtures each spaced 6 ft apart will give me almost 90 footcandles. Between that and workbench lights plus a drop light or two should keep me out of the dark. Are all t8 fixtures created equally these days?

No.

There is a thread about this. But your budget constraints may cause you to buy best bang for the buck.

 

[cybrdyke]

Are all t8 fixtures created equally these days?

The very cheapest ones are all equally bad. Thin metal, extremely sharp edges, really crappy ballast....etc....
But with a very small budget, you're going to be using them. Get a normal (not compact) 2 lamp 4' T8 strip light, or a 4 lamp 4' T8 Tandem strip (8' total) from any big box store. They'll have Lithonia or Cooper/Metalux. At that grade, their equally cheap.
Get enough to accurately light the area that you think is most important in the short term and a few more to fill in the darker spots that aren't as important. Get the wiring for extra fixtures in place now.

Good luck
CD

 

[TTTTTT]

Found this site awhile ago. Although wanting to sell their products a great calculator program for lighting. Just doing the same thing now for the same size space.

dave

http://www.visual-3d.com/tools/interior/Default.aspx?id=14783

 

[jeopardy98]

No.

There is a thread about this. But your budget constraints may cause you to buy best bang for the buck.

I'm only seeing the $20 per fixture flush mounts. Is that the best bang for the buck I'm going to find? Can the hanging lights be hardwired and flush mounted? They seem to be a bit cheaper but I'm sure there is a reason for that.

I'm also considering Craigslist and picking up a few here and there.

Are the 4 lights better than 2 (2) light fixtures or are the lumens going to be the same?

It is certainly looking like I might be spending my toolbox money on more light fixtures.

 

[jeopardy98]

Found this site awhile ago. Although wanting to sell their products a great calculator program for lighting. Just doing the same thing now for the same size space.

dave

http://www.visual-3d.com/tools/interior/Default.aspx?id=14783

Excellent. Let me know what you come up with and what your plan is if you don't mind.

 

[Platonic Solid]

... I have a lighting budget of $700 for the entire house ...

That's beyond pathetic.

That's the same as saying you have no lighting budget for your garage/workshop at all.

Realistic Lighting Budget Estimate for Garage/Workshop:
$1 per square foot, thus 24'x44' = $1056 for basic strip light fixtures and bulbs.

 

[jeopardy98]

Well thank you. I would take offense but since the builder made that decision I'll pass along the info.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Well thank you. I would take offense but since the builder made that decision I'll pass along the info.

No offense intended. I'll post a suggested layout for you in a few minutes.

 

[jeopardy98]

Oh I didn't think you intended to offend. I agree with you after looking and pricing that $700 is ludicrous.

Thank you. I would really appreciate that!

 

[Platonic Solid]

Suggested Fixture and Lamps:
Qty. 24 Lithonia C 2 32 120 RE = 2 lamp strip light with 2.625" lamp spacing and residential ballast (thus low RFI)
available at HD for $31.97 each.

Qty. 48 Lamps: Sylvania 22026 (5000K) or 21767 (4000K)
5000K Fluorescent T8 Fo32/850/Xp/Eco3 available at globalindustrial.com for $2.93 each.
or
4000K Fluorescent T8 Fo32/841/Xp/Eco3 available at globalindustrial.com for $3.37 each.

​

 

[Platonic Solid]

I selected a residential ballasted fixture due to my assumption that this space is underneath your living space. There is a cheaper option: 8TSSF-232-UNV-EB81-U which is an 8ft 4 lamp commercial ballasted fixture for $42.99, but RFI would be a concern for the main living space above.

 

[jeopardy98]

Wow! Thank you! I will start pricing those! You have taken a ton of the guesswork out for me and I have something to give my builder at contract signing.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Glad I could help. Since I did this rather quickly, I did not take the time to subtract wall thicknesses. Above plan is based on a room with 24'x44' interior dimensions. To adjust for actual interior dimensions, keep fixtures parallel to wall at 2.5' from interior wall. (Hope that made sense).

 

[jeopardy98]

I selected a residential ballasted fixture due to my assumption that this space is underneath your living space. There is a cheaper option: 8TSSF-232-UNV-EB81-U which is an 8ft 4 lamp commercial ballasted fixture for $42.99, but RFI would be a concern for the main living space above.

Yes sir. I will have my primary living space above the garage. I will also have about 40' actual usable space because of the stairs.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Numbers are hard to read. Email me the picture - check your PM.

 

[jeopardy98]

Email sent. Thank you!

 

[Platonic Solid]

Here you go: 21 Fixtures, 42 Bulbs (same fixture and bulb recommendation as above)

​

 

[landyacht]

Just a suggestion, if you are handy / comfortable working with electricity then have them wire according to a lighting plan similar to above and just have them install keyless bulbs for now (a couple of dollars each). Then swap out to fluorescents of your choosing when you have more time and funds to allocate. The guy wiring the garage probably doesn't care what fixtures you plan on using, just how many, and where.
Julian

 

[jeopardy98]

Well I spent several hours in Lowes and HD tonight and I picked out all my fixtures for my outside and inside. I also managed to pick up 60w led bulbs for all my standard base sockets for $2.48 each. Not counting the cash I dropped on 50 bulbs I managed to get all my fixtures in for $550. That left me $150 to work in the garage. If I go the route above and pay for the fixtures in the next week I can get them for $270 plus another $176 for bulbs. Basically what I have left for the garage will cover the bulbs and I'll have to come out of pocket about $300. Just to have it done I'm going to go ahead and do that. I'm not sure what the extra cost with the electrician will be since that is a ton more splices and a ton more boxes but hopefully it won't be too much. I've already sent my revisions to the builder for the contract.

The above layout should give me just what I'm looking for and with the 22026
FO32/850/XP/ECO3 5000K bulbs I shouldn't ever be working in the dark.

 

[jeopardy98]

Well just in case anyone runs across this thread I ended up picking these fixtures: I'm not super worried about the interference from the commercial ballast and the price was right.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lithonia...rescent-Strip-Light-C-2-32-120-GESB/100543144