Zercaloy 4

[no704]

My machinist mentor that passed on about 5 years ago at 76 and misiarable would never show it. But his job being high security and he couldn’t even share with his wife is lost made him more miserable. He lost his wife and daughter to his job. Not that they were killed, and they were not but left him a very lonely old man. I’m not letting that happen to me!
As one of his best friends I could not even contact his own daughter to let her know her father was dead. After several weeks of trying he was laid to rest in the veteran cemetery herein Phx. I still have no idea if his daughter even knows!

 

[RoninB4]

-After reading I've come to the conclusion that I may have misjudged the OP. If this is so then I'd like to retract my previous comments and offer a public apology to the OP. As someone that's worked with a lot of hazardous and banned substances I suggest you be careful about what is requested you do. I have too many examples from industry and government putting employees and contractors at risk in doing work. This is still happening despite EPA, NRC, and common sense mandates.

 

[Xti04]

I used to do home health nursing for DOL guys who worked at plants here in East TN. Exposed to beryllium, asbestos, radioactive substances for extended periods of time, and all other manner of animal experiments and environmental exposures. Most have chronic respiratory issues and oddball cancers from their exposures. Make sure you use correct PPE and take every precaution to protect yourself!

 

[rlitman]

I really don’t think it’s going to be all that bad. Seems like just don’t let the chips pile up and keep the part cool. I’ll be running at least an air blast. Probably get a cool mist system as I’ve been waiting one anyway. Should work. I’m not converting my machines to flood coolant.

Air seems like the best idea. All the mist systems I'm familiar with are water based, and you spend the money on a class D extinguisher to avoid water for good reason.

 

[no704]

Air seems like the best idea. All the mist systems I'm familiar with are water based, and you spend the money on a class D extinguisher to avoid water for good reason.

Good point everything I’ve seen says to use flood coolant. I’m going to try and get the mill to draw it to my final diameter 3/16”. I really don’t want to turn down this 3/4” bar and make a bunch of scary chips! Tried parting of a hunk today, went pretty well until about half way through my tool locked up in it. Finished that cut and a couple others on the horizontal saw. Cleaning up the parts I was supprised to find that it gives off sparks when hit with compressed air!

 

[RoninB4]

I used to do home health nursing for DOL guys who worked at plants here in East TN. Exposed to beryllium, asbestos, radioactive substances for extended periods of time, and all other manner of animal experiments and environmental exposures. Most have chronic respiratory issues and oddball cancers from their exposures. Make sure you use correct PPE and take every precaution to protect yourself!

-Some of the stories I was referring to of exposure to hazards/risks are also from East Tn. and probably from the same locations. The resulting health problems don't show up for many years and are difficult to prove the source after so long. A lawsuit will be difficult to win and doesn't compensate for the impact on your shortened lifespan.

 

[no704]

-After reading I've come to the conclusion that I may have misjudged the OP. If this is so then I'd like to retract my previous comments and offer a public apology to the OP. As someone that's worked with a lot of hazardous and banned substances I suggest you be careful about what is requested you do. I have too many examples from industry and government putting employees and contractors at risk in doing work. This is still happening despite EPA, NRC, and common sense mandates.

Thank you for that. Safety is always my #1 priority. And I have no problem telling anyone to F off or correct them if something even seems unsafe. I do work with many hazardous materials and equipment. With proper training and planning as well as PPE things can be done with minimal risk.

 

[RoninB4]

With proper training and planning as well as PPE things can be done with minimal risk.

-Yes it can be done with minimal risk but do bear in mind that using lead (lathe dead centers), tri-chloroethane, and BeCu were once regarded as "no big deal" and were commonplace in machine shops. Exposure to toxic materials is readily assigned to get the job done by people that will not be held accountable for the long term effect it has on you. Even the NRC and TVA tend to look the other way when something needs to be done that's not in the regulatory guidelines. It's your life and future, be safe is all I can say.

 

[T444e]

A little self serving, but it breaks up the monotony of Snap On vs. Harbor Freight and Old Man Yelling at Clouds posts.

Just do what I do, stay away from the general tool forum.

 

[no704]

Anyone care to speculate on WTF is going on with it emitting sparks from having air blown onto it?

 

[mike93lx]

Anyone care to speculate on WTF is going on with it emitting sparks from having air blown onto it?

You've angered it

 

[no704]

You've angered it

Maybe it’s picking up on the fact that I’m a little bit terrified of it! Had some other samples of it and they also do it!

 

[no704]

Parting it off was was pretty sketchy! I usually hand feed on a parting op, but due to the likelihood of work hardening I used the power feed. Upon reflection I should have probably stopped and speed up the lathe as the cutting diameter was getting smaller.

 

[alwaysFlOoReD]

I didnt go back and re-read... Did I understand correctly that water will accelerate combustion? So then maybe moisture in the air is causing the sparks?

 

[Grant Gunderson]

Anyone care to speculate on WTF is going on with it emitting sparks from having air blown onto it?

In all the material science classes I had we were always taught to break the problem down to a smaller scale and think about it. So if the chips can self ignite then blowing air on it is causing the dust / micro particles of it to bounce into each other, get excited and ignite. Thus why flood cooling is recommended to keep it cool. The question is what kind of flood coolant? And then how the gell do you dispose of it.

I remember my dad telling me the EPA wanted them to separate the asbestos stuff from the rest of the “hot” contaminanted equipment and he was like what the hell. The asbestos is the least of the worries compared to how radioactive the equipment was.

My dad always said he minimized time in hot areas and used all of the PPE yet he ended up years latter with an extremely rare autoimmune condition. I’m certain it came from his work experience but zero way to prove it. And asking him if he thought his work could have caused it he said sure anything’s possible but he’s had a great life and wouldn’t change a thing as he had exciting and interesting work and life experiences.

That being said we still don’t know what we don’t know. Best to have a healthy respect for the unknown.

 

[Beerhippie]

Somehow, the idea of adding more air--and hence O2--to something known to auto-ignite sounds like a bad one.

Maybe a flood of an inert gas would be a better idea?

 

[RoninB4]

Had some other samples of it

-Are those other samples from new material or a previously used component?

 

[rlitman]

...Thus why flood cooling is recommended to keep it cool. The question is what kind of flood coolant?...

Exactly. You don't want oil based mist in the air, but oil's fine for flood cooling, and has the benefit of keeping the part away from oxygen. The oil even has the potential to smother the chips. That is, at least until it ignites. <sigh> Yeah, let's add this one to the "things I won't work with" list.

 

[no704]

-Are those other samples from new material or a previously used component?

Other samples are used tubing. Not sure what they were, but don’t register above background. And they are pretty mangled up. Would not be good for anything other than material analysis.

 

[RoninB4]

Other samples are used tubing. Not sure what they were, but don’t register above background.

-Define what "background" means.

 

[no704]

Spoke with my supplier today. Trying to get close to finished dimensions from the mill. Possibly have him do the finish machining.
He told a story of having a 55gal drum near a lathe full of chips that got ignited. Said it was like a jet engine !

-Define what "background" means.

Oh sorry for not being clear on that. Nuclear speak. If you have a Geiger counter set to its most sensitive setting like 0.1 mRem per hour just your everyday surroundings will register something. This is used as a baseline for measurement. And will change depending on your location. At higher elevations it will be a little bit higher due to not having as much atmosphere shielding the cosmic rays. At a research reactor it will be very low because the building is shielded.
Any thing over twice this measurement is to be handled as radioactive.
In most places a banana would technically have to be handled as radioactive due to the potassium in it. And would probably be 3x background.

 

[PCustoms]

-Define what "background" means.

You're awfully concerned about what he's doing and you don't know what background radiation is?

 

[no704]

You're awfully concerned about what he's doing and you don't know what background radiation is?

Give him a break, lots of folks freak out at anything nuclear thanks to media and green peace hype! I like to try and educate these people a little bit. Once one has a basic understanding it becomes a lot less scary.

In the 7 or so years I have been in this industry I can guarantee that I have received orders of magnitude more radiation dose flying on commercial aircraft than from any activity at a reactor.

 

[Chris_Hamilton]

I almost left what I was doing at the time and went to work for Framatone servicing the various nuclear reactors across North America. At that time I desperately wanted that job but there was a lot of competition for it. Money was otherworldly good as was the benefit/living expense plan when traveling (which was all the time). I could have worked there 3-5 years and would have had enough to pay cash for a home and land, and set myself up in business doing what I do currently. And had a sizable amount to put towards retirement. Really wish I would have gotten hired on there.

I am good at what I do though, and I am really good at not making money.

 

[RoninB4]

Spoke with my supplier today. Trying to get close to finished dimensions from the mill. Possibly have him do the finish machining.

-Finish machining? Stringent surface finish (RMS), size tolerance, or machine process (EDM/WEDM, Jig Grinding, etc.)?

He told a story of having a 55gal drum near a lathe full of chips that got ignited. Said it was like a jet engine !

-That's what some reports state. There are several materials somewhat common in shops that need to be approached with caution as they can be hazardous, toxic, flammable, or explosive while machining. It's not always explicit on the MDS/SDS tag so I ask questions of others before they begin. Concern for the safety of others is part of The Golden Rule of reciprocity.

Oh sorry for not being clear on that. Nuclear speak.

-That's what I thought, no apology needed.

 

[RoninB4]

You're awfully concerned about what he's doing and you don't know what background radiation is?

-You're awfully concerned with what I'm doing. S'matter, your social circle bored with you trolling them too? Some reading in the link to occupy your idle hours.

Using Social Media for Reassurance and Validation

Many people post on social media to get reassurance from others. Finding contentment and happiness from within oneself is a healthier strategy.

www.psychologytoday.com

 

[no704]

-Finish machining? Stringent surface finish (RMS), size tolerance, or machine process (EDM/WEDM, Jig Grinding, etc.)?

-That's what some reports state. There are several materials somewhat common in shops that need to be approached with caution as they can be hazardous, toxic, flammable, or explosive while machining. It's not always explicit on the MDS/SDS tag so I ask questions of others before they begin. Concern for the safety of others is part of The Golden Rule of reciprocity.

-That's what I thought, no apology needed.

Finish turning for features.

 

[RoninB4]

Finish turning for features.

Ok....I won't ask for details.

 

[no704]

Ok....I won't ask for details.

Nothing too fancy, just some solid end caps that are a press fit inside the tube. Rounded nose on one end and a cavity to be crimped onto a cable on the other.

 

[RoninB4]

Nothing too fancy, just some solid end caps that are a press fit inside the tube. Rounded nose on one end and a cavity to be crimped onto a cable on the other.

-Thought maybe the features were either beyond the capabilities of your machinery (.004 radial hole array) or something you weren't comfortable doing (3a class thread). Didn't want to pry.

 

[slowtwitch73]

We need some pics/vid of this stuff sparking...

 

[no704]

-Thought maybe the features were either beyond the capabilities of your machinery (.004 radial hole array) or something you weren't comfortable doing (3a class thread). Didn't want to pry.

No worries, nothing too special. Just don’t really want to be making a pile of chips of this stuff. Will be on hold for now anyway. XRF came back with a lot of Na in this sample. So this material can’t be used, Na really lights up when irradiated. So will be waiting to see what the mill has to say.