Engineer PA-09

Posted by 141drew Jul 21, 2020 at 11:21 AM and filed under Reviews & Features

Updated on May 28, 2021 at 11:37 AM

So, I can’t seem to get out of my “nerd build” phase. I’ve moved on from keyboards and strange little TVs to unmanned aerial vehicles. Essentially, these are model airplanes with onboard computers that are programmed to fly very long distances and perform a number of different mission objectives. More on that later…

But in doing all of this, I’ve become a bit of a crimp tool connoisseur. Crimping heavier gauge wire with automotive terminals is easy – even for a cheap tool. But crimping small 24awg wire with 2.54mm connectors is not. I know… cuz I’ve tried just about every cheap ass crimping tool out there.

Recently, I broke down and bought this. Holy hell gentlemen – I didn’t believe the hype and now I’m a hype beast. It’s so, so good. And the thing is, the tool isn’t really made all that well. It feels almost cheap in the hand, but the dies are something special. If you do a lot of fine wiring work, get these – you won’t be disappointed.

Not a sponsored post.

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View thread (27 replies)

casmurbax

Well-known member

Jul 22, 2020

Ryan, please keep on doing your nerd builds, I don't find them nerdie at all.

I must admit I am interested in your airplane builds.

Never really gave crimpers for small wires much thought before.

TuxThePenguin

Well-known member

Jul 22, 2020

I have a pair of these too but haven't used them much. Purpose-specific crimpers are better and often easier but you really can't beat the flexibility of how many types of connectors these can crimp and the price is good and they don't take up a ton of space in my box.

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 22, 2020

casmurbax said:
Ryan, please keep on doing your nerd builds, I don't find them nerdie at all.

I must admit I am interested in your airplane builds.

Never really gave crimpers for small wires much thought before.

Awe thanks man... I haven't made any videos on the subject yet... But my first effort was this:

I call it the T-1... And it was just a trainer as I've never flown a model airplane before. On board was a fairly simple flight controller that guided me along my path of education and eventually, lead to a horrific crash and burn just last night.

T-2 will be under construction soon.

The next program is Mercury and the first airframe is the M-1. Essentially, it's a much more sophisticated and capable aircraft with a pretty impressive flight controller. I won't even have to fly it... I'll just throw it into the air and it will fly where I program it to go, take pics, video, etc... flight times of around 2 hours if things go right:

The little blue pcb you see on the left is the flight controller... I'm building it now... A ton of soldering and just as much config, software work once it's done. Lots of opportunity to screw up!

All of these airframes are store bought. We just modify the hell out of them hoping to make them fly better and further... and then we add open source flight controllers. It's a **** ton of fun because you get to do things out in the shop and see how they work in the field in very short order. I've always enjoyed instant gratification like that.

Our end goal is a VTOL aircraft with crazy flight times and a **** ton of technology. I've already started gathering parts for it, but it's prolly close to a year down the road... and that's if this COVID thing keeps going.

Last edited: Jul 22, 2020

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 22, 2020

TuxThePenguin said:
I have a pair of these too but haven't used them much. Purpose-specific crimpers are better and often easier but you really can't beat the flexibility of how many types of connectors these can crimp and the price is good and they don't take up a ton of space in my box.

I can't believe how good these things work. It's changed my opinion on 2.54mm connectors completely...

TuxThePenguin

Well-known member

Jul 22, 2020

Ryan said:
I can't believe how good these things work. It's changed my opinion on 2.54mm connectors completely...

did you have to get used to crimping with them? Any techniques to share?

(I probably just need to use mine more)

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 22, 2020

TuxThePenguin said:
did you have to get used to crimping with them? Any techniques to share? (I probably just need to use mine more)

I don't think so? I just squeeze the handles and the dies do the work... I did watch the first few to figure out how much pressure was adequate.

Lassen Forge

Well-known member

Jul 22, 2020

Thanks, Ryan... now I gotta spend more money... :rant:

Japanese tool makers seem to have a knack for doing stuff right. I have a pair of connector pliers, designed to push in the little lock buttons on multipin automotive electrical connectors... think I paid what seemed to me an extraordinary amount, was wondering if I was crazy, but it was probably the best $60 I dropped on a tool.

Firebrick43

Well-known member

Jul 22, 2020

A couple of months ago I not only got into high powered rocketry making an eggtimer but also some CNCish projects so I had a lot of connectors to crimp so I got serious. I tried the pa09 but ended up getting a factory Molex crimper. If you watch eBay you can get them for 60-80$. This one for Molex SL but works with the different servo connectors and even kk 254 if you remove the spring loaded holder. With the sl/servo terminals it holds them in the correct orientation and depth. Just load the wire and squeeze. Does both the conductor and insulation crimp at the same time.
View media item 105552

I also ended up with a db9/25 crimper and a stakon ratcheting crimped for uninsulated terminals, also around 80$ each.

Last edited: Jul 22, 2020

gahrajmahal

Well-known member

Jul 23, 2020

Photos - sources for the terminals and wire you are crimping would add to this discussion. Plus, thin wire is difficult to strip. What tools do you like there?

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 23, 2020

Firebrick43 said:
A couple of months ago I not only got into high powered rocketry making an eggtimer but also some CNCish projects so I had a lot of connectors to crimp so I got serious. I tried the pa09 but ended up getting a factory Molex crimper. If you watch eBay you can get them for 60-80$. This one for Molex SL but works with the different servo connectors and even kk 254 if you remove the spring loaded holder. With the sl/servo terminals it holds them in the correct orientation and depth. Just load the wire and squeeze. Does both the conductor and insulation crimp at the same time.
View media item 105552

I also ended up with a db9/25 crimper and a stakon ratcheting crimped for uninsulated terminals, also around 80$ each.

Damn. You aren't playing! Would love to see your rocketry stuff... That's next on our list.

Firebrick43

Well-known member

Jul 24, 2020

Ryan said:
Damn. You aren't playing! Would love to see your rocketry stuff... That's next on our list.

View media item 105568
Here is the flight computer. It’s a eggtimer quantum. First smd kit I have done. Dual deployment, altimeter, back up charges, and armed/programmed via WiFi/web browser, tested good.

View media item 105569
Battery I am using.

I am designing the sled. I probably will do an eggtimer gps in the nose cone.

View media item 105570 Here is the nose cone! Wildman JR kit. Need to get back at it but job change and other projects have stalled it. First launch of the local high power club is in november. They have a 10’000 ft clearance and this rocket supposedly will do that with the biggest motor. I have the translucent red body tube.

https://wildmanrocketry.com/products/wildman-jr

Firebrick43

Well-known member

Jul 24, 2020

gahrajmahal said:
Photos - sources for the terminals and wire you are crimping would add to this discussion. Plus, thin wire is difficult to strip. What tools do you like there?

View media item 105571
These are Molex KK 254 (as in 2.54 mm or .100”). I have 2,3,and 4 pin connectors. They use them on the duet 2 and duex 5 boards on the 3D printer I am building. Duet 3D used the male plugs on their board so I am forced to use these, ok but not my first choice.

View media item 105572These are Molex SL and my first choice for .100” board spacing. They (like the Kk 254) will work with .100” header pins. But they have locks and are oriented so you don’t get them flipped around and let the smoke out.

View media item 105574The female terminals that go into the plug housing

View media item 105573One with a higher pin count. They are available from 2 to over 20 if I remember correctly.

View media item 105575
These are my favorite automatic strippers. (All other set unused now)

They work well on 14 ga down to 30 ga stranded wire. They only thing they don’t work well is silicone insulation with a woven fiberglass sheath for thermocouples. Works still just takes three or 4 cycles. But nothing else I have works well with that wire either.

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 27, 2020

Firebrick43 said:
View media item 105571
These are Molex KK 254 (as in 2.54 mm or .100”). I have 2,3,and 4 pin connectors. They use them on the duet 2 and duex 5 boards on the 3D printer I am building. Duet 3D used the male plugs on their board so I am forced to use these, ok but not my first choice.

View media item 105572These are Molex SL and my first choice for .100” board spacing. They (like the Kk 254) will work with .100” header pins. But they have locks and are oriented so you don’t get them flipped around and let the smoke out.

View media item 105574The female terminals that go into the plug housing

View media item 105573One with a higher pin count. They are available from 2 to over 20 if I remember correctly.

View media item 105575
These are my favorite automatic strippers. (All other set unused now)

They work well on 14 ga down to 30 ga stranded wire. They only thing they don’t work well is silicone insulation with a woven fiberglass sheath for thermocouples. Works still just takes three or 4 cycles. But nothing else I have works well with that wire either.

I want one of those strippers so bad... hard for me to justify the $100, but...

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gahrajmahal

Well-known member

Jul 27, 2020

Firebrick43 thanks for the details! Professional tools make professional connections. Love that wire stripper. Do you make wiring diagrams for your rockets? I used to love developing ladder logic diagrams for the industrial equipment I used to build. I used that same format when rewiring my cars too.

JBH

Well-known member

Jul 28, 2020

gahrajmahal said:
Plus, thin wire is difficult to strip. What tools do you like there?

This little yellow plastic thing from Jokari is inexpensive and works well on small wires. It's easy to judge depth, too. (I've used it down to 28AWG):

View media item 93704
I'm sure it's available from a US source, but I imported mine from amazon.de.

Elora also sells a neat little Euro-style stripper. It is a nicer tool but you have to judge depth by eye. I believe it is made by Schmitz but I have not seen that wire stripper directly from them or from any other known rebrander.

View media item 94296 View media item 94297
A Pressmaster Embla with the PTFE (blue) blade works in a pinch as well. I suspect Stripax is similar, though I've never used one.

Stuey

Well-known member

Jul 28, 2020

JBH said:
This little yellow plastic thing from Jokari is inexpensive and works well on small wires. It's easy to judge depth, too. (I've used it down to 28AWG):

View media item 93704
I'm sure it's available from a US source, but I imported mine from amazon.de.

The Knipex 1280100SB looks identical and is easier to find, but I'm not sure how the price compares. I ordered my Knipex from Amazon UK or DE.

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 28, 2020

Stuey said:
The Knipex 1280100SB looks identical and is easier to find, but I'm not sure how the price compares. I ordered my Knipex from Amazon UK or DE.

Here it is:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005EXNXJI/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Still isn't cheap... I just ordered these:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000XEUPMQ/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I know Klein makes good stuff, but I already have that lingering feeling I'm spending money in an effort to save it.

plc268

Well-known member

Jul 28, 2020

Firebrick43 said:
View media item 105575
These are my favorite automatic strippers. (All other set unused now)

They work well on 14 ga down to 30 ga stranded wire. They only thing they don’t work well is silicone insulation with a woven fiberglass sheath for thermocouples. Works still just takes three or 4 cycles. But nothing else I have works well with that wire either.

I didn't think I'd see a Railcore on GJ, but here we are. :rocker:

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 28, 2020

plc268 said:
I didn't think I'd see a Railcore on GJ, but here we are.

Is their a negative bias towards 3d printers on TGJ? Hell if I would know... I have a PRUSA MK3 kit sitting in a box that I need to build.

plc268

Well-known member

Jul 28, 2020

Ryan said:
Is their a negative bias towards 3d printers on TGJ? Hell if I would know... I have a PRUSA MK3 kit sitting in a box that I need to build.

I don't think so. I know I plugged the railcore before on GJ, just didn't expect to see it randomly.

The only ones that would have negative bias towards a 3d printer are those who don't have the time or are not willing to learn how to setup/use a 3d printer and learn to 3d model. But they are an immensely powerful tool for a workshop, and aren't all the expensive nowadays.

BTW, on topic: I have the Engineer PA-09 crimpers as well. I agree they are fantastic. I struggled crimping small wires for a long time with these bulky cheapo ratcheting crimpers, and on a whim/recommendation, I bought a pair of these, and it's made doing electronics work so much easier. It's hard to explain, and almost one of those things you have to feel. I initially balked at the price, and there's a cheaper set of crimping pliers that are similar, made by IWISS. Supposedly people get decent results with those as well. But I've learned over the years, if you plan on using anything a lot, buy the higher quality tool.

And I haven't completely sworn off ratcheting crimpers. I recently bought a $25 IWISS 3220M ratcheting crimpers. And they do some fantastic crimps in one stroke (as opposed to two on the PA-09). These aren't really necessary to own if you already have the PA-09, but eh... we're on the tool forum for a reason. :lol:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B078WPT5M1/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Ryan

Administrator

Staff member

Jul 28, 2020

plc268 said:
I don't think so. I know I plugged the railcore before on GJ, just didn't expect to see it randomly.

The only ones that would have negative bias towards a 3d printer are those who don't have the time or are not willing to learn how to setup/use a 3d printer and learn to 3d model. But they are an immensely powerful tool for a workshop, and aren't all the expensive nowadays.

BTW, on topic: I have the Engineer PA-09 crimpers as well. I agree they are fantastic. I struggled crimping small wires for a long time with these bulky cheapo ratcheting crimpers, and on a whim/recommendation, I bought a pair of these, and it's made doing electronics work so much easier. It's hard to explain, and almost one of those things you have to feel. I initially balked at the price, and there's a cheaper set of crimping pliers that are similar, made by IWISS. Supposedly people get decent results with those as well. But I've learned over the years, if you plan on using anything a lot, buy the higher quality tool.

And I haven't completely sworn off ratcheting crimpers. I recently bought a $25 IWISS 3220M ratcheting crimpers. And they do some fantastic crimps in one stroke (as opposed to two on the PA-09). These aren't really necessary to own if you already have the PA-09, but eh... we're on the tool forum for a reason.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B078WPT5M1/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I refuse to look at that link damnit.

JBH

Well-known member

Jul 28, 2020

Stuey said:
The Knipex 1280100SB looks identical and is easier to find, but I'm not sure how the price compares. I ordered my Knipex from Amazon UK or DE.

Both Jokari and Knipex rebrand are available through Amazon, Zoro, etc. so it's hard to say one is easier or harder to find. Knipex is a much better-known name, so in that sense one is more likely to search for them.

Knipex rebadges a few Jokari wire stripping tools. The Knipex brand and colorway adds a predictable price premium to this stripper. From amazon.com:

Jokari, $38.85 - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BMER574/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Knipex, $57.50 - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005EXNXJI/?tag=atomicindus08-20.

Is the Jokari twice as good as the Klein stripping pliers above, as the price premium would imply? At least, I think. The Kleins have no depth stop, for starters.

Rocklim

Well-known member

Jul 28, 2020

JBH said:
Both Jokari and Knipex rebrand are available through Amazon, Zoro, etc. so it's hard to say one is easier or harder to find. Knipex is a much better-known name, so in that sense one is more likely to search for them.

Knipex rebadges a few Jokari wire stripping tools. The Knipex brand and colorway adds a predictable price premium to this stripper. From amazon.com:

Jokari, $38.85 - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BMER574/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Knipex, $57.50 - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005EXNXJI/?tag=atomicindus08-20.

Is the Jokari twice as good as the Klein stripping pliers above, as the price premium would imply? At least, I think. The Kleins have no depth stop, for starters.

The Knipex looks identical to the Jokari; not sure which company is the is OEM?

bczygan

Well-known member

Jul 29, 2020

You guys have really gone down the special tools rabbit hole!

Jealous!

Bill

Stuey

Well-known member

Aug 2, 2020

Ryan said:
Here it is:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005EXNXJI/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Still isn't cheap... I just ordered these:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000XEUPMQ/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I know Klein makes good stuff, but I already have that lingering feeling I'm spending money in an effort to save it.

I like those Knipex, and also have the near-identical Craftsman Pro's from a long time ago. They're good choices.

I like automatic strippers sometimes, and the Knipex/Jokari is a benefit when you need the stripped length to be very repeatable.

JBH said:
Both Jokari and Knipex rebrand are available through Amazon, Zoro, etc. so it's hard to say one is easier or harder to find. Knipex is a much better-known name, so in that sense one is more likely to search for them.

Knipex rebadges a few Jokari wire stripping tools. The Knipex brand and colorway adds a predictable price premium to this stripper. From amazon.com:

Jokari, $38.85 - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BMER574/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Knipex, $57.50 - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005EXNXJI/?tag=atomicindus08-20.

Is the Jokari twice as good as the Klein stripping pliers above, as the price premium would imply? At least, I think. The Kleins have no depth stop, for starters.

Thanks!!

I ordered my Knipex from Amazon UK or DE to save on price some time ago (it was cheaper than Amazon USA even with international shipping), would have went with the Jokari instead if I were familiar with the brand at the time.

Hmm, I also have the Knipex 1262180 (I paid $40, it's now $48 at Amazon), and the Jokari 20100 looks identical but priced at $70. :dunno:

Joel65

New member

Aug 11, 2020

Engineer has yet to disappoint me in the 5 or so tools I have from them. Their zip tie flush cutters (np-05) perform perfectly and have the most comfortable grip of any pliers tool I’ve ever used. Glad to hear you’re enjoying the crimps.