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sub panel mounting

billconner

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I have this panel I'm reusing. I believe it's rain tight but I'm using indoors. Can I mount it up side down? All the kos are perfect for that. Otherwise I have to fill and punch one 1" for feed (and don't want to buy a drill or greenlee for one use at age 71.)

it's a Cutler-hammer BR BR816L125RP



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PCustoms

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Since it appears to be a 3R panel, and therefore design to be mounted upright to be rain tight, NO.
 

PCustoms

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Figured that, even though indoors. Now to cut a 1" hole.
You don't own a step drill?

The HF one will work for a few holes. Or a hole saw. Or drill the biggest you have and a die grinder, file etc.
 

sparky 1971

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I wouldn't have a problem with it. I doubt there is anything on the door sticker stating it has to be mounted "right side up", and if there is, it's for when being used outdoors. The door will probably be a pain in the **** though, leading me to take it off and throw it away. Or... for less than the price of a good vari-bit, one could buy an indoor Eaton BR panel and still use the same breakers that fit the panel in the OP.

 
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billconner

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****. The Klien stepped drill was $70 at local electrical supply. Nearly twice the cost of the panel. Now, does it have a 1" ko where rigid is stubbed in.....
 

mike93lx

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As long as the door won't falloff when it's open, I'd flip it over for my shop. Weather rating is irrelevant in the application. Heck, could just remove the door
 

sparky 1971

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Figured that, even though indoors. Now to cut a 1" hole.
If you're stubbed up in the middle, you could use a hub, but it won't be too long before you're seeing diminishing returns. $12 for the hub and you're 1/3 of the way to a new panel.


 
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sparky 1971

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Zeke

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Scribe your hole and drill 1/8th holes as close as possible just inside the scribe, get it out and a rat tail file and a few minutes of your (free) time and it's done. If you have a Dremel, even faster. Looks better right side up, I don't care who you are. :ROFLMAO:
 
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billconner

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Too much help too fast. Wow and many, many thanks. I agree on right side up, plus it makes sense for other reasons. I may buy another box. Would be neater, wouldn't have to punch other holes for branch circuits and fill existing. I'll try to figure out kos.

The HF stepped drill for $12 makes sense since there's a 3/4" ko in a good place. And I might go after it with a hand nibbler and/or Dremel.

One of these solutions will work. Thank you again!
 

wyliesdiesels

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need to backup here. is this panel going in a detached structure? is the feeding panel in another structure? if so and you will have more than 6 breaker handles, you will need a hold down kit and a main breaker....
 

sparky 1971

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need to backup here. is this panel going in a detached structure? is the feeding panel in another structure? if so and you will have more than 6 breaker handles, you will need a hold down kit and a main breaker....
If I remember correctly from another thread, he is turning an attached garage into a living room and extending the feeder. However, I'm not going to go digging through all of the threads to confirm.
 
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billconner

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you will have more than 6 breaker handles, you will need a hold down kit and a main breaker....

What's a hold down kit?

Yes - sub panel in detached accessory structure, main in a sub panel in dwelling. 8 full size breaker spaces. First two on left were/will be a 50 amp main, leaving room for six full size. Lighting, door openers, 2 convenience circuits, 2 future for an ev charger - maybe some day. Doesnt that work?

It's fed of a 50 amp main but will be red by all copper no. 6 - don't know temperature rating but will check tomorow - but think that allows at least 60 amps? Especially useful to know if I buy a new panel, but not leaning that way at the moment.
 

mike93lx

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What's a hold down kit?

Yes - sub panel in detached accessory structure, main in a sub panel in dwelling. 8 full size breaker spaces. First two on left were/will be a 50 amp main, leaving room for six full size. Lighting, door openers, 2 convenience circuits, 2 future for an ev charger - maybe some day. Doesnt that work?

It's fed of a 50 amp main but will be red by all copper no. 6 - don't know temperature rating but will check tomorow - but think that allows at least 60 amps? Especially useful to know if I buy a new panel, but not leaning that way at the moment.
It's a bracket that bolts over the breaker that is feeding the panel to prevent removing it
 

sparky 1971

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need to backup here. is this panel going in a detached structure? is the feeding panel in another structure? if so and you will have more than 6 breaker handles, you will need a hold down kit and a main breaker....
As it turns out, good catch.
What's a hold down kit?

Yes - sub panel in detached accessory structure, main in a sub panel in dwelling. 8 full size breaker spaces. First two on left were/will be a 50 amp main, leaving room for six full size. Lighting, door openers, 2 convenience circuits, 2 future for an ev charger - maybe some day. Doesnt that work?
The hold down kit will be to keep the 50 amp main from being removed. Someone could take it out with hot wires connected to it. You also need a barrier to keep fingers off of the hot lugs. You'll be be much better off time and money wise buying a main breaker panel. I forgot the barrier part of a nine panel change out two weeks ago and had to make a last minute 350 mile round trip drive to get them. I don't know what Eaton has, but the Square D looks like this.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Square-D-QO-Back-Fed-Main-Breaker-Barrier-PKSB1QOBFCP/311790747


Edit: I read the code rule, the barrier isn't going to be required in a sub panel. Never mind.


It's fed of a 50 amp main but will be red by all copper no. 6 - don't know temperature rating but will check tomorow - but think that allows at least 60 amps? Especially useful to know if I buy a new panel, but not leaning that way at the moment.
 
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Norcal

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billconner

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A new panel (exactly the same but indoor) costs under $40.
It would be much easier than what you're suggesting, have a better finished product, and not have such an "unconventional" installation.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Eaton-B...nter-with-Surface-Door-BR816L125SDP/100112551
Yes but still have to punch a hole for 1" rigid feeder. I guess a NEMA 3R indoors is unconventional, but still code compliant. And hard to justify skimping on new panel after buying $200+ of wire to feed it. But the whole building is somewhat unconventional. Rubble trench foundation. Surface bonded block stem wall. 100% rough sawn pine. Used overhead doors. Attic with stairs. Barn sash. Panel will fit right in. I was going to do all rlm lighting or keyless porcelain but relenting on that inexpensive led strips. The overhead doors and door openers spoiled the vintage look enough to give in on lighting.

Hard to build with aesthetics as a priority to or $20/sf.
 
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billconner

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It's a bracket that bolts over the breaker that is feeding the panel to prevent removing it
Only $4 at HD but is it required for a 50 amp panel (125 amp panel rating)? Description says for 150 to 225 amps.

PS - found right one, code requires, from reading one of those things that might not get picked up at inspection. I'll get one.
 
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billconner

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Well, feeling a little dumb. Rooting around in an old tool box found a greenlet punch for 1" kos. I must of bought it while in grad school - 45 years ago - and haven't used it since.
 

PCustoms

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I'd still have to punch a hole for the feed. No easier.
Panels have knockouts.......


Plus I'm pretty sure everyone has been trying to tell you you also need a hold down kit (brand specific!) For your current panel.
 
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billconner

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I looked at the diagrams Sparky posted and still need to punch a hole. Roughed in wrong over a year ago.

I can order the hold down kit from several places - $4 to 5.

The panel I have is good condition. I don't see any advantage in tossing it and spending $40.
 
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billconner

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I do appreciate the help and constructive criticism. GJ is a great place because of the sincerity and expertise of the members.

I'll post a picture of install when complete. Still trying to decide on branch wiring - all EMT or Romex with EMT to protect it below joists overhead.
 
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billconner

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Wire finally arrived from wireandcableyourway.com - 4 days late - all thanks to Fed Ex.

SER - same fastening spacing as Romex -4 1/2' max and 12" from any panel or box?
 
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billconner

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Done except hold down kit and branch circuits. Learned a lot about no. 6 wire. Hold down kit is scheduled to arrive tomorrow. Perhaps not easy but not difficult. I have difficulty thinking a different panel would make it easier.
 

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