J H Williams vintage hand tools

[misterbill]

That awesome you will have to post a picture of it once it’s done .

After cleaning off the grease, dirt, house paint, and mill dust and sorting out the detritus the box is in OK condition. I gently rubbed off the flaking paint and ended up spraying the outside of the box with a coat of clear to act as a fixative. Final inventory shows I'm just missing the SB-30 draglink socket.

I find boxes like this one to be interesting archeological exercises. You can sift through the layers to see the progression of acquisition of the contents. Newer Gedore, Tatools, and Taiwan-made stuff on top. 1989 dated Wright socket followed by a 1983 penny under all the dust. Finally get to the original Williams tools at the bottom.





Bill

 

[Farmer J.]

After cleaning off the grease, dirt, house paint, and mill dust and sorting out the detritus the box is in OK condition. I gently rubbed off the flaking paint and ended up spraying the outside of the box with a coat of clear to act as a fixative. Final inventory shows I'm just missing the SB-30 draglink socket.

I find boxes like this one to be interesting archeological exercises. You can sift through the layers to see the progression of acquisition of the contents. Newer Gedore, Tatools, and Taiwan-made stuff on top. 1989 dated Wright socket followed by a 1983 penny under all the dust. Finally get to the original Williams tools at the bottom.





Bill

What a nice looking set, and a genuine honest patina of use. You just can't buy stuff like that new today.

 

[S-K Tool Fanatic!]

After cleaning off the grease, dirt, house paint, and mill dust and sorting out the detritus the box is in OK condition. I gently rubbed off the flaking paint and ended up spraying the outside of the box with a coat of clear to act as a fixative. Final inventory shows I'm just missing the SB-30 draglink socket.

I find boxes like this one to be interesting archeological exercises. You can sift through the layers to see the progression of acquisition of the contents. Newer Gedore, Tatools, and Taiwan-made stuff on top. 1989 dated Wright socket followed by a 1983 penny under all the dust. Finally get to the original Williams tools at the bottom.





Bill

That set turned out beautifully!!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Found some Williams pieces at the flea this morning.



A postwar miniature combo wrench roll with a partial set inside. Not one but two identical M-42 hinge handles, 9/32-inch drive, cad finish. And an M-110 spinner-extension jobbie with a 1/4-inch male drive stud and female opening that was a real head scratcher for an hour or three until I solved the puzzle. Williams actually dropped the "N" (for New) from their "NM-" (for New Midget) 1/4-inch drive model number scheme sometime before 1963 (first newer catalog I found it in...), ostensibly because enough time had passed when "M-" could be used for Midget again without any concern about confusion with the earlier "M-" scheme for original 9/32-inch drive Midget tools. Being an almost exclusively prewar and wartime guy, used to dealing with M- (9/32) and NM- (1/4) tools, I did not know that.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

The M-42's were found with these PLVMB and CAL-AIR screwdriver bits, also 9/32-inch drive, of course, and also cad. I dug all these out of a giant stack with mainly newer tools. The PO obviously didn't like having to take time to switch from slot to cross-recess bits on the same hinge handle!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Here's that chrome-y much later era M-110 1/4-inch drive spinner-extension shown next to the early NM-110 1/4-inch drive spinner-extension inside my mint-y cosmo electrical set.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

And here's what I am doing with the pouch, which cleaned up very nicely.



Some of you may remember I did something similar with a pouch I found back in July, shown here. If I find one more pouch, I'll have a nice, safe, warm and brand-appropriate home for all my Chro-Moly, Chrome-Alloy, and Alloy Williams electrical/ignition Superrenches. Ideally, maybe some day I will run into a few that are also period correct. Until then, these'll do just fine, and perseverance pays off. (If you no looky, you no findy!)

 

[four.cycle]

^ Quite the find there. I have one of those little Williams boxes here somewhere. I don't think there's anything in it.

 

[AntiqueBen]

I couldn't pass this up when I saw it today. A 21" Williams Railroad Special. I believe the 21" is the biggest RR Special that Williams made. It opens up to a massive 4". I usually never buy a wrench that is bent, but it's in such great shape I thought I'd deal with it. It had to have took tremendous force to bend a wrench this massive. Maybe someone stood on this thing at some point. I'm tempted to heat it up & straighten it out. Any thoughts on that??

 

[Ricky Joe]

.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Interesting that it has a Whitman and Barnes logo on handle and Williams logo on the head.

A dating tell. They did that for a short number of years to exploit the name brand recognition and customer base reputation of W&B after the acquisition of the forge and wrench-making half of W&B in 1920. Also because they were using their dies. Note that the W&B is forged. The Williams marking is stamped. I have a small DOE wrench with the same characteristic markings on the shank (forged W&B) and major jaw face (stamped Williams Bklyn logo), also with a customer marking (Globe Slicers - a famous deli machine maker!) on the flip side, found and reported in much more detail back in 2021 here.

Nice find, Ben.

 

[Macduf]

Pick up at goodwill, funny no one grabbed it before.

 

[Cruzan80]

Very nice! Is the extension 1/4 or 9/32?

 

[Macduf]

1/4

 

[Oldtuleguy]

They dropped the n from nm on the 1/4 after a while

 

[misterbill]

I found this Williams 1/2” drive extension yesterday at an estate sale. It’s not too unusual except for the AT-8708 stamped on the side. That AT number doesn’t correspond to the Merlin Packard set and was obviously hand stamped so I’m not sure what to make of it.
-Don

Don graciously passed this along to me. My OCD got the better of me and my wallet and I was able to find the extension in a downloaded PDF of the Army Air Forces Technical Order No. 02-55-3 - Overhaul Tools Catalog for Rolls-Royce Engines Manufactured by Packard Motor Car Company Detroit Michigan - in the miscellaneous tools section.




Bill

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I couldn't pass this up when I saw it today. A 21" Williams Railroad Special.

I brought his little brother home from the flea today. I'm not a big monkey wrench collector. I have a few that are rare for different reasons (tiny, obscure maker, etc). The handle on this one, which appears to be an early semi-translucent fibrous plastic, is what grabbed me, and I it. It is more colorful in person, deeper maroon, with flecks of red, than it appears in the photos. Someone on the Garage Sale thread postulated that it may have been plasti-dipped, like those aftermarket pliers handles prevalent in the late 40s and early 50s, that you placed in warmwater to activate and apply. But I have my doubts. This one looks made for the wrench handle, as you can see where it match-fits the elbow there. I'll have to do some research. It was knurled or ribbed, but they are well worn down.

EDIT: I recognize that these typical came either all steel or "knife" style (period ads did not invoke "Perfect Handle" for fear of trademark violation), with wooden scales. The unusual handle is precisely why I snagged it.

 

[AntiqueBen]

I brought his little brother home from the flea today. I'm not a big monkey wrench collector. I have a few that are rare for different reasons (tiny, obscure maker, etc). The handle on this one, which appears to be an early semi-translucent fibrous plastic, is what grabbed me, and I it. It is more colorful in person, deeper maroon, with flecks of red, than it appears in the photos. Someone on the Garage Sale thread postulated that it may have been plasti-dipped, like those aftermarket pliers handles prevalent in the late 40s and early 50s, that you placed in warmwater to activate and apply. But I have my doubts. This one looks made for the wrench handle, as you can see where it match-fits the elbow there. I'll have to do some research. It was knurled or ribbed, but they are well worn down.

EDIT: I recognize that these typical came either all steel or "knife" style (period ads did not invoke "Perfect Handle" for fear of trademark violation), with wooden scales. The unusual handle is precisely why I snagged it.

That is an interesting handle. Could someone have done a custom job on the handle just to "personalize" it? Hard to tell from the pics. Either way, not something you usually see on those wrenches.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Could someone have done a custom job on the handle just to "personalize" it?

That's the prevailing thought, but I would think beyond just personalizing it, perhaps for more comfortable and perhaps warmer grip than the steel. Based on how well it's fit, though, I am wondering if the "someone" could possibly be some company or entity that did more than one, either a shop in a RR yard or whatever. Maybe I'm just overestimating what it would take.

Either way, it seems pretty early. It's not CAB, pyralin, or tenite. It reminds me of the Burma handles that the British put on knives made in the Pacific during WWII when rubber was rationed. This is not soft. It's hard, but again, fibrous.

 

[JohnDeere]

How old is this? Only markings are the w in the diamond an “s” and “patd”.

 

[wrenchguy]

Almost done except for the No.1 SOE.

Thanks twertsy, without this post back in the day i'd never know what wrenches went on this board. see here, https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...intage-hand-tools.274782/page-12#post-7824992

 

[Targa68]

Four S-shaped wrenches with concave handles.
- 251B, 5/8" - 1/2" this have the old marking; "J.H. Williams & Co. Bklyn, N.Y. U.S.A." and the W-Diamond logo. Assuming older than 1919.
- 2 x 860 (?), marked with "FOSTER MACH CO", no size markings, one marked with SPECIAL and the W-Diamond logo, second have slight remains of the W-Diamond logo. Anyone have additional info on these?
- 860 (?) 5/16" - 1/4" with W-Diamond logo.

 

[Targa68]

- 2 x 860 (?), marked with "FOSTER MACH CO", no size markings, one marked with SPECIAL and the W-Diamond logo, second have slight remains of the W-Diamond logo. Anyone have additional info on these?

Answering my own question here
These must have been made for the lathe maker Foster Machine Co.
From Vintage Machinery http://vintagemachinery.org/mfgindex/detail.aspx?id=2840&tab=7

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Nice finds, Targa!

In all my years of picking, I've only ever found two (2) 800 series concave panel "S" wrenches in the wild, both very early, but probably not the same year of production. The 866G has the block Brooklyn logo, the 861X has the oval logo, doubtlessly abbreviated due to the small size of the jaw face. On the large wrench, the model number was stamped on the minor jaw face on the opposite end from the branding on the major jaw face. On the small wrench, the core model number (861) was forged on the shank near the major jaw face, with the suffix (X) determining the milled opening being stamped. These variations would drive me nuts if I had them in plentitude. For now, I'm happy.

 

[Targa68]

Nice wrenches!

 

[Private Lugnutz]

These must have been made for the lathe maker Foster Machine Co.

Agreed! Very nice wrench to own!

I've never seen any documents with hard numbers, and their portfolio over the years was very diverse, from military to general automotive, but I have to imagine that industry was a big slice of the pie in their stockholder booklets.

Here are all my third party Williams wrenches. I've posted them individually on this thread before if you want to search for more details, but never before as a group shot. From the top to the bottom are Automatic Screw Machine Company (most similar to your Foster find in terms of type of customer), Globe Slicers (easily the coolest in my collection, Globe was thee most prolific supplier of meat slicers to butchers and delis in NYC), Kelly Press (printing outfit), and Dexter (also lithography, printing, etc).

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Almost done except for the No.1 SOE.

I've got to scout harder this year. I could use a crisp Ben Franklin!

 

[wrenchguy]

May not be crisp... But gladly paid!
Here's a odd 25 i came up with, looks nickel plated, not marked special either. I'm leaving it asis. Anyone seen or know about why this extra effort and cost into this piece? thx.

 

[Mike'smeatshop]

I pic this wrench today real cheap. Not sure what wrench guy needed.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Not sure what wrench guy needed.

That's the right type of wrench. Single open end engineers. But it's too new (1950's) and not the right size, either. His will be 4" long with a 1/2" milled opening marked "1/4" for the USS nut size it fits on the minor jaw face, and it will have the oval logo on the major jaw face.IT may or may not have traces of the black enamel on the handle. If you scroll up a few you'll see some examples of the logo on other wrenches in his last post and my post just above it. There are two: one including 'BROOKLYN', the other just 'FORGED.' I'm actually not sure if he cares which, as they are the same age. On tiny wrenches, like the No. 1, it may not have the full name, just J.H.W.&Co. as you can see on mine.

 

[Mike'smeatshop]

That's the right type of wrench. Single open end engineers. But it's too new (1950's) and not the right size, either. His will be 4" long with a 1/2" milled opening marked "1/4" for the USS nut size it fits on the minor jaw face, and it will have the oval logo on the major jaw face.IT may or may not have traces of the black enamel on the handle. If you scroll up a few you'll see some examples of the logo on other wrenches in his last post and my post just above it. There are two: one including 'BROOKLYN', the other just 'FORGED.' I'm actually not sure if he cares which, as they are the same age. On tiny wrenches, like the No. 1, it may not have the full name, just J.H.W.&Co. as you can see on mine.

Thank you sir.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

My pleasure. Anything to help complete that board!

 

[wrenchguy]

I pic this wrench today real cheap. Not sure what wrench guy needed.

Thanks 4 looking, heres posting about the wrench and its description from awhile back.

J H Williams vintage hand tools

Depending on condition there is a $100 REWARD FOR THIS WRENCH. It has to match the sizes listed for the NO.1. It has to show the "diamond w" or "oval" logo along with a stamped or embossed "1". thx.

www.garagejournal.com

These are the logos as i call them that i'd use as correct on the board. So far i've found 6 different variations of the oval logo, all are acceptable to me. So if it has a oval logo its good. If it only has a "W in Diamond" logo its good to go. If it horizontal block lettering its good to go. It also has to have the numeral "1" embossed or stamped on the wrench. The milled opening can't be modified and the other measurements must match specs given for No.1 on the list above. good luck.

 

[Mike'smeatshop]

Thanks 4 looking, heres posting about the wrench and its description from awhile back.

J H Williams vintage hand tools

Depending on condition there is a $100 REWARD FOR THIS WRENCH. It has to match the sizes listed for the NO.1. It has to show the "diamond w" or "oval" logo along with a stamped or embossed "1". thx.

www.garagejournal.com

These are the logos as i call them that i'd use as correct on the board. So far i've found 6 different variations of the oval logo, all are acceptable to me. So if it has a oval logo its good. If it only has a "W in Diamond" logo its good to go. If it horizontal block lettering its good to go. It also has to have the numeral "1" embossed or stamped on the wrench. The milled opening can't be modified and the other measurements must match specs given for No.1 on the list above. good luck.

Sounds like a plan man. Now I know what to look for. Thanks.

 

[Ayrhead]

I just picked up a Williams 9/32” Socket Set with a Snap On and a Plomb Ratchet. It’s got a pretty decal on the inside of the lid…

 

[Ricky Joe]

.

 

[wrenchguy]

"This is for the bolt at the piston end of the rod." ????
There were other manufacturers of the 25.
keepin' it Williams, note afterthought throwing in sparkplug wrenches. thx

 

[misterbill]

Recently snagged this Williams ignition set. I believe it's a 1140P Midget Electrical Set as shown in the 1947 Williams catalog. The leatherette roll is in fantastic shape. The set was missing the 1112 and 1113 wrenches (which I had in stock) and it came with a K-D No. 7 pair of ignition pliers. I had some Meguiars leather/vinyl product which I used to wipe down the roll. Really happy with the result.





Bill

 

[Ricky Joe]

.

 

[wrenchguy]

Trade this 1914-1924 Williams 993 spark plug wrench for a Williams 993A or a 994 s-p wrench. Or purchase outright. Thx.