The VISES of Garage Journal

[Shiftless]

Picked up at the car boot sale this morning, 6" jaw width, pretty good condition, no name found anywhere but it's obviously a Massey type quick release
£10

Great score!
I‘d be all over that deal here in the U.S.
For us Yanks, that is about $13.50

 

[CRSINMICH]

dutch: One quick quibble - if you found that vice at a "car boot sale" then what you found is an Entwisle and Kenyon's vice.

The patent for the vice/vise was awarded to Wilson Riley
​

Mr. Riley's vices were on exhibit in 1879

Notice that Exhibit 7367 is a No.2 with 6" jaws and Instantaneous Grip
​

 

[1982fxr]

Has anybody seen the new Wilton Apprentice series vises? They have the bullet design. Cost is only $150 for the 6”.

Obviously most here have/want USA made classic vises, but I could see this being an inexpensive way to get into a good looking, probably decent quality vise with a lifetime warranty.

That's cheaper than harbor freight

 

[jopy]

Update on my vise project

I just got a 3D scan taken of the base vise so I can start getting quotes from foundries

Also I just ordered the materials for the screw and the handle and the final weight of the screw will be approximately 50KG!!

 

[Outlawmws]

Not happy with existing anvil vise combinations? Make your own!
Needs racing stripes

I hate to say it, but I kinda like that as a movable bench vise!! I'm guessing about a 2" jaw on the vise?

 

[skmbabon]

I hate to say it, but I kinda like that as a movable bench vise!! I'm guessing about a 2" jaw on the vise?

Not mine, but that sounds about right. I think the anvil is railway track.

 

[Outlawmws]

Not mine, but that sounds about right. I think the anvil is railway track.

I agree.

 

[fishwatcher]

That's cheaper than harbor freight

Yes, you’re right. The 6” Doyle is $199 vs the Wilton 6” for $149. The Doyle 4” from HF is the same price as the 4” Wilton Apprentice at just under $100. Both have lifetime warranties.

I’m interested in seeing the first reviews of these new Apprentice vises. I still like and hugely prefer my USA made vintage Wilton’s of course. It’s very interesting that the look (and some of the function) of the iconic Wilton Bullet is now available at such a low price point.

 

[dannyr]

dutch: One quick quibble - if you found that vice at a "car boot sale" then what you found is an Entwisle and Kenyon's vice.

The patent for the vice/vise was awarded to Wilson Riley
​

Mr. Riley's vices were on exhibit in 1879

Notice that Exhibit 7367 is a No.2 with 6" jaws and Instantaneous Grip
​

good information

small aside - the patent shows the 'handle' for the engineers version with a 'doorknob' end - like the joiner's vise - this was a cast iron part and today often has the end missing -- when it came to manufacture of the engineers version they must have already realised this weakness and made the handle of a slightly different shape - see dutch's fine example - and of wrought iron, malleable iron or steel

 

[dutchgray]

good information

small aside - the patent shows the 'handle' for the engineers version with a 'doorknob' end - like the joiner's vise - this was a cast iron part and today often has the end missing -- when it came to manufacture of the engineers version they must have already realised this weakness and made the handle of a slightly different shape - see dutch's fine example - and of wrought iron, malleable iron or steel

I will have a better look to see if I can tell if that handle was cast or forged not that is easy to do, it's definitely been machined at the hand grip area, it has a center dimple in from where it would have been on a lathe.

 

[CRSINMICH]

dutch and danny: This is a cut from a 1914 Crerar, Adams & Co. Catalog of Railway Supplies in Chicago. The handle looks like a cross between the patent drawing and dutch's vice. It looks like it could have been turned on a lathe, however, drawings in catalogs and patents are not entirely reliable.

Notice that none of the vises listed have 6" jaws. A No.15 would have been just about that size. Does that mean that by 1914 Massey no longer offered 6" versions? All that could be said for certain is that Crerar, Adams didn't offer a 6" vise.

​

 

[682bear]

Reed 204R static jaw....is the area under the jaw normally like this? Forge welded? Repaired? This is my 1st Reed so I am not familiar with their specifics. Thanks

I'd say that's been repaired..

-Bear

 

[Outlawmws]

I'd say that's been repaired..

-Bear

I agree; welded, then ground.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

Reed 204R static jaw....is the area under the jaw normally like this? Forge welded? Repaired? This is my 1st Reed so I am not familiar with their specifics. Thanks

Both my 104R and 204R have a similar chipping under the jaws. I'll take some pictures when I get a chance. I don't think that's a repair.

 

[wtn1271]

Here's a picture of a Craftsman Reed from 1943. It looks similar to mine. I am thinking it is this way from the factory or the same guy repaired both.

 

[akasrick]

Reed 204R static jaw....is the area under the jaw normally like this? Forge welded? Repaired? This is my 1st Reed so I am not familiar with their specifics. Thanks

Hollow towers? They jaws had to be attached someway. There is at least one patent showing a new way of attaching, fairly involved, I wouldn't imagine it got much traction.
Looks like the towers were at least beefed up.

Akasrick

 

[Outlawmws]

Here's a picture of a Craftsman Reed from 1943. It looks similar to mine. I am thinking it is this way from the factory.

I'm not seeing the grinding on yours at all.

I believe Reed stated in early literature the jaws were cast in place.

 

[ChefRex]

My 204 1/2r, as Outlaw said cast in place.

 

[wtn1271]

Chef Rex,
Yours looks similar too, especially the outlined areas. Some vises probably just have a better casting.

 

[akasrick]

Reed 204R static jaw....is the area under the jaw normally like this? Forge welded? Repaired? This is my 1st Reed so I am not familiar with their specifics. Thanks

There was also a process which I have no idea if Reed used, for what I call Electro Magically welded. Which means I have no idea how it was accomplished. I imagine a lot of energy was used. Looking at mine looks like it has none of the smoothness yours has.

akasrick

 

[Patrickm82]

3 of my 4 Reeds have similar casting marks. This is a Reedsman 5180.

 

[KMScott]

Sure would like to see how they fit the hard jaws in the mold when the vise is casted. All of my Reeds had cast in jaws just like these examples you guys have shown.

I have replaced several of these cast in jaws and every time I break thru the 60 R/C I look for Copper or Nickel often used in brazing hard inserts to softer cast material. I found what looks like Copper in the 106 jaws I replaced. The Reed inserts on the R series have the round boss in the center of the jaw inserts. I’m assuming for more surface area in the casting.

How did they cast the Static and Dynamic with the finished hardened serrated jaws and then how well they align up to each other.

 

[682bear]

Well... now I guess I'll have to look at my Reedsman and see what it looks like under the jaws...

-Bear

 

[TheRealZeus]

Both my 104R and 204R have a similar chipping under the jaws. I'll take some pictures when I get a chance. I don't think that's a repair.

“Insert Casting.” the preform harden steel jaws would be referred to as “cast-in inserts,” as a generic term to the technique. They are placed in the molds prior to pouring.

I have a simple theory that somebody gettin’ in the business went to the parker foundry, saw men machining the jaws with hand files by eye fitting them flush, and said… “heck naw.. we’ll just pour it onto the jaws.”

 

[fullthrottle24]

Cast in place, welded on, mine all look similar as well.

 

[TheRealZeus]

Was reference;
Post in thread 'Vises without removable jaws?'
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/vises-without-removable-jaws.421070/post-7871853

 

[akasrick]

Cast in place, welded on, mine all look similar as well.

Do you have a date on that adv. Time and vise improvements march on.

akasrick

 

[colmal]

^^ You are welcome. Let me know if you find numbers or lettering when you clean it - especially if it is NOT a G-P.

No ID on it-original black paint with a darker red on jaw area- 2" 3lb 8.5 oz

Most of the red came off as I left it a bit longer in the molasses being fully seized up, came out well thou, even the retaining screw was removed with no effort, threads are excellent, lightly used, the locating pins look to have been agriculturally filed on there ends, can't imagine that's original, probably just leave it as it is, won't repaint it.
Dawn, G-P (?), Stanley, 2 inchers.

 

[Beerhippie]

Is "agriculturally filed" Strine for "Bubba'ed"?

 

[682bear]

Well... now I guess I'll have to look at my Reedsman and see what it looks like under the jaws...

-Bear

I stand corrected... my Reedsman is the same way under the jaws...



-Bear

 

[fullthrottle24]

Do you have a date on that adv. Time and vise improvements march on.

akasrick

Not that particular catalog, but another one I have is dated 1949 with a flat nose Reed with same description.

While time does indeed march on, the improvements, durability, quality of materials and craftsmanship of skilled machinists is unfortunately gone.

 

[KMScott]

While time does indeed march on, the improvements, durability, quality of materials and craftsmanship of skilled machinists is unfortunately gone.

Still a few skilled Toolmakers around, not gone yet. Just wish I had a few apprentice that I could have trained.

I would love to give the new Machinist a drawing from when I was new in this trade Like this Starrett 326 Pipe jaw drawing and turn them loose. Finished these up earlier this week.

 

[fullthrottle24]

Still a few skilled Toolmakers around, not gone yet. Just wish I had a few apprentice that I could have trained.

I would love to give the new Machinist a drawing from when I was new in this trade Like this Starrett 326 Pipe jaw drawing and turn them loose. Finished these up earlier this week.

You are correct, I appreciate your skills and knowledge you share here with us. I was specifically referring to the corporate world’s planned obsolescence and people not appreciating the value of quality built to last and service products that last for generations. My grandfather was a tool and die maker, his vise sits on my bench as tribute to his craft.

 

[micahd1997]

Still a few skilled Toolmakers around, not gone yet. Just wish I had a few apprentice that I could have trained.

I would love to give the new Machinist a drawing from when I was new in this trade Like this Starrett 326 Pipe jaw drawing and turn them loose. Finished these up earlier this week.

Immaculate, Kevin. I know of at least two brothers that (both skilled machinists) that you passed alot of your wisdom on to.

 

[alex03281996]

The swivel jaw seems to give the vise a grimacing look

Can you share the dimensions for that swivel jaw pin?? I need to make one for my latest acquisition!

 

[micahd1997]

Here’s a recent find for me - a 2.5”, 12lb Monarch № 210. It may be the closest that I ever come to finding a new old stock Prentiss. Virtually 100% of the original japanning finish is still intact. The jaw serrations are crisp, and except for signs of very light use on the tops of the jaw towers, it is practically unused. It came from the shop of a 97 year old New York native. Sadly his health is in steep decline, so my only communication was with his son. However, given the vise’s condition I wouldn’t be surprised to hear that he was its only owner.

Prentiss’ entire line of Monarch vises was discontinued in February 1919, so it’s at least 106 years old. Pretty incredible that vises like this exist, and I know many of them are held by members in this thread

 

[MyLittleSpartan]

The listing was taken down, but I just saw a Colombian 109 sell near me, didn't see it on the list of vices and can't find any information online, anyone know anything about it?

 

[micahd1997]

The listing was taken down, but I just saw a Colombian 109 sell near me, didn't see it on the list of vices and can't find any information online, anyone know anything about it?

Any pictures? Did you actually see the "9" in the "109"? Because I don't believe Columbian ever made a 109

 

[MyLittleSpartan]

Any pictures? Did you actually see the "9" in the "109"? Because I don't believe Columbian ever made a 109

Unfortunately by the time I thought of screenshotting them it had been removed and the lady didn't send me more photos.. It really looked like a 109, but I guess it could have been a ground off 8? It was covered in outside grime and half eaten by bushes.

 

[Tom Graham]

When you’re restoring an entire family of Charles Parker 97x series vises, you know those jaw inserts are going to need some attention. So, you reach out to Logan Kendrick (AntiqueVises.com) knowing that he’ll do an excellent and fast job re-surfacing them. I am delighted with the job he did!