Pick my plans apart - What did you wish you did when you built?

[VietGnome]

Planning a DIY 30x40 garage/shop build this summer. Feel like I have most of it nailed down.

Planned Use: Park vehicles, storage for small tractor w/ blower, 4x4, duck boat in the fall/winter, etc. Plan to turn the back section into a workshop area for light vehicle work/assorted workshop ****, as well as an area to work on the boat, small engines, etc. No lift as of current but planned for possibility of 2 post in the future.

Dimensions: 30x40. 12'8" Ceilings
Build: 2x6 Construction, Engineered Slab w/ 8" stemwalls. Vinyl siding, steel roof.
Electrical: 125A Sub panel, 240V for future lift, welder/compressor, and EV future proof. Circuits will be ran for heatpump. Power is planned to be ran underground, will likely stub up through the slab. Lots of outlets, planning for all the ones along the back wall to be in the 40" range to accommodate work benches. I have all the circuits planned for the most part. Outlets are 20A alternating between 2 circuits, I have a few dedicated circuits for a couple freezers and a fridge, if I go down the plumbing route there will be a dedicated POU Hot water tank circuit, lights, openers, etc will all be on separate circuits.
Lighting: 10x 8FT T8 LED Lights, 100K LM total. Should provide 65-75FC on working plane range. Will add task lighting along the back wall as required.
Doors: Found a killer deal - Planning two 10x10s in the front, one 8x8 on the side. Unsure if wall mounted openers will be in the budget - will decide closer to and wire outlets as needed. Plan is to keep the 8x8 on a manual chain pull as it won't see a ton of use.
I know most people prefer the drive through, but that just isn't feasible with the layout of my land. It will also allow me to park the duck boat perpendicular in the shop area to work on it, and will be very convenient to store in the winter, and still fit two vehicles inside.
Plumbing: Possibly planning on running water for a slop sink in the back right corner. Unsure of the logistics of it. Getting water to it should be fairly simple, but it might be a slight uphill run to the septic tank. If that's the case will likely scrap that plan.
Finish: Not planned past electrical right now. Over the winter/next year plan to blow R40 into the ceiling, R21 into the walls, finish walls with painted OSB, and ceiling with white steel.

I think I've covered anything, just looking for some critique/advice, and know what people would change about theirs/can't live without. You can only build once so may as well do it right.

 

[Steve W.]

I had some city zoning restrictions, so I built as large as I could, which was only 24 x 30 x 8 (750 sq. ft. limit).

About the only thing I wish had been done differently was to have larger overhangs on the eaves and possibly the gable ends. I only have one foot on the eaves and nothing on the gable ends.

I don't see any windows in your drawing. I have two across the back, one on the right-side end and one on the left side of the front. They are about 18x36" awning windows. No idea how much extra they might have cost, I just told the contractor what I wanted and he installed them. Advantage is that they can be left open in all but the worst rain storms. You might think they don't provide much of a direct breeze, but would be surprised how much air comes through. I have them mounted high on the walls, so security is not bad. You have to be rather tall to look through them from the outside.

.

 

[VietGnome]

I had some city zoning restrictions, so I built as large as I could, which was only 24 x 30 x 8 (750 sq. ft. limit).

About the only thing I wish had been done differently was to have larger overhangs on the eaves and possibly the gable ends. I only have one foot on the eaves and nothing on the gable ends.

I don't see any windows in your drawing. I have two across the back, one on the right-side end and one on the left side of the front. They are about 18x36" awning windows. No idea how much extra they might have cost, I just told the contractor what I wanted and he installed them. Advantage is that they can be left open in all but the worst rain storms. You might think they don't provide much of a direct breeze, but would be surprised how much air comes through. I have them mounted high on the walls, so security is not bad. You have to be rather tall to look through them from the outside.

.

I forgot to include overhangs in my OP. Im planning on 24" overhangs and 24" Gables.

I thought about windows, but my thought process behind not doing them was A) security risk, B) losing that sweet sweet wallspace, and C) anything on the rear wall would be immediately facing the woods and get little air and no sun. Somewhat similar with the right wall. Left with the 8' door would face my backyard and be decent, but I figured if I wanted a breeze I could open doors.

Oh and the price lol. Plus I don't mind burying myself in a windowless den in the winter.

 

[larry_g]

Take a look at the position of your 8' rollup door. To me it looks like a large rig in the left bay would partially block the door. Consider moving it a bit toward the back wall. Also pay attention to the inside measurements, If your 40' outside your only 39' inside.


lg

 

[VietGnome]

Take a look at the position of your 8' rollup door. To me it looks like a large rig in the left bay would partially block the door. Consider moving it a bit toward the back wall.


lg

That never crossed my mind. It's like 23' or so so it should fit a full size truck in the left bay and not quite block it, but it may be worth pushing back a foot or two.

 

[kngelv]

I'd also have the side door the same width and height as the fronts. You'll never wish you had a smaller door. I'd make sure all the doors have tracks that go just below the ceiling. If you ever plan on jackshaft openers then put high bay outlets for each one with a switch down low. I'd add a third circuit for your receptacles. Don't wait on the lift. It's waited far too long and kick myself all the time because of it. Wher would you put a lift. The side bay makes the most sense because it will be close to your shop area. What are you doing for heat and what state? Take your time and think it through before you build. Keep a written log of what you want to do and make sure the pad is thick enough. Painted OSB looks terrible IMHO. Good luck.

James

 

[VietGnome]

I'd also have the side door the same width and height as the fronts. You'll never wish you had a smaller door. I'd make sure all the doors have tracks that go just below the ceiling. If you ever plan on jackshaft openers then put high bay outlets for each one with a switch down low. I'd add a third circuit for your receptacles. Don't wait on the lift. It's waited far too long and kick myself all the time because of it. Wher would you put a lift. The side bay makes the most sense because it will be close to your shop area. What are you doing for heat and what state? Take your time and think it through before you build. Keep a written log of what you want to do and make sure the pad is thick enough. Painted OSB looks terrible IMHO. Good luck.

James

Ill consider a bigger door. Definitely more expensive and it really won't see a ton of use. It opens out into the yard and it's for the odd utility vehicle and the boat mostly. I could do without it but it's handy to have.

Ill look into a 3rd circuit for outlets, really shouldn't cost a ton more. For what it's worth I was planning 2 for the walls, and 1 for ceiling/outdoor. So technically 3. A lift definitely isn't in the budget now, but it's absolutely on the list. Slab will be 6" so should fit most if not all 2 posts.

Planning to run a heatpump. Likely a 28K BTU. Im in Atlantic Canada.

 

[ptt49er]

My biggest regrets in my 30x40 build...
-I didn't specify flatness on my floor. It's not flat at all.
-too many windows

I did run a 20amp 120v circuit along each wall.

 

[Steve from Socal]

I would suggest 14' eaves, RV or full height trucks in the future, make the space much more flexible.

 

[Codyboy]

Thats a lot going on in a 29x39 footprint.
You will be moving stuff around when in workshop mode.
If thats the largest enclosed I could build, I'd look into a lean-to for the tractor and boat.

Not a deal breaker but instead of a 3068 mandoor I'd do a 3080.

And thats a lot of trusses for a metal roof unless its code or whatever , maybe snow load? Idk.
Here they'd be 4ft o.c. with 1x4 or 2x4 purlins at 2ft or 3ft o.

 

[Copymutt]

Never big enough. I do welding, grinding, painting etc work on the garage slab outside. Weather is 99% cooperative, but the sun is a killer. Doing a huge shade cloth overhead this year.

 

[andyvh1959]

I overdid the number of outlets in my 24x28 shop, like every two feet on three walls, and no single outlet boxes, all duplex. I think I would be just as good with duplex boxes every four feet. I did both 15amp and 20amp circuits/outlets. Could have just done everything with 20amp outlets and breakers. In the 100amp subpanel I had 30amp breakers for my welder, air compressor and eventual electric boiler for the in floor heating system.

Any windows I positioned higher on the walls so its more difficult to peek inside and also keeps the windows higher above work areas and allow for shelves.

 

[dcg9381]

I would suggest 14' eaves, RV or full height trucks in the future, make the space much more flexible.

You need a 16' eve for a 14' door. But you're right. Once you are at 14', if it goes down the road it goes in the shop.

12' ceiling a 10' door is right.

With that truss design, there is no attic space. That could be changed. Should it be changed depends on the insulation plan perhaps.
What's missing here and I see a lot of people miss it is a foundation plan that makes sure the there is a slope on the garage door entrance or a 1" drop for the garage doors. You don't want the slab level with the driveway. You want the doors to close down and there to be a 1" or so lip around things so water doesn't get in.

Watch the slope of ANY concrete around your man doors or roll up doors. Pooling water outside a door is no fun.

 

[Codyboy]

You need a 16' eve for a 14' door. But you're right. Once you are at 14', if it goes down the road it goes in the shop.

12' ceiling a 10' door is right.

With that truss design, there is no attic space. That could be changed. Should it be changed depends on the insulation plan perhaps.
What's missing here and I see a lot of people miss it is a foundation plan that makes sure the there is a slope on the garage door entrance or a 1" drop for the garage doors. You don't want the slab level with the driveway. You want the doors to close down and there to be a 1" or so lip around things so water doesn't get in.

Watch the slope of ANY concrete around your man doors or roll up doors. Pooling water outside a door is no fun.

Yes this. Ive seen posters argue that the garage door threshold tapers down to the driveway but that doesn't keep windows (wind) i think ai gets dumber every day)blown rain out.

When they formed mine , they used 2x material.
So on mine there is a 1 1/2" threshold the bottom of the door sits in. No way for water to blow in.
Yeah yeah its dirty. Still waiting on the driveway part.

 

[TurnipTruck]

Are you copying me?




I also have work areas in the back and other similarities. A tractor (&junk) are in a full length lean-to on the other long side.

 

[HoosierMark]

I would plan for a slop sink. If elevation is wrong put a simple sump pump under it to push the water up to the septic. You could also dig a small pit and drain the water from it into that. You will lIke the sink for simple cleanup.

 

[y'sguy]

I also skipped the windows in my garage/studio. But, I did do skylites, good natuural light. Mine don't open but I wish I had one that did for exhausting of heat build up in the summer.
I would also add that you need to have someone qualified to asses your heat pump with the 12+ ceiling height.

 

[Captain Spaulding]

The two big things I’d have done differently are that I would have installed floor heat, and I’d have built a segregated dirty and hot work area with no wood for welding, grinding and torch work.

After working in my neighbor’s shop, floor heat is a dream.

I do most of my metal work outdoors, which is far from ideal.

 

[andyvh1959]

I gotta get my *** in gear and finish the heated floor system for my shop. The tubing is in the concrete, the wiring is there to just plug in the boiler. For a WI winter if I just kept the shop at 55F it'd be plenty warm enough to work out there in the winter.

 

[VietGnome]

I would also add that you need to have someone qualified to asses your heat pump with the 12+ ceiling height.

What do you mean by this? Ive done some research and some math and it seems that a 28K BTU should be more than enough to heat it?

 

[VietGnome]

Thats a lot going on in a 29x39 footprint.
You will be moving stuff around when in workshop mode.
If thats the largest enclosed I could build, I'd look into a lean-to for the tractor and boat.

Not a deal breaker but instead of a 3068 mandoor I'd do a 3080.

And thats a lot of trusses for a metal roof unless its code or whatever , maybe snow load? Idk.
Here they'd be 4ft o.c. with 1x4 or 2x4 purlins at 2ft or 3ft o.

Yeah I mean I'm sure bigger would be better, but I'm at my price limit lol. Id love a 40x50 or something, but I just can't swing it.

My FIL has a 26 or 28x34 or something like that and has a life time of mechanic and fab tools. He's got it tuned to all fit perfectly so I figured I can make it work easily.

I don't have a ton of stuff now, so I figured I'd be able to tailor everything to the shop as a build it out, then if we upsize down the road it'd only be easier.

Edit: forgot to include, decent snow load here, so we go 2' OC and I'm doing full 5/8 sheathing.

The boat will be stored outside most of the time, it's just an aluminum jon after all. But in the fall I need/want somewhere to dry it out after hunts so the blind doesn't get mouldy, and likely somewhere to tuck it during the winter.

Depending on space I might just pull the motor, blind, flooring, and tarp it and winter it outside.

I've thought about a lean to off the side, but off the blank wall isn't feasible with property lines, and off the 8x8 door side wouldn't be great.

I forgot to include I also have a decent shed that fits the tractor and blower like a glove, so I'll likely store it in there. I like having the option to winter it in the garage incase the chute/auger ice right up and freeze **** stiff.

 

[VietGnome]

You need a 16' eve for a 14' door. But you're right. Once you are at 14', if it goes down the road it goes in the shop.

12' ceiling a 10' door is right.

With that truss design, there is no attic space. That could be changed. Should it be changed depends on the insulation plan perhaps.
What's missing here and I see a lot of people miss it is a foundation plan that makes sure the there is a slope on the garage door entrance or a 1" drop for the garage doors. You don't want the slab level with the driveway. You want the doors to close down and there to be a 1" or so lip around things so water doesn't get in.

Watch the slope of ANY concrete around your man doors or roll up doors. Pooling water outside a door is no fun.

I wasn't aware of the 1" drop. The plan is for the slab to sit a few inches above grade, and be slightly sloped from back to front for snow melt off. Though I didn't consider how that slight grade will effect how the side 8x8 door closes?

I also would love 14' doors, but the only issues is A) definitely raises the price, and B) anything over 12' walls requires engineered plans, which is also a pain in the *** and huge price jump.

FWIW I'm pretty confident I'll never be an RV guy.

My biggest regrets in my 30x40 build...
-I didn't specify flatness on my floor. It's not flat at all.
-too many windows

I did run a 20amp 120v circuit along each wall.

What do you mean by flatness? You want no grade and totally level? Do you live in an area with snow?

 

[Junkman]

10'x10' doors and a 14' ceiling. Those 2 things will cover all future needs that you can think of.

 

[ptt49er]

What do you mean by flatness? You want no grade and totally level? Do you live in an area with snow?

I have humps in my floor from where the trucks dumped and valleys in between. Sometimes a 1/2" difference over 10' or so. I wouldve like to have seen 3/16* or less but I didn't specify (or know to). Sure I could fix the peaks but it's hard to when it's full of junk lol

Hardly any snow in northern South Carolina.

If possible add a half bath. Having a toilet in the shop has been great!

Good luck and enjoy the build!

 

[gtae07]

Lots of outlets, planning for all the ones along the back wall to be in the 40" range to accommodate work benches.

I would suggest more like 50 ish inches everywhere. Read on here once that outlets should be high enough to allow you to lean a 4x8 sheet against the wall without blocking them and that turned out to be good advice when I built my old shop.

Also, each wall had two dedicated outlet circuts, alternating every 4 feet. My lighting was split between two dedicated circuits as well. Probably overkill but I wanted to be able to work on electrical stuff without having to kill all the lights.

 

[MushCreek]

I always put lighting on it's own circuit so if I trip a breaker I'm not in the dark. And talking about dark- if you are dead set against a small window, plan on having emergency lighting. We get outages fairly often where I am, and when the lights go out suddenly, it's DARK. I put a very small window about 10' off the ground just for that reason.

How far are you from the house? As an old fart, I use the bathroom a LOT during the day. Saves a lot of walking back and forth. You really need a way to wash your hands, too.

 

[VietGnome]

I always put lighting on it's own circuit so if I trip a breaker I'm not in the dark. And talking about dark- if you are dead set against a small window, plan on having emergency lighting. We get outages fairly often where I am, and when the lights go out suddenly, it's DARK. I put a very small window about 10' off the ground just for that reason.

How far are you from the house? As an old fart, I use the bathroom a LOT during the day. Saves a lot of walking back and forth. You really need a way to wash your hands, too.

I'm quite a close to the house. Probably a 40-50ft walk to the back door.

I also have a few wooded acres so I piss in the woods like its nobodies buisness.

I'll look into the feasibility of pumping to the septic if I can't get it graded right.

I've thought about just running a sink for hand washing only that drains out the back, but it's definitely against code.

If anything if it seems feasible ill stub in plumbing and tackle it down the road.

 

[finn]

Reconsider your decision to eliminate windows. Natural light is great, as is the ventilation they provide.

Security has never been an issue to me, and if I leave my doors open I get squirrels and chipmunks, plus the occasional garter snake and roaming mouse inside.

 

[bluedog225]

High small windows are great for light with security. Maybe frame for roll up doors for better security (or barn doors). And beefy framing for man door. Nice to be able to lock it up tight.

I sloped my slab for drainage and wish I had more flat area. Nice for a variety of tasks.

I didn’t see where you are. But getting off grid with solar is becoming more feasible. May want to check your roof direction, slope, and ability to carry panels. Though ground mount is easier/better in many ways. And a place for two refrigerator sized stacks of LiFePO4 batteries. Probably want them on an outside wall and plan for fireproofing the space and surrounding. Very unlikely to burn (and will not burn like a tesl–different chemistry) but can possibly vent. Also very rare. Some electrical planning involved as well depending on wether you want it be grid tied.

figuring out the plumbing aside, a slop sink seems handy and a toilet/shower even more handy.

 

[cvairwerks]

I'd suggest putting the lights on two separate circuits... Don't always need them all on and less chance of popping both breakers at one time.

 

[JohnX14]

A few thoughts based on what others have said, in no particular order.

I don't like the looks of the painted osb, but it's very functional. My friend did finished plywood and I don't love that either, but it looks much better. I do understand the function vs. cost.

I'd never put a 1" drop from shop to apron. It's an ankle breaker. You can slope a concrete apron 2 or 3' out and have better effects. At the man door, I'd look at having a 4-6" step down, if you can work the grade properly.

The 50" height just seems high to me for outlets. Yes plywood laying against wall will block the use of them if lower, but there are enough outlets that there's one nearby.

In my much smaller 28x28 garage, I had 2 windows and a man door on one wall. The light from the windows was nice, but the windows blocked me from using that wall for shelves, ladder storage, etc. as much as I'd have liked.

 

[logical]

I put outlets at whatever height will suit their intended use. I can't remember the last time I had a 4x8 sheet of anything leaning against a wall but it was definitely back in the later part of the 20th century.

 

[racecougar]

Agreed with the others about windows (they are absolutely worth giving up a little wall space for) and sloping (not stepping) the slab at the garage doors.

Regarding the metal roof, I highly recommend going hidden fastener (like standing seam) if you don't want to deal with leaks and replacing screws down the road. I just replaced all 1,640 roof screws on my 7-1/2 year old building over the past week. Not a fun job. I don't know where you're located, but since you mention snow load, this is even more important, as snow has more time to find an opening to leak through than rain.

I'll also suggest surface-mounted EMT for your wiring runs. It avoids weakening your framing with a bunch of drilled holes, makes insulation a snap, but most importantly, it allows you to easily make changes in the future. I've moved, and also added, several outlets over the past 7-1/2 years in my building.

I'm confused as to whether you're using roll-up or sectional doors. Your plans show the outline of sectionals, but a number of posts in this thread point to roll-ups. I would avoid roll-ups at all costs, especially on a building that you want to insulate.

 

[VietGnome]

Agreed with the others about windows (they are absolutely worth giving up a little wall space for) and sloping (not stepping) the slab at the garage doors.

Regarding the metal roof, I highly recommend going hidden fastener (like standing seam) if you don't want to deal with leaks and replacing screws down the road. I just replaced all 1,640 roof screws on my 7-1/2 year old building over the past week. Not a fun job. I don't know where you're located, but since you mention snow load, this is even more important, as snow has more time to find an opening to leak through than rain.

I'll also suggest surface-mounted EMT for your wiring runs. It avoids weakening your framing with a bunch of drilled holes, makes insulation a snap, but most importantly, it allows you to easily make changes in the future. I've moved, and also added, several outlets over the past 7-1/2 years in my building.

I'm confused as to whether you're using roll-up or sectional doors. Your plans show the outline of sectionals, but a number of posts in this thread point to roll-ups. I would avoid roll-ups at all costs, especially on a building that you want to insulate.

Maybe I'll reach out for a quote for standing seam to compare. The thought of tons of screws makes me a little uneasy, but everywhere seems to praise it over shingles.

I was under the impression that the screws were good for 10-15 atleast? Pending they're not overtight.

Surface mounting did cross my mind, but my main concern is I won't be finishing right away, so I dont see how it's possible if I don't have OSB up right away?

Doors are sectional, not sure why some have said rollup.

 

[racecougar]

I was under the impression that the screws were good for 10-15 atleast? Pending they're not overtight.

They CAN last that long, but I promise that any crew installing them for you won't care as much about a perfect installation as you would. Many of mine were overtorqued.

If you're stuck doing exposed fasteners, at least go with ZXL's, or even better, Atlas UltiMate.

 

[VietGnome]

They CAN last that long, but I promise that any crew installing them for you won't care as much about a perfect installation as you would. Many of mine were overtorqued.

If you're stuck doing exposed fasteners, at least go with ZXL's, or even better, Atlas UltiMate.

Thanks for the advice.

The only crew I'm paying is concrete, everything else I'm doing myself so I can take the time and care to do it right.

 

[MushCreek]

My roof was put on in 2011, and no leaks or water stains yet. Exposed screws. I do inspect periodically.

 

[ATC]

Skip the windows unless they are horizontal up at the roofline. I have 4 in my 24x32 and they are a huge waste of space. I have cabinets blocking 2 of them. And the SW facing ones let the sun blind me in the winter when the sun is lower. I hang a piece of cardboard over one by my toolbox in the winter months.

I wish we would have plumbed ours for water and ran an Ethernet cable to it.

 

[dcg9381]

I wasn't aware of the 1" drop. The plan is for the slab to sit a few inches above grade, and be slightly sloped from back to front for snow melt off. Though I didn't consider how that slight grade will effect how the side 8x8 door closes?

You can do it that way. I actually do a slight slope on the garage slab AND a 1" drop at the door. Be careful that your driveway approach slab has correct slope also.. But water can't go "up hill" which is why I prefer to drop at the door threshold. I've seen so many people make mistakes on this...

What do you mean by flatness? You want no grade and totally level? Do you live in an area with snow?

 

[racecougar]

Again, as opposed to a lip at the doors, you can slope the pad from the door to the edge. This old photo is the best I have on-hand at the moment, and it may be hard to discern, but the pad slopes outward right at the door openings. It accomplishes the same as a step/lip without creating an obstacle.

Thanks for the advice.

The only crew I'm paying is concrete, everything else I'm doing myself so I can take the time and care to do it right.

If that's the case, the overall cost difference between standing seam and typical R-panel roofing is minimal. The main adder is labor.