yevangelis
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
youre right about that ^
youre right about that ^
picts of your in-floor heat set ups.
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Addrock
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Me too! Love the heat!
Me too! Love the heat!
yevangelis
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
NICE you two, so simple...
NICE you two, so simple...
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Well not as simple. Handles all our heat plus domestic hot water.
Water softener >> Sediment filter >> Carbon filter >> UV Filter. Heat exchanger keeps things separate. 2 zones, top with priority.
Well not as simple. Handles all our heat plus domestic hot water.
Water softener >> Sediment filter >> Carbon filter >> UV Filter. Heat exchanger keeps things separate. 2 zones, top with priority.
keweenawbee
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Butcherblock no less.
Butcherblock no less.
z28toz06
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
ww, some serious diy here.
ww, some serious diy here.
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Our ICF walls only have ribs every 8 inches for fastening. I needed a backing material and it was on clearance. Its just some kind of hardwood shelving from HD. Its around our garage doors too lol.
Our ICF walls only have ribs every 8 inches for fastening. I needed a backing material and it was on clearance. Its just some kind of hardwood shelving from HD. Its around our garage doors too lol.
Burl
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Isn't this the idea of radiant heat? To put the heat from the fluid into the floor? If I was only losing 10 degrees between the supply and return I think I'd want to slow down the flow.
Isn't this the idea of radiant heat? To put the heat from the fluid into the floor? If I was only losing 10 degrees between the supply and return I think I'd want to slow down the flow.
keweenawbee
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
What is that silver sardine can to the left of your air eliminator? Looks like a hydraulic separator but I don't see four pipes going into it.
What is that silver sardine can to the left of your air eliminator? Looks like a hydraulic separator but I don't see four pipes going into it.
00si2
Active member
keweenawbee
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
I realize they are different (kinda the same, but no fluid exchange), but don't they both need four pipes? Must be the angle of the photo. Are you saying that is your source of your DHW in lieu of a coil in a tank? Pumps must run a lot?
I realize they are different (kinda the same, but no fluid exchange), but don't they both need four pipes? Must be the angle of the photo. Are you saying that is your source of your DHW in lieu of a coil in a tank? Pumps must run a lot?
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Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
some good info in here.
and some real nice work overall.
How much is it costing you guys to run? I plan to build a new shop in the next year or so. but dont know if electric or wood would be a better way to go for heat. The plan is to do radiant floor, but its all up in the air right now.
some good info in here.
and some real nice work overall.
How much is it costing you guys to run? I plan to build a new shop in the next year or so. but dont know if electric or wood would be a better way to go for heat. The plan is to do radiant floor, but its all up in the air right now.
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
You are correct, it does have 4 pipes. Hot in from heater and return, in from floor and return. Pumps only run when either floor calls for heat. You can see the four gauges , two small units indicating temp and two larger tridicators indicating temp / pressure on either side of the heat exchanger.
Its actually quite a bit simpler than it looks. You basically have a pump fed loop running off to the side of your standard water setup. When a floor calls for heat, it simply kicks in both the floor pump ( one of the green Taco's ) and the larger domestic side pump. Regular domestic hot water is not effected by the floors.
The little green unit under the taco switching relay is simply an auto fill valve assembly which ensures the system is always topped up and running at the appropriate pressure. Its just fed with the standard cold water supply as we do not use a mix.
You are correct, it does have 4 pipes. Hot in from heater and return, in from floor and return. Pumps only run when either floor calls for heat. You can see the four gauges , two small units indicating temp and two larger tridicators indicating temp / pressure on either side of the heat exchanger.
Its actually quite a bit simpler than it looks. You basically have a pump fed loop running off to the side of your standard water setup. When a floor calls for heat, it simply kicks in both the floor pump ( one of the green Taco's ) and the larger domestic side pump. Regular domestic hot water is not effected by the floors.
The little green unit under the taco switching relay is simply an auto fill valve assembly which ensures the system is always topped up and running at the appropriate pressure. Its just fed with the standard cold water supply as we do not use a mix.
keweenawbee
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Just trying to figure out your system. I see more than just a supply and a return pipe on your boiler, do you have a DHW (domestic hot water) storage tank of some kind out of the photo? Prestige makes their Excellence boiler that has a small internal hot water tank that is really cool, but it is a bit larger than yours in physical size, and I have never seen a boiler act as an on demand domestic water heater w/o some sort of tank. But then again I am a master of none.
Just trying to figure out your system. I see more than just a supply and a return pipe on your boiler, do you have a DHW (domestic hot water) storage tank of some kind out of the photo? Prestige makes their Excellence boiler that has a small internal hot water tank that is really cool, but it is a bit larger than yours in physical size, and I have never seen a boiler act as an on demand domestic water heater w/o some sort of tank. But then again I am a master of none.
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keweenawbee
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
That isn't a Quietside is it? Yikes.
That isn't a Quietside is it? Yikes.
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
very nicely done complicated yet condensed very well executed. is everything functional?
Well not as simple. Handles all our heat plus domestic hot water.
Water softener >> Sediment filter >> Carbon filter >> UV Filter. Heat exchanger keeps things separate. 2 zones, top with priority.
very nicely done complicated yet condensed very well executed. is everything functional?
FATBOYINMAINE
Member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
which is more expensive to purchase and run, an electric hot water tank or an electric on demand set up? lots of good info on this site!!! building a 30x50 soon thanks
which is more expensive to purchase and run, an electric hot water tank or an electric on demand set up? lots of good info on this site!!! building a 30x50 soon thanks
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Technically a BTU is a BTU, Im sure you will have a slight heat loss from the tank, but not much.
Technically a BTU is a BTU, Im sure you will have a slight heat loss from the tank, but not much.
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Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
sorry for not replying for afew months
I am using geothermal heating as my only heat source. they have two types of geothermal heaters water to forced air, and water to water. I am using water to water, just like a boiler
the way it works is, there is a refrigerant compressor inside the unit and as it condenses the refrigerant heat is given off just like any typical air conditioner. with water I am capturing that heat and putting it into my holding tank for the infloor heat (typical 130 degrees), but also like any air conditioner cold refrigerant is also a byproduct. to "warm up" the cold refrigerant it runs through another water source that comes from 4,600' of pipe directional bored into the earth 30' deep under my shop floor.
it gets more complicated than that as I am running a two stage setup with multiple compressors that are all multi-speed, but its way cheap to run and I kept my shop (54x83 w/ 16' ceiling) at 70 degrees all winter long
I have a question for you are you are you going to run a boiler also or just a geo thermo. are you going to heat the shop more than that?not quite sure how that works.if you could educate us that would be great. ps shop looks awsome keep up the great work
sorry for not replying for afew months
I am using geothermal heating as my only heat source. they have two types of geothermal heaters water to forced air, and water to water. I am using water to water, just like a boiler
the way it works is, there is a refrigerant compressor inside the unit and as it condenses the refrigerant heat is given off just like any typical air conditioner. with water I am capturing that heat and putting it into my holding tank for the infloor heat (typical 130 degrees), but also like any air conditioner cold refrigerant is also a byproduct. to "warm up" the cold refrigerant it runs through another water source that comes from 4,600' of pipe directional bored into the earth 30' deep under my shop floor.
it gets more complicated than that as I am running a two stage setup with multiple compressors that are all multi-speed, but its way cheap to run and I kept my shop (54x83 w/ 16' ceiling) at 70 degrees all winter long
Rich H.
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Whoa there, can we back up just a little bit??
"For me it was a matter of how much hot water was entering the system at a given time. We needed to adjust the proportioning value (heat mixing valve?) to allow much less "hot" water in. Basically the system was getting too much hot water at a time.
Now the valve only lets in a small amount of hot water while the pump is running. The pump runs longer but I use less heated water.
Just a thought, hope you get it figured out."
---------------
"yep once i got everything ballenced out and everything up to temp.turned it down to 55f and just left it there it is tollerable."
------------
Guys, can you please expand on that a bit?
I just finished the plumbing aspect on my system using a 9.6kw hydroshark, but still need a thermostat and the anti freeze before I can fire up the system.
But!! I'd rather avoid the "arm and a leg" time period if possible!
I can't spare an arm and a leg at the moment....
I've got a primary/boiler pump on the left...and secondary/circulator pump on the right, just like this one:
http://www.hydro-smartwholesale.com/Images/HTPanel.png
After I get it filled and running, should I be looking at reducing flow through the primary/boiler pump?
Both pumps are 3 speed...should I start out with the boiler pump on "low", and then reduce the flow even more by closing the valves next to it also?
Or is the flow of boiler water best reduced from another point?
Please educate me, I really need to get my brain wrapped around this before I fire up the system. The I sheet that came with the panel is fine for helping me hook it up and make it work (and I am a bit of a bonehead, so it did help), but there isn't any info in there in "how to run it without going broke" (probably the most important part!).
Whoa there, can we back up just a little bit??
"For me it was a matter of how much hot water was entering the system at a given time. We needed to adjust the proportioning value (heat mixing valve?) to allow much less "hot" water in. Basically the system was getting too much hot water at a time.
Now the valve only lets in a small amount of hot water while the pump is running. The pump runs longer but I use less heated water.
Just a thought, hope you get it figured out."
---------------
"yep once i got everything ballenced out and everything up to temp.turned it down to 55f and just left it there it is tollerable."
------------
Guys, can you please expand on that a bit?
I just finished the plumbing aspect on my system using a 9.6kw hydroshark, but still need a thermostat and the anti freeze before I can fire up the system.
But!! I'd rather avoid the "arm and a leg" time period if possible!
I can't spare an arm and a leg at the moment....
I've got a primary/boiler pump on the left...and secondary/circulator pump on the right, just like this one:
http://www.hydro-smartwholesale.com/Images/HTPanel.png
After I get it filled and running, should I be looking at reducing flow through the primary/boiler pump?
Both pumps are 3 speed...should I start out with the boiler pump on "low", and then reduce the flow even more by closing the valves next to it also?
Or is the flow of boiler water best reduced from another point?
Please educate me, I really need to get my brain wrapped around this before I fire up the system. The I sheet that came with the panel is fine for helping me hook it up and make it work (and I am a bit of a bonehead, so it did help), but there isn't any info in there in "how to run it without going broke" (probably the most important part!).
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Here is my simple electric setup. I was going to wait to get a new NG line ran, but found a smoking deal on a Seisco electric boiler.
Line voltage thermostat controls the pump and temp sensors in the Siesco turn itself on.
Here is my simple electric setup. I was going to wait to get a new NG line ran, but found a smoking deal on a Seisco electric boiler.
Line voltage thermostat controls the pump and temp sensors in the Siesco turn itself on.
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Spire
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Took me a few years to figure this system out. Three floors of 4 loops per floor on a Heat Link controller. Domestic Hot water tank off of boiler. This small room is attached to the back of my house in a pit 8 feet deep. 175k BTU Nat Gas boiler. 3800 sq ft. house. The boiler is sitting on the 2 x 12 shelf seen in the second picture, if that makes sense.
MANY vast improvements are planned.
Took me a few years to figure this system out. Three floors of 4 loops per floor on a Heat Link controller. Domestic Hot water tank off of boiler. This small room is attached to the back of my house in a pit 8 feet deep. 175k BTU Nat Gas boiler. 3800 sq ft. house. The boiler is sitting on the 2 x 12 shelf seen in the second picture, if that makes sense.
MANY vast improvements are planned.
Attachments
Spire
Well-known member
BadgerBoilerMN
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
The money and time misspent is always astounding.
Not bad on the Buderus GB though. I give you credit for reading the installation manual.
Using a water heater as a dedicated heat source for radiant floors takes a little more than reflected here. But no worries, you will get another chance in about five years. Do be sure to keep your CO detector full of new batteries.
All parts from Menard's ?...good luck with that. I design a lot of systems, but repair more. The guys at Menard's complain that the customers too often ask for help after the fact.
Pumps installed with vertical shafts "up" or "down" are one of the clearest signs of a novice hydronic man, be he amateur or professional.
Just to be clear, air is death to all hydronic systems and some people who run their boilers dry...especially true of electric boilers (more DIY I suspect). Air is not hard to eliminate if the system is designed right.
Boilers, and pumps are almost always over-sized in almost every residential and light commercial hydronic heating system for lack of a proper heat load analysis and simple, proven design parameters. IMG]http://www.badgerboilerservice.com/images/SampleHeatLoadAnalysis.pdf[/IMG]
This is a bad thing and a waste of resources. [
The money and time misspent is always astounding.
Not bad on the Buderus GB though. I give you credit for reading the installation manual.
Using a water heater as a dedicated heat source for radiant floors takes a little more than reflected here. But no worries, you will get another chance in about five years. Do be sure to keep your CO detector full of new batteries.
All parts from Menard's ?...good luck with that. I design a lot of systems, but repair more. The guys at Menard's complain that the customers too often ask for help after the fact.
Pumps installed with vertical shafts "up" or "down" are one of the clearest signs of a novice hydronic man, be he amateur or professional.
Just to be clear, air is death to all hydronic systems and some people who run their boilers dry...especially true of electric boilers (more DIY I suspect). Air is not hard to eliminate if the system is designed right.
Boilers, and pumps are almost always over-sized in almost every residential and light commercial hydronic heating system for lack of a proper heat load analysis and simple, proven design parameters. IMG]http://www.badgerboilerservice.com/images/SampleHeatLoadAnalysis.pdf[/IMG]
This is a bad thing and a waste of resources. [
BadgerBoilerMN
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
I did overlook your system Possum. I like it though a low water cut-is in order whend
the boiler is the highest point of the heating system. Again, most especially on electric
boilers and I might add, critical on DIY electric boilers.
I did overlook your system Possum. I like it though a low water cut-is in order whend
the boiler is the highest point of the heating system. Again, most especially on electric
boilers and I might add, critical on DIY electric boilers.
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Dude, that looks awesome! I love how tidy it is. Nice work
Here is my simple electric setup. I was going to wait to get a new NG line ran, but found a smoking deal on a Seisco electric boiler.
Line voltage thermostat controls the pump and temp sensors in the Siesco turn itself on.
Dude, that looks awesome! I love how tidy it is. Nice work
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
LOL..
Dunno about that man.
There are alot of people who are very satisfied with the in floor systems they have purchased from Menards.
LOL..
Dunno about that man.
There are alot of people who are very satisfied with the in floor systems they have purchased from Menards.
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Menards...what are you guys rich or something?
Did I mention my heater was under $200 on eBay lol. I'm sure if I would have asked about it here before I tried it many responses would have be negative.
Seriously tho, I think a cheap simple system can work well and be as simple as a hammer.
Menards...what are you guys rich or something?
Did I mention my heater was under $200 on eBay lol. I'm sure if I would have asked about it here before I tried it many responses would have be negative.
Seriously tho, I think a cheap simple system can work well and be as simple as a hammer.
VairKing
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Here is my system. The main reason I am posting this is to show that you don't have to spend thousands and thousands of dollars to have in floor heat. Some people have more money in copper fittings than I do into my whole system. So try not to laugh or criticize too much, my in floor is as simple as it gets, as cheap as it gets, and works really really well.
1st pic shows my wood boiler, which I designed and built myself. It works well. Heating my 1500 sq ft house only, it consumes about 5 cords of wood/winter which is pretty damn decent here in MI. With the shop tacked on I am averaging about 8 cords.
The shop is 200 ft away from the boiler, and pex was laid in a trench and then sprayfoamed over.
1000 sq ft, 2 "zones", 16" on center runs, with faucet style valves on each one to help with zone control, although both are wide open and I see no need to change it.
The rest is simple. A 24 volt transformer sends voltage to a digital thermostat on the wall which turns a 24 volt relay on and off, which switches the pump on and off. No heat exchangers are used, boilerwater goes through the floor. A mixing valve has been added to reduce water temp entering the floor from 180 to about 90 degrees.
The bucket is used to purge air out of the system, as my shop is uphill from the boiler bleeding the air out was a challenge.
This is the first year I have been running it and it works great.
Now back to your fancy beautiful polished copper systems with gauges and do-dads galore.
Here is my system. The main reason I am posting this is to show that you don't have to spend thousands and thousands of dollars to have in floor heat. Some people have more money in copper fittings than I do into my whole system. So try not to laugh or criticize too much, my in floor is as simple as it gets, as cheap as it gets, and works really really well.
1st pic shows my wood boiler, which I designed and built myself. It works well. Heating my 1500 sq ft house only, it consumes about 5 cords of wood/winter which is pretty damn decent here in MI. With the shop tacked on I am averaging about 8 cords.
The shop is 200 ft away from the boiler, and pex was laid in a trench and then sprayfoamed over.
1000 sq ft, 2 "zones", 16" on center runs, with faucet style valves on each one to help with zone control, although both are wide open and I see no need to change it.
The rest is simple. A 24 volt transformer sends voltage to a digital thermostat on the wall which turns a 24 volt relay on and off, which switches the pump on and off. No heat exchangers are used, boilerwater goes through the floor. A mixing valve has been added to reduce water temp entering the floor from 180 to about 90 degrees.
The bucket is used to purge air out of the system, as my shop is uphill from the boiler bleeding the air out was a challenge.
This is the first year I have been running it and it works great.
Now back to your fancy beautiful polished copper systems with gauges and do-dads galore.
Attachments
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![P1010223 [800x600].jpg](/forum/data/attachments/167/167188-d02e30dbd36cb9d832271dcb0e97e495.jpg)
![IMG_0068 [800x600].jpg](/forum/data/attachments/167/167273-69b9198341f8fadef2089ffcf32867e2.jpg)
e30bradley
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
I love copper, its so pretty. ha totally off topic, sorry.
I love copper, its so pretty. ha totally off topic, sorry.
koditten
Well-known member
Re: picts of your in floor heat set ups.
Nice job! It's nice to see that it doesn't take a rocket scientist to make a system work. I wish I had access to wood to heat my floor system. I'm stuck with the 150 bucks extra for natural gas. I'm not complaining a bit. I figure that an't bad to do what I want when I want.
You didn't mention anything about your insulation package, but I'm guessing that you took no shortcuts.
KO
Nice job! It's nice to see that it doesn't take a rocket scientist to make a system work. I wish I had access to wood to heat my floor system. I'm stuck with the 150 bucks extra for natural gas. I'm not complaining a bit. I figure that an't bad to do what I want when I want.
You didn't mention anything about your insulation package, but I'm guessing that you took no shortcuts.
KO