Swinging garage doors?

[ceo012384]

In the garage/workshop I'm currently building (see my other thread), there is NO possibility of using an overhead standard door due to ceiling height. I need to use a swinging door of some sort. The opening is about 8 feet wide and about 6 feet high. I was thinking of just two 4-foot-wide doors that would swing outwards.

However, it seems that no garage door company wants to or does make these, and many seem opposed to installing it. The ones that might do it want to charge 5 grand just for the doors, which seems preposterous. After hearing that, I didin't even want to hear what their install charges might be.

Does anyone have any suggestions? Is this something I could try to make myself? It doesn't sound that hard in theory, but I know it is probably tougher than it sounds.

I want them to be insulated and sturdy, and hopefully last a long time.

Thanks in advance.

 

[poncho62]

You could make your own....4x8 sheets of plywood with foam sandwiched in between.......Some nice trim on the outside. If you screw them together they will be much more sturdy than with nails.

Have you thought about doors that slide sideways on a rail?....Room permitting of course.

BTW....I just had 2 10'x8' doors installed...........$2500 installed

 

[elvee]

Search the site for carriage house doors. There are a couple of guys on here, myself included, who have gone that route. There is one very well done build on here where the owner built the doors himself. They can be as simple or complex as you want. The biggest factor with these style doors is making them resistant to sagging under their own weight.

 

[jamm]

In the garage/workshop I'm currently building (see my other thread), there is NO possibility of using an overhead standard door due to ceiling height. I need to use a swinging door of some sort. The opening is about 8 feet wide and about 6 feet high. I was thinking of just two 4-foot-wide doors that would swing outwards.

I don't know if anyone makes this, but what about a roll-up door (not sectional)with the mounting hardware on the exterior. After looking at your other post it looks like there would be room above the door on the exterior.

Have you thought about a sliding door (barn type) like Norm has on "The New Yankee Workshop"? My personal 2 cents worth is to stay away from a two door installation as I think it would require a center post to keep the doors secure and have as little flex as possible when closed. Then the post will always be in the way.

Good luck either way!

 

[Franz©]

There is always bifold, not a bad solution if you eill only be opening from the inside.

 

[TooTall]

Here's an outfit that has exactly what you want. Not cheap though.
http://www.realcarriagedoors.com/

Cheers,
Kurt O.

 

[1320stang]

Do they go out and 'mingle' with other garage doors?

 

[Franz©]

Not real sure Larry, but I think swinging garage doors are groupies for a musical group.

Sort of the garage version of DeadHeads.

I have no plans to do an investigation.

 

[Sundowner]

here's a thread from the first set of doors I built for my garage
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10845

 

[Yotaforce]

I was going to do that at one point. I had planned to build the frame out of angle iron, cover it with matching cladding and plywood, and maybe the styrofoam backing inside. It was going to be the cheapest route, but I ended up going all out with my roll up doors, so I never did test my design.

 

[TerryG]

5000.00! Wow, that seems high don't it?

I have swing doors on my shop. 4 X 8, but they came with the building. Simple to make, and mine are 10 years old now.

 

[nyjets53]

try this site for making your own doors...I'll be making a set real soon, following alot of his techniques...

http://www.woodshopdemos.com/gar-dr-1.htm

 

[89vert]

I made mine . They are 2X4 's tenoned at the corners and filled with insulation . They have been up for years and work great .

 

[ceo012384]

You could make your own....4x8 sheets of plywood with foam sandwiched in between.......Some nice trim on the outside. If you screw them together they will be much more sturdy than with nails.

Yeah based on everyone's responses in this thread I am planning to make my own. Definitely will be using screws, big lag bolts, etc.

I don't know if anyone makes this, but what about a roll-up door (not sectional)with the mounting hardware on the exterior. After looking at your other post it looks like there would be room above the door on the exterior.

Have you thought about a sliding door (barn type) like Norm has on "The New Yankee Workshop"? My personal 2 cents worth is to stay away from a two door installation as I think it would require a center post to keep the doors secure and have as little flex as possible when closed. Then the post will always be in the way.

Good luck either way!

As far as the rollup doors, the only thing I could find that someone makes are the ones that they use for convenience stores and such... i.e. they are metal and very ghetto-looking.

As far as sliding doors, the ground outside isn't really suited for that, unforunately.

Here's an outfit that has exactly what you want. Not cheap though.
http://www.realcarriagedoors.com/

no way I'm paying that kind of cash. Looks nice, though.

Do they go out and 'mingle' with other garage doors?

good one!

here's a thread from the first set of doors I built for my garage
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10845

Wow man, great work!!! Those are really nice looking! I'm pretty good with woodworking, but not quite that good I don't think.

try this site for making your own doors...I'll be making a set real soon, following alot of his techniques...

http://www.woodshopdemos.com/gar-dr-1.htm

Thanks man!!! That writeup is very helpful. I've got a million ideas running through my head... we'll see where I go with it.

I made mine . They are 2X4 's tenoned at the corners and filled with insulation . They have been up for years and work great .

I may do something basic like that since I don't have huge amounts of time for the planning.






Thanks for the suggestions, guys

We'll see what my stubborn do-it-yourself *** can come up with

 

[kbs2244]

The 2 concerns I have with swinging doors is snow and auto openers.
If you are in snow country, you have to shovel before you can open them.
And most people keep the snow blower in the garage.
Plus I do not know of any one that make an opener for them.
I would think about bi-fold. Just remember you need to beef up the building to take the weight of them hanging out there.

 

[rsanter]

if it was me I would make them. use a welded metal frame so you will never have sag and clad them in the finish you want. install some insulation in the gap from the thickness on the metal.

bob

 

[jklingel]

make 'em

In 1975 I built my own garage doors and hinges, just like you'd build a wall. They swing (when it is dark...) and are each 6' wide by 8' high. Work fine. When I build my new garage, I will install a people door in one of them for a variety of reasons. No one, btw, says they have to be the same size, either. Depending on what you take in/out a lot, you could always build them asymmetrically and open the small one most of the time, leaving the large one more "semi-permanent". Good luck.

 

[markb1]

We live on what was an old dairy and these doors enclosed one end of an equipment shed for a one car garage. I think these might have been made in the '20s or '30s, the house and old barn go back to the turn of the century.

 

[Dead Skunk]

What about using SIPs (structural insulated panels, I think?)? They're basically a plywood or strandboard and styrofoam sandwhich. The edges would have to be framed with some 2X6 ,but they should be relatively sturdy since the 3 layers are all glued together somehow.I'm pretty sure they come in 4' X 8' units.I would think they would resist sagging reasonably well and would give great insulation value.
Warren

 

[Franz©]

The SIP is effective because the foam is placed as liquid and sticks to everything.
Some very interesting SIP walls have been coming out of factorys in the last couple years for replacement housing in hurricane prone areas. The drywall is laid flat, the stud assembly laid on top of the drywall, and then a layer of foam holds the board to the studs. Another layer of foam and the plywood or OSB skin is laid in place & tacked. The end product is about 4 times as strong as a 2 x 6 wall and has double the insulating quality.

 

[Pure Oil]

Nice article!!!!

 

[jimvannoy]

Pretty easy to make them. Just some 2x4's and sheets of plywood. You could also make a sliding door if you have enough space on the building walls. Here is the sliding door I made for my barn in the background and the swinging doors I made for my shop. Also made the smaller set for my carriage house.

 

[daddylama]

....

dig the compressor shack, outside... hate that damned racket inside the shop!

is than a model A frame leaning against the door in the far left of the picture? got so used to looking for stuff like that (30s car parts) when i'm driving or walking around, that it starts to be the first things i look for in pictures (well, the kinda pictures that are on a family friendly site like this, anyway )

 

[Sundowner]

The SIP is effective because the foam is placed as liquid and sticks to everything.
Some very interesting SIP walls have been coming out of factorys in the last couple years for replacement housing in hurricane prone areas. The drywall is laid flat, the stud assembly laid on top of the drywall, and then a layer of foam holds the board to the studs. Another layer of foam and the plywood or OSB skin is laid in place & tacked. The end product is about 4 times as strong as a 2 x 6 wall and has double the insulating quality.

the EPS (Expanded PolyStyrene) infill between the OSB sheets in SIP's has been known to experience creep over time. I understand that the newer formulas help correct this, but I can't confirm it and I don't think I'd use an SIP as a stand-alons structure for a swinging door.

 

[Franz©]

You live long enough and you'll find damn near everything creeps over time due to gravity. Stop by and I'll prove that to ya.

 

[jimvannoy]

dig the compressor shack, outside... hate that damned racket inside the shop!

is than a model A frame leaning against the door in the far left of the picture? got so used to looking for stuff like that (30s car parts) when i'm driving or walking around, that it starts to be the first things i look for in pictures (well, the kinda pictures that are on a family friendly site like this, anyway )

Yea the frame is for my 31 coupe. The body is in the shop. It has a 4" chop. I will also channel it. Building a 50's style Hot Rod with flathead V8.

 

[ceo012384]

What about using SIPs (structural insulated panels, I think?)? They're basically a plywood or strandboard and styrofoam sandwhich. The edges would have to be framed with some 2X6 ,but they should be relatively sturdy since the 3 layers are all glued together somehow.I'm pretty sure they come in 4' X 8' units.I would think they would resist sagging reasonably well and would give great insulation value.
Warren

The SIP is effective because the foam is placed as liquid and sticks to everything.
Some very interesting SIP walls have been coming out of factorys in the last couple years for replacement housing in hurricane prone areas. The drywall is laid flat, the stud assembly laid on top of the drywall, and then a layer of foam holds the board to the studs. Another layer of foam and the plywood or OSB skin is laid in place & tacked. The end product is about 4 times as strong as a 2 x 6 wall and has double the insulating quality.

How much do SIPs cost?

They are drywall on one side?

Are the wooden bits pine?

I assume none of the wood is pressure treated?

Thanks guys.

 

[Franz©]

The SIP I've been exposed to were all manufactured to order, so it ain't like you're going to call a lumber yard and buy plywood.

 

[bahamasair]

The 2 concerns I have with swinging doors is snow and auto openers.
If you are in snow country, you have to shovel before you can open them.
And most people keep the snow blower in the garage.
Plus I do not know of any one that make an opener for them.
I would think about bi-fold. Just remember you need to beef up the building to take the weight of them hanging out there.

I made mine out of 2x2" square tubing welded to make the structure then I put hardy board panels on the outside, Stuffed air condition duct board in the frame and 3/8 ply on the inside. For auto openers I used swing gate openers that have a battery backup. Mine have been working fine for 5 years or so. They also run way quieter than an overhead door.
Im about to cut one of mine to put a regular sized door in one of the panels so I dont have to open the double doors to get in and out.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

What about using SIPs (structural insulated panels, I think?)? They're basically a plywood or strandboard and styrofoam sandwhich. The edges would have to be framed with some 2X6 ,but they should be relatively sturdy since the 3 layers are all glued together somehow.I'm pretty sure they come in 4' X 8' units.

I'm sitting here reading this thread for the first time, and before I got to your post, I was thinking the same thing, SIP's, like used on the roof of log homes, and other unusual construction projects.

Charles

 

[ceo012384]

The SIP I've been exposed to were all manufactured to order, so it ain't like you're going to call a lumber yard and buy plywood.

I'm sitting here reading this thread for the first time, and before I got to your post, I was thinking the same thing, SIP's, like used on the roof of log homes, and other unusual construction projects.

Charles

These sound like the might be easy to use...

So about what I asked earlier...

Cost? Materials? Etc.?

 

[elvee]

Chris,

I just went back to the beginning of this thread and read your first post. As I posted earlier, I bit the bullet and had two sets built for our garage. Delivered to Atlanta from Washington state, the total for two sets of 8'6" x 8'6" doors, all hardware, plus shipping was a touch over $7000. I used a company called Evergreen Carriage doors, and didn't go with his simplest doors. Give them a call - you might be very surprised by their price. When I was shopping around I had estimates as high as $20,000 from a shop in New Jersey. The cheapest place local to me wanted about $11,000 just for the slabs, etc etc. I've been working on the finish on our doors all weekend, and I can very honestly state there is no way I could have built these doors as well, or for the same amount.

Elmer

 

[kbs2244]

I was going through one of my old “How They Did it in the Old Days” books last night.
It turns out that an old Colonial trick for my snow fear was to not make the hinge post vertical.
They would tip them towards each other at the top of the door frame.
This made the doors a trapezoid, not a rectangle. But when they were swung open the bottom edge would lift higher. The steeper the angle the higher the lift.
Might be something to think about if it snows around you.

 

[ceo012384]

Chris,

I just went back to the beginning of this thread and read your first post. As I posted earlier, I bit the bullet and had two sets built for our garage. Delivered to Atlanta from Washington state, the total for two sets of 8'6" x 8'6" doors, all hardware, plus shipping was a touch over $7000. I used a company called Evergreen Carriage doors, and didn't go with his simplest doors. Give them a call - you might be very surprised by their price. When I was shopping around I had estimates as high as $20,000 from a shop in New Jersey. The cheapest place local to me wanted about $11,000 just for the slabs, etc etc. I've been working on the finish on our doors all weekend, and I can very honestly state there is no way I could have built these doors as well, or for the same amount.

Elmer

Elmer,

Thanks for the reply.

Do you have some pics of your doors!?

I'd love to see them.

-Christopher

I was going through one of my old “How They Did it in the Old Days” books last night.
It turns out that an old Colonial trick for my snow fear was to not make the hinge post vertical.
They would tip them towards each other at the top of the door frame.
This made the doors a trapezoid, not a rectangle. But when they were swung open the bottom edge would lift higher. The steeper the angle the higher the lift.
Might be something to think about if it snows around you.

That's something to think about... I feel that the extra difficulty of making them that way would be outweighed my ability to simply shovel the doors out, though.

 

[elvee]

http://picasaweb.google.com/elveith/NotTheTraditionalCarriageHousePics/photo#5148312146216470178

There are a couple of choices for motorized openers, but for the time being I have elected to keep them manual. This garage won't be for everyday cars. The highest traffic thing that will go in and out will be my motorcycles, and they will fit through one side.

 

[ceo012384]

http://picasaweb.google.com/elveith/NotTheTraditionalCarriageHousePics/photo#5148312146216470178

There are a couple of choices for motorized openers, but for the time being I have elected to keep them manual. This garage won't be for everyday cars. The highest traffic thing that will go in and out will be my motorcycles, and they will fit through one side.

Elmer,

Those look friggin' GREAT!!! That's exactly what I would like but thought I couldn't afford... however I will probably try talking to this company you used.

A couple more Q's:

Are they internally insulated?

How much would cost have been dropped if you didn't get the windows?

How difficult were they to install yourself?

Thanks again. And that's a beautiful carriage house you have, sir.

-Christopher

 

[elvee]

Chris, thanks for the compliments on the building. Right now those doors are sitting on saw horses inside being finished. They'll go back up this weekend, I hope.

I really don't know what the cost difference would have been without the windows. I also had an upcharge on these because they were bigger than 8' in both directions. As far as hanging them, I had the finish guys do it. It wasn't really anything more than installing a huge set of french doors. We bought raw door jamb material and prebuilt the door frames, then put those in like prehung units. Two guys had the door jambs built in about three hours, and had them in and squared in another two hours.

Those doors have some insulation behind the cedar center panels. Otherwise they are solid wood - douglas fir for the main bits, and cedar for the inset panels. The backs of the doors have finish grade luaun over the center area to cover the insulation.

 

[ceo012384]

Elmer, even with your help, I still can't justify paying that much for a pair of doors that I believe I can competently build myself to a reasonable degree of quality. I have started the process, check it out in my garage build thread.

Thanks again for your help.

 

[yard_dawg]

with the idea of swinging doors verses the orignal type. if i have a opening of 16 ft x 9 ft. is this to big to put the swinging type doors on. my shop is 2x4 framing , each door would be a 9ft tall by 8 ft wide. thanks guys

 

[rickairmedic]

Actually YD if you placed a post in the middle of your opening then your doors would be 4' X 9' each which wouldnt be that bad.

Rick