Need help with my old 2 ton sears jack

[muskaman67]

hey guys, today i went outside to do some maintenance on my car and when i put my jack underneath the car, the jack lifted just to the frame but wont lift the vehicle. I can continue to pump it but it just wont lift. I went to the store and got some hydraulic oil thinking it was low on oil but no dice. I can lift the jack up and down no problem by itself and it will hold in the up position. Just with no weight on it. This jack is have it prob 25 years old. Its the old style 2 ton sears model. Made in japan. Does anyone have any suggestions for me? The seals seem to be ok, no fluid leaking or anything. Ive never messed done any maintenance with this jack before. Thanks.

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[chewy7]

Maybe post a picture of it or the model number would help.

 

[sselander]

Yasui designed Jack

This should help:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83147

 

[muskaman67]

I just tried to even jack myself with it and it jacks me up a inch and then just settles back down. what can be the problem?

 

[coolreed]

Probably just needs new O-rings and new fluid. You can probably do it yourself.

A great reason to always use Jack-Stands when working on your car. If you do not you are risking injury or death by relying on a 25 cent O-Ring.

Be Safe. I lost a dear friend years ago because he did not use Jack Stands and his car fell on him.

 

[Major Ramifications]

HiBall has a great jack repair thread on here somwhere. It's a sticky, let me see if I can find it.

Here it is:
http://garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51105

 

[muskaman67]

thank you. are these jacks fairly easy to repair like all the o-rings and such? I've never dealt with taking apart a jack.

 

[Major Ramifications]

Yes, they are easy. Check out Hiball's How-To.

 

[Hiball]

Id Venture to bet the Main Cup is Compromised.. Tear it Down and give me a shout.

 

[muskaman67]

i tore it down a hour ago, and all the seals looked good. So i reassembled it and adjusted the overload valve. Mine was 1.7 turns from the bottom. It still does the same thing as before. I pump it up with myself on it and it goes up a inch and slowly falls down.

 

[muskaman67]

Id Venture to bet the Main Cup is Compromised.. Tear it Down and give me a shout.

It the main cup that giant o ring? where you have to use the pipe wrench to get it off? Is that the main cup?

 

[Hiball]

It the main cup that giant o ring? where you have to use the pipe wrench to get it off? Is that the main cup?

The Main cup is on the End of the Piston, It could be a Ucup or a Ucup shell with a Oring, There is a ORing inside the tank nut but it doesnt have anything to do with the Jack lifting.

 

[muskaman67]

The Main cup is on the End of the Piston, It could be a Ucup or a Ucup shell with a Oring, There is a ORing inside the tank nut but it doesnt have anything to do with the Jack lifting.

unfortunately, im not 100% sure which part that is...but i noticed when i was moving the ram in and out manually one i had it al taken apart, it seemed to be by feel making pressure like the seal wasn't letting anything get by it.

 

[Hiball]

unfortunately, im not 100% sure which part that is...but i noticed when i was moving the ram in and out manually one i had it al taken apart, it seemed to be by feel making pressure like the seal wasn't letting anything get by it.

I have a tutorial that has been linked a few times in the this thread, If the Main Ram isnt the culprit it could be a valve issue. Did you mess with anything prior to the problem? Is the Release Assembly seated correctly in the Jack?

 

[muskaman67]

I have a tutorial that has been linked a few times in the this thread, If the Main Ram isnt the culprit it could be a valve issue. Did you mess with anything prior to the problem? Is the Release Assembly seated correctly in the Jack?

I haven't messed with the jack prior to having problems. i just take it out of the garage and use it. And the release assembly, is that the star wheel with the square nut at the end thats turns? Because i pulled the star out, and turned the nut a few times but figured out how that worked so i dont think the star with the square nut is the issue. Do you think all my seals where the pump goes are good or do i need to replace them? I think mine have 2. When i was looking down there i thought i saw 2 o rings and 2 backups.

I appreciate you answering me and giving me suggestions what it possibly can be.

 

[Hiball]

I haven't messed with the jack prior to having problems. i just take it out of the garage and use it. And the release assembly, is that the star wheel with the square nut at the end thats turns? Because i pulled the star out, and turned the nut a few times but figured out how that worked so i dont think the star with the square nut is the issue. Do you think all my seals where the pump goes are good or do i need to replace them? I think mine have 2. When i was looking down there i thought i saw 2 o rings and 2 backups.

I appreciate you answering me and giving me suggestions what it possibly can be.

Generally even a Worn Pump Piston seal (In your case Orings/Backups) will still operate the Jack, And most of the time the Main Ram Piston seal will still operate even with a bad edge/split with No load. It sounds like a Valve Issue, Release not seating, Lack of Oil or a Oil Galley is blocked.

 

[theoldwizard1]

The Main cup is on the End of the Piston, It could be a Ucup or a Ucup shell with a Oring, There is a ORing inside the tank nut but it doesnt have anything to do with the Jack lifting.

+1 !

 

[muskaman67]

Generally even a Worn Pump Piston seal (In your case Orings/Backups) will still operate the Jack, And most of the time the Main Ram Piston seal will still operate even with a bad edge/split with No load. It sounds like a Valve Issue, Release not seating, Lack of Oil or a Oil Galley is blocked.

Ok. Is this the valve part your talking about in the pic? I'm really sorry for not knowing the names and parts of the internals of the jack. Does it effect the way the jack works as far a holding load and such as in my case if i took the square part and turned that part in or out from where it originally was?
<a href="http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/?action=view&current=DSC00965.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/DSC00965.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

 

[Hiball]

Ok. Is this the valve part your talking about in the pic? I'm really sorry for not knowing the names and parts of the internals of the jack. Does it effect the way the jack works as far a holding load and such as in my case if i took the square part and turned that part in or out from where it originally was?
<a href="http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/?action=view&current=DSC00965.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/DSC00965.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

Yes, that is the Release assembly. If yours has a flat square stock like mine in the Picture there should be a Ball below it. When you turn the gear it drives the square plug downward and presses the ball against the Seat, Which directs oil into the Cylinder.

 

[muskaman67]

Yes, that is the Release assembly. If yours has a flat square stock like mine in the Picture there should be a Ball below it. When you turn the gear it drives the square plug downward and presses the ball against the Seat, Which directs oil into the Cylinder.

yes mine looks like that. So with that, what should i do? Do i need to do anything with the ball? Is there a seal in that area that i need to change?

 

[Hiball]

yes mine looks like that. So with that, what should i do? Do i need to do anything with the ball? Is there a seal in that area that i need to change?

No Seal that has anything to do with the operation of the Jack. Did you pull the ball out to make sure there isn't something underneath it, That is Keeping the Ball from Seating?

 

[muskaman67]

No Seal that has anything to do with the operation of the Jack. Did you pull the ball out to make sure there isn't something underneath it, That is Keeping the Ball from Seating?

I havent tried pulling the ball out, but its odd that i used the jack yesterday and it worked fine and then today i go to use it and now i have a issue with it. just doesn't support any weight. Do you think that if all the seals are good within the jack, should i even mess with changing them or just leave them the way they are?

 

[Hiball]

I havent tried pulling the ball out, but its odd that i used the jack yesterday and it worked fine and then today i go to use it and now i have a issue with it. just doesn't support any weight. Do you think that if all the seals are good within the jack, should i even mess with changing them or just leave them the way they are?

There is a possiblility that a piece of seal made its way through the system and isn't allowing the Valve ball to seat properly etc.. Did you flush the unit when you had the Reservoir off? Its nearly impossible for me to Diagnose your Jack over the Internet. I will say that your description sounds like one of the things i listed in Post #16.

 

[muskaman67]

i know, unfortunately its hard to diagnose my issue especially when i barely know anything about jacks. And yes when i had the ram out, i let all the fluid drain out, and once i put it all back together i put new hydraulic fluid back in. Also, after i put it back together, i noticed that when i pump the jack handle i can see the jack pump getting lubricated but also ever so slightly leaking over the edge. You think possibly those seals could be bad as well? maybe is that a issue as well to my jack?

 

[Hiball]

i know, unfortunately its hard to diagnose my issue especially when i barely know anything about jacks. And yes when i had the ram out, i let all the fluid drain out, and once i put it all back together i put new hydraulic fluid back in. Also, after i put it back together, i noticed that when i pump the jack handle i can see the jack pump getting lubricated but also ever so slightly leaking over the edge. You think possibly those seals could be bad as well? maybe is that a issue as well to my jack?

Id venture to bet they have hardened and probably arent working as New.. But it still should do more than what your describing. Did you try and Bleed the Unit?

1. Check the Oil Level, It should rest just above the inner cylinder when peering into the hole.
2. With the handle in the Release position
3. Pump the Jack 8-10 times (This will flush oil through the Valve)
4. Twist the handle to the Raise position
5. Try and Cycle the Jack

 

[muskaman67]

Also, Hiball, when you talk about the main cup is compromised, what exactly do you mean by that? Is there a seal i have to replace?

 

[muskaman67]

Id venture to bet they have hardened and probably arent working as New.. But it still should do more than what your describing. Did you try and Bleed the Unit?

1. Check the Oil Level, It should rest just above the inner cylinder when peering into the hole.
2. With the handle in the Release position
3. Pump the Jack 8-10 times (This will flush oil through the Valve)
4. Twist the handle to the Raise position
5. Try and Cycle the Jack

Yes, i tried that earlier. Unfortunately it still leaves me with the jack not holding any other weight but its own.

 

[Hiball]

Also, Hiball, when you talk about the main cup is compromised, what exactly do you mean by that? Is there a seal i have to replace?

When you had it apart did you inspect the Main Ram seal? Most of the time unless they are completely compromised they will still work on light loads.

This Seal...

 

[muskaman67]

yes that seal seemed good to me. I looked it all over and it looked crack free, still felt soft and not all hard. When i put it back into the cylinder i felt a little bit of resistance like it was building pressure so it made me think that the seal was still functioning properly. You think i should replace that one? Does the HF o-ring kit have that size seal?

 

[muskaman67]

In the picture, this is the type that my jack has. I got this pic from someone else's thread. Anyways, the part of the left, that giant o-ring is what your talking about right? that the main cup right? That o-ring on my jack looked good. you think it would be wise of my to replace it anyways? And also, by looking at that pic, i didnt know those 2 parts could come apart too. Or maybe his is really messed up?
<a href="http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/?action=view&current=Floorjack5.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/Floorjack5.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

 

[Hiball]

yes that seal seemed good to me. I looked it all over and it looked crack free, still felt soft and not all hard. When i put it back into the cylinder i felt a little bit of resistance like it was building pressure so it made me think that the seal was still functioning properly. You think i should replace that one? Does the HF o-ring kit have that size seal?

No.. To Replacing it (for now) and No its not in the Hf Oring kit. Did you tear into the Working Valve? The one on the other side of the Release.

 

[Hiball]

In the picture, this is the type that my jack has. I got this pic from someone else's thread. Anyways, the part of the left, that giant o-ring is what your talking about right? that the main cup right? That o-ring on my jack looked good. you think it would be wise of my to replace it anyways? And also, by looking at that pic, i didnt know those 2 parts could come apart too. Or maybe his is really messed up?
<a href="http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/?action=view&current=Floorjack5.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q141/muskaman67/Floorjack5.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

No.. The Main Ram Seal is on the Right at the end of the Ram. The one on the Left is the Tank nut Seal (Sits in a groove) inside the tank nut.

 

[muskaman67]

No.. To Replacing it (for now) and No its not in the Hf Oring kit. Did you tear into the Working Valve? The one on the other side of the Release.

Is the working valve the one where it has a dust shield on it that says do not remove, where you can adjust the screw in or out?

 

[Hiball]

Is the working valve the one where it has a dust shield on it that says do not remove, where you can adjust the screw in or out?

No that is the Overload...

 

[muskaman67]

No.. The Main Ram Seal is on the Right at the end of the Ram. The one on the Left is the Tank nut Seal (Sits in a groove) inside the tank nut.

Ohhh, to tell you the truth, i really didnt even notice to look at that, or maybe i did, but didnt pay any attention to it. I dont think it was damaged when i looked at it though, cause i think it would of stuck out to me.

 

[Hiball]

Ohhh, to tell you the truth, i really didnt even notice to look at that, or maybe i did, but didnt pay any attention to it. I dont think it was damaged when i looked at it though, cause i think it would of stuck out to me.

 

[muskaman67]

yes i know, im freaking retarded when it comes to messing with jacks. but if its a car, im a genius.

 

[muskaman67]

No that is the Overload...

DAMMIT, whats the working valve? haha I hate this...i dont know **** from a rock when it comes to these jacks.

 

[Hiball]

DAMMIT, whats the working valve? haha I hate this...i dont know **** from a rock when it comes to these jacks.

Did you follow the Tutorial? It shows the overload components along with the Working valve. The Overload is the one with the "Do Not Adjust" cap, It is a Safety Valve that prevents you from exceeding the Load rating of your Jack.

 

[muskaman67]

Did you follow the Tutorial? It shows the overload components along with the Working valve. The Overload is the one with the "Do Not Adjust" cap, It is a Safety Valve that prevents you from exceeding the Load rating of your Jack.

yes i looked over the tutorial 100 times. i really appreciate you answering all my questions. You are def one of the best and most helpful members on this forum.