A wrench is but a wrench...

[texchappy]

or is it? Was looking at some of the tool threads and started wondering about wrenches - having just gotten a Gedore BSW box-end combo.

Wrenches being such simple tools, is there anything different from one wrench to the next? I assume metallurgy but anything else? Is there any design aspects that makes one wrench superior to the next? I'm talking box end, open end, and combo; not ratcheting.

TIA,
Tony

 

[Flatland Dave]

Design , weak points, finish.

 

[64Trvlr]

The way it sits in your hand, comfort, balance, weight and correct broaching.

 

[texchappy]

Thanks for the replies. Any makes/models that are better at those things? I can see why some of them might be more of a personal thing - e.g. sits in hand?

 

[Flatland Dave]

Generally, you get what you pay for.

Not getting into the truck brand and COO discussion.

There is a reason a Cadillac costs more than a Yugo.

 

[kamesama980]

generally you get what you pay for. Generally. As you get into the premium stuff (snapon, matco, etc) there's a LOT more difference in price than quality over the previous step. (IE snapon is a little better quality than craftsman but costs a LOT more wheras craftsman is a LOT better than 'china' but only costs moderately more) Personally I don't think the premium brands (snapon, matco, etc) are worth the price difference. I have a number of tools from them but all purchased for next to nothing at garage and estate sales from the little old lady whos husband passed away.

To some extent you can tell overall quality of hand tools by the sharpness of the lettering and the casting. If the letters, texture, and edges look smudged or blurry, it's ****. If they're sharp and nice looking, chances are it's going to be better ovarall.

I've seen some cheapo wrenches not actually be the right size. A lot of times they fit a little looser to compensate for generally poor tolerances and quality control. They also tend to be softer and more able to open up and round off a head when bolts are really tight.

LOL started this post before flatland dave posted but look at the opening line. (at work...sometimes it distracts from the internet)

 

[Stick-man]

Last time I handled one (quite a while back) Mac Tools, wrenches had a reversed head from all of the others. I referred to them as left handed wrenches. I could never get them to work in tight areas. I have had a Craftsman not work in a tight area and a Snappy would. I like Snappy, and that's mostly what I have, except that the sides are too sharp and dig into your fingers. I should have looked more into Matco, they seem to be really nice.

 

[texchappy]

Besides the Gedore BSW I just got, all my other wrenches are basic sets of Craftsman bought when they were still made in the USA. In ratchets and sockets I've been buying williams rather than snap-on, etc.

 

[blackz26]

Thickness. Snappy wrenches are a lot thinner then Craftsman RP. Sometimes allows for better clearance.

 

[Herb]

The large heavy ones make better hammers when you're angry at your car.

 

[kc-steve]

Both Williams and Wright have their own patented gripping versions of wrenches. I like both and prefer WrightGrip. See attachments.

Also, toss an old high quality wrench in a box of wrenches and listen for the "ring". Then toss a cheap import wrench in and listen for the difference in sound.

Steve

 

[woody 73]

I have bought some old wrenches that look like dog ****, feel like dog ****, but you would be amazed at how tight the tolerances are on the nuts & bolts.

On the other hand I picked up some wrenches that look fantastic, feel fantastic, but they are very loose on the nuts & bolts; so sometimes there are not so obvious qualities that might be overlooked.

 

[HaroRider]

Dont tolerences come in to play as well? Tightern tolerences means less stripped out bolts?

 

[Dave455]

I reckon there's more difference between different brands of wrench than just about any other tool! Some aspects most folks will agree on, some come down to personal taste!

It's not very original but I reckon Snap On are overall about the best. They are tough, made to fine tolerances, beautifully finished and stand the test of time. I'd rate Stahlwille up there with Snap On, but not everybody likes the Satin finish! Many would probably add Hazet to the first place as well, but I don't own enough to vouch for them.

Almost as good are Mac (provided they are the Made in U.S.A wrenches) and a small German firm called Saltus, who produce lovely stuff but only in Metric. I've heard good things about Wright, but don't own any myself! Facom probably deserve a place here as well, but only in respect of the French made wrenches I own - I can't vouch for the current line!

Acceptable 'workshop grade' for me would be King **** ( British Made), Beta (Italian) or Gedore. I find the finish on some of the Gedores (some only - their wrenches come in 2 finishes) a little rough for my tastes!

Anything Taiwanese I'd avoid! They can get the job done, but without any pleasure in use, so I've always ended up replacing any I've bought!

If you are looking for B.S.W. your choices are more limited. Snap On offer combination wrenches in B S sizes and they are superb. King **** offer everything, and are fine. Gedore offer a couple of patterns ( box end and one of the combinations if I recall) which are undoubtedly tough, but not as nicely finished as King ****. Elora do a selection too, but I don't own any!

A good option in the U.K. would be to keep an eye out for older wrenches by any of the classic British makes such as Britool, Bedford or Gordon. These are all first class but probably hard to find in the U.S.A.

Good hunting!

 

[billp603]

There are so many subtle details in other areas as well.
How easy is it to read the size markings? Are they marked on both sides?
How the shape of the open end is forged to minimize the lobster claw outside dimensions
How rough the casting texture is gives you a trade off on how “non-slip” it can feel in your hand vs. how quick it is to wipe it off.
There are many reasons that 20+ companies have found a market niche for the same product in prices that range from 1X to 25X one another.
The ones that feel best in my hand are the older SK raised panel style, but I have not held them all.

 

[ken w.]

I feel that Snap On makes the best wrenches. The open end the at the best angle for turning the fastener. Thet are strong and comfortable to use. When you use your wrenches everyday you will know what I mean. The Mac wrenches are the wromg angle and too thick. Craftsman are cheap wrenches and they work.I really can't complain about them. The only complaint I have with the S/O wrenches are the price.Very expensive.

 

[porschedude996TT]

Mine differ in smell...LOL

 

[CWP1616L]

Wrenches being such simple tools, is there anything different from one wrench to the next? I assume metallurgy but anything else?

Shape Shape Shape

 

[bwringer]

Huh. I wonder why you don't see King **** brand wrenches in the US?




Anyway, after a fruitless trip to Sears to gaze in disgust at the ****** Chinese lobster claws they're now peddling, I happened to find that Menard's sells some very nice everyday use wrenches under the goofy "Master Force" brand name.

They're not swathed in shiny flaky chrome (nice matte nonslip finish), both ends fit nuts and bolts nice and tight, the open ends are nice and tidy (not those unusable gigantic lobster claws), they're very reasonably priced, and they're made in the US of damn A!

 

[Roverbo]

or is it? Was looking at some of the tool threads and started wondering about wrenches - having just gotten a Gedore BSW box-end combo. (...)

TIA,
Tony

Hi Tony,
if you want loads of wrench-nerding, you should read some of the appr. 762 pages on the "tools from the old world" thread...
Among loads of uselfull, funny and/or unnecessary information, you´ll find scanned pages from european, independant consumer reports on wrenches. Snappy is among the best, along with Hazet, Gedore and Stahlwille (all 3 old, family owned, german brands). Other good, european brands are Elora, Walther and Belzer. However europeans (like me) tends to prefer "fruit skin finish" (better grip with dirty hands) where americans loves glossy finish (better look in your huge toolchests). So that can narrow your selection.

 

[Gotmayhem]

One of the most important features of a wrench is how it fits in your hand. This isn't something that you can read about on the internet, you only know once you hold it. Some people like super thin wrenches such as Snap On while others like the big rounded beams of a Williams Supercombo. Either way it's up to personal preference, but using an uncomfortable wrench for an extended time is a nasty experience for everyone.

 

[texchappy]

Hi Tony,
if you want loads of wrench-nerding, you should read some of the appr. 762 pages on the "tools from the old world" thread...
Among loads of uselfull, funny and/or unnecessary information, you´ll find scanned pages from european, independant consumer reports on wrenches. Snappy is among the best, along with Hazet, Gedore and Stahlwille (all 3 old, family owned, german brands). Other good, european brands are Elora, Walther and Belzer. However europeans (like me) tends to prefer "fruit skin finish" (better grip with dirty hands) where americans loves glossy finish (better look in your huge toolchests). So that can narrow your selection.

Well, I guess I'm going to have to go against that stereotype. That was part of what made me start this thread -- comparing the finish on my new Gedore versus my very glossy (and some blue) Craftsman sets.

 

[Kracin]

Huh. I wonder why you don't see King **** brand wrenches in the US?




Anyway, after a fruitless trip to Sears to gaze in disgust at the ****** Chinese lobster claws they're now peddling, I happened to find that Menard's sells some very nice everyday use wrenches under the goofy "Master Force" brand name.

They're not swathed in shiny flaky chrome (nice matte nonslip finish), both ends fit nuts and bolts nice and tight, the open ends are nice and tidy (not those unusable gigantic lobster claws), they're very reasonably priced, and they're made in the US of damn A!

love these incredibly scientific and unbiased posts.. wow

 

[fstfbdy]

I use everything from craftsman , Mac , Matco and Snap on.
I love my Snap on Flank Drive wrenches the best. Both regular and ratcheting wrenches.

 

[Dave455]

Think the reason you don't see many King **** wrenches in the U.S.A. is that there isn't the need. They are a popular, and reasonably priced, brand in the U.K. but would be a good deal more expensive after shipping, and probably couldn't compete with Snap On, Mac, Proto, Wright etc which are all mega money in the U.K.

They are a good choice if you need British Standsrd wrenches though, and I believe someone imports those!

 

[sberry]

I can use about any end wrench, a cheap Stanley Walmart wrench is about 99% as good as the best minus a pinch of finsh and a second shot of chrome. Lots of these are the exact same blank, pinch them off the line and divert them to another stamp for a brand. Aint a pinch of **** difference in metal.

 

[celticbhoy]

I don't like the way snap on wrenches feel in my hand or any polished thin handled wrench. I prefer the craftsman thick handled industrial wrenches and the mastercraft non polished thick handled industrial wrenches. They won't slip if I have a bit of oil or grease on my hands, and they feel great. Their clearance isn't as good as S/O but they grip pretty damn well.

 

[cryan]

Celticbhoy, Cool Avatar, shame its the wrong team! There is only one team in green, Hibernian FC, Original and best since 1875! lol.

 

[december45]

Just the idea of " a wrench is but a wrench" Makes me suggest you pick up a snapon wrench, there is a difference. Ive got a set of SK ratchet wrenches that in my hand blows away craftsman for comfort.
I do think there are many other reasons to pick one wrench over another, but just pure comfort is at the top of the list for me.

 

[cryan]

Just the idea of " a wrench is but a wrench" Makes me suggest you pick up a snapon wrench, there is a difference. Ive got a set of SK ratchet wrenches that in my hand blows away craftsman for comfort.
I do think there are many other reasons to pick one wrench over another, but just pure comfort is at the top of the list for me.

I don't think its down to brand as much as personal preference. For example I know guys that rave about thin handled wrenches like Snap on yet I find they can feel uncomfortable when pulling hard on them. In that situation I prefer thicker rounder handles. It can be very hard to convince a guy that has spent thousands on tool truck tools that the £30 pound set from the local hardware store is as good but the brutal truth is that they were probably manufactured in the same way with the same process. the difference is the % of price mark-up the brand name will allow in the customers mind. Anyone who wants to learn how to build an empire should not study the Romans or Napoleon, study Snap-On! The real secret behind their success is brand management. They make some excellent tools but so do many others the real difference is the mental picture they have built for themselves which although we think comes from our opinion actually has been carefully placed in our minds by them. For example I know what their tools feel like in my hand, I like them but no better than others. I have a sensible head on my shoulders and a business brain. Yet I would sell my Mother for a big Midnight Blue Epiq toolbox! That desire is not fuelled by the quality of the box over other boxes and certainly not by value for money. Its fuelled by the fact that they have made it seem cool, other guys think their cool and by buying one I therefore will become cool. Even if it costs more than my car and the cool effect lasts for 1 day.

I really, really want a midnight blue epiq!!!!!

 

[CWP1616L]

I don't like the way snap on wrenches feel in my hand or any polished thin handled wrench.

Snap-on box end wrenches - more specifically the XB series - are considerably thicker. FYI.

 

[Dan Jacobs]

When a young truck mechanic I was amassing a fine collection of Mac tools
then I went **** over tea kettle when a 7/8 wrench broke. Then the next week it was 1"
I traded the lot for Snap On and never looked back That was 35 years ago (dang)
and I'm looking forward to buying my next Snap On hand tool though I have to buy them online due to my local dealer being an a$$wipe

 

[Chuck122]

I have to side against those that say "a wrench is a wrench". When pushes come to shoves, a premium quality wrench is what is needed. They do not slip&strip nearly as much, they give you better clearance, better leverage ergonomics and all. Simply put, buy the best you can afford. Are the snap on wrenches good value? Hell no! But they are the **** when it comes to damaged fasteners. I'm not a big kool-aid drinker but for wrenches I chug a gallon and ask for more. It's simply one of these things

 

[Murphy4570]

When you absolutely, must, have to get the job done, you need the best money can buy.

To quote my favorite tool brand, "there is a difference".

 

[BK13]

Has anybody checked out the Armstrong MAXX combo wrenches? I looked at a set today at my local pusher... err, tool store, and they had a set of metrics there. They look like you could really crank on them, what with the handle twisted 90 degrees, so you are essentially pulling/pushing a flat surface, rather than an edge.

 

[N.I.]

To the untrained eye a wrench is a wrench.

But if you are working with badly rusted fasteners, having decent wrenches greatly reduces the risk of rounding them off.

They have better tolerances, cleaner more accurate broaching, better steel and perhaps more importantly, they are correctly tempered so they bend before breaking.

The chinese can use any old melted down shite, add plenty of carbon, forge it into a wrench and give it minimal tempering to yield something that is relatively strong. However it will be brittle and if you overload it will snap with no warning.


I have found that the easiest way to gauge the overall quality of a wrench is to study of the broaching on the ring end. It seems to reflect the effort gone into the wrench as a whole.


There are a few simple things to check for, no measuring tools required:

Look for a fairly thin ring.

Make sure the the broaching is clean, even and well formed.

Make sure the broaching is square.

And more importantly look for broaching which is the full depth. The cheaper the wrench, the bigger the lead in chamfer of the ring.



A few photos of random cheapies- (The photos make them look better than they are in person)

This one is not remotely square.



This one has quite a large lead in chamfer and is off square. (There were a few alot worse than this, but they didn't come out in focus)



Chunky one will poorly formed broaching.



And whoever made this was blind in one eye.




And Some Gedore no.7 to compare against-






I have a full set these Gedore, 6 to 27mm and set of Hazet 7 - 27 and every single one is perfect. Also have a set of Elora up to 1 & 1/4 and they are excellent too, athough the ring is a wee bit chunkier


In my opinion the biggest issue with cheapy wrenches is the lead in chamfer. For example, I was able to measure some 13mm wrenches with a chamfer of nearly 2mm.
Now if you take a 13mm, M8 bolt, the head height is about 5.5mm. If you lose 2mm due to a chamfer, straight away the bolt will round off with 35% less torque applied. 1.5mm and you lose about 25%.

And that is ignoring tolerances!


I would amagine that there is minimal difference in the steel used by the top manufacturers these days. King **** openly publish that they use 31 CrV3 steel for their wrenches. If you do a bit of searching it seems some of the Germans also use the same steel.



.

 

[Pumpman1968]

I'm sorry....I've read the question 3 times and cant seem to get past Herbs avatar!

 

[DMAR]

I'm sorry....I've read the question 3 times and cant seem to get past Herbs avatar!

I'll second this comment; where the F does that thing live...?

As to the OP, IMO life's too short for cheap wrenches. Quality costs, some more than others... Snap On's are great, but so are Mac, Wright, Williams Supercombos (USA), Cornwall, and Protos. I have not had any of the German wrenches, but I'm sure they're great too, the German's manufacture some very nice tools.

I suppose how hard you use the tool depends on how much quality you require. I like to buy once, cry once.

 

[Skin]

I have bought some old wrenches that look like dog ****, feel like dog ****, but you would be amazed at how tight the tolerances are on the nuts & bolts.

On the other hand I picked up some wrenches that look fantastic, feel fantastic, but they are very loose on the nuts & bolts; so sometimes there are not so obvious qualities that might be overlooked.

Certainly speaking in terms of the box ends remember that the off corner engagement everyone is using now will make the box end appear as if it has much more play than your old fashioned tight fitting 12pt box end with the sharp corners. Its done intentionally to let the wrench roll into the flats of a 6pt fastener.

Differences in wrenches to me basically comes down to feel. Tolerances and thicknesses can vary all over the map regardless of brand and country of manufacture. To add even more complexity to it fastener sizes all vary so you'll never find a wrench that will fit everything tight. It just doesn't exist. Even more true when your talking about corrosion where a 15mm bolt head might have so much scale that its close to 16mm but after you scrape the **** off the good metal left makes it closer to a 14.5mm. Fun.

 

[celticbhoy]

Celticbhoy, Cool Avatar, shame its the wrong team! There is only one team in green, Hibernian FC, Original and best since 1875! lol.

Don't mind Hibs, definitely the better of Edinburgh and the club that one of the greatest humans to have ever lived supported.. James Connolly. However, Celtic - 1967 - European Champions - greatest club in the world!

Snap-on box end wrenches - more specifically the XB series - are considerably thicker. FYI.

Is this what the snap on high performance long wrenches are made of? If so, then those wrenches are brilliant.