Welders..need some advice

[Xcursion88]

Hello again

I have about all the equipment I need finally (no piece of decent equipment is cost friendly) and am opening a business and I need to address the lack of a welder. This is one area I've little experience with. I think I can get away with a MIG welder only but as far as specs of the machine itself (not brand) but specs I have no idea what I should be looking for.

Exhaust work would be the main thing I need it for. Whether just welding hangers to pipe or welding joints. I do not at this point foresee doing any kind of body work as I have no interest in body work/painting etc.

Any thoughts and or must have minimums specs and such information would be greatly valued.

Thanks

 

[zkling]

If you are not willing to do a little research on your own to make an educated purchase, are you willing to put in the time and effort to learn how to weld? This has been covered so many times it just gets old.

A millermatic 211 would probably be all you need and more, but

 

[Professur]

Hello again

I have about all the equipment I need finally (no piece of decent equipment is cost friendly) and am opening a business and I need to address the lack of a welder. This is one area I've little experience with. I think I can get away with a MIG welder only but as far as specs of the machine itself (not brand) but specs I have no idea what I should be looking for.

Exhaust work would be the main thing I need it for. Whether just welding hangers to pipe or welding joints. I do not at this point foresee doing any kind of body work as I have no interest in body work/painting etc.

Any thoughts and or must have minimums specs and such information would be greatly valued.

Thanks

My personal opinion ... take a class. Otherwise you're just going to waste your money.

 

[creativecars]

I am wanting a Lincoln 210 mp machine. Arc, MIG, DC TIG and aluminum spool. Machine starts at $999.99. I have a little Miller 110v machine and 3/16 is MAX.

BTW... what kind of business are you opening where someone will pay you to practice welding on their project?

 

[erty67]

Opening a business and need a welder, but don't know what kind of welder or even how to weld. Please don't.

 

[R.Anderson]

"Exhaust work would be the main thing I need it for. Whether just welding hangers to pipe or welding joints. I do not at this point foresee doing any kind of body work as I have no interest in body work/painting etc. "

Pipe welding eh try this one http://www.millerwelds.com/products/multiprocess/pipeworx/

 

[welder4956]

"Exhaust work would be the main thing I need it for. Whether just welding hangers to pipe or welding joints. I do not at this point foresee doing any kind of body work as I have no interest in body work/painting etc. "

Pipe welding eh try this one http://www.millerwelds.com/products/multiprocess/pipeworx/

That's a bit of overkill, don't you think? He really doesn't need pulsing or waveform controls for welding exhaust pipe.

A basic welder like the Miller 211 or Hobart Handler 185 with 75% argon/25% CO2 gas is fine. Just stay away from the 110V welders. Not very stable and definitely not intended for commercial use.

 

[R.Anderson]

That's a bit of overkill, don't you think? He really doesn't need pulsing or waveform controls for welding exhaust pipe.

A basic welder like the Miller 211 or Hobart Handler 185 with 75% argon/25% CO2 gas is fine. Just stay away from the 110V welders. Not very stable and definitely not intended for commercial use.

That was the idea, extreme overkill. Trying to shock him into doing his own homework.

 

[sberry]

A basic welder like the Miller 211 or Hobart Handler 185 with 75% argon/25% CO2 gas is fine. Just stay away from the 110V welders. Not very stable and definitely not intended for commercial use

Listen to this. It pretty well hit the nail on the head and is a cant miss.

 

[skylinegtr20]

I have a Miller Matic 212 and its good for basic shop work.

 

[wagon]

Millermatic 180, Lincoln 180, Powermig 210, Tweco Fabricator 181

all have fine heat control. hobarts and home depot/lowes units are on tap settings. Millermatic's AutoSet feature might be helpful for you as a beginner.

on the note of overkill, why not go for a Sub Arc unit?
http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/Equipment/Pages/product.aspx?product=K2803-1

 

[rsanter]

Miller 211 will be the best welding investment you can make.
It will make you look like you are actually a good welder

Bob

 

[bcradio]

That was the idea, extreme overkill. Trying to shock him into doing his own homework.

I want that welder... Maybe I can sell the first born.

 

[Xcursion88]

Thanks to the people who offered a genuine reply.....I am not welding on anything that is not mine until I am efficient with it. The only way to become efficient with it is practice and then practice some more. Even that will not make being a good welder automatic but hope to reach a point of being able to do a satisfactory weld. Something that time and practice could provide.

To the other folks who found the need to be sarcastic I would say you have too much time on your hands to post meaningless replies. Seriously. Get some friends (and I don't mean the electric kind) and or do some things in life.



Again, thanks to those who offered genuine advice

 

[yfz 450]

I have also been looking into starting to weld and have been looking around on forums for info about welding and it is hard to find good information. It just seems that if you don't know how to weld your an idiot and you should just not even try because you will never be good. It seem anybody is willing to help on any subject except welding. I was going to start a thread to try and learn but I guess it's not worth it. It's not like "hey man what your thinking of doing is not gunna work this might be a better option" instead it's "if you don't know what your doing you never will so don't even try you will never be good if you have to ask a question when your just starting out at welding"

 

[creativecars]

I think the problem seemed to be that the op indicated he was opening a business. "I have about all the equipment I need finally (no piece of decent equipment is cost friendly) and am opening a business and I need to address the lack of a welder. This is one area I've little experience with."
And several of us (myself included) don't feel a person should practice welding as part of a business idea.

As several have mentioned a welding class is one of the best ways to get through a ton of necessary information without taking the time to do it on your own. A community college or welding school will help you get there fastest with a professional looking over your shoulder.

The youtube videos are also very informative. If you were close by I would gladly show you everything I know... Got 20 minutes... lol.

After you get some good basic information the rest is practice, practice, practice.

Do you have some specific questions??

 

[Murphy4570]

A basic welder like the Miller 211 or Hobart Handler 185 with 75% argon/25% CO2 gas is fine. Just stay away from the 110V welders. Not very stable and definitely not intended for commercial use.

I disagree. For exhaust work any name brand 110V MIG welder will work just fine, or FCAW. They hold up just fine in a shop.

 

[creativecars]

To the op, what kind of business are you opening??

Are looking to do a variety of welding projects like I do? That is the reason I am looking at the Lincoln 210mp. It gives me ability to Arc, Mig, Tig (steel) and spool gun aluminum. For 1000 to start out it looks to be a great multipurpose machine. It also runs on 110 or 220.
Many people get by with the "gasless mig" which uses flux core wire. Not my recommendation. Actually by definition MIG (Metal Inert Gas) has to use gas!
Stupid companies want to name things they cant back up... another story.

 

[JDSV]

While doing some quick research on basic welders, I came across the Northern Tools variety for Stick and MIG. Both seem highly rated (as far as reviews go) and the price is not bad. And I think the MIG has a plastic wire feed instead of metal, so it would be more prone to failure.

Stick: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200632004_200632004

MIG: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200403263_200403263

As a hobbyist either of these would probably be just fine, but as for potentially using in a business environment I would probably get a Miller or a Lincoln as mentioned above.

 

[creativecars]

While doing some quick research on basic welders, I came across the Northern Tools variety for Stick and MIG. Both seem highly rated (as far as reviews go) and the price is not bad. And I think the MIG has a plastic wire feed instead of metal, so it would be more prone to failure.

Stick: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200632004_200632004

MIG: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200403263_200403263

As a hobbyist either of these would probably be just fine, but as for potentially using in a business environment I would probably get a Miller or a Lincoln as mentioned above.

A quality stick welder can be picked up on CL for $100. The above flux core wire welder is not a MIG.

 

[bigjeff94]

A gasless flux core wire feed welder has its uses, but an actual MIG is much more versatile, that being said I've had my eye on the hobart handler MIG series for home use they seem like real nice machines at a decent price.

 

[motofool33]

Get the new Lincoln 210mp, it covers all bases needed for small fab work. Reliable with easy to get parts.

 

[Xcursion88]

To the op, what kind of business are you opening??

Are looking to do a variety of welding projects like I do? That is the reason I am looking at the Lincoln 210mp. It gives me ability to Arc, Mig, Tig (steel) and spool gun aluminum. For 1000 to start out it looks to be a great multipurpose machine. It also runs on 110 or 220.
Many people get by with the "gasless mig" which uses flux core wire. Not my recommendation. Actually by definition MIG (Metal Inert Gas) has to use gas!
Stupid companies want to name things they cant back up... another story.

Type of business is auto repair/safety/emission inspection....

The main need for any of this talk is to have a welder on hand that I can at the very least do some work to exhausts. Whether something as simple a tacking a hanger back to the tubing or cutting out a complete junk muffler and putting another in...as is right now I don't have a welder and and was just looking for some thoughts on the equipment i could get by with. As far as amount of usage I have no idea at this point but the fact remains I will need to use one and I don't have one.

This didn't need to be made into a mockery by some people that just can't resist to post something useless.

If I chose to weld and butcher up someones property that is my choice albeit a stupid one but still my choice. So to some of the folks with way too much time on their hands...a little less parenting and scolding on here and a little more useful information would go a LONG way.

 

[Murphy4570]

If that's all your doing, just run over to your local welding gas supply shop (or Home Depot), and pick up a Lincoln 140 or 180. Run gas or flux, doesn't matter for exhaust. You can make strong quality and good looking welds either way if you are a good weldor. You might want to hire an employee or two who have 5+ years experience in a muffler shop, as they can teach you how to weld, as well as the intricacies of exhaust welding.

 

[pi_guy]

If I chose to weld and butcher up someones property that is my choice albeit a stupid one but still my choice. So to some of the folks with way too much time on their hands...a little less parenting and scolding on here and a little more useful information would go a LONG way.

Just what the industry needs another hack.

 

[aka Larry]

A 110V welder is just fine for exhaust work, and cheaper than a 220V machine. Get one from one of the big three (Miller, Lincoln, Hobart) and you'll be fine. Don't even think about getting one from HF.

Teaching yourself to weld is possible, but taking a class at your local CC is a much better idea. You can learn the right way and then practice, practice, practice.

 

[Zeke]

Thanks to the people who offered a genuine reply.....I am not welding on anything that is not mine until I am efficient with it. The only way to become efficient with it is practice and then practice some more. Even that will not make being a good welder automatic but hope to reach a point of being able to do a satisfactory weld. Something that time and practice could provide.

To the other folks who found the need to be sarcastic I would say you have too much time on your hands to post meaningless replies. Seriously. Get some friends (and I don't mean the electric kind) and or do some things in life.



Again, thanks to those who offered genuine advice

I agree that some replies are sarcastic or critical. And then you follow with attitude being all of 8 posts so far.

I'd say a good many of us have seen jackleg jobs done by someone "in business" and were commenting accordingly. You may not have to go to school to learn to weld well. I didn't at first, became decent at it and then went to school and learned a lot on top of what I already knew (and thought I knew).

Which turned out to be not that much. But, we didn't have Jody at Welding Tips and Tricks and others like him that many years ago. Really good self taught welders are hard to find. So getting a welder as part of a business whether your business is working on your own jobs or not does seem a little odd when you don't know how to weld if you don't mind my saying so.

Just don't buy a POS welder. BTW, I have a little Lincoln 100 that would do fine for tubing but if you don't know how to use it it will blow holes all over the place.

 

[erty67]

If I chose to weld and butcher up someones property that is my choice albeit a stupid one but still my choice. So to some of the folks with way too much time on their hands...a little less parenting and scolding on here and a little more useful information would go a LONG way.

This statement alone just makes everyone want to spend their free time helping you with information a simple search would have provided. Yes, I am being sarcastic. What you are not understanding is these people are trying to help you. Learn how to weld, or at least do some of your own research to learn what you need and how to start. Then attempt it. You are 100% right...butchering up someone's property is your choice. Members trying to guide you in a better direction is their choice and to be honest, maybe you should be a little more receptive and respectful. That is useful information that would go a LONG way. Have a good day.

 

[Xcursion88]

So getting a welder as part of a business whether your business is working on your own jobs or not does seem a little odd when you don't know how to weld if you don't mind my saying so.

As much as ASSUMING I would just get any welder and just start making very important welds with no practice and or knowledge whatsoever? Yes indeed sir, that does seem a bit odd.

And BTW back to you, I just missed a used Lincoln 100 with gas conversion and cart for $150. Seemed like a good deal from what I've seen so far but maybe not.

Which brings to another direct question...there seems to be conflicting opinions on needing gas or not for only doing exhaust type work. Some say don't waste time and money on a 110 v welder with no gas. Others say a non gas 110v welder would be fine for simple exhaust work.

 

[aka Larry]

Which brings to another direct question...there seems to be conflicting opinions on needing gas or not for only doing exhaust type work. Some say don't waste time and money on a 110 v welder with no gas. Others say a non gas 110v welder would be fine for simple exhaust work.

Gas is easier, flux-core is cheaper. I still contend a 110V unit works just fine for exhaust work since the pipe is usually pretty thin.

$150 on that Lincoln 100 you mentioned was a good deal.

 

[Xcursion88]

This statement alone just makes everyone want to spend their free time helping you with information a simple search would have provided. Yes, I am being sarcastic. What you are not understanding is these people are trying to help you. Learn how to weld, or at least do some of your own research to learn what you need and how to start. Then attempt it. You are 100% right...butchering up someone's property is your choice. Members trying to guide you in a better direction is their choice and to be honest, maybe you should be a little more receptive and respectful. That is useful information that would go a LONG way. Have a good day.

If you followed along you would know that was meant as sarcasm back. I asked a simple ..SIMPLE question for people to discuss some welders MIG or not for doing some work. Some of those responses in which I replied the above to offered no opinions or help. Matter of fact they were just short of saying as long as I am not a certified welder I should have no questions welding related ever. How dare me! Whatever and ridiculous.

 

[bcradio]

120v gas MIG will do you just fine.

 

[welder4956]

Many of you are harping on the need to do more research. Part of doing all of the research is getting opinions from others on their experience and considering if those opinions are relevant to the work he is doing. I don't see an issue with the OP's question. He wasn't asking whether his decision to get into welding was correct, he was asking for help in choosing a welder.

On the 110V welders, I have a guy at work who uses one on his farm to repair the bush hog and other miscellaneous light welding. He is constantly having issues with it. Then he went to visit his cousin who has a Millermatic 211 and he said the difference was like night and day. Sure, he could fight with his 110V welder and eventually make a weld that didn't fall apart. But why start out with a handicap like a poor welding machine for the application? A better welding machine will make the learning process easier and the end result will be better welds and more versatility for his business.

 

[Tronyadorable]

Whatever you choose, order a long whip. 12-15 footer.A flex head is nice when under a car too.Weldin over the differential comes to mind. Broken manifold studs and bolts too. Check out HTP's stuff.
Unless you're doing show cars a little spatter wont matter and CO2 is just fine and a hell of a lot cheaper than C25.

 

[sberry]

He doesn't need more research. He needs the right machine for him and what he intends to do. Auto exhaust and light car work the 120V 135A units from brand players are all good. 023 wire and C25.
I do some exhaust and I use 030 on a 230V machine but use the same unit for light work on occasion to 1/4 and the larger wire gives it more punch. A 230V machine is twice as good if you are doing any more than sheet metal fabrication, even building simple tools it works better.
Sure, you can use C02, a fuzz different is all.

 

[Djstorm100]

so a hobart 140 is a no go?

 

[pi_guy]

Part of it is understanding what you are doing. Having an attitude that it is ok to learn and screw up on customers cars is not good. Doing alleged research by asking a bunch of people on a forum what they think is not acceptable.
Learning to weld is not a on line course, you need hands on with an instructor that has a good grasp of safety before you start to weld.
I see too many people that treat compressed gas cylinders like there is no danger and why bother to have them secured. Second there is molten metal involved that can cause a fire or damage stuff from heat. Not wanting to learn what is proper and figuring it out by doing just puts more work on the fire dept in his area and endangers innocent people .
He is probable a good candidate to weld a bracket on to a gas tank

 

[sk farmer]

Wow, lots of pissyness here. Before I put my two cents in let us t be known that I am a miller 211 owner and fan.

I Don't have use for a 140 class or smaller welder and cannot see why anyone would want to settle for one unless they a absolutely have to.

Why? Everybody thinks they can just plug it in to any old outlet and go to work. They should be on their own 20 amp or larger circuit. They are not a toaster or hand drill.

Welders need power and if you need to upgrade the 115 volt you may as well spend just slightly more and put 230 in. Then you can power a real welder, something that runs on 230.

 

[CNGsaves]

^ ^ Good advice. Have yet to find out from OP if shop even has electric setup to handle a 240v welder.

 

[Xcursion88]

^ ^ Good advice. Have yet to find out from OP if shop even has electric setup to handle a 240v welder.

240 is fine.