VISE REPAIR 101 all vise repairs, lubricants, sources for parts and the tricks to fix

[coleman10]

Coleman: check your local Craigslist or garage sales for older chargers you can buy for $5-25 or in that range. i hear the older ones don't need a battery in the loop, but i still need to clean out my shop and set up my tank. if you let us know where you live somebody here might have an extra one to sell you if you can't find one.

screws, jaws anything metal except stainless, nickel, chrome and other plated metals can go in your Electrolysis tank. here's a great read on the do's and don'ts of home electrolysis. i had a ton of questions and others did too and the experts were answering them all. i can't remember a question that didn't get answered on that thread.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=237752&highlight=homemade+electrolysis

I wonder if this one would work. 29 bucks at HF. Has both automatic and manual modes. I suppose it's worth a shot.

http://m.harborfreight.com/26-amp-612v-manual-charger-60322.html?utm_referrer=direct/not provided

 

[coleman10]

I wonder if this one would work. 29 bucks at HF. Has both automatic and manual modes. I suppose it's worth a shot.

http://m.harborfreight.com/26-amp-612v-manual-charger-60322.html?utm_referrer=direct/not provided

"Clamps unpowered until connected to battery."

Nothing on Craigslist at the moment. I'm in the metro Fort Lauderdale area. If anyone has an extra one lying about, let me know.

 

[EOC_Jason]

You can subscribe to threads. I subscribe with no email notification, then you just go to the UserCP to see what new posts there are on the threads you subscribe to.

 

[mtesh73]

opted for a bit of contrast

i usually use stainless steel hex cap head screws for the collar. i figured a little bit of contrast cant hurt.

 

[exmaxima1]

Re: opted for a bit of contrast

i usually use stainless steel hex cap head screws for the collar. i figured a little bit of contrast cant hurt.

I believe they are called button head socket cap screws

 

[Wanna Ride]

Re: opted for a bit of contrast

I believe they are called button head socket cap screws

Correct.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#button-head-socket-cap-screws/=un48et

 

[Wanna Ride]

WannaRide: happy to hear you found information you can use. can you post a few pictures of your vise in a couple posts. one before and another one after you finish? good luck

Thanks! I snagged this for.... five bucks! It's in excellent condition; no cracks, no missing parts, operates nice and smooth. Would it be sacrilegious if I paint it... red?

BEFORE:

 

[Retrosmith]

Testing out different rattle can vise and cabinet colors.

For the older Wilton's, Rustoleum Satin Sage looks closest (upper right)

Just beneath the Sage is the Rustoleum Verde Green which is close match for newer Wilton's. The Verde Green was ordered from Home Depot. I had to buy 6 cans for about $35.

The Rustoleum Hammered Rosemary (middle left) is a color that I haven't seen before that would look good on a vise.

 

[zkling]

I kinda like the pistachio, just because it's different. You could accent with beige for that still in the shell feel.

 

[balane]

Just beneath the Sage is the Rustoleum Verde Green which is close match for newer Wilton's.

I've tried a lot of different paint to match the original old-school Wilton mint green. This is the closest I've found and it's really close.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FN0M63Q/?tag=atomicindus08-20

.

 

[Retrosmith]

I kinda like the pistachio, just because it's different. You could accent with beige for that still in the shell feel.

It'd be different that's for sure but if I'm going that far I'd paint it to look like Sesame Street's Bert.

I've tried a lot of different paint to match the original old-school Wilton mint green. This is the closest I've found and it's really close.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FN0M63Q/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Thanks for the tip. I'll pick up a can.

 

[coleman10]

"Clamps unpowered until connected to battery."

Nothing on Craigslist at the moment. I'm in the metro Fort Lauderdale area. If anyone has an extra one lying about, let me know.

Just to close out my question and in case anyone out there is also looking for a manual battery charger, I did a little more digging and the Schumacher SE-82-6 fits the bill - $34 from Amazon.

 

[exmaxima1]

Testing out different rattle can vise and cabinet colors.
Just beneath the Sage is the Rustoleum Verde Green which is close match for newer Wilton's. The Verde Green was ordered from Home Depot. I had to buy 6 cans for about $35.
.

I was in the same situation last week looking for Verde Green to refurbish an old Belsaw belt sander. Didn't need 6 cans from HD, and nobody seemed to carry it. I was shocked to find it at Menards along with the Blue that looks great on many vises.

 

[exmaxima1]

I've tried a lot of different paint to match the original old-school Wilton mint green. This is the closest I've found and it's really close.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FN0M63Q/?tag=atomicindus08-20

.

Is that the vise you sold recently on the auction site? What kind of swivel clamps are those??

 

[mtesh73]

Re: opted for a bit of contrast

yes they are.... my hands type faster than my brain can compute sometimes.

I believe they are called button head socket cap screws

Correct.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#button-head-socket-cap-screws/=un48et

 

[balane]

Is that the vise you sold recently on the auction site? What kind of swivel clamps are those??

Yes, that was one that I sold on eBay. It came with nuts and bolts for swivel locks when I got it. I purchased a couple of carriage bolts. Those nuts I had and I don't know what vise they came off originally. Possibly an American Scale. I had to make the sliding handles for them and added a washer.

 

[exmaxima1]

Yes, that was one that I sold on eBay. It came with nuts and bolts for swivel locks when I got it. I purchased a couple of carriage bolts. Those nuts I had and I don't know what vise they came off originally. Possibly an American Scale. I had to make the sliding handles for them and added a washer.

A washer is always a nice touch after a great paint job like that. I'm starting work on a similar vise, and hope it turns out 1/2 as nice as yours.

 

[balane]

I like using washers and will play with thicknesses. I know it's a tiny detail but I like to have the handles perfectly parallel to the vise body when they're snugged up.

Thanks for the compliment and good luck with yours.

 

[drivesitfar]

Balane: I have to agree those handles that you borrowed from another vise and made the sliding handles for look pretty cool on that Wilton. any chance you want to make a post to show and tell how you make a swivel handle? i'm pretty sure i'll need to make a gross of them once i get started on my projects in my "little" cabinet.

by the way the stump looks like the hole in the middle is getting bigger. I guess you'll just have to only restore those vises that are over 100 pounds soon or the smaller ones will fall in.

of course this goes without saying that your vises you sit on that stump look pretty damn nice.

 

[blkadder]

I have been using electrolysis for years (comes with owning an MGB) on various parts, from lower A frames, to Russian PPs-43 barrel shrouds. I tried all of the battery charger options, and I think you will find that they have a tendency to detect a short and turn themselves off. If you can find an old power pack for an HP printer, they can put out about 35v at 2 amps. Personally, I built a power supply just for this and etching metal (serial numbers on receivers). I built one using plans from this site:

http://coustil.free.fr/atelier_gravure_gb.html

If you are handy with electronics it is pretty straight forward. I also have a Pyramid power supply I got at the "stereo" shop at my local flea market. It puts out 12v, but most importantly, it puts out 15 amps (which actually does all the work). I set up my tank using just a HD bucket with some pieces of rebar set around the perimeter, and then wired together. I get pretty decent action from my setup. I can post up some pics should they be needed. Thanks for all the advise for squaring away my new paperweight.

Ron

 

[drivesitfar]

Ron: sure ad a few pictures here and so your awesome post doesn't get lost in this thread maybe also post it over on the Electrolysis thread i posted a link to so it will be there for others. i think you are the first on to have those ideas and a link to building your own power source. thanks

i have a lot of Morgans and i didn't know they made a coachmaker's vise and happy to see you found one. my vote is for boiled linseed oil unless you have a favorite color.

 

[blkadder]

I think the Morgan will be bare steel. That way it shows off the character, and gives an insight as to the life it had lived.

I will put something together for the electrolysis thread.

I had a question about a vise that I just saw on CL. It is a brinnell vise. I did not see this one listed on the other thread. Here is a picture.

Thanks for all the great responses.

Ron

 

[drivesitfar]

BLK: it looks like an interesting open screw vise. it also looks like maybe a mounting foot has broken off so unless it is something you want to put on a shelf to look at i'd probably pass on that vise.

 

[exmaxima1]

BLK: it looks like an interesting open screw vise. it also looks like maybe a mounting foot has broken off so unless it is something you want to put on a shelf to look at i'd probably pass on that vise.

Absolutely pass, unless parts are needed to fix a similar vise. Alot of time could be wasted on a vise that would never fetch more than $5.

That thing is ready to be scrapped. And judging from the pic on that table, it might actually have some scrap weight....

 

[Fretters]

The support under the front jaw insert has been broken off too. Saying that though, if they're not wanting more than a few quid for that and there's nowt else wrong with it, I'd be tempted to get it just for curio value. It's an unusual design. You'd want to check why they've lathered it with primer/paint before taking the photo though. That could be hiding something or they may just have tried poorly tarting it up.

 

[sbosecker]

Morgan Vise Jaw Face (Jaw Insert) Information may be found in the attached pdf documents.
A Morgan Vise parts list that Wild Cowboy provided to me is also attached.


Parts for Morgan Vise's may be obtained from:


Milwaukee Tool & Equipment Company
2773 South 29th Street
PO Box 2039
Milwaukee, WI 53201
414-645-0200
[email protected]

I received the following information from [email protected] regarding a vise I have (4 Standard Vise) that seems to have Morgan Vise DNA.

The Morgan Vise Company was started in the 20's. We purchased the company and moved it to Milwaukee Wisconsin in February 1970. The documentation we received was very limited. To the best of our knowledge The Morgan Vise Company never made a vise with the word "standard" on it. But the could have. Your pictures look similar to our vise and some of the numbers even match, but we have no idea if any parts are interchangeable.

No one in your area stocks these parts. I can sell parts directly to you using a credit card. You may return the parts prepaid freight for full credit on the cost of the parts.

Scott

 

[GUNpowder]

Re: VISE REPAIR - Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw

Canadian Vise (aka Record/Paramo)

Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw:

(Static jaw) Retaining Screws - 5/16 X 18 NC x 5/8 Long

(Dynamic jaw) Retaining Screws - 5/16 X 24 NF x 1 1/4 Long

Curious that a manufacturer would take the trouble to tap the holes
for the removable jaw retaining screws differently for each jaw.

I would think this would be significant tooling costs, plus labour costs,
and I wonder what would be the point?

Photo shows the size comparison between 5/16 x 24 NF x 1.250"(Left) and 5/16 x 18 NC x 0.625" (Right).

I couldn't get a sharp picture showing the different head types of the two machine screws. The 5/16x28 NF has a slotted Hex head. The 5/16x18 NC has a normal round head.

Both fit snugly into counter-bored (0.050"), and counter-sunk holes.

 

[exmaxima1]

Re: VISE REPAIR - Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw

Canadian Vise (aka Record/Paramo)

Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw:

(Static jaw) Retaining Screws - 5/16 X 18 NC x 5/8 Long

(Dynamic jaw) Retaining Screws - 5/16 X 24 NF x 1 1/4 Long

Curious that a manufacturer would take the trouble to tap the holes
for the removable jaw retaining screws differently for each jaw.

I would think this would be significant tooling costs, plus labour costs,
and I wonder what would be the point?

.

No way those are the original screws. The manufacturer would absolutely NOT have different threads and screw lengths for something as mundane as jaw screws.

 

[drivesitfar]

SB: thanks for posting and earlier i added your post # to the #2 post on this thread next to Morgan vises.

GunPowder: i agree with you and EX that i doubt those vise screws were stock that way. i'm guessing the longer ones were added later. i think i remember you saying the Made In Canada vise was your Dad's or Granddad's so do you know if they bought it new?

ALL: anybody in the process of restoring a vise that wants to put the before and after pictures on this thread instead of starting a new thread with just the one vise? please do if you have one or recently did one so we can all see and maybe ask you a few questions about it or just enjoy the vise ****.

 

[GUNpowder]

RE: GunPowder: I agree with you and EX that i doubt those vise screws were stock, guessing the longer ones were added later.

The Canadian vise is at least 60 years old and perhaps 80. Circa anywhere from 1930 to 1955. Around 90% chance it was provided as provincial government issue, very likely bought through local hardware store, but I have no way to confirm that.

My guess is that the original screws were the shorter 5/16x18 NC x 5/8. For the same reason bulldozers use NC threads - easier to keep clean and less likely to strip.

The 5/16x24 NF have hex heads and slots. They are 1 1/4" long.

If you were replacing lost fasteners in malleable iron, you might want to keep the same diameter. NF give more holding strength. So drill the existing 5/8" holes deeper and thread the new portion NF... except there is no evidence the deeper 5/16x24 NF were ever re-threaded. The NF threads in the casting look legitimate.

Gosh, I would love to find an original catalog or foundry info about this vise. It is an interesting mystery.

 

[GUNpowder]

Re: VISE REPAIR - Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw

No way those are the original screws. The manufacturer would absolutely NOT have different threads and screw lengths for something as mundane as jaw screws.

I think you need to consider the era this vise was manufactured... say perhaps as early as 1920. Skilled labour was cheap. Henry Ford had just thought of the assembly line.

Wouldn't be the first time a manufacturer built in replacement part headaches into the supply chain!

Roll Royce continued to build cast valve covers, held on by beautiful T bolts, on their Merlin engines during wartime. When the life expectancy of the the aircraft was measured in hours... When Packard begun supplying engines under license, they immediately went to stamped sheet metal valve covers and normal hex nuts. Not pretty but darn faster to produce by the thousand.

So perhaps these two bolt sizes are original equipment?

 

[jakemac]

Maybe it was a Friday vise. The original holes could have been stripped and rather than scrap an otherwise good vise, they improvised so that they could ship it out.

 

[drivesitfar]

GunPowder: I did a little search on the main vise thread and came up with a few other Made In Canada vices. Northern King vice on post #16310 and #5018. then post #710 has 3 Made in Canada vices (RAE, Grey and Henry). i'm sure i've seen more, but these are what came up on a search without reading all 21,000 posts. they all look basicly the same as the Record vices so still leaning that way as to the original patent they are using.

Jake: Friday night vise. As much as that is funny it probably could be true.

 

[Fretters]

Re: VISE REPAIR - Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw

Canadian Vise (aka Record/Paramo)

Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw:

(Static jaw) Retaining Screws - 5/16 X 18 NC x 5/8 Long

(Dynamic jaw) Retaining Screws - 5/16 X 24 NF x 1 1/4 Long

The 5/16"x18 is likely BSW, which I'd guess was the original type in both jaws.

 

[Fretters]

GunPowder: I did a little search on the main vise thread and came up with a few other Made In Canada vices. Northern King vice on post #16310 and #5018. then post #710 has 3 Made in Canada vices (RAE, Grey and Henry). i'm sure i've seen more, but these are what came up on a search without reading all 21,000 posts. they all look basicly the same as the Record vices so still leaning that way as to the original patent they are using.

Jake: Friday night vise. As much as that is funny it probably could be true.

That RAE vice has the same styling.

 

[GUNpowder]

Re: VISE REPAIR - Removable Jaw retaining screws are different for each jaw

The 5/16"x18 is likely BSW, which I'd guess was the original type in both jaws.

I owe some people an apology... I agree the original threads were 5/16x18.
Funny that I would not have thought of BSW threads on something of this vintage (I once had a love/hate relationship with an 850 Norton motorcycle; positive ground is another adventure...)

 

[GUNpowder]

Update: It took a week of coaxing but after removing the 4th screw I can confirm that the two replacement fasteners were added later. They are fine thread but one was originally too long and evidence of being trimmed with a hacksaw.

And yes, now that I have the removable jaw plate out of the way, the fine thread bolts do indeed enter appr. 5/8" before thread engagement.

The Brits and their Whitworth threads... actually I believe they were first to standardize threads at a place called Enfield Lock.

Leaves me in a bit of a challenging way as to how best to effect repairs.
All 4 holes could be drilled oversize and tapped to 3/8-16 NC. Some concern over thread engagement as I am not sure one would get rid of the original thread.

One could drill oversize, shrink fit brass rod, then drill and tap to modern SAE 5/16-18 NC? Pretty big holes to fill with brazing rod, although that would be the most durable sort of repair, I think.

Very useful device to have on the corner of one's reloading bench.

I have attached more pictures. Thanks for the assistance with finding similar posts by the way; I have been sifting through the pages but it's a time consuming process.

 

[GUNpowder]

Maybe it was a Friday vise. The original holes could have been stripped and rather than scrap an otherwise good vise, they improvised so that they could ship it out.

Witty fellow... but the hacksaw marks on one of the two replacement SAE screws are a dead give away of on the farm repair. Another contributor suggested the original screw thread may be BSW...

 

[GUNpowder]

GunPowder: I did a little search on the main vise thread and came up with a few other Made In Canada vices. Northern King vice on post #16310 and #5018. then post #710 has 3 Made in Canada vices (RAE, Grey and Henry). i'm sure i've seen more, but these are what came up on a search without reading all 21,000 posts. they all look basicly the same as the Record vices so still leaning that way as to the original patent they are using.

Jake: Friday night vise. As much as that is funny it probably could be true.

Thanks for digging these pictures out for me! The RAE looks especially close.
I'm hoping to fit nylon, brass and steel jaws at some point in the future. Need to figure out what to do with the retaining screws for the jaw inserts first - see other posts.

 

[Outlawmws]

GUN, Helicoil to the original size and be done.