Impacts vs Chrome sockets - pictures [PIC. HEAVY]

[Olafur]

We all know one should not use impact wrench on chrome socket! Ok, with that behind us lets look at some pictures of chrome sockets that have seen years of impact use.

These pics come from the same shop, these guys fix everything that shows up, lots of farm and construction equipment, trucks etc since 1998. The short version - they don't use impact sockets, just chrome sockets on the guns. It's a cultural thing over here in my area. You know, when everyone is doing it - what's the problem?

It seems many members here on GarageJournal consider using regular sockets on impact guns very dangerous. I guess this thread could be seen as red-pill. Perhaps I want to show you just how long one can use impact guns on decent chrome sockets before they actually fail. Like you can see in pictures, decent chrome sockets eventually just wear out and then crack finally after years of use.

Few 3/4" drive sockets, some of these are probably close to 20 years old. In the first years of the shop they bought Craftsman and Koken in 3/4 drive. Last 10 years or so they have been buying more Taiwan stuff.



Craftsman 1 7/8" note this shop deals mostly with metric, so this one is still around. Still some impact use.


Looks good, big size and plenty of metal to absorb the power from the gun.


Craftsman again - 1 1/8 close enough to 28mm to have seen plenty of use.


some damage here but not to bad. Good socket - notice the thick wall.


Next up is 32mm Koken, this one has seen it all, 6 point, extreme use.


Some deformation and wear and a crack as well.


Third pic showing the cracks


28mm Koken not as common size as 32 so still alive.


Notice how good the business end looks compared to the 32mm =less use.


Facom 24mm this one is not as old as the koken/craftsman stuff above. Bad pic sorry


Noticeable wear, don't know much about this one.

 

[Olafur]

Next is 1/2 drive.
Basically these guys don't use 1/2 drive impact sockets. They just use the guns on chrome day in and day out.

Family photo: Anyone see any signs of impact use??


Old heyco 19mm


The chrome was to shiny for the camera, it actually looks very good.



13 mm Beta several years of use, possibly a decade.


Bad pic but this end looks very good, Betas are hard.


Unknown Cr-v 19mm surface drive, few years old. Judging by where I found it, it was destroyed very recently. Notice the absence of signs of "explosion" or shrapnel flying etc. This is how they usually fail.





Sonic 17 mm less than 2 years old. This one sees the business end of impact wrench most days.


This end looks very good, quite hard stuff in this socket. Typical for recent Taiwan offerings.



The following 3 sockets come from the same set 4-5 years old. The most common sizes have been replaced, these are still around.

Sonic, cant remember the size this one is on it's last legs.


Some signs of deformation but minimal - this one has taken a lot of beating.


Sonic 22mm seen better days


Again - this end looks good, it will look like this until the socket just cracks.


Sonic 24, this is how they end after years of hammering:


Hardly noticeable wear, fatigue gets them eventually.


Here is the short 1/2 drive extension from the same set:


Yup, lots of hammering.


Koken 30 or 32 size probably 15 year old.


Survivor:


18mm Koken




Finally 1-2 year old toptul 17 and 19. Common sizes heavy use.


Toptul seems to behave similar to "Sonic" rather hard.


They will probably crack before they show much wear. Similar to the Sonic's above.

 

[uglyjacko]

How about a picture of the anvil from the impact?

 

[shoggoth80]

Correct me if I am wrong. I know that some manufacturers machine dimples into the corners on the square drive end... but I can see where the anvil has hammered the square drive ends, and deformed the metal there. Also, no way to discount the wear and the cracks. That stuff may happen in normal use, but would an impact not accelerate the process? I hammer on stuff all day long, but it's a lot of impact sockets on big stuff, and normal hand tool use.

 

[sam.coll]

Ha yeah all good until one shatters one day and shards of steel go flying, willing to bet if they aint using the correct tool for the job then they aint wearing safety glasses or personal protective equipment either!

 

[Olafur]

Thankfully we - who know better - buy "impact" sockets.

Any impact sockets actually, even sockets made in unknown location out of unknown materials of unknown: hardness, malleability and ductility - it's all good.

1) It says "impact" on the package
2) They are black

= instant guarantee against accidents. The right tool for the job!

Really?

 

[theoldwizard1]

40+ years ago, I was an assistant manager in a Sears garage. At that time, The Craftsman 1/2" deep sockets only came in 12 point and the store did not stock individual impact sockets (only sets). Back then, the most popular sizes were 1/2" and 9/16". So the guys in the shocks and exhaust bays used 1/2"-3/8" chrome adapters with 3/8" chrome sockets. The store could barley keep them in stock !

 

[Kensgarage]

Looks very familiar.....
Good write up.

Oh well. Time to get to it.
Have fun.

 

[1950mercury]

Most tool company's will not warranty chrome sockets that have been used on impacts.
If you try to use the sockets on a ratchet they will be as loose as a 3 doller *****.

 

[Olafur]

40+ years ago, I was an assistant manager in a Sears garage. At that time, The Craftsman 1/2" deep sockets only came in 12 point and the store did not stock individual impact sockets (only sets). Back then, the most popular sizes were 1/2" and 9/16". So the guys in the shocks and exhaust bays used 1/2"-3/8" chrome adapters with 3/8" chrome sockets. The store could barley keep them in stock !

I can imagine. 3/8 drive chrome does not last long in front of 1/2" impact. On average considerable difference in wall thickness between drive sizes.

 

[Olafur]

Looks very familiar.....
Good write up.

Oh well. Time to get to it.
Have fun.

Thanks, judging by the looks of many used chrome socket sets on Ebay I am sure many members here have seen this before.

Most tool company's will not warranty chrome sockets that have been used on impacts.
If you try to use the sockets on a ratchet they will be as loose as a 3 doller *****.

True. However warranty on hand-tools over here has been very close to zero anyway.

 

[Olafur]

How about a picture of the anvil from the impact?

Stay tuned.

 

[superautobacs]

When you say "they", are you referring to your employer or the companies purchasers? Are they not aware of the existence of impact sockets?
I take it that these are your co-worker's sockets or communal use? What do you use?

Thanks for sharing.

 

[colin39]

Stay tuned.

How about a picture of the anvil from the impact?

You post yours and ill post mine later lol

 

[Olafur]

Yours truly at your service, as requested -"chrome hammering" anvils:
1/2" drive:
Few months old IR




1-2 years old "Kraftwerk"


IR - age unknown


Hog ring loose but else pretty normal


IR -age unknown


bad pic sorry the end in front of the ring is dagmaged


Probably around 2 year old "Sonic" branded gun, quite powerful but difficult trigger BTW:




New(ish) Chicago Pneumatic (not powerful but somewhat nice gun)


bad pic, nothing to see really:


3/4" chrome hammering impacts:

This older C.P is resting comfortably with worn out motor and broken vanes. The anvil however is still here and this one is responsible for plenty of the damage seen in the first post of this thread.


Nice anvil


Group shot, first is recent IR, second is broken Gison (gutless from the beginning with broken hammer) next are two older twins: Chicago Pneumatic (774) made in Japan approx 1000 lb/ft guns.

 

[Olafur]

Ok, question: Some sockets have rounded corners in the drive end so it's difficult to see how bad these sockets are worn out. Furthermore: Are these pictures really showing chrome sockets after heavy impact use or is this just normal wear from hand tools?

I will try to address that:
Found the remains of Koken 3/8" drive socket set, the opposite ends: 6mm and 19mm are still there:


Here we have unspoiled drive end vs used one. Most of the damage on the 19 mm drive end is probably from 3/8 butterfly wrench.


I have already shown you pics of some 1/2" drive sockets from this 4-5 year old Sonic set:



Here are some of the sockets I posted before, including the cracked 24mm with new torx T70 and the rarely used 9mm socket for comparison.


Another bad pic.


One more. So yes Sonics have rounded corners in the drive end. The mushrooming in the corners from the impacts is considerable never the less.


Before we leave this set I want to show you 3/8 drive, because this guy doesn't have any 3/8 power tools.
11mm 12mm and 13mm - what's up with the 13?


Another look at 13, it's quite worn - this is because this guy primarily works on farm equipment and tractors from Europe. And the standard head size for 8mm fasteners there is 13! So here we have a socket with heavy use and it is really showing:


Now lets take a look at the drive end:


Another look now with 11 and 12 again, unfortunately these pics are not good enough, but I hope you see the drive end looks quite good, very little mushrooming or deformation in the corners if any at all! I hope you see clearly the difference vs impact damage.


Next up is Toptul set, it's an extra and has seen little use:


17mm, 9mm(unused) and 19mm drive ends.


Same sockets from another Toptul set, this one has seen full use for a year or so, the guy working out of this one gets many nasty jobs of rusted out equipment: His main tools are OxAc torch, BFH and impact guns etc.. and it shows:


Same sockets, finally a half-decent photo. As you can see the common 17 and 19 sizes have taken serious beating.

 

[Wamsutta]

The chrome sockets eventually wear out the anvil and then your sockets are falling off all the time unless you hold the socket on.

 

[Olafur]

The chrome sockets eventually wear out the anvil and then your sockets are falling off all the time unless you hold the socket on.

As I subcontract some work in this place I have used many of their impacts and I have not noticed this problem - so to speak. Yes the oldest 1/2 guns have this problem but after extreme use: don't they always? 3/4" anvils all hold sockets firmly still so not a problem.

 

[Olafur]

More photos:

The graveyard, the remains of worn out sets:


Few candidates:


drive ends


same sockets turned around.


One more 1/2" set, this is actually old Koken set with several items replaced with other brands.


I turned the sockets upside down to show the drive ends. Years and years of impact use on some of the original Koken sockets remaining.


Bigger sizes, mostly Koken still.


Take a look at these 22 and 24mm Kokens, they have been shortened to extend their live, mushrooming cut off the end. Talking about heavy wear:




Drive ends:


Here they are with 36mm Impact socket, I wanted to show you the old Kokens are more worn out on the drive end than the Impact. That's interesting because they are supposed to be harder than the Impact socket. Bad picture sorry.


The real difference between them is however seen here: The old kokens are still alive and kicking after all these years of impact use, but the 36 Sonic "impact" with all it's wall thickness is not:




Sadly the fantastic Koken chrome sockets are not "Impact" sockets - else they would give years of service as thin wall impacts. They simply don't shatter and just rip up peacefully when they finally fail, no chrome flaking to speak of. So they are as good as it gets. It's a shame really they are not "Impact" sockets.

 

[90zcar]

Some people get so uptight about this topic and get full of rage if u go anywhere near the topic of chrome on an impact. If you have never used a chrome socket in your life on an impact your full of **** or you never really wrenched before.
In my home garage I use impact on my impact gun and chrome on ratchets and can't remember the last time i used chrome on an impact....but I have before.
At work it's a different story(industrial mechanic). I don't personally own any of my tools at work and 1/2 the time **** is lost and scattered around and you use what is available at the moment. I never once "shattered" a chrome socket on an impact gun. I've cracked chrome and ive cracked an impact aswell. Not saying it can't happen but come on...


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[Olafur]

Similar situation here.
I have used impacts on chrome since I first tried an impact wrench about 30 years ago. Over here the shops supply all tools and if they want to beat up their chrome gear it's mostly their problem. I can do that.

However this is part of a very minimalistic tool culture. One I disagree with and since I am getting more and more projects in this place I am bringing in my own toolbox and tools. I don't like spending considerable chunk of the day hunting down tools, working with worn out tools or stand there like an idiot needing tools I have at home but they don't. And yes, some of my impact sets will follow.

 

[Olafur]

When you say "they", are you referring to your employer or the companies purchasers? Are they not aware of the existence of impact sockets?
I take it that these are your co-worker's sockets or communal use? What do you use?

Thanks for sharing.

I am referring to the shop owner who started alone over 20 years ago and now runs a shop with about 10 mechanics + side operations, and his long time employees. Each mechanic has his own box, but basically tools are shared back and forth. All tools shop owned.

Yes they are aware of impact sockets there are several above the extensions, 3/4 and 1" drive.


Here are few, mostly German Walter sockets.


One box in the main shop also has this drawer, there is something black in there, doesn't appear to be much used.


*edit*
Can't resist to show you guys the Icelandic repair kit for 1" drive ratches. It clearly wasn't strong enough but now totally "fixed".

 

[kunkernator]

I for one, only have impact sockets. 99% of my work i use an impact wrench, the other 1%, i just use the impact sockets on my ratchets. I will NEVER use a chrome socket on an impact, ever since some ******* in tech school shattered one, which sent him to the hospital.


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[JBradley500]

I won't lie. I use low power battery impacts with chrome sockets all the time. One thing I do find myself doing with an 1/2" air impact and a chrome socket is on Chevy (mostly) manifold studs. The impact sockets want to round them off too easily. Other than that, I do my best not to be in that situation.

 

[Olafur]

There is no clear cut line between impact sockets and chrome sockets. Chrome sockets can be very hard and brittle and on the other end of the spectrum are sockets so soft they are complete junk. Same story with so called "impact" sockets.

This means if we leave the chrome plating out there is great overlap between impact sockets vs non- impacts regarding what counts for safety: hardness, ductility and malleability.

The distinction between impact and none impact sockets is basically in the very "capable" hands of marketing geniuses.

And clearly - they won the game. No-one questions the wisdom of using whatever black oxide (or even black paint) sockets if they are labelled "impact".

The result is, people are hammering on all kinds of junk (Harbour Freight) and think anyone using top quality chrome socket on his impact gun is an idiot! You have seen my pictures of Koken chrome sockets, now google "broken impact socket" and take a look.

Image posted by member here:

Not only is this sockets made of junk, it seems to be rather hard and even brittle junk capable of sending pieces of the sockets flying if enough power is used.

I will take Koken, Stahlwille, Snap On, Toptul and many other brands chrome sockets on my guns before I would use many so called "impact" sockets on the market today. At least I know by experience they don't shatter!

Funny how this works.

 

[Thegratenate]

I'm with Olafur, I'll rattle away on a quality 1/2" drive socket from Wright, or an old Blackhawk, but use lesser sockets sparingly on an impact. My default is to use impact sockets for everything, but I have access to chrome when I run into clearance issues.

 

[kv501]

Some people get so uptight about this topic and get full of rage if u go anywhere near the topic of chrome on an impact. If you have never used a chrome socket in your life on an impact your full of **** or you never really wrenched before.
In my home garage I use impact on my impact gun and chrome on ratchets and can't remember the last time i used chrome on an impact....but I have before.
At work it's a different story(industrial mechanic). I don't personally own any of my tools at work and 1/2 the time **** is lost and scattered around and you use what is available at the moment. I never once "shattered" a chrome socket on an impact gun. I've cracked chrome and ive cracked an impact aswell. Not saying it can't happen but come on...


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Working at a truck body manufacturer when I was 21 I had a coworker badly injured by a chrome socket on an impact.

It wasn't flying shards that got him; when the socket broke it came off the nut and shot him in the face hard. Caught him right under the safety glasses, broke the bridge of his nose and tore his tear duct. Vision was blurry for about two weeks and luckily it came back, but the tear duct never worked again as long as I knew him (wasn't a friend of mine; worked there about 3 years). I remember he had to put drops in that eye all the time.

You can do it if you want but that was enough of an example for me. Impact sockets aren't that expensive.

 

[Monte]

This older C.P is resting comfortably with worn out motor and broken vanes.

i was told the vanes are made out of the same material circuit boards are made of, actually from the residues of circuit board production. Maybe a DIY repair with parts from the electronic store might work...

 

[DodgeMech]

The chrome sockets eventually wear out the anvil and then your sockets are falling off all the time unless you hold the socket on.

impact sockets will do the same damned thing to one...i've been using a 1/2 inch impact daily for a couple years now, sockets slide on and off easy, just got a new 1/2 inch cordless impact from dewilt(thing is kick ***, btw), and the sockets barely want to go on...so, impact sockets will damage an anvil too, but perhaps not as quickly as chrome

 

[Olafur]

i was told the vanes are made out of the same material circuit boards are made of, actually from the residues of circuit board production. Maybe a DIY repair with parts from the electronic store might work...

Come to think of it, yes the material in similar. Good point, thanks Monte.

I recently fixed both the 3/4 CP774 guns in the picture above and they work fine today. However I am not sure I did the shop guys a favour doing it. These guns are heavy and basically not powerful enough to justify the weight. Yes they do better than any 1/2 drive but not much. I suspect the broken CP could be the same story - so hardly worth repairing.

 

[uglyjacko]

The only chrome sockets I used with my impact is 3/8 drive craftsman set, as the warranty is no ? Asked, unlike others which will void the warranty with the drive end looking like ****. Will use 1/2 drive chrome when there is no other choice to get out of a bind and also craftsman because of the great warranty!

 

[Olafur]

Well, since photobucket has restored my images I guess it time to bump this one for new members. For fun if nothing else.

 

[Olafur]

I wan't to make a point about impact sockets and safety.

A REAL and SAFE impact socket is made out of rather soft steel. They are not supposed break with pieces of metal flying. It follows they don't last very long, relatively speaking. There is a reason Snap On impact sockets wear out faster than some cheaper brands. It's not a quality issue, it's a safety issue. Snap On can't cut corners there, their reputation is on the line. And they are serving some big and serious customers who would sue them right away over safety issues with their tools. Same story with other established expensive brands.

Case in point; 36mm socket in this picture. This is german made top quality impact socket, and it's worn out.

The cheaper brands we love today .. frequently are highly recommended because they "hold up well". This simply means they are harder, and almost certainly not as safe as their softer counterparts.

This picture is from Harbour Freight impact socket - and this nasty breakage indicates it way to hard and you are no better off using it than the average chrome socket.

Just few more PSI at the gun and it would have shattered and sent shrapnel flying.

 

[flushcut]

Impressive thread! Thanks for sharing.

 

[6PTsocket]

While there are no absolutes, harder = more brittle. Chrome plated sockets are generally harder, more brittle chrome vanadium and most decent brands of impacts are softer, less brittle chrome moly that makes them less prone to shatter. But I would think they would be more prone to wear. Then you come to the real world and who knows what kind of metalurgy goes into some cheap sockets, regardless of what they claim to be made from. Tekton uses chrome vanadium in their impact sockets. Anybody ever shatter one? And yes I have sinned and nothing happened. I almost always use the correct type. This post has me wondering if there is a valid reason.

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[hangfirew8]

This is why I invested in Sunex CrMo 3/8 impact socket sets and IR 1/2 shallow impacts.

However my 1/2 deeps are a real mix of who knows what, probably mostly CrV. I'll upgrade at some point. They were purchased before I knew better.

-HF

 

[Flybye]

After breaking chrome sockets with a 15” 1/2 breakerbar, I can’t even imagine the torture chromies see with impacts. Nice pics, though.

 

[Olafur]

While there are no absolutes, harder = more brittle. Chrome plated sockets are generally harder, more brittle chrome vanadium and most decent brands of impacts are softer, less brittle chrome moly that makes them less prone to shatter. But I would think they would be more prone to wear. Then you come to the real world and who knows what kind of metalurgy goes into some cheap sockets, regardless of what they claim to be made from. Tekton uses chrome vanadium in their impact sockets. Anybody ever shatter one? And yes I have sinned and nothing happened. I almost always use the correct type. This post has me wondering if there is a valid reason.

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Well, you summed up my point rather well with this comment. In my experience Taiwan impact sockets are indeed quite hard and I haven't seen much difference as how they break-crack versus chrome. Main difference in my view is wall thickness. But no I have never shattered one - meaning flying debris. But then I have never experienced or seen chrome socket do that either. I remember one casualty from cracked socket, it was chrome that split open - but the guy was holding the socket when it happened. It was still in one piece but ripped his finger open.

It was the owner of the sockets pictured in this thread, the shop owner and foreman with 45 years of wrenching under his belt. He did mention something about impact sockets when this happened, but came to his senses rather quickly when he realized the socket in question was from a set he bought 15 years ago and had seen the business end of impact guns hundreds of times.

 

[KillNThrill24]

Interesting topic that I never really thought a whole lot about. I've cracked a few chromies on an impact in my early teens before I knew any better. Hid those from dad of course. A friend of mine who buys cheaper tools (his claim is somewhat valid, he doesn't use them much so why spend the money), has a set of Hazard Fraud impact sockets and I always wondered why they felt different than my snap on impact sockets. Not to sound crazy, but they always felt colder, and a bit harder. And when you dropped one, the HF always had a different tone to it. But I honestly just thought it was the coating they used and never really thought about why they were different. Now I'm really curious. Good thread bump OP.

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[JulianMorrow]

My local Sears was closing last fall and had a fire sale, so I bought Craftsman (Chinese made) 1/2" impact socket sets. All metric, both deep & shallow sets. I just use these impact sockets on both my hand tools and electric impact wrench. No problems so far.

I'm sure there are guys who use chrome sockets on impact wrenches with no problems. And there are people who don't wear safety belts when they drive. A lot of this involves your risk level, and what you think is acceptable risk.

My risk: my 1/2" metric socket may be too thick-walled in a tight clearance. But that's just an inconvenience. I can always switch my ratchet and go with my chrome 3/8" sockets.
The risk of putting a chrome socket on an impact wrench is more than just an inconvenience, it's dangerous to you and anyone you're working with.

As someone here noted, impact sockets aren't that expensive. If you're on a tight budget, you can get a nice Tekton impact metric set for $40 on Amazon (see below). Come on, guys. Stop the ********. Everyone here can afford that. Your wife or girlfriend will appreciate it.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B009447UOC/?tag=atomicindus08-20