Help with gutter

[dragonballz]

You can see in the picture that the 2nd-floor gutter drains into the 1st-floor gutter. At the point where the 2nd-floor gutter joins the 1st-floor gutter, I believe it overflows BEHIND the vinyl siding because it drips out of the siding's drain holes. In the winter time, I get tiny icicles coming out of those drain holes.

How can I fix this leak? Is there an attachment to force the water to flow left inside the gutter instead of straight down into the gutter? The gutter is already slightly pitched

Thanks

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MORE PICTURES

You can see the original wood shingles behind the vinyl siding in the 3rd picture

 

[JMURiz]

Does the downspout dump straight into the gutter of is there an elbow to help it flow down-gutter? Adding a 90 when it enters the lower gutter to help it flow down the gutter would help.

 

[Bondo]

Ayuh,.... It appears to me that the sidin' is improperly installed at that junction point of the gutter/ downspout,....

The gutter should stop short of the wall, 'n the sidin' should go past the end of the gutter, rather than that j-channel that goes Around the gutter end,....

 

[wbrian63]

Lower gutter needs to come down and be shortened. Siding needs to be removed where it notches around the gutter and be properly installed to go behind the gutter.

Alternately, you could try to put a right-angle-flat end on the downspout to direct the flow better.

What you've got here is bad gutter design/implementation. The lower gutter is effectively handling the rain flow off the lower roof, plus all of the upper roof that's directed into the downspout.

If this is a new siding job - I'd call the contractor and get him back to the jobsite to fix the mistake. If not, you're on your own to fix it. Hope you have some spare siding pieces.

I see a similar problem where the upper gutter wraps around the end of the upper story. Any overflow of that gutter is going to wrap around the face, flow along the bottom of the gutter and behind the siding...

 

[JMURiz]

Ahhh, good point Bondo, looks like the siding goes around instead of behind the gutter

 

[Bondo]

Ahhh, good point Bondo, looks like the siding goes around instead of behind the gutter

Ayuh,.... Hard to see, but the 2nd story gutter/ sidin' interface don't look much better,...

 

[myredracer]

Ayuh,.... It appears to me that the sidin' is improperly installed at that junction point of the gutter/ downspout,....

The gutter should stop short of the wall, 'n the sidin' should go past the end of the gutter, rather than that j-channel that goes Around the gutter end,....

Yes. ^^

Totally wrong gutter & siding install and lack of proper flashing...

The gutter should **** up against the siding and the siding should be flashed so the water running downhill along the intersection of the roof/wall will be forced to run into the gutter. This should be addressed asap before damage occurs to the building structure, if it hasn't happened already. Check the rest of the house and fix as required. How did this pass inspection?

Is there step-flashing installed all the way up the intersection of roof and siding? Can't see with the gutter in the way. If not, you have a big problem on your hands. The pic below shows what it looks like and is of a retro-fit job. I'm going to guess it's not there as you can see a vinyl trim piece running continuous at bottom of the gutter sitting on the shingles.

Not sure about the age of the house or your building code requirements, but in Canada, some years ago, "rain screen technology" became a requirement so that any water/moisture trapped between the building wrap and siding would drain/vent away via furring strips behind siding material.

Was this built by a general contractor? You might consider getting a few reputable contractors to look at it and give you an opinion and estimate to fix it. Maybe even contact your AHJ?

Hate to say it, but it begs the question, what else could potentially be wrong with the siding installation (like say around doors and windows)??

 

[dragonballz]

Does the downspout dump straight into the gutter of is there an elbow to help it flow down-gutter? Adding a 90 when it enters the lower gutter to help it flow down the gutter would help.

Thanks. Currently, it goes straight down into the gutter. I will try a 90.

Yes, it is a relatively new siding job. We went with the low-bid. We do have alot of extra siding. The siding was done in 2011 and there is no interior water damage that we can see.

Thanks everybody. I will do the 90 elbow first, since it is the easiest.

 

[dragonballz]

MORE PICTURES
You can see the original wood shingles behind the vinyl siding in the 3rd picture

 

[rburke65]

I'm betting that this house was re-sided and that this is not original to the house.

 

[ishiboo]

I'm betting that this house was re-sided and that this is not original to the house.

I think that's pretty much guaranteed, even if he hadn't said flat out you can see the old wood shingles behind the siding.

Yes, this is an improper job.

The easy fix is to temporarily move the downspout out of the way, and properly seal the end cap of the siding which is leaking. You will also need to make sure the gutter isn't clogged and the pitch is right. I would also notch the left side of the downspout so water is directed away from the house in the case of a high volume flow, so it wouldn't splash up and over the right side. I don't think that's a concern unless the whole gutter is backing up, but it's easy to cut that.

The correct fix is to remove the gutter, cut it off and put a new cap on the end, and then repair the siding there. You could also put a piece of PVC or treated wood trim in the shape of the inside of the J trim, painted to match, if you are scared of making the siding repair or don't have and can't get the correct siding to replace it, or if the existing siding is substantially discolored.

A bleach and water mix and a sponge or rag will be your next project, wiping all the mildew/pollen/etc. off those gutters to make them look nice again.

 

[captain14]

Usually low bid causes issues later.

Ask me how I know.

 

[dragonballz]

I think that's pretty much guaranteed, even if he hadn't said flat out you can see the old wood shingles behind the siding.

Yes, this is an improper job.

The easy fix is to temporarily move the downspout out of the way, and properly seal the end cap of the siding which is leaking. You will also need to make sure the gutter isn't clogged and the pitch is right. I would also notch the left side of the downspout so water is directed away from the house in the case of a high volume flow, so it wouldn't splash up and over the right side. I don't think that's a concern unless the whole gutter is backing up, but it's easy to cut that.

The correct fix is to remove the gutter, cut it off and put a new cap on the end, and then repair the siding there. You could also put a piece of PVC or treated wood trim in the shape of the inside of the J trim, painted to match, if you are scared of making the siding repair or don't have and can't get the correct siding to replace it, or if the existing siding is substantially discolored.

A bleach and water mix and a sponge or rag will be your next project, wiping all the mildew/pollen/etc. off those gutters to make them look nice again.

Thanks!
I will go the easy route first! That mold/moss is from a tree we had. We got rid of the tree and had that whole section of 1st-floor roof shingles replaced.

 

[nehog]

Ayuh,.... It appears to me that the sidin' is improperly installed at that junction point of the gutter/ downspout,....

The gutter should stop short of the wall, 'n the sidin' should go past the end of the gutter, rather than that j-channel that goes Around the gutter end,....

I saw that and said "WTF?"

Who ever installed that siding clearly did it wrong. Shorten the gutter, fix the siding and it should work better.

 

[nolimits76]

Thanks everybody. I will do the 90 elbow first, since it is the easiest.

FYI, the 90 is a temp solution IMO. Doing it right as already suggested would be your best bet. Not the easiest or cheapest, but won't kill you either.

Not sure about the age of the house or your building code requirements, but in Canada, some years ago, "rain screen technology" became a requirement so that any water/moisture trapped between the building wrap and siding would drain/vent away via furring strips behind siding material.

Not sure where the OP is located, but install of furring strips is not a requirement everywhere. I don't do residential, but on a few commercial projects we've installed them, but coincidentally those architects were from out of state that had them specified. The locals don't require them, nor are they part of the building code.

 

[cat06]

I really don't like dumping one gutter into another, if possible (it looks like there is a door where you blocked out in a picture) trying taking the upper down spout out of the gutter and running it over that gutter and down the side of the house and letting it dump on the ground (not close to the foundation) on its own