making a wood boiler for radient

[Dagny]

Sounds like your on the right track.there are a billion rules for pressurized boilers and few for unpressurized. The biggest problem if they are open to the atmosphere is a steady stream of oxygen entering the system making some cruddy looking water and shortening component life.

 

[Huntmaster86]

Yeah that's the one down fall im aware of is potential rust and shortening of life of components. I know it's a tough question to answer but if I go with an open system are we talking 5-10 years to fail or a couple years?

The propane boiler I have in my house for baseboard radient is still going strong and it's all 8+ years old. Boiler is a little older

 

[ADSR]

Bondo I was hoping you would chime in. .

This guy is all over the net. I was googling boat transmission and he pops up.

 

[Bondo]

Yeah that's the one down fall im aware of is potential rust and shortening of life of components. I know it's a tough question to answer but if I go with an open system are we talking 5-10 years to fail or a couple years?

The propane boiler I have in my house for baseboard radient is still going strong and it's all 8+ years old. Boiler is a little older

Ayuh,.... With the thickness of propane tanks, I'd think a decade or maybe 2,....

This guy is all over the net. I was googling boat transmission and he pops up.

I'm a long time poster, 'n Mod over at iboats,....

 

[TractorJeff]

Is that 25 face cord?
A guy out in NYS bought an outdoor stainless steel water heater in the early 90's and its still going strong. It is open to the atmosphere with a small vent port where the make up water is so it doesn't pressure up. It has a little water pump to pump around the house and it has a little flapper door for the air inlet and fan. As I remember it also has a domestic hot water coil in the hot water.

 

[Huntmaster86]

Yeah 25 face cord. They can be very simple to make or they can be very elaborate. Id love to build a good gasification boiler but the funds don't permit at the moment. I have a 4 month old little girl I have to start buying toys for I see a 4 wheeler and sled in the near future. Lol

 

[LennyTheLizard]

Don't know that I can really add to what Bondo already told you.

I didn't build mine, a bought it from a couple guys that work for a pipeline company. They built it, but their city council shut them down (don't allow outdoor boilers inside city limits).

Anyway, mine is pressurized, and use the same T&P valve as hot water heater just like Bond said. I have one directly on the boiler (and the outlet is piped straight through the wall to outside). And another is installed on the radiant controls panel.

My stove is installed inside a wood shed connected to my shop, but there is no opening from wood shed to shop. All the pumps and thermostats are "upstairs" in my main 40X60 shop space.

There were no controls on the boiler when I bought it, but I bought the DIY boiler kit from altheatsupply.com. It included blower with damper, a Ranco Temp controller.

I've found that the blower is really not needed. It's great to turn it on when you first start a fire for a minute or two, but the natural draft gets the fire going plenty good, and doesn't seem to waste as much heat up the stack.

 

[Huntmaster86]

Thank you len! Ill have to see what i can find out about the sensors you both are refering to. I sure like the cost alot more than 100 each

 

[Huntmaster86]

Nope, no build thread, it was pre-internet for me,.....

The pressure relief valves are the same ones as used on water heaters, oil/ gas boilers,....
3/4" in, 3/4" out, 'n the little over-ride lever on top,....

Maybe $20. a piece,....

I've got a Bud that works for Sid Harvey that gives me good deals,....
Actually, 'bout every contractor supply in the area knows me, 'n treats me fairly,....

You can keep askin' questions, 'n I'll keep tryin' to answer 'em for ya,....

do you have any supply stores down this way that you recommend? Im right down RT 3 from you

 

[Bondo]

Nope,... Don't go parts buyin' way down there,....

Must be several places in Fulton/ Oswego though,....

 

[Huntmaster86]

Just picked up tips and electrodes for the plasma cutter. Let the cutting begin!!

 

[86turbodsl]

I'm just impressed you cut up a 1000 gallon tank. Those are too expensive here to make anything out of. Nice work. Carry on.

 

[Bondo]

do you remember where you got your components? the t&p valves i saw were 150-200 each or is that the norm?

do you have a build thread by chance?

Ayuh,..... $15. to $20. bucks for a T&P valve,....

I buy the ones without the plastic diptube,....

 

[Huntmaster86]

ko thanks bondo. Im looking at them now. are there any specific brands you have had better luck with?

86turbo, i searched for months to find either a boiler that would work for me or material that i could build one out of and this ended up being cheaper than what steel shops wanted just for the outer tube. crazy in my eyes but oh well lol.

my buddy and i were busy today, we burned out the caps for my burn box and the cap for the burn&water end and the chimney holes. I just have to figure out where i want my door positioned in the burn box so i can cut that out. Ill upload pics from my phone in a few.

 

[Huntmaster86]

My buddy and I made up some legs last night. I may trim them a little when I get it all done but in the mean time im going to leave it this height.



Here is is burning the holes out.

 

[Bondo]

Ayuh,... Lookin' Good,....

A couple more thoughts,...

Don't big it to tall, 'n build a BIG door,....

Heftin' big wood, just below 'bout belt buckle high is 'bout right for the bottom of the door,...
'n a bigger door is easier to get big wood through,.... especially when thrown,...

 

[Huntmaster86]

the door is what im trying to determine size of right now. I cut up a bunch of steel at work to make the door 16x16 and im thinking that is going to be too small. why have a 34" burn box and only a 16" door. Im thinking now maybe 20x20? what size is your door on your boiler? anyone else with door sizes?

 

[Bondo]

Ayuh,..... Mine is 24" wide, by 22" tall, with the bottom of the door, 32" from the ground,....

Keep it low in the box, so's smoke is less apt to billow out in yer face,....

 

[Brad J.]

I built one from plate steel about 6 years ago. 24" by 24" door. Would like a 24" by 30" tall if I could have done it again.

I run Burnrite brand water treatment and check them with their PH strips every fall. It cost me about 30 bucks a year in maintenance but the water isn't rusty after all these years.

A buddy installed a central boiler with tap water and the next year the water was pure rust color. That is how the water jackets don't last in my opinion.

I'm not totally sold on your water volume or thickness of the propane tanks but I know people use them. My firebox is 3/8" plate and the Outer jacket is 5/16".

My chimney pipe drops down and sits about 16" off the floor. I have around 300 gallons of water.

 

[Huntmaster86]

Thanks you for the input on the water treatment. Im unsure what treatment im going to use yet. I have to start researching it soon.

Had a great family weekend so I didn't work on it until Sunday night. That's when we really made some progress. We got both caps welded on, chimney fitted and tack welded into place and we got the burn box aligned in the water jacket and started welding that up. I made part of the door up but have to finish that and find some hinges. It's all coming together and looking like a boiler now.

We were welding the inside of the burn box here


Welding the inside of the front of the burn box


Chimney is plumb and tacked

 

[Huntmaster86]

Being a non pressurized boiler where do you recommend the in and out ******* to be? Top for return or supply?

 

[Bondo]

Ayuh,.... The hottest water is at the top, so why would ya pull the supply from the bottom,..??

Push the return in the bottom, 'n draw the supply off nearer the top,...
Bein' an open system, ya can't draw off the very top, which is why I say nearer the top,....
The supply has to be just below the lowest point the water can get down too, before it's refilled,....

 

[Huntmaster86]

That's what I thought was pull off the top but I thought I read someplace it was differ BC its and open system.

 

[Bondo]

That's what I thought was pull off the top but I thought I read someplace it was differ BC its and open system.

Ayuh,..... Mine, bein' pressurized, pulls directly off the top,....

Yer's bein' open, should pull from the top of the lowest water level expected,....

In other words, the water level can't be allowed to drop below the hot pipe tap,....

 

[Huntmaster86]

Ok thank you bondo. We got the chimney all welded inside the burn chamber and the hole drilled for the drain. Going to use that port to pressurize it to test for leaks.

Why do people add water to the tank before they pressurize it? Wouldn't that make it a pain in the *** to Reweld if there was a leak?

 

[Bondo]

Why do people add water to the tank before they pressurize it? Wouldn't that make it a pain in the *** to Reweld if there was a leak?

Ayuh,.... Because a tank pressurized with only air, is a Bomb,....

Fill it with water 1st to do yer hi-pressure tests,.....

Checkin' for leaks, only pressurize to less than 5 psi,..... 2 or 3 is enough,.....

 

[Huntmaster86]

If I only pressurize it to 3-4 psi should I still fill it? I don't have my hose hooked up yet because as you know we still have been getting freezing and below temps

 

[NUTTSGT]

Ayuh,..... Mine is 24" wide, by 22" tall, with the bottom of the door, 32" from the ground,....

Keep it low in the box, so's smoke is less apt to billow out in yer face,....

I know nothing of wood boilers but I will make a suggestion. Regarding the smoke in your face when feeding it, maybe make a smoke curtain. The new DAKA wood furnace I just put in has a smoke curtain. Not much more than a piece of steel that hangs on the inside by two hooks. Throw big enough wood in, it merely flips out of the way but it helps keep the smoke inside the fire box while the door is open.


You can see it hanging down in the pic. My old wood stove didn't have one and this one does. A simple design that does work.

 

[Aquamoose]

Interesting build. I wonder if anyone has considered using a wood burning pool heater for radiant floor heating? I have both but the heater is for the pool and a tankless water heater for the shop radiant system so the thought has crossed paths with me before.

The pool heater has 120 feet of stainless steel tubing that snakes above the firebox and is efficient enough to raise the water temp about 4°-5°, with a pool pump. If given a choice, I'd try it with a smaller heater combined with a recirculating pump.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Bondo]

If I only pressurize it to 3-4 psi should I still fill it? I don't have my hose hooked up yet because as you know we still have been getting freezing and below temps

Ayuh,... At very low pressures, it should be fine, without water in it,....

Use a sprayer bottle, 'n soapy water to find the leaks,.....
If there are any,......

 

[Huntmaster86]

I know nothing of wood boilers but I will make a suggestion. Regarding the smoke in your face when feeding it, maybe make a smoke curtain. The new DAKA wood furnace I just put in has a smoke curtain. Not much more than a piece of steel that hangs on the inside by two hooks. Throw big enough wood in, it merely flips out of the way but it helps keep the smoke inside the fire box while the door is open.


You can see it hanging down in the pic. My old wood stove didn't have one and this one does. A simple design that does work.

That's a great idea that I can do even after the build is done if im having issues with the smoke. Thank you

 

[Huntmaster86]

Ayuh,... At very low pressures, it should be fine, without water in it,....

Use a sprayer bottle, 'n soapy water to find the leaks,.....
If there are any,......

Ok thank you bondo

 

[NUTTSGT]

That's a great idea that I can do even after the build is done if im having issues with the smoke. Thank you

If you decide to do it, let me know, I (hope) I can get a better picture or two for you.

 

[Huntmaster86]

Took a few months off of the boiler. Back at it now. I realized how fast the summer was going and the cold months are just around the corner. I have a few holes to cut/drill for my water lines and a vent( non pressurized). I'm thinking about adding a site water tube to the front so I can tell my water level. Any ideas on this??

 

[Huntmaster86]

Here is how it sits currently





Some nice beefy hinges I got for it

 

[Huntmaster86]

I had a few had head Palm moments when testing for leaks. Towards the end of sealing it up I forgot to depressurise the tank. Makes it very hard to weld over a leak with air coming out of the pin hole lol

 

[Smitty3215]

I've built two different outdoor boilers now I wouldn't waste my time with a site glass. I can go all winter and only have to add water once matey 3-4gal. The biggest thing is insulation. And be prepared to cut a ton of wood haha.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Regarding smoke ... The Garn wood boiler (technically a water heater as it is designed to shut down before 212F) uses a forced draft. I has a protrusion on the front between the door and the fire box. Forced air is feed in through this protrusion blowing through the firebox toward the back. One air entrance at the top, one at the bottom. No smoke whatsoever when you open the door.

When the firebox is cold you can sweep up the ashes with a whisk broom and a dust pan. If the draft blower is on, what little ash that gets air born blows to the back.

 

[Huntmaster86]

I've built two different outdoor boilers now I wouldn't waste my time with a site glass. I can go all winter and only have to add water once matey 3-4gal. The biggest thing is insulation. And be prepared to cut a ton of wood haha.

Lol ya I'm sure. Fortunately, I get kiln dried wood from work for free( big *** pallets) just gotta cut em with the saw or find time at work to disassemble them lol

 

[Huntmaster86]

My boiler is made nearly the same as what your doing. The firebox has a 6" space all around the firebox and 6" between back of firebox and back of waterjacket.

So Water jacket is: 48" Dia x 48" Deep
Fire box is: 36" x 42" Deep.

There's a 6" pipe going straight up through firebox and water jacket out the top.
When heating season is over, I'm going to switch my water lines. Hot water supply needs to come out the top, and it will get a good thermal siphon going.

I've been trying to figure out the locations for my supply and return lines. How did it work out for you switching the lines around?