277 volt lighting

[realvc]

My shop was built with 277 volt, 8 foot, T12 two lamp flouescent fixtures.

There are eighteen fixtures in this 30' x 60' building.

When I moved in I found a stack of these new in the box fixtures and have been replacing the ballast as needed from the stack.

Recently two of the fixtures would only light on one lamp and when I switch the lamps around it still will only burn on the one side so I've replaced the whole fixture using the new ones.

Two other fixtures will light on one lamp and after a time the other will come on.

The lights are wired up 240 volt and seem to work O.K.

I've been here almost 10 years and have gone through around 6 ballasts and 28 lamps plus replace the two complete fixtures.

I've priced new T8 fixtures and lamps would run around $1000.00

I'm trying to decide if I should just rock on with what I got or bite the buttlet and switch everything out to the T8's.

I had planned on doing this before I retired and now that I am retired the $1000.00 looks a whole lot larger than it did.

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[astroracer]

I think biting the "buttlet" would be frowned upon in some circles...

How much money have you spent on the "repairs"? It sounds like the only thing it is costing you is time... I would just keep on doing what you are doing if the cost is nothing but time...
Mark

 

[rockwithjason]

you may look at replacing the tubes with ballast bypass led units. it's a little more front end cost but you are eliminating a point of failure, reducing energy costs and you may not need as many units because the output is higher.

 

[realvc]

I think biting the "buttlet" would be frowned upon in some circles...

How much money have you spent on the "repairs"? It sounds like the only thing it is costing you is time... I would just keep on doing what you are doing if the cost is nothing but time...
Mark

Thanks, all it has cost so far is just my time and the cost of the replacement lamps.

 

[realvc]

you may look at replacing the tubes with ballast bypass led units. it's a little more front end cost but you are eliminating a point of failure, reducing energy costs and you may not need as many units because the output is higher.

Thanks, I'll check into this.

 

[cybrdyke]

Depending on how old the ballasts are....back in the day, ballasts were voltage-specific, but they were also battleships. You could connect a 277v ballast to a 240v supply and it would probably fire the lamps. But, it's not correct. And ballasts back then had no "brains" so they couldn't correct it for you. You're probably not getting optimal performance from the lights, nor are you getting maximum life cycles.
On the other hand, the replacement stuff is free.....
To rewire to 4' T8's :
18 tandem kits with 4 lamp ballasts will cost you about $450. 72 lamps will cost you another $150 - (ish). Plus your time to re-wire them.
Good luck.
CD

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Is this a residential shop?

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Cybrdyke beat me to it. You're killing the 277 ballasts running them on 240...

Tommy

 

[realvc]

Is this a residential shop?

Yes it is a residential shop.

 

[realvc]

Cybrdyke beat me to it. You're killing the 277 ballasts running them on 240...

Tommy

I agree, but that is what was here when I came on the scene.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

I agree, but that is what was here when I came on the scene.

Well, if you have the spares and you're OK with the shortened lifespan, I guess it's no biggie. Biggest concern would be if the switches aren't double pole...

Tommy

 

[realvc]

Depending on how old the ballasts are....back in the day, ballasts were voltage-specific, but they were also battleships. You could connect a 277v ballast to a 240v supply and it would probably fire the lamps. But, it's not correct. And ballasts back then had no "brains" so they couldn't correct it for you. You're probably not getting optimal performance from the lights, nor are you getting maximum life cycles.
On the other hand, the replacement stuff is free.....
To rewire to 4' T8's :
18 tandem kits with 4 lamp ballasts will cost you about $450. 72 lamps will cost you another $150 - (ish). Plus your time to re-wire them.
Good luck.
CD

You get a better price than I was quoted. It came out like right at $50.00 a fixture including lamps so that would be $900.00 before taxes.

The only thing I've had to buy so far has been the lamps.

I also lowered all the fixtures from off the ceiling rafters. That brought them down from about 14 foot to about 8 foot. I've also installed three additional fixtures bringing to total to 18. The light is way better and way easier to change lamps, ballasts or whole fixtures.

 

[realvc]

Well, if you have the spares and you're OK with the shortened lifespan, I guess it's no biggie. Biggest concern would be if the switches aren't double pole...

Tommy

The electrician that has been instructing me checks everything I do and he O.K.ed the switches and all the changes so far.

I do all the work the way he instructs me and then he comes back by to see if I've done it all like he told me.

 

[nadogail]

IMHO, I would ask around about a Buck/Boost Transformer to kick the 240 to 277.

What say you gurus?

 

[reader2580]

You could buy ballast bypass LED tubes and just rewire with 120 volts direct to the tubes. You don't need the 277 volt ballasts then. I have seen the LED tubes for $11 each.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Yes it is a residential shop.

Code does NOT permit anything but 120v lighting in a residential setting.

U should change it all to 120v...

IMHO, I would ask around about a Buck/Boost Transformer to kick the 240 to 277.

What say you gurus?

277v and above is NOT a DIY voltage!

 

[Wes J]

FYI, 277 volts is used for commercial buildings with 480 volt 3 phase service. In 480 Y configuration, each phase to neutral is 277 volts. They can run these light fixtures at 277 volts single phase with no need for a transformer.

 

[realvc]

Code does NOT permit anything but 120v lighting in a residential setting.

U should change it all to 120v...

Yes I agree. It's a work in progress and since no permits or inspections are required everyone does what ever they want.

Our home has been brought up to code on the electrical and plumbing but my shop is a work in progress.

We live in a rural community around a lake with all kinds of homes built over the years by the owners.



277v and above is NOT a DIY voltage!

The 277v lights are wired up 240v

 

[wyliesdiesels]

U screwed up the quote...

The lights need to be changed to 120v operation. They cannot be ran on 240v 277v or any voltage other than 120v to be code compliant...

 

[Norcal]

The 277v lights are wired up 240v

Does not matter, residential is limited to 120V maximum, somebody got a deal on worthless 277V fixtures & they were hacked in, because 277V was not available.

Years ago was at a auction of a electrical contractor retiring, folks were snapping up new 8 foot, 2-lamp 277V strips for $10 each, was laughing the whole time while that lot was up for bid.

Convert them or replace them, as it is there is a mess.

 

[realvc]

Does not matter, residential is limited to 120V maximum, somebody got a deal on worthless 277V fixtures & they were hacked in, because 277V was not available.

Years ago was at a auction of a electrical contractor retiring, folks were snapping up new 8 foot, 2-lamp 277V strips for $10 each, was laughing the whole time while that lot was up for bid.

Convert them or replace them, as it is, there is a mess.

That is what I figure happened here.

It is not near the mess today as it was when I started. The lights are the last of electrical that I'm redoing.

 

[realvc]

I've decided to change out all the lighting to the T8, 110 volt units.

The wiring and the lighting has bugged me from the beginning. Like I said before everything has been redone now except the lights and the only reason I stopped is that we had the house remodeled but now that is done I can get back on track with the shop updates.

Thanks for all your replies you have helped me decide to go for the big to me lighting change out.
It is the right and best thing to do even though it is gonna cost me some of that hard to come by money.

I'll have a bunch of the 277v fixtures and lamps to get rid of if any one needs them you can get a real good deal.

Thanks again
Vince

 

[G_P]

Look on Craigslist. The 277v only stuff usually goes for pennies or is given away since there is little demand for it. Multi voltage lighting is more pricey since it can be used at home.

You can probably pick up a whole load of 277v fixtures from a building that upgraded to LED.

 

[doctorsouse]

Out of curiosity, what is the cost of the T8 fixtures you are looking into? I only ask because I wonder in your case how much extra it would cost for you to upgrade to LED fixtures.

 

[realvc]

Out of curiosity, what is the cost of the T8 fixtures you are looking into? I only ask because I wonder in your case how much extra it would cost for you to upgrade to LED fixtures.

The cost of the T8 fixtures comes to about $50.00 each including lamps.

I'll need 18 so it is real close to $900.00 total before taxes.

 

[realvc]

I picked up seven of the T8 4 lamp fixtures yesterday and was able to get 6 of them hung.
The other 11 were picked up this morning.

The electrical supply house even honored the quote from Sept of 15 and the gave me a better deal on the lamps since they had gone down in price.

What a huge improvement they are making.

Now to get the rest of them hung.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

I think biting the "buttlet" would be frowned upon in some circles...

How much money have you spent on the "repairs"? It sounds like the only thing it is costing you is time... I would just keep on doing what you are doing if the cost is nothing but time...
Mark

 

[LS6 Tommy]

You could buy ballast bypass LED tubes and just rewire with 120 volts direct to the tubes. You don't need the 277 volt ballasts then. I have seen the LED tubes for $11 each.

Not gonna get near that price for 8' T12s...

Tommy

 

[realvc]

Got all the fixtures switched out to the T8 and wired for 120.

I had lowered all the old 277 volt lights down to 9 foot to get better lighting.
The new T8 lights are so much brighter I had to raise them up to cut out the glare.

Should have done this long ago. The old lights were a problem form the get go.
I never had all of them working at the same time for very long.

I now have light everywhere.

The only thing is that my fm radio does not like the new lights. But I have overcome that moving the external antenna. I may even go to an outside antenna later on.
For now I'm enjoying the lights and the sound.