The VISES of Garage Journal

[oldldh]

From the balmy shores of the Gulf of Mexico...

I have but one thing to say ---

HO!!! HO!!! HO!!! --- Y'ALL...

 

[Tomthumb717]

Jim Reed - Could you explain what you are referring to when you say the fixed holes date the vise to pre 1919? Are you referring to this setup? If so, what is that determination based upon?

 

[va.grouseman]

72highboy, that is a really nice Prentiss you have there, all the way around and you can make you a pin by lathe if you have one or by hand on a grinder grinder.---I've made 4 by hand so far using a grinder to shape them and a 1/2 inch drill as my lathe to finish with.---Or we have some pros on this forum that are in that business and can fit you with one down to thousandths if you give them the numbers and pitch.---But you are right, some swivel jaws are factory threaded, most are friction pins.---The latest Athol's and the Starretts came threaded, and the Wilton swivel jaw is threaded for a couple examples.

 

[Tomthumb717]

VA - Really like the paint on the Starrett do you remember the color by any chance?

 

[meatsis]

WOW that Starrett is sweet!!!

 

[jakemac]

Just picked up this 2.5" Athol today. Pd 60. Gotta fix the swivel.

Guy also had a perfect Rock Island 577 but wanted 399 for it. I may offer him 275. It was really sweet!

He only wanted $60 for the baby Athol, but wanted full boat for the RI ?
I guess he's a "size really does matter" kind of guy.

 

[bluebolt]

If bluebolt has a Reed 206 and asking $2000 what sky high price should I ask for my double swiveller Reed 406? It is an unwieldy monster that I initially intended to flip but once I get the pin free things may change.

More than a few are asking about it.

Hiboy:
You got a great vise for a fair price. A man never forgets his first Wilton.

If I had a 406 I would be asking $3000 so no one would ever buy it! One of these days I will get a swivel jaw Reed. It's one of the vises on my "sell my soul and eat Ramen noodles for a year" list!

 

[oldldh]

VA - Really like the paint on the Starrett do you remember the color by any chance?

You can try "Zolatone" paint...their 20 series...

www.zolatone.com

It's the closest I've found...

(By the way, that's the original factory paint on "Birdboy's" monster Starrett...)

 

[bluebolt]

Anyone else also check "vice" when searching CL? Found a few good deals that way.

The first time I tried using "vice" I found a 8" Reed that was actually a Columbian 508 fixed base vise with a Reed tag riveted over the Columbian name.

 

[macgee]

Just picked up this 2.5" Athol today. Pd 60. Gotta fix the swivel.

Guy also had a perfect Rock Island 577 but wanted 399 for it. I may offer him 275. It was really sweet!

I would love to have that small Athol.

72highboy, that is a really nice Prentiss you have there, all the way around and you can make you a pin by lathe if you have one or by hand on a grinder grinder.---I've made 4 by hand so far using a grinder to shape them and a 1/2 inch drill as my lathe to finish with.---Or we have some pros on this forum that are in that business and can fit you with one down to thousandths if you give them the numbers and pitch.---But you are right, some swivel jaws are factory threaded, most are friction pins.---The latest Athol's and the Starretts came threaded, and the Wilton swivel jaw is threaded for a couple examples.

Oh, I really really really want & love to have that Starrett.

 

[kwoswalt99]

Hiboy:
You got a great vise for a fair price. A man never forgets his first Wilton.

I dunno, I find them very forgettable.

 

[72highboy]

Jim Reed - Could you explain what you are referring to when you say the fixed holes date the vise to pre 1919? Are you referring to this setup? If so, what is that determination based upon?

Also interested

72highboy, that is a really nice Prentiss you have there, all the way around and you can make you a pin by lathe if you have one or by hand on a grinder grinder.---I've made 4 by hand so far using a grinder to shape them and a 1/2 inch drill as my lathe to finish with.---Or we have some pros on this forum that are in that business and can fit you with one down to thousandths if you give them the numbers and pitch.---But you are right, some swivel jaws are factory threaded, most are friction pins.---The latest Athol's and the Starretts came threaded, and the Wilton swivel jaw is threaded for a couple examples.

It's not mine yet, posted at $60.. Although I want to get some more pictures before I make the drive..I think I can see a chunk of the dynamic jaw support missing on the right hand side of the vise, the section that sticks out from the bottom of the body toward the dynamic jaw.. See here

I do have access to a lathe so i could make a pin pretty easily, hardest part would be finding out the taper.. Are they normally hard? Edit: as in hardened, or mild steel

 

[Tomthumb717]

Old- Thanks for the info i will look them up

 

[jimreed2160]

Jim Reed - Could you explain what you are referring to when you say the fixed holes date the vise to pre 1919? Are you referring to this setup? If so, what is that determination based upon?

Yes. That is the fixed hole swivel base. Pull up on the pin and the vise will rotate until you light down on one of the holes. It was the early swivel mech. Later models used the screw swivel that allows for infinite positions. I have notes from info here on GJ that show the infinite screw setup was patented and used after 1919.

 

[CrotalusAtrox]

CA: you have skills sir and thank for showing us how you made that handle over on the vise repair 101 thread. what's next?


Thanks Drives not sure what's next I still kick myself for not buying the Reed 406 swivel jaw swivel base with replaceable jaws that I looked at back in April o well. On the Hunt for more flat nosed Reeds.

 

[jimreed2160]

As for the pin, they are pretty easy to make. The last one I made for a Prentiss was made from a lag bolt. I ground it to shape by rotating it on a grinder. My pin certainly does not the exact fit as one made with a lathe but it does fit and work.

This one is a little loose at the top but the fit where it counts is spot on. I think the oversized top is better than the original because it is easier to grab. Those early vise makers made puny little pins and you need lobster thumbs to pull them out.

 

[macgee]

Also interested

It's not mine yet, posted at $60.. Although I want to get some more pictures before I make the drive..I think I can see a chunk of the dynamic jaw support missing on the right hand side of the vise, the section that sticks out from the bottom of the body toward the dynamic jaw.. See here

I do have access to a lathe so i could make a pin pretty easily, hardest part would be finding out the taper.. Are they normally hard? Edit: as in hardened, or mild steel

Good eye and yes it does appear to have a chuck out the slide support.

The taper angle for the swivel jaw pin if I stand corrected is two degrees from center.

 

[scooternut]

72
I'd say good eye on the chunk. I had one handy to help you compare.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[72highboy]

Very strange... Asked for more pictures and got these

All from the wrong side.. But I don't see that chunk any more...

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

[va.grouseman]

Tomthumb, Old is right about the original paint.---I bought it from PinchPoint, a member here, and it was NOS except age stains from setting in storage for years.---So I don't know what they call it.


72highboy, The pins are a mild steel especially if you are going to make your own.---I made the mistake of not test the Rockwell of a piece of round stock out of the scrap and it was tool steel.---I like to have never ground it to shape,---Get a mild piece for sure.---Make it about 18'' long so you can twirl it on the stone but have plenty of length so you don't have to get too close to your work.---you'll be twirling about half a turn with one hand and half a turn with the other, but keep it moving so you don't get flat spots.

If you go old school and grind the pin, then the taper will reveal itself.---You just have to grind and test a hundred times.---Don't grind for a long time before testing, you will over grind.---Gingerly grind when you think you are getting close to bottoming out and test frequently.---if you find you've over ground, then grind the flat of the bottom until the bottom of the rod is the same size as the bottom of the pin hole.---You can keep on grinding then testing until the taper and the length match the hole, but leave yourself 3/4'' to shape a top on the pin.---after you've sawed your pin off , grind your head to shape which can be flat on top with a rounded edge or a round top, whatever you prefer.---Place the bottom of the taper in a 1/2'' drill and gently put the drill in a vise.---I padded my drill with rags.---It's better if it's a 2 speed drill so you can lock in the slow speed.---Turn your drill on and use a flat file to gently smooth out the grind marks.---I then used a chainsaw round file to file me a ring near the top for grabbing.---It's time consuming but easier than you think.---Here's some I've made.

As you can see, I made the Rock Island #136 pin too tall, but it is what is and I ain't changing it.

 

[KMScott]

The taper angle for the swivel jaw pin if I stand corrected is two degrees from center.

I have a different taper I use when I make my Prentiss pins macgee. Here is my drawing to help you guys out if you trust me. I also added the Reed 406 Pin drawing which is 3-1/2 degrees.

Just a note about taper pins, if the taper is not straight or made to the thousand's like mentioned earlier then pressure from clamping on a workpiece could damage your tapered hole, the hole is harder to repair and easy to damage. You guys that hand grind your pin should only make hand made pins for show vises unless you are really good at it. The holes should also be draw polished with 180 grit or coarser sandpaper or polishing stones after getting the stuck pin out. The pin is rusty and so is the hole. It is great to see guys making hand made parts like screw heads and taper pins but just be careful if you plan on using the vise.

 

[va.grouseman]

Very good point KM.--ALL the ones I've made pins for I have no intentions of using, I have other work horses for that.---That said, if I was going to use a swivel jaw, I doubt I would be brutal enough to do damage to one cause they just aren't made for heavy duty work.---Maybe something like holding a wedged shape piece of metal for band-sawing or something. Just holding not torqueing.---Now if I could get a hold of a Hollands #48, I might give it a yank.---They're made like Sherman Tanks.

 

[kwoswalt99]

Very good point KM.--ALL the ones I've made pins for I have no intentions of using, I have other work horses for that.---That said, if I was going to use a swivel jaw, I doubt I would be brutal enough to do damage to one cause they just aren't made for heavy duty work.---Maybe something like holding a wedged shape piece of metal for band-sawing or something. Just holding not torqueing.---Now if I could get a hold of a Hollands #48, I might give it a yank.---They're made like Sherman Tanks.

I don't see why you say that. I've broken vises many times, and it wasn't the swivel that broke. I've seen quite a few broken Hollands too...

 

[GETRIDAONE]

I need it just a little tighter. OOP'S

 

[Thirdyfivepickup]

35:
You know where to find the date code?

12-30-1966 is the date code...

Don't know if that's good or bad. I guess a 50 year old vise is not bad to keep around...

 

[va.grouseman]

originally posted by Kwoswalt99.

I don't see why you say that. I've broken vises many times, and it wasn't the swivel that broke. I've seen quite a few broken Hollands too...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I haven't broke any vises because I don't push them beyond their limits.---A man has got to know his limitations and he has got to know his vises limitation to, or both are in serious trouble.---If you have been through this whole forum from page one, you will have read many testimonies and seen many pics of fellows that bought swivel-jaws just to find out the swivel mechanism was cracked or broke off completely and jerry rigged back to barely usable or to unload it on an unsuspecting buyer.---It's easy to hide.---Many are welded shut because they're broke, so they just make a non-swiveler out of it.---If your challenge calls for a tank, don't use a Volkswagen and a 22 pistol, get a tank.

As far as the Hollands swivel-jaw I mentioned is concerned, 345 lbs. of work-horse.---I wouldn't be afraid to bare down a little on that one.---But as KMScott said, I would still just have it for show.


http://scuttle.dayid.org/wiki/images/4/4a/Hollands48.png

 

[Outlawmws]

I don't see why you say that. I've broken vises many times, and it wasn't the swivel that broke. I've seen quite a few broken Hollands too...

You have broken "a few" 8" Hollands vises? Wow! that must have been some cheater bar!

 

[Shiftless]

va:
Well said

outlaw:


35:
Yeah, not too bad...That's when I graduated from High School

 

[kwoswalt99]

I don't see why you say that. I've '' broken vises many times, and it wasn't the swivel that broke. I've seen quite a few broken Hollands too...

That should have said I've 'SEEN BROKEN SWIVEL'. I have broken a harbor freight rotating vise. Not quite as impressive.

 

[bagged89s10]

My semi cleaned up Parker 956 and semi built stand.

 

[macgee]

I have a different taper I use when I make my Prentiss pins macgee. Here is my drawing to help you guys out if you trust me. I also added the Reed 406 Pin drawing which is 3-1/2 degrees.

Thanks Kevin,

Either I wrote the wrong angle down for my mini Prenstiss or was given the inaccurate info. My lathe needs a fix so I have not turned one yet. Thanks for the info.

You are correct about needing the right & matching taper all the way through the pin otherwise you'll have a high point where all the loads will transfer to and will cause undue stress to that single point.

 

[kwoswalt99]

Will that stand be bolted to the ground?

 

[autopts]

My semi cleaned up Parker 956 and semi built stand.

Very nice! Great to see a big old Parker in that nice a shape! Great stand also!

 

[CrotalusAtrox]

originally posted by Kwoswalt99.

I don't see why you say that. I've broken vises many times, and it wasn't the swivel that broke. I've seen quite a few broken Hollands too...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I haven't broke any vises because I don't push them beyond their limits.---A man has got to know his limitations and he has got to know his vises limitation to, or both are in serious trouble.---If you have been through this whole forum from page one, you will have read many testimonies and seen many pics of fellows that bought swivel-jaws just to find out the swivel mechanism was cracked or broke off completely and jerry rigged back to barely usable or to unload it on an unsuspecting buyer.---It's easy to hide.---Many are welded shut because they're broke, so they just make a non-swiveler out of it.---If your challenge calls for a tank, don't use a Volkswagen and a 22 pistol, get a tank.

As far as the Hollands swivel-jaw I mentioned is concerned, 345 lbs. of work-horse.---I wouldn't be afraid to bare down a little on that one.---But as KMScott said, I would still just have it for show.


http://scuttle.dayid.org/wiki/images/4/4a/Hollands48.png

Love the analogy of using a tank when you need a tank, the world I live in we would have two tanks just in case tank number one decided not to work. I think this is the reason I have more then one vise or at least thats what I tell myself.

 

[Outlawmws]

Bagged, Loving the Vise stand!

 

[meatsis]

Bagged that stand is awesome!! How much does it weigh? and are you planning on bolting it to the floor.

 

[macgee]

Does anyone recognize this small bullet-esque vise?

There's a great thread & photo's by the owner of this vise milling a new swivel base for it and I think he's going a little above the call of duty, it's impressive. I recommend checking it out.

http://www.thegaragegazette.com/index.php?topic=29127.0

 

[bagged89s10]

Thanks all. I haven't weighed all the pieces yet. The stand isn't welded at all yet either. I sliced a section of pipe into 3 pieces which will go around the ibeam. My hope is that the stand will be bottom heavy enough and stable to not have to bolt down. I can always add weight under the sprocket and fill the stand 1/3 of the way wth sand.

 

[trijeff]

Does anyone recognize this small bullet-esque vise?

There's a great thread & photo's by the owner of this vise milling a new swivel base for it and I think he's going a little above the call of duty, it's impressive. I recommend checking it out.

http://www.thegaragegazette.com/index.php?topic=29127.0

Thinking that is a Bugatti, pretty much the Holy Grail of vises

 

[macgee]

Thinking that is a Bugatti, pretty much the Holy Grail of vises

The owner would truly hope it was a Bugatti but unfortunately its a weee bit too small to be one, the finish would also say otherwise. It's still a cool baby vise.

Still curious by the maker, maybe it was college casting project or something?

I am jealous with the owners talent and his shop.