To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Intermixing Metric and SAE Sizes in Tool Storage

oldschoolcraft

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 31, 2017
Messages
1,829
Location
Bay Area, California
Does anyone here intermix metric and standard size tools in their toolbox/cart?

For example: 4mm, 3/16", 5mm, 7/32", 6mm, 1/4", etc

I imagine if you are a professional working on a known item (car, airplane, water pump, etc) then it would be much slower to organize tools this way, because you already know in advance if you're dealing with metric or standard sizes.

You might not know offhand which size it is, but you know it's metric and can try 2 or 3 sizes until you figure it out. If you intermixed metric and standard, you might have to try 4 or 5 to figure it out, since the SAE ones would be wasted tries.

But, if you not a professional, like myself, I almost never know whether it's metric or standard by looking at it. For example, I took apart a broken office chair left in the dumpster last night because I wanted to donate the base to another chair. It was hex fasteners, but no idea if metric or standard. So I had to try 3 different standard hex keys. And then switch to metric set and tried a few there until I found it.

If I had intermixed my metric and standard, I'd have found the right one faster.

Also as a non-pro, sometimes you see worn fasteners. Maybe it is a metric hex fastener but worn to the point where the slightly larger SAE hex key will fit it better. I really don't care what works, just that it works properly without damaging the fastener.

I also imagine handyman type work to be uncertain. Show up at a friend/family/customer house and they have an old lawnmower or something to take apart. Might have no idea if the fasteners are metric or standard. Or maybe it was old and repaired with different replacement fasteners, some are metric and some are SAE. Having your sockets/wrenches/hex keys set up intermixed would let you use them like a size gauge to find the right size.

The biggest downside I can see in doing this strategy is I will need all custom storage solutions since everything is made to separate metric from standard. Every nice socket organizer I've seen is built separately. My high quality Wiha Hex Keys have a storage container that separates them.

Here's what I'm asking:

1- What downsides of intermixing metric and standard are there that I might not be thinking about? And do these downsides apply to non-professionals?

2- Anyone else here every try or think about intermixing?

3- Any advice on how to handle storage so that it can be set up in this way?

I apologize to the pro wrenches reading this since I know the thought is painful and awful!
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Toothaker

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 25, 2016
Messages
1,367
Location
Wichita, Kansas
I'm a non-pro weekend wrench kinda guy, and there's no way I would intermingle metric with SAE. I don't have enough tools to justify having separate drawers for metric sockets and SAE sockets - they are in the same drawer. But they are on separate rails for sure.

I do have enough wrenches that I have a dedicated metric and dedicated SAE wrench drawer.

It goes back to speed and convenience for me. If I'm working on my daughter's bicycle, I know I can grab my metric tools and be able to find the right size. I don't work on metric enough to be able to recognize the size by looking at the fastener. And when I'm working on an old Ford, I don't want metric tools in my way slowing me down.
 

cm cm

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 15, 2016
Messages
46
Location
LOS ANGELES
Why is everyone trying to re invent the wheel lately?

Go use your tools, instead of trying to overthink stuff...
 

Snakebyt

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 2, 2014
Messages
1,075
Location
Lubbock Tx
Since i work mainly on toyota mainly, i havent had a SAE in my toolbox in a few years.Even when i was working at another place that dealt with lots of makes and models, i only had a handful of SAE
 

Mr Ratchet

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 3, 2011
Messages
930
Location
Michigan
I can't think off hand what would drive me into an insane asylum faster than the above topic suggestion.
 

sk farmer

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2009
Messages
5,572
Location
nd
What's an SAE tool....lol.
oh my god! that is so funny!







not.......


this type of attitude is really starting to bug me. there is so much good usable stuff out there with sae fasteners. airplanes, trucks, tractors, structures, machinery......the list goes on and on. how about classic cars, collectable vehicles and other older items? much of the modern world was built with things that used sae fasteners.

don't get me wrong, i have plenty of stuff with metric fasteners. some very new and some older but my life and job depends on some older and newer well made stuff that has sae fasteners. i bet that is true of many of the people on the forum as well as real life, you know people that actually do stuff.

if you can and do choose to only work on things with metric, have at it but things with sae are not going to go away and become obsolete just because you don't like sae and think metric fasteners are vastly superior.

excuse me, i am going work on some things with a 1/2 and 9/16 wrench but will not get all pissy because i may need a 10 or 14 mm before the day is done.

maybe i will get lucky and need a 19mm and i can use my 3/4 just to piss off a metric fanatic.
 

Tallpilot

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 13, 2017
Messages
2,384
Location
Orlando
I don't think that's exactly the attitude. Most people who post here love tools and having a large collection of them but it is irritating to need two sets of everything. That is the point of standards; to keep things the same.

I suspect we will keep seeing fractional sizes for quite a few more years.
 

EOC_Jason

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 25, 2012
Messages
11,388
Location
Bentonville, AR
If it's new (relatively) I will start with metric, because even if it is SAE typically a metric still will still fit without issue. Unless something is really **** and I run the risk of stripping it then I will try to find the tightest fitting socket/wrench...

If it's something old and USA made, then it's almost always SAE... ;)
 

BDT/NWMN

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 22, 2012
Messages
3,762
Location
Erskine, Mn
You may be out in California; but You would likely still notice a dust cloud, lightning, and and a roar of despair coming from North-Western Minnesota if anyone did that to Me..

Tool box is for tools. Metric assortment is for metric. SAE are kept separate from metric.

However, I could make some drawer labels:
Metric wrenches and SAE sockets
Screwdrivers and Metric hex wrenches
Hammers and Metric sockets

Once You start putting that stuff in a tool box; the need for such labels may become a reality:lol:

But I have observed the organizational skills of fastener and bolt bin owners that will trump the tool boxers. Metric fine and coarse tread, NC and NF fasteners or various hardness all proudly grouped by approximate size.. But,, Some tool boxers adapt this fine skill by filling half their tool box with non-tool items.. It would make an interesting contest to see who could screw up a tool box the worse.
 
Last edited:

theoldwizard1

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 22, 2011
Messages
43,275
Location
SE MI
Before I bought a decent tool chest, I did not have enough drawers to keep them separate. My solution was black electrical tape on the metric wrenches. It helped, but the drawer was so stuffed full, it still took a long time finding what I wanted.

I couple of years ago, bought a middle chest when my pliers and cutters no longer fit in one drawer. Good investment !
 

MercLSU

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 17, 2015
Messages
1,110
Location
Baton Rouge, LA
I thought that if you mixed the two...the SAE would eat the Metrics. Sort of like mixing piranhas and goldfish. I wouldn't try it...
 

crewchief888

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 3, 2009
Messages
13,751
Location
NW indiana
i have 2 (more or less complete) sets of tools, one in my service truck, and another in the garage.

in my service truck the top compartment of my box has 3/8" & 1/2" drive std & MM sockets. another drawer has 3/4" dr std only, and misc long allen, chrome swivels, and open end crowsfeet.
all my 1/4" dr stuff, std & MM is in a separate blow molded box in another compartment.
wrenches are separated std up to 1"
1 1/16" -1 5/8" in a different drawer
std angle head in a drawer
all MM in a separate drawer
another compartment has std wrenches up to 2", along with hammers, prybars, 3/4" dr ratchet handle.

at home sockets are all in 1 drawer, except for 1/4" dr set, seperate drawers for std & MM, ratchets breaker bars, extensions, adapters, and speeders have their own drawer...


:beer:
 

Ole Slewfoot

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 22, 2016
Messages
5,098
Location
Freedom, CA
13,14, 1/2 and 9/16 all in the same package.

attachment.php
 

MikeF2316

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 29, 2012
Messages
9,605
Location
Thornhill, ON
I keep them separate, and always will. Generally I'm working on a modern car or motorcycle, so there's no need to even think fractional inch. And of the few things that are, then I can just grab the proper rails/wrenches.
 

Yarpo

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 11, 2017
Messages
1,356
Location
Minnesota
The biggest downside I can see in doing this strategy is I will need all custom storage solutions since everything is made to separate metric from standard. Every nice socket organizer I've seen is built separately.
Here's what I'm asking:

Just buy a rail that has no labels, like so.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0060VG1CY/?tag=atomicindus08-20

You can then intermix and place your tools any which way you please, why you keep asking us to do it for you is beyond me :(
 
Joined
Jul 24, 2016
Messages
3,371
What's an SAE tool....lol.

Up until fairly recently, all work done on my Toyota which isn't much, since it's a Toyota, but all I've ever used was SAE on mine. I have in the last month, finally bought a complete set of 1/2 inch sockets in metric and I bought a 9 MM wrench only because the price was right. Otherwise, everything I work on, from my 1993 International box truck, to my two tractors, to all construction projects are SAE exclusively.
 

Lelandwelds

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 6, 2017
Messages
2,443
Location
Central Texas
So, spinning wrenches by the Braille method? I kinda do that already. I expect to guess the size incorrectly and from the start carry my second and third guess.

I do know enough to start out in the right drawer based on what I am currently working on. Plus, before I start I often Google and YouTube first.
 

bczygan

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2009
Messages
22,002
Location
DETROIT! Arsenal of Scrappers
Does anyone here intermix metric and standard size tools in their toolbox/cart?

For example: 4mm, 3/16", 5mm, 7/32", 6mm, 1/4", etc

I imagine if you are a professional working on a known item (car, airplane, water pump, etc) then it would be much slower to organize tools this way, because you already know in advance if you're dealing with metric or standard sizes.

You might not know offhand which size it is, but you know it's metric and can try 2 or 3 sizes until you figure it out. If you intermixed metric and standard, you might have to try 4 or 5 to figure it out, since the SAE ones would be wasted tries.

But, if you not a professional, like myself, I almost never know whether it's metric or standard by looking at it. For example, I took apart a broken office chair left in the dumpster last night because I wanted to donate the base to another chair. It was hex fasteners, but no idea if metric or standard. So I had to try 3 different standard hex keys. And then switch to metric set and tried a few there until I found it.

If I had intermixed my metric and standard, I'd have found the right one faster.

Also as a non-pro, sometimes you see worn fasteners. Maybe it is a metric hex fastener but worn to the point where the slightly larger SAE hex key will fit it better. I really don't care what works, just that it works properly without damaging the fastener.

I also imagine handyman type work to be uncertain. Show up at a friend/family/customer house and they have an old lawnmower or something to take apart. Might have no idea if the fasteners are metric or standard. Or maybe it was old and repaired with different replacement fasteners, some are metric and some are SAE. Having your sockets/wrenches/hex keys set up intermixed would let you use them like a size gauge to find the right size.

The biggest downside I can see in doing this strategy is I will need all custom storage solutions since everything is made to separate metric from standard. Every nice socket organizer I've seen is built separately. My high quality Wiha Hex Keys have a storage container that separates them.

Here's what I'm asking:

1- What downsides of intermixing metric and standard are there that I might not be thinking about? And do these downsides apply to non-professionals?

2- Anyone else here every try or think about intermixing?

3- Any advice on how to handle storage so that it can be set up in this way?

I apologize to the pro wrenches reading this since I know the thought is painful and awful!

OMG!:shocking:

That's like tossing your white socks and black socks willy nilly all together in the same drawer!

Who would do such a thing?:D

Bill
 

cm cm

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 15, 2016
Messages
46
Location
LOS ANGELES
13,14, 1/2 and 9/16 all in the same package.

attachment.php

Did you just say 1/2 and 13mm are the same thing?

They are not. Close, you could swap it one way... but not the other.

At that point, you could just as easily put an adjustable in your box and be done... close enough.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

GTO

Well-known member
Joined
May 8, 2009
Messages
3,931
Location
NJ,FL
Does anyone here intermix metric and standard size tools in their toolbox/cart?

For example: 4mm, 3/16", 5mm, 7/32", 6mm, 1/4", etc

I imagine if you are a professional working on a known item (car, airplane, water pump, etc) then it would be much slower to organize tools this way, because you already know in advance if you're dealing with metric or standard sizes.

You might not know offhand which size it is, but you know it's metric and can try 2 or 3 sizes until you figure it out. If you intermixed metric and standard, you might have to try 4 or 5 to figure it out, since the SAE ones would be wasted tries.

But, if you not a professional, like myself, I almost never know whether it's metric or standard by looking at it. For example, I took apart a broken office chair left in the dumpster last night because I wanted to donate the base to another chair. It was hex fasteners, but no idea if metric or standard. So I had to try 3 different standard hex keys. And then switch to metric set and tried a few there until I found it.

If I had intermixed my metric and standard, I'd have found the right one faster.

Also as a non-pro, sometimes you see worn fasteners. Maybe it is a metric hex fastener but worn to the point where the slightly larger SAE hex key will fit it better. I really don't care what works, just that it works properly without damaging the fastener.

I also imagine handyman type work to be uncertain. Show up at a friend/family/customer house and they have an old lawnmower or something to take apart. Might have no idea if the fasteners are metric or standard. Or maybe it was old and repaired with different replacement fasteners, some are metric and some are SAE. Having your sockets/wrenches/hex keys set up intermixed would let you use them like a size gauge to find the right size.

The biggest downside I can see in doing this strategy is I will need all custom storage solutions since everything is made to separate metric from standard. Every nice socket organizer I've seen is built separately. My high quality Wiha Hex Keys have a storage container that separates them.

Here's what I'm asking:

1- What downsides of intermixing metric and standard are there that I might not be thinking about? And do these downsides apply to non-professionals?

2- Anyone else here every try or think about intermixing?

3- Any advice on how to handle storage so that it can be set up in this way?

I apologize to the pro wrenches reading this since I know the thought is painful and awful!


:eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy::eyecrazy:
 

fred.foobar

Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2013
Messages
14
The biggest downside I can see in doing this strategy is I will need all custom storage solutions since everything is made to separate metric from standard. Every nice socket organizer I've seen is built separately. My high quality Wiha Hex Keys have a storage container that separates them.
Posts about asking what is the best of the best of the best, name-dropping Knipex, Wiha, money is no object, then posts like this. lol, OK...

Dunno, the biggest downside to me would be using the wrong sized wrench and rounding off a fastener. Some sizes between systems are only a short and curly sized away from doing this:
14mm < 9/16" < 15mm

Your suggestion is a solution looking for a problem. It seems to me that it would take a hell lot more time figuring out how to reinvent the wheel, combine all of your sockets and wrenches, making custom storage solutions for them than to simply grab a wrench, try it out for size, put it back and grab another if the fit ain't right.

Post less, wrench more. Folks have been wrenching for centuries, built skyscrapers and even went to the moon before the interwebz.

Its Miller Time.
 
Last edited:

CJM8515

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
9,308
Location
NJ
I have tons of sae tools..rarely use them b/c everything is metric. My grandfather has CMan stuff from the 60's and 70's, all real nice stuff. All SAE and pretty useless today.
 

BMack37

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 28, 2015
Messages
1,091
You can pretty accurately guess whether something is metric or standard if it hasn't been worked on by 20 different people using whatever hardware they find...where was it made? When was it made? Those two pretty much tell you what kind of fasteners it uses, there are exceptions but most of the time, you're going to get it right.
 

cherrybomb

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2016
Messages
893
Location
Near Madison Wi.
I don't intermix my sockets,they stay on their marked rails.But my combos stay in the same drawer,reason being unless the fastener head is clearly marked you almost have to try it to get a tight fit.There are some sizes that closely interchange,take your digital micrometer and check some fasteners and wrench openings.I'm not a pro wrencher so I have more time to study these things.Of course your Toyota makes things simpler.But like 3/4 or 19mm. and there is a few others,use what fits best.Also sometimes a worn or painted over fastener affects the wrench,I'm thinking 1/2-13mm,just keep wrenching,always interesting. Thats a few reasons I personally keep my combos closeby.
 

6PTsocket

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 12, 2014
Messages
4,593
It is a matter of what you use your tools for. I think that for almost everyone, it is not a good idea. The vast bulk of the time most of us know whether we are working on metric or SAE. When I am trying to see what tool fits the fastener, I don't need to have more bad choices to sort through or be tempted to use a loose fitting tool that might round out a fastener if it is very tight. It is handy to know the sizes in the two systems relate. A 13 mm is a little bigger than 1/2 and if the 1/2 fastener is chewed up, I might try 13mm. 3/4 is only .05" bigger than 13mm and they are virtually interchangable. In a word, NO. I would never consider mixing SAE,with metric and all of my rails are not size marked. Except for the red and blue Gearwrench rails, they are not even measuring system marked. There may be exceptions but most companies mark their sockets to indicate which system they belong in. Something like a band or a line of vertical marks is used. I Don't even keep the SAE and metric in the same drawer except for 1/4" socket sets that take up so little space.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 

shawndp

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 25, 2017
Messages
243
Location
Toronto, ON
Officiallly the answer is no, I would not mix SAE and Metric. All SAE is banished from my tool cart for the simple reason that I do not like working on cars that are not Metric. BUT, I do have a Craftsman kit that has mixed hex among other things. I call it my sampler platter as it contains the most frequently used pieces, so you aren't alone in your line of thought.
 

nelstomlinson

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 27, 2009
Messages
649
Location
Interior Alaska
I have SAE and metric in different boxes. Most of my equipment is one or the other, so I roll out the box I'm going to need.

As for the question in the OP, try it. Report back.
 

WittHay

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2016
Messages
2,157
Location
Surrey, BC Canada
It can be done in 1/2" sizes if you are short on space.

In the service truck for 1/2 chrome deeps i have 18,3/4,22,15/16, 1 1/8, 30 on a rail. The rest of the rail is used for hex bits 5/8, 17, 3/4 .

Work on old American and new German and Italian equipment those sizes cover all I need in large chrome deep and hex
 

Metalio

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Messages
52
Location
NL
This makes no sense OP. Most things you'll be working on will use either metric or SAE fasteners, so in that case you're just making it harder for yourself to find the right socket.
 

Ole Slewfoot

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 22, 2016
Messages
5,098
Location
Freedom, CA
WE still have plenty of the late 80s mixed cars on the road here.
Did you just say 1/2 and 13mm are the same thing?

They are not. Close, you could swap it one way... but not the other.

At that point, you could just as easily put an adjustable in your box and be done... close enough.
A 1/2" wrench may be 0.504 - 0.510" ANSI B18.2.2
A 13mm hex may be 0.501 - 0.511" ISO 4032

Being that the fastener has rounded corners, it's cheaper to make fasteners on the smaller end of the spectrum, and the wrench hasn't got any smaller over 75 years of use, it's usually going to work.

My nineteen dirty-toofs is 0.003" off 15 mm, I'm really worried about that one.
What if a metric bolt yells at me?
 
Last edited:

American Locomotive

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
11,014
Location
Rhode Island
I really don't see the need to over complicate things by interweaving your tools. If I'm not sure a bolt is metric or standard, I'll just bring both my socket rails or wrench holders. Or, I'll just bring a few sockets of SAE and Metric that seem close. It's really not a big deal.


Did you just say 1/2 and 13mm are the same thing?

They are not. Close, you could swap it one way... but not the other.

At that point, you could just as easily put an adjustable in your box and be done... close enough.
I regularly interchange 1/2" and 13mm when I'm in the junkyard and only have a handful of tools to keep things light. I've used 1/2" sockets on 13mm bolts, and 13mm wrenches on 1/2" bolts. It works basically all the time. Maybe if you have a wrench that was made on the small size, and a bolt a little on the large size it wouldn't work.
Not seeing it? I only see 1/2" and 9/16". :dunno:
14mm "cheats" nearly perfectly with 9/16", and 13mm "cheats" less perfectly with 1/2", but usually the tolerances of tools and fasteners are generous enough that it works.
 
Last edited:

Fbmoose48

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 26, 2017
Messages
202
Location
GJ
This seems like a bad idea. People have been working with both SAE and metric equipment long enough that if mixing was a good idea someone would have done it by now. Some familiarity with the item being worked on can often eliminate one standard or the other.
 

crane operator

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 1, 2016
Messages
307
Location
sw missouri
13,14, 1/2 and 9/16 all in the same package.

attachment.php

Ahh, I've taken your solution one further. I've got 9 to 19mm, and 1/4 to 7/8" SAE. Ratchet action, spinner action and damaged bolts.

No storage worries because it fits in the pliers pocket of my pants. 5wr (and yes its a peterson)

20180217_115412.jpg
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom