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Affordable Bi-directional scan tool?

SuzukiGS750EZ

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By "affordable" i mean not something that's $3000 that inflates tires as well! Something a home mechanic can afford, (if they range from 700-5,000 the lower end of the scale...) any ideas? Haven't bought a scan tool in a long time so no clue what's on the market besides snapon
 
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dclassical

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I would look at Autel (can't remember the model, around $1k from what I remember) or the Launch X431 (a little over $500 if I remember correctly).

I have an old OTC Genisys and the Nemisys that work for me, for now, but those are the two I would look at if I needed one today.
 

VinceG

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I have the Matco MaxMe you can get them used for a decent price the thing I like is that it has Generic OBD usage but Subscription for more in depth work so instead of paying hefty yearly update you can choose what you want and for how long. I have Chrysler on mine and pay 20 a month if i need another one I switch it or add it for a month. it also updates more often so it is always up to date. it is made by Launch but only the Matco version has the subscription service.
 

mfewtrail

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This scan tool has gotten a lot of positive recent review on YouTube. Here is one This scan tool will put Snap-On out of business!

Launch X431 PROs mini. WiFi and Bluetooth. 2 years of updates. $55 discount on Amazon until 8/31/18 with code 83AUH7LB

From Eric @ South Main Auto in the comments on that video:

Great tool for the price, just bear in mind it is "Launch China" not made by "Launch USA" (2 separate companies) so technically you will have no product support for it in the USA. If you were to call Launch USA they would tell you to pound salt because it is a "Launch China" tool. Kinda ***** because they are a fraction of the cost of the Launch USA products.... Any how still a decent tool for the money.
 

WhiffySpark

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That launch is a joke compared to a snapon tool. I have a Maxme for the house and even that ***** sometimes
 

Bartleby

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It really depends on what you're planning on doing.

I would take a used Modis Ultra or Solus Ultra with the latest update. I like to look at PIDs for some driveability concerns, and I like to see them displayed in a graph format. The difference between the two is that the Modis has a built-in 2-channel scope so it's usually more expensive.

I have also tried an OTC scanner, and it was good for the basic bi-directional controls I've used it for. I have yet to get my hands on an Autel. IIRC, I've heard OTC does BCM stuff better than Snap-on for imports, but I don't have the chance of sitting down and doing a side-by-side comparison on many cars to prove it myself. :dunno:

You'll also need to factor in the cost of software updates. Keep in mind that Snap-on updates cost about $1k.
 

BoostedOne

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Do you need the ability to scan umpteen brands of vehicles? I have different laptop based solutions for different brands. Seems like if you need a few, theres some niche based tool thats very powerful. For instance, on my Chryslers I use Auto Enginuity. For my Volkswagen family vehicles, its VAG-Com. For my Fords I use FORScan.
 

catron44

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FWIW, I have a foxwell 510 with the GM and Chrysler software. I was able to deal with an airbag issue on my old truck and it paid for itself there. It came with one make loaded and you can buy others as needed. I only have Jeeps and a Ram so I'm now set with the Chrysler software that cost an extra $60.

yes it's a chinese scanner, no it's not a snap on, but for the $150 it gets the job done for me.
 

HoosierBuddy

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Way OT...but, I've been using this to talk to my old WRX:

https://www.tactrix.com/

For $190 you get a tool that not only will read codes and do data logs...you can reflash the ECU with it. Not saying you SHOULD reflash the ecu, but, you know, for off road applications, an amazing bit of kit.

Phil
 

theoldwizard1

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That launch is a joke compared to a snapon tool.

The Snap-On tools are not perfect either. I have watched several videos, including one today, where either Eric O. (South Main Auto) or Ivan (Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics) has had to switch to a different brand to do get the job done.

Lower cost scan tools usually do good coverage on high volume cars built within the past 10-15 years. The do NOT do well on high end European cars (MB, BMW, Porsche, etc).
 

theoldwizard1

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He has quite a selection of scanners, and he tends to jump around between them. I would like to see a video where he talks about the pros and cons of each scanner.
Short version is, sometimes scanner A works on a vehicle but sometimes it does not. So he switches to scanner B. or C or D.

Keith Defazio (New Level Auto) out on Staten Island has several different OEM scanners ($,$$$ ea) in order to "get the job done". Remember, most of these require a subscription to get automatic updates.

So much for OBD-II being "standard".
 

theoldwizard1

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Autel DS808

Its awesome and for $659 can't beat it.
"... Autel MaxiDAS DS808: Based on the Android 4.4 operating system ..."

So in other words, the software would run on a $90 Fire HD 8 tablet. Okay, sure, they have a nice heavy rubber bevel on it (like the kids version of the Fire tablets) and an OBD-II wire/plug (could be replaced by a Bluetooth adapter).

Is the software worth over $500 ? Maybe.

EDIT : I would rather be able to buy the software separately so that if I break the tablet or simply want to upgrade, it is not an issue.
 
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theoldwizard1

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I have also tried an OTC scanner, and it was good for the basic bi-directional controls I've used it for.

Interesting footnote. OTC is now owned by Bosch. Bosch also owns other brands of scan tools besides marketing their own brand. Many if these tools are obviously the same. Different labels, different colors. Same hardware and software.
 

theoldwizard1

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From Eric @ South Main Auto in the comments on that video:
Great tool for the price, just bear in mind it is "Launch China" not made by "Launch USA" (2 separate companies) so technically you will have no product support for it in the USA. If you were to call Launch USA they would tell you to pound salt because it is a "Launch China" tool. Kinda ***** because they are a fraction of the cost of the Launch USA products.... Any how still a decent tool for the money.

Very confusing ! Launch Tech USA sell the X431 PRO

The X-431 PROS Mini is clearly a different device but the main menus look identical. This device is NOT listed on the Launch Tech USA web site !


So is the "business relationship" between Launch Tech USA and the China based Launch (I have not found their web site yet)
 
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milwaukeephil

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Very confusing ! Launch Tech USA sell the X431 PRO

The X-431 PROS Mini is clearly a different device but the main menus look identical. This device is NOT listed on the Launch Tech USA web site !


So is the "business relationship" between Launch Tech USA and the China based Launch (I have not found their web site yet)

Neither is the Launch x431 Diagun which looks cool.
 

toolenthusiast

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That launch is a joke compared to a snapon tool. I have a Maxme for the house and even that ***** sometimes

Sometimes Launch runs circles around Snap-on.

Connect your MaxMe and then your preferred Snap-on scantool to any BMW. The Launch tool will decode the VIN and get to work. The Snap-on will ask you what model, what engine, what options, et cetera. (The Snap-on won’t even narrow down the list of engines to the ones that are correct for the model year.)

Every system has plenty of weak points.
 
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vpd66

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The Launch x-431 pros mini looks very interesting, but with all this USA/China support debate I'd wait and let it get out on the market for a while and see what happens. They say free 2 year updates, but what happens after 2 years?
 

VinceG

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The Launch x-431 pros mini looks very interesting, but with all this USA/China support debate I'd wait and let it get out on the market for a while and see what happens. They say free 2 year updates, but what happens after 2 years?

You pay for updated probably 800 to 1200 a year. That is what makes the Matco Maxme nice it is subscription based so you can get only what you need. I have never had a issue used it on my Chrysler with the Chrysler subscription used basic OBD on a ford, Honda, and a mini. if I needed mor in depth on those brands i would get the subscription for that brand for a month.
 

Kaane

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"... Autel MaxiDAS DS808: Based on the Android 4.4 operating system ..."

So in other words, the software would run on a $90 Fire HD 8 tablet. Okay, sure, they have a nice heavy rubber bevel on it (like the kids version of the Fire tablets) and an OBD-II wire/plug (could be replaced by a Bluetooth adapter).

Is the software worth over $500 ? Maybe.

EDIT : I would rather be able to buy the software separately so that if I break the tablet or simply want to upgrade, it is not an issue.

It's the cheapest full function scanner, you won't find a better deal. I have a launch as well and it ***** in comparison. Snap on is 5 times the price, Encore is feature incomplete.

I still use Xentry and GM Tech 2 and Factory BMW tools, but 95% things can be solved with the Autel.
 

mfewtrail

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Very confusing ! Launch Tech USA sell the X431 PRO

The X-431 PROS Mini is clearly a different device but the main menus look identical. This device is NOT listed on the Launch Tech USA web site !


So is the "business relationship" between Launch Tech USA and the China based Launch (I have not found their web site yet)


No clue about the business relationship between Launch Tech USA and the Chinese company. I think this is Launch China's site: http://www.x431.com/website/index.do


I believe the actual issue with not purchasing tools from an authorized US dealer is the chance that you could receive a knockoff. See this link below.

http://www.launchtech.co.uk/counterfeit-launch-x431-tools/
 

Eric29

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I second this. You just have to buy software for each model of car you work on though (one model comes free). I think you said home mechanic so this might work for you.

FWIW, I have a foxwell 510 with the GM and Chrysler software. I was able to deal with an airbag issue on my old truck and it paid for itself there. It came with one make loaded and you can buy others as needed. I only have Jeeps and a Ram so I'm now set with the Chrysler software that cost an extra $60.

yes it's a chinese scanner, no it's not a snap on, but for the $150 it gets the job done for me.
 

Showkey

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The Launch x-431 pros mini looks very interesting, but with all this USA/China support debate I'd wait and let it get out on the market for a while and see what happens. They say free 2 year updates, but what happens after 2 years?

You pay for updated probably 800 to 1200 a year. That is what makes the Matco Maxme nice it is subscription based so you can get only what you need. I have never had a issue used it on my Chrysler with the Chrysler subscription used basic OBD on a ford, Honda, and a mini. if I needed mor in depth on those brands i would get the subscription for that brand for a month.


According to the questions and answers on amazon the updates are $399 per year after the second year. Also the scanner continues to work without updates.
AUTEL had update fees for while and now updates are free. But AUTEL also has the same issues with it depends where you buy the scanner. AUTEL seems to have several distributors and many resellers.
 

theoldwizard1

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I would rather be able to buy the software separately so that if I break the tablet or simply want to upgrade, it is not an issue.

No clue about the business relationship between Launch Tech USA and the Chinese company. I think this is Launch China's site: http://www.x431.com/website/index.do

From what I can glean from that website it appears that X431 (not Launch Tech USA) at one time DID sell their software with an OBD-II Bluetooth adapter WITHOUT THEIR OWN TABLET !

It was called X431 iDiag. It ran on both Android and iPad

attachment.php


It also seems to have disappeared off of the Internet.
 

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WhiffySpark

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Sometimes Launch runs circles around Snap-on.

Connect your MaxMe and then your preferred Snap-on scantool to any BMW. The Launch tool will decode the VIN and get to work. The Snap-on will ask you what model, what engine, what options, et cetera. (The Snap-on won’t even narrow down the list of engines to the ones that are correct for the model year.)

Every system has plenty of weak points.

I would still choose snapon. Had a maxidas too

I’m fine filling in the vin. Takes 20 seconds. Saves frustration from dealing with launch or autel software
 

frank001

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The Snap-On tools are not perfect either. I have watched several videos, including one today, where either Eric O. (South Main Auto) or Ivan (Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics) has had to switch to a different brand to do get the job done.

Lower cost scan tools usually do good coverage on high volume cars built within the past 10-15 years. The do NOT do well on high end European cars (MB, BMW, Porsche, etc).



I have an iCarSoft CR Plus. Works on my Porsche 2014 911, 2013 Mercedes, 2011 Ford Ranger and 2006 Sprinter. Reads the codes and resets the maintenance and CEL lights. Also does air bag and ABS. The menu also shows a lot of other vehicles it should work on, but I haven't tried them. $200.00.
 

Bobioz1

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I have an iCarSoft CR Plus. Works on my Porsche 2014 911, 2013 Mercedes, 2011 Ford Ranger and 2006 Sprinter. Reads the codes and resets the maintenance and CEL lights. Also does air bag and ABS. The menu also shows a lot of other vehicles it should work on, but I haven't tried them. $200.00.

Is it a bi-directional scan tool?
 

Tallpilot

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From what I can glean from that website it appears that X431 (not Launch Tech USA) at one time DID sell their software with an OBD-II Bluetooth adapter WITHOUT THEIR OWN TABLET !

It was called X431 iDiag. It ran on both Android and iPad

attachment.php


It also seems to have disappeared off of the Internet.

That's been your fantasy for as long as I've known you!
 

Bartleby

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Short version is, sometimes scanner A works on a vehicle but sometimes it does not. So he switches to scanner B. or C or D.

Obviously.

My point was that I would like to know what his experience has been using each of them. Which has better import coverage? Which is better for domestics? If I could only purchase one, which would he recommend?

Scanners are expensive, and unfortunately I cannot afford all of them. :(

I would like a more detailed answer.

So much for OBD-II being "standard".

OBD II is a standard required by the EPA. They have their own requirement for OBD II that all auto manufacturers must have if they intend to sell to the US market. Anything beyond those requirements are up to the manufacturers.
 

L.Cheapo

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Obviously.

My point was that I would like to know what his experience has been using each of them. Which has better import coverage? Which is better for domestics? If I could only purchase one, which would he recommend?

Scanners are expensive, and unfortunately I cannot afford all of them. :(

I would like a more detailed answer.



OBD II is a standard required by the EPA. They have their own requirement for OBD II that all auto manufacturers must have if they intend to sell to the US market. Anything beyond those requirements are up to the manufacturers.

I've been a fan of Eric's virtually since the beginning of his channel. In the early days, he used a Snap On Verus virtually exclusively. Ivan from Pine Hollow did as well, and mostly still does.

Now Eric has a plethora of scan tools, and they all have their issues. From my viewing, I'd say his Autel crashes the most, his Launch lies the most, and he seems to dislike his Verus the most, for reasons I don think he's explicitly stated.

Keith from New Level Auto refers to Autel as "awfultel" and I can't remember him using one recently. He uses mostly brand specific scan tools, which are really the best for their respective brands, although owning and keeping several of them updated is out of reach for most of us.

I was looking for a scan tool and researched everything I could for a long time. Fact is, no aftermarket scan tool is perfect or does everything on every model made since 1996. The Launch/Autel/Others all seemed shady--lawsuits from OEMs, you have to buy it from here--not there, etc. I also wanted a scope. For those reasons, and a very good deal, I ended up with a new Modis Edge earlier this year. I only use it on my personal vehicles and those of family (Chrysler, Ford, Toyota) and it hasn't given me any headaches. It was a "buy once cry once" thing for me. YMMV.
 

dnschmidt

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The best bang for the buck is Autel MS906BT. This is the model that Eric is currently using. Keith has a personal hatred for the main man at Autel USA which explains his animosity toward them. He's pretty firmly on the Launch side of the Autel/Launch battle. Eric is on the Autel side. Keith has pretty much every factory scan tool available so his need for a general purpose scan tool is not that great as he has the best model specific tools available.
 

theoldwizard1

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I also wanted a scope. For those reasons, and a very good deal, I ended up with a new Modis Edge earlier this year. I only use it on my personal vehicles and those of family (Chrysler, Ford, Toyota) and it hasn't given me any headaches. It was a "buy once cry once" thing for me. YMMV.

CRY ! I would be going hysterical !! My biggest investment in diagnostic equipment was back in the days points when I spent about $50 for a Sears/Penske dwell-tach !

I don't know how any shade tree mechanic could afford a Modis Edge.
 

dnschmidt

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theoldwizard1 Then you don't have enough money. I have three friends that are not pros in any sense of the word that have Verus's two of which bought them at last years SEMA show. Why, they felt like it. Check out Studsman on YouTube. This guy has a $4000 R134a refrigerant recovery system in his house and he's a retired engineer that just dicks around for the hell of it. I asked him what's he going to do when they go to 1234yf refrigerant, he told me he'd buy a machine for that if he ever bought a car that used it. He has a legit, not Chinese clone, of the Tech 2 that he bought new for $10,000. I asked Terry why? He said he likes quality tools. Has a **** load of Fluke meters too.
 

WhiffySpark

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I've been a fan of Eric's virtually since the beginning of his channel. In the early days, he used a Snap On Verus virtually exclusively. Ivan from Pine Hollow did as well, and mostly still does.

Now Eric has a plethora of scan tools, and they all have their issues. From my viewing, I'd say his Autel crashes the most, his Launch lies the most, and he seems to dislike his Verus the most, for reasons I don think he's explicitly stated.

Keith from New Level Auto refers to Autel as "awfultel" and I can't remember him using one recently. He uses mostly brand specific scan tools, which are really the best for their respective brands, although owning and keeping several of them updated is out of reach for most of us.

I was looking for a scan tool and researched everything I could for a long time. Fact is, no aftermarket scan tool is perfect or does everything on every model made since 1996. The Launch/Autel/Others all seemed shady--lawsuits from OEMs, you have to buy it from here--not there, etc. I also wanted a scope. For those reasons, and a very good deal, I ended up with a new Modis Edge earlier this year. I only use it on my personal vehicles and those of family (Chrysler, Ford, Toyota) and it hasn't given me any headaches. It was a "buy once cry once" thing for me. YMMV.

That’s the truth but no one is going to believe that on here.

Also
Comes back to you don’t pay retail for snapon. I think the best I did on the Odis was just under $3k.
 

Tallpilot

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theoldwizard1 Then you don't have enough money. I have three friends that are not pros in any sense of the word that have Verus's two of which bought them at last years SEMA show. Why, they felt like it. Check out Studsman on YouTube. This guy has a $4000 R134a refrigerant recovery system in his house and he's a retired engineer that just dicks around for the hell of it. I asked him what's he going to do when they go to 1234yf refrigerant, he told me he'd buy a machine for that if he ever bought a car that used it. He has a legit, not Chinese clone, of the Tech 2 that he bought new for $10,000. I asked Terry why? He said he likes quality tools. Has a **** load of Fluke meters too.

Classic Dennis. Accurate analysis but could have perhaps been delivered with a little more tact.

Some people here are broke and some are just cheap. We all choose what to spend our money on. Most of this equipment makes no economic sense for those of us just 'dicking around.' I could pay for a lifetime of maintenance and repairs for what I spent on my tools. I get enough satisfaction from doing it myself that I will buy all the necessary speciality tools. An AC machine is on my list since it is one of the few capabilities I don't yet have.

That’s the truth but no one is going to believe that on here.

Also
Comes back to you don’t pay retail for snapon. I think the best I did on the Odis was just under $3k.

I paid $1k for my Ethos Tech with 17.2 and it's updated automatically to 17.4 then 18.2. I hope it updates to 18.4 but it could be nearing the end of the 3 years of included updates.

I picked up a Vantage Ultra for $1200 and will pay $500 to update it to 18.4 in October.

These things are affordable if you want them. If you want other things more than take your car to a shop when it needs something besides fluids, brakes or shocks.
 

Showkey

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theoldwizard1 Then you don't have enough money. I have three friends that are not pros in any sense of the word that have Verus's two of which bought them at last years SEMA show. Why, they felt like it. Check out Studsman on YouTube. This guy has a $4000 R134a refrigerant recovery system in his house and he's a retired engineer that just dicks around for the hell of it. I asked him what's he going to do when they go to 1234yf refrigerant, he told me he'd buy a machine for that if he ever bought a car that used it. He has a legit, not Chinese clone, of the Tech 2 that he bought new for $10,000. I asked Terry why? He said he likes quality tools. Has a **** load of Fluke meters too.


We all know guys that collect tools and then we know guys that use tools :lol_hitti
 
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