Lighting advice for 9 car 2100 SF attached garage

[AaronTTRS]

We broke ground this week on a new house that will have a 9 car 2100 square foot attached garage. A layout pic is attached but it's 3/3 tandem with a separate 3 car section.

I wanted to use can lights (finishing like the inside of the house) but as I read here that's not very popular.

This will be a showcase garage where I will store and detail (I don't do any mechanical work).

Looking for something very bright but upscale and presentable.

Advice appreciated.

Aaron

 

[mike93lx]

A budget might help, especially when you are talking about upscale.
What is the ceiling height and how will the walls, floor and ceiling be finished?

 

[AaronTTRS]

11 foot ceilings. Walls will be dark grey, floor with be black/white/red/grey racedeck free flow.

I'd love to be $750-ish (or less) on budget just for the lights (not install,etc) if possible.

This is my current garage, look will be similar only much larger.

 

[jon72vega]

Was that your silver Speedster at Cars and Coffee today?

 

[Shiftless]

Considering the fact that you are building a showcase garage of that size, I strongly suggest that you increase your lighting budget. Well designed lighting will make your car collection look much better. Also, since you will be doing detailing, will you move cars around to the dedicated detailing area or will you need proper detailing light levels everywhere in your 2100 square feet? Big difference between storage levels of lighting and detailing levels of lighting not only in foot-candles of illumination but also in placement of fixtures.

Check some of the pre made lighting layouts and fixture recommendations by Platonic Solid and others.

 

[AaronTTRS]

Was that your silver Speedster at Cars and Coffee today?

Yup, that was me!

 

[AaronTTRS]

Considering the fact that you are building a showcase garage of that size, I strongly suggest that you increase your lighting budget. Well designed lighting will make your car collection look much better. Also, since you will be doing detailing, will you move cars around to the dedicated detailing area or will you need proper detailing light levels everywhere in your 2100 square feet? Big difference between storage levels of lighting and detailing levels of lighting not only in foot-candles of illumination but also in placement of fixtures.

Check some of the pre made lighting layouts and fixture recommendations by Platonic Solid and others.

Cool, thanks I'll check them out.

No issue increasing budget if that's needed to do it right. Everything else on this house is waaaay over anyhow

Detailing will be in the far inside 3 bays of the 6 bay area. That's where the floor drains/hot water will be.

 

[Shiftless]

It’s good to know how you will be using a space prior to installing lights. Clearly you don’t need 100 foot candles of illumination in areas dedicated to storage and display. For detailing, you need not only lots of lumens but fixture type and placement are critical to see well enough to be able to do a first class job on paint correction.
Good luck with your project and keep us posted!

 

[Platonic Solid]

Those dark grey walls aren't going to do you any favors with respect to lighting. You'll likely need ~20% more fixtures to compensate. Your drawing has no dimensions. Would definitely go with something dimming. Plan entire layout for detailing (93fc+) then dim for desired ambiance.

You might find the LED edge lit flat panels used in the Olariu detailing bay (link) interesting. Flat panels can be recessed in grid ceilings, recessed with a flange kit (though this can be challenging to get fixtures located exactly where you want them with respect to joist locations), installed in surface mounting frames as done in the Olariu detailing bay, or hung as floating panels of light for a unique ultra-modern industrial effect. Assume cost to be in the $1/sq ft arena.

Now to completely blow the budget, installing a suspended ceiling (link) opens up a whole new world of options.

 

[AaronTTRS]

The six car section is 44 x 30 (27 in the upper left corner) and the 3 car section is 22.5 x 30.

90% of the time will be used to walk around the cars with a Cigar and glass of whiskey. 10% of the time is car washing/detailing.

 

[75gmck25]

Would you consider using white on the upper few feet of the walls? It would help a lot to reflect light, and the lower grey section should still have the more refined look you seem to want.

You will probably also need some low angle lighting if you want the lower part of the cars to stand out and be accented. With grey walls and racedeck floor you won't get much for low angle reflected light. The area under the car will be a black hole if all lighting is from directly above.

Bruce

 

[AaronTTRS]

Would you consider using white on the upper few feet of the walls? It would help a lot to reflect light, and the lower grey section should still have the more refined look you seem to want.

You will probably also need some low angle lighting if you want the lower part of the cars to stand out and be accented. With grey walls and racedeck floor you won't get much for low angle reflected light. The area under the car will be a black hole if all lighting is from directly above.

Bruce

I could save a ton (about $2000) if I left the walls white because the builder can just spray. Hadn't really thought about the correlation between color of walls and the lighting.

I can also get lighter racedeck, going new not reusing the ones from this house. I've liked the dark floor in current house, but this new space is 4 times larger.

 

[Shiftless]

“90% of the time will be used to walk around the cars with a Cigar and glass of whiskey. 10% of the time is car washing/detailing.”

That sounds like a nice way to spend your time! I was in Indiana in May. Can I bring a bottle of Lagavulin on the next trip?

 

[AaronTTRS]

“90% of the time will be used to walk around the cars with a Cigar and glass of whiskey. 10% of the time is car washing/detailing.”

That sounds like a nice way to spend your time! I was in Indiana in May. Can I bring a bottle of Lagavulin on the next trip?

Absolutely!

 

[AaronTTRS]

Picking back up, framing is done and i’m getting closer to needing to choose.

I’m thinking maybe 12 4ft fixtures on the 6 car side and 4 on the 3 car side.

I know we want ceiling mount lights and i’d prefer ones where the builder can hide all wires.

 

[Shiftless]

Think about edge lit LED panel lights. You’ll love ‘em

 

[Viper98912]

No no no, stop stop stop.

You said you like recessed can lights? DO IT.

You want that "showroom" feel? DO IT.

This is what I've done in 3 houses now. I personally think it looks GREAT, and gives you that awesome, reflective, multi bulb look reflecting off your paint.

I have 12 recessed in my current 3 car, and had 15 in my last 3 car. All depends on your rafter spacing and symmetry.

If you go with regular 4ft setups, you will be disappointed if you want that showroom feel.

PS - 2100 sqft attached is just obnoxious

(PM me for additional pictures)

 

[AaronTTRS]

I love the recessed look your garage has!


[/I]

No no no, stop stop stop.

You said you like recessed can lights? DO IT.

You want that "showroom" feel? DO IT.

This is what I've done in 3 houses now. I personally think it looks GREAT, and gives you that awesome, reflective, multi bulb look reflecting off your paint.

I have 12 recessed in my current 3 car, and had 15 in my last 3 car. All depends on your rafter spacing and symmetry.

If you go with regular 4ft setups, you will be disappointed if you want that showroom feel.

PS - 2100 sqft attached is just obnoxious

(PM me for additional pictures)

 

[AaronTTRS]

My wife thinks it's obnoxious too, but I know it will be really cool. Here it is so far. and a view of the house from the back.

 

[pbon]

They now make dimmable color changing LED flat panels. Might want to triple your budget and look at those. For the finished look, I would be using either the flat panel or cans. When I was shopping for lights for my working garage/shop I found 8 inch 2000L cans but did not want double the number of lights and the cone dispersion is not as broad. With the color changing you could have 5000k for when you work and 3000k or 4000k for hanging out.

 

[LSU]

My only comment is that I'm jealous.

Post when you're done

 

[cybrdyke]

If you check out some dealerships, you'll notice that alot of them still use track lights and downlights. The reason is because these give the cars those sparkly reflections that make them look all shiny and new. LED track lights are not your father's track lights. They're tiny, modern looking, aim-able, very bright and come in a ton of different colors, beams, styles, etc.
Have a look at a few of these for instance...https://www.liteline.com/20000119-pf_track_led/led/led-track-fixtures/filter=3000042149,3000042150
For downlights, they come in tons of different sizes, shapes, and colors now. And, you can aim them to focus on your cars! Look here, for instance: https://www.liteline.com/page/Luna%20Landing
Good luck,
CD

 

[memphisnate]

What about doing recessed lighting for all your main lighting then get some mobile lights that can be setup when you are detailing?

 

[AaronTTRS]

Am I crazy for considering flush mounting 16-20 of these or similar?

Hykolity 4FT 42W Linkable LED Shop Light with Pull Chain, Hanging or FlushMount Garage Utility Light with Cord, 5000K Workbench Light, 3700lm 64w Fluorescent Fixture Replacement, ETL Listed- 4 Pack https://www.amazon.com/dp/B071KTDBTV/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[cybrdyke]

Am I crazy for considering flush mounting 16-20 of these or similar?

Yes.
Hykolity 4FT 42W Linkable LED Shop Light with Pull Chain, Hanging or FlushMount Garage Utility Light with Cord, 5000K Workbench Light, 3700lm 64w Fluorescent Fixture Replacement, ETL Listed- 4 Pack

That's something that you hang over your bench. Plus, it's woefully inefficient.
Run away.
CD

 

[AaronTTRS]

Builder said the wiring for 20-25 cans would add a bunch of cost.

Any advice on good flush mount ceiling options?

I’m waaaaaay over budget already so really want to try and control cost but, good lighting is a must.

 

[ishiboo]

You gotta forget the $750 budget if you're going to have "showroom" and "detail quality" lighting throughout the whole shop. Especially if you're not doing it yourself. I think I have about $1500 in materials for 1100 square feet and that's with Black Friday shop lights that were super cheap, recessed cans, and LED trims.

Cans are very easy to wire, maybe you could do it yourself? Use the Wago lever nuts and it's easy as pie.

There are plenty of flush mount LEDs discs, not sure if they have come down in cost lower than using a recessed housing and a LED trim though. They still require a junction box to be installed.

 

[memphisnate]

You gotta forget the $750 budget if you're going to have "showroom" and "detail quality" lighting throughout the whole shop. Especially if you're not doing it yourself. I think I have about $1500 in materials for 1100 square feet and that's with Black Friday shop lights that were super cheap, recessed cans, and LED trims.

Cans are very easy to wire, maybe you could do it yourself? Use the Wago lever nuts and it's easy as pie.

There are plenty of flush mount LEDs discs, not sure if they have come down in cost lower than using a recessed housing and a LED trim though. They still require a junction box to be installed.

If you don't mind doing some wiring, the recessed cans are super simple to do. The hardest part would be figuring out where you want the lights to go and cut the holes.

 

[cybrdyke]

Builder said the wiring for 20-25 cans would add a bunch of cost.

Any advice on good flush mount ceiling options?

I’m waaaaaay over budget already so really want to try and control cost but, good lighting is a must.

Lets get your semantics fixed...
Normally when lighting folks want a fixture where the lens is flush with the ceiling, it's a "recessed" fixture. Picture a typical office building.
If a fixture is mounted to the drywall ceiling, it's "surface mounted".
It sounds like what you're asking for is "surface mounted fixtures". Is that what you want?
Just trying to help you be clear.
CD

 

[AaronTTRS]

Lets get your semantics fixed...

Normally when lighting folks want a fixture where the lens is flush with the ceiling, it's a "recessed" fixture. Picture a typical office building.

If a fixture is mounted to the drywall ceiling, it's "surface mounted".

It sounds like what you're asking for is "surface mounted fixtures". Is that what you want?

Just trying to help you be clear.

CD

Yes sorry.

Sounds like fixtures mounted to the ceiling surface will be much less cost from the install side than the recessed which I originally was aiming for.

The house itself is $100k over budget (almost all due to garage) so I really need to control cost so I can stay married [emoji41]

Aaron


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[Platonic Solid]

Realistic budget for good lighting ~$1/sq.ft.

 

[cybrdyke]

Builder said the wiring for 20-25 cans would add a bunch of cost.

Any advice on good flush mount ceiling options?

I’m waaaaaay over budget already so really want to try and control cost but, good lighting is a must.

Even a surface mount fixture is going to need an electrical box installed in the ceiling, so I dont see much difference in labor costs between a surface mount and a recessed can.
There's a few exceptions, like a flat panel and surface mount bracket. You can figure around $45 to $50 for the panel and another $25 for the surface bracket. These can be installed with just romex from fixture to fixture. Still, it wont be a big labor saver.
You're in a pickle with the budget, sorry to tell you. I dont think that you'll be happy with any of those low-budget 4' strips from Amazon, ebay, or the internet. They wont look right in your nice new garage.
Cans with LED trims are pretty cheap, material-wise. Wafer lights are, too. Installation for both are about the same.
LED track heads are about $30 to $50 each, plus track and fittings, plus installation.

CD

 

[quattro_sinko]

FWIW, I have supplied and installed a lot of 6" led "cans" that are only 1/2" thick and come with their own mini-junction boxes. At $15-$18 each (bulk) they offer a savings in materials and labor over traditional housings and LED trims.

Looks like you have a nice project on your hands.

I'd agree with shiftless, check out the indirect/flat panels, and even more with pbon. Color changing flat panels would be perfect.

 

[Sparkynutz]

Why not just install a large array of track lighting. You'll be able to install the fewest boxes and wiring possible. You'll be able to add to and increase lighting or re-arrange until you see fit easily and quickly any time later on. The other good thing about that is just buy what you need to get by now and buy more later as needed.
That's what I'd do with 11ft ceiling.

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[BoostAddiction]

Can lights are a problem for sealing, and it is very hard to make them airtight. If you don't do that, you'll have leaky ceilings, and your HVAC bills and your comfort in the garage will reflect that.

If you do choose to use can lights, and if you insulate the attic area above the garage -- and you should -- you have to specify fixtures that can tolerate insulation being around them, which adds even more cost.

Plus, they are really hard to get consistently even distribution of light across a wide area like a garage.

In general can lights in a garage ceiling that has an insulated attic above it are a really bad idea from an energy perspective, in addition to the difficulty of getting even light distribution.

 

[Sparkynutz]

I have almost 30 can lights in my ranch house and have nothing but problems with them when its below zero they drop condensation. I've been trying to replace a few at a time with tightly sealed led retrofits and insulate the **** out of the can in the attic. We'll see if this winter is any better. There is two areas I'd install can lights. Soffet, and basements. Other than that I'd never ever reccomend them for air sealing issues.

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