1/2 Cup
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slimpickins wishing you and yours a Merry Christmas and a great New Year..
Above 1200 Sq/FT 2 Garages and a Shop
- Thread starter slimpickins
- Start date
Wokspaces above 1200 squarefeet.
drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: there is no way you got your cat to do that unless it was her idea. or did you photoshop her in?
great picture and did you make it your Christmas card? love the snow in the background even though i'd prefer 75 degrees and sunshine wherever that might be this time of year. that said the snow surely does just SAY CHRISTMAS.
thanks for adding to another good year here on GJ and hope to see you more in 2019.
great picture and did you make it your Christmas card? love the snow in the background even though i'd prefer 75 degrees and sunshine wherever that might be this time of year. that said the snow surely does just SAY CHRISTMAS.
thanks for adding to another good year here on GJ and hope to see you more in 2019.
BBChevro
Well-known member
Merry Christmas and a happy New year to you and your family Slim.
Sent from my SM-G950F using The Garage Journal mobile app
Sent from my SM-G950F using The Garage Journal mobile app
Lyndon
Well-known member
Slim
I hope you doing a great job of getting through the Christmas feast, and are probably now relaxing into the evening.
Here's to a relaxing holiday period, and a great start to 2019.
Lyndon
Yeah - that one!
I hope you doing a great job of getting through the Christmas feast, and are probably now relaxing into the evening.
Here's to a relaxing holiday period, and a great start to 2019.
Lyndon
Yeah - that one!
oldironfarmer
Well-known member
Merry Christmas and a Happy Cat for the New Year, Slim!
drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: my cat (CLEO) wants to know why she didn't get to dress up for Christmas? she's wanting to talk to your cat and i'm not sure i'm going to allow that unless you post on here more often.
hope 2019 isn't starting off too cold in your part of the world and I know it will be the best year yet.
take care
hope 2019 isn't starting off too cold in your part of the world and I know it will be the best year yet.
take care
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slimpickins
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drivesitfar
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Slim: I flew across the USA one winter from Seattle to Myrtle Beach and we stopped in Chicago. the flight was delayed to the next morning cause of the weather and since i left in 65 degree weather (warm day for our winter that is for certain) and Myrtle Beach was 75 i had shorts on. long story short when i got out to the bus to take us to the hotel cause our bags were still on the plane -6 degrees was a bit chilly to say the least.
we just lost power for 15 hours and our house's temp dropped to 61 degrees so here's a picture of my bride all bundled up as we started a puzzle. I can't even imagine what 111 degrees colder would be like. OMG i'm not sure how or why you do it, but i'm guessing you love your NEIGHBORS and your life up there so best of luck on those COLD, COLD, COLD days of winter.
if you at least have power maybe you can post more of your great thoughts whether you have garage stuff or not cause they usually make me (us) smile.
a courtesy pic of my bride freezing at 61 degrees.
cheers
we just lost power for 15 hours and our house's temp dropped to 61 degrees so here's a picture of my bride all bundled up as we started a puzzle. I can't even imagine what 111 degrees colder would be like. OMG i'm not sure how or why you do it, but i'm guessing you love your NEIGHBORS and your life up there so best of luck on those COLD, COLD, COLD days of winter.
if you at least have power maybe you can post more of your great thoughts whether you have garage stuff or not cause they usually make me (us) smile.
a courtesy pic of my bride freezing at 61 degrees.
cheers
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drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: did you say you could build a website or that you have or were you saying you were an IT guy?
hope you are warming up a bit!!
hope you are warming up a bit!!
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slimpickins
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1/2 Cup
Member Emeritus
Slim I think we should send you some of our heat of late at over 40 C for the last week or so.
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slimpickins
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slimpickins
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1/2 Cup
Member Emeritus
Slim those are just awesome concept pics and I like the clear span underneath for your work area.
Is that ok structurally?
I just luv the Fort Snow, that is something I would have done as a kid.
Canada is certainly on our bucket list..
Is that ok structurally?
I just luv the Fort Snow, that is something I would have done as a kid.
Canada is certainly on our bucket list..
drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: looks like you've got big plans for a nice pole building. while I don't have an answer for your engineering and stress load on your cantilever I do have a few questions.
1) why are you only building it 14 foot tall if you want some storage and a sitting or man cave area up there? the storage unit i lease has 14 foot tall ceilings and the lower ceiling is 7 foot tall then you have the floor and the upper ceiling is just a little over 6 feet so i have to be careful walking up there on my loft a prior tenant built without bumping my head on the beams.
2) can you maybe hang some supports from the roof supports to help with some of the load of the cantilever?
3) what size are the poles supports (4x6's or ??) and how far apart would be something you might want to mention so Andy or another engineer or builder might be able to give you a better idea?
4) I like the idea of the man cave upstairs and just letting you know a stairway takes up a ton of floor space down below. also some guys use fork lifts to raise stuff to their lofts so having the railings being able to be unbolted and bolted might be something to think about instead of having to walk everything up on the stairs.
great looking fort and I bet your kids like you will remember it forever.
I'm interested in hearing what some of the other guys say about your drawing and maybe you'll find some answers looking at other member's garages and post your findings here too.
good luck!!
1) why are you only building it 14 foot tall if you want some storage and a sitting or man cave area up there? the storage unit i lease has 14 foot tall ceilings and the lower ceiling is 7 foot tall then you have the floor and the upper ceiling is just a little over 6 feet so i have to be careful walking up there on my loft a prior tenant built without bumping my head on the beams.
2) can you maybe hang some supports from the roof supports to help with some of the load of the cantilever?
3) what size are the poles supports (4x6's or ??) and how far apart would be something you might want to mention so Andy or another engineer or builder might be able to give you a better idea?
4) I like the idea of the man cave upstairs and just letting you know a stairway takes up a ton of floor space down below. also some guys use fork lifts to raise stuff to their lofts so having the railings being able to be unbolted and bolted might be something to think about instead of having to walk everything up on the stairs.
great looking fort and I bet your kids like you will remember it forever.
I'm interested in hearing what some of the other guys say about your drawing and maybe you'll find some answers looking at other member's garages and post your findings here too.
good luck!!
OP
slimpickins
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drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: I'm sorry I never did hang in garage gallery until a couple years ago cause everything is so cool and nice & EXPENSIVE so I just hung out in old tools so i wouldn't drool everyday as i was reeling from an awful REAL ESTATE MARKET in our area.
that said it looks like you bought your property or maybe just started this thread in 2011 almost 8 years ago. i bet your pole building is great dry storage and maybe a lot more trouble to remodel or re do than it might be to just keep it as dry storage and build yourself a custom building that you designed yourself. if money isn't available or you can't or won't be able to borrow or want to add to your bills then you might save some funds by remodeling the old, but i bet it's not as much as you think.
It looks like you have enough room to build a DREAM SHOP on your property and keep the pole building where it is. or do you?
anyway I still need to pick up my vintage cement mixer (I think he's still holding it for me), but I haven't rushed to meet him cause i heard he had the flu and i've already had one cold this year.
i'd love to hear you are above 0 degrees again cause the -60 sounds miserable.
sending some heat at least mentally.
cheers
that said it looks like you bought your property or maybe just started this thread in 2011 almost 8 years ago. i bet your pole building is great dry storage and maybe a lot more trouble to remodel or re do than it might be to just keep it as dry storage and build yourself a custom building that you designed yourself. if money isn't available or you can't or won't be able to borrow or want to add to your bills then you might save some funds by remodeling the old, but i bet it's not as much as you think.
It looks like you have enough room to build a DREAM SHOP on your property and keep the pole building where it is. or do you?
anyway I still need to pick up my vintage cement mixer (I think he's still holding it for me), but I haven't rushed to meet him cause i heard he had the flu and i've already had one cold this year.
i'd love to hear you are above 0 degrees again cause the -60 sounds miserable.
sending some heat at least mentally.
cheers
oldironfarmer
Well-known member
Sorry I missed these posts, Slim.
Cantilevers can be hard on the wall. Laminated 2x6's are very strong.
The unknown is the load you eventually put on the mezzanine.
It is much better with supporting posts.
Drives is right, hanging it from the trusses is an excellent option.
First step is to estimate the load you will put on the floor. Generally 25 psf is light. 100 psf is not a high load. Look at warehouse and attic loads. Think about having a dance and people line the mezzanine before it fails.
Once you establish the load, you look at the roof load. You'll find ceiling loads and a few attachments like the mezzanine are small in comparison to wind and snow loading.
If you can stand a few supporting posts you can build a walkway which can span between the posts.
Your posts are likely much stronger than needed to support the building. But when you add a cantilever you try to twist the post into an S shape. However slight that may be, an S is much weaker than an I for vertical loads. Then when you add an 18" snow cover you push down hard on the columns and may bend them out of shape which will bend you out of shape.
I didn't understand how the brackets were to be attached to the posts.
Was this an engineered building? If you know the manufacturer they may be able to give you the design roof loading. If you find it is designed for a lot more snow accumulation than you typically get you can use some of that extra to support interior loads.
Cantilevers can be hard on the wall. Laminated 2x6's are very strong.
The unknown is the load you eventually put on the mezzanine.
It is much better with supporting posts.
Drives is right, hanging it from the trusses is an excellent option.
First step is to estimate the load you will put on the floor. Generally 25 psf is light. 100 psf is not a high load. Look at warehouse and attic loads. Think about having a dance and people line the mezzanine before it fails.
Once you establish the load, you look at the roof load. You'll find ceiling loads and a few attachments like the mezzanine are small in comparison to wind and snow loading.
If you can stand a few supporting posts you can build a walkway which can span between the posts.
Your posts are likely much stronger than needed to support the building. But when you add a cantilever you try to twist the post into an S shape. However slight that may be, an S is much weaker than an I for vertical loads. Then when you add an 18" snow cover you push down hard on the columns and may bend them out of shape which will bend you out of shape.
I didn't understand how the brackets were to be attached to the posts.
Was this an engineered building? If you know the manufacturer they may be able to give you the design roof loading. If you find it is designed for a lot more snow accumulation than you typically get you can use some of that extra to support interior loads.
Bob Heine
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Slim, I went back to the beginning to see what you are starting with.
I don't know anything about post buildings and I also don't know how to calculate the extra load on the existing building. My thought would be to build a structure independent from the existing structure. Then I'd over-build the new structure.
I would add more posts on both sides between the existing posts (not necessarily as big but at least as deep). You decide how deep you want the mezzanine and that would determine how many posts to add. If you add a post every 12- or 16-inches between the original posts, that would allow you to put similarly spaced engineered wooden I-beams across the span from one side of the shop to the other. Those posts could also support scissor trusses above the mezzanine, allowing you to replace the existing ones without fear of a roof collapse. If posts set in holes isn't doable, perhaps concrete footers would work to support the additional posts.
For the side mezzanines, if they are only for storage, additional posts at the front of the shop would support more wooden I-beams and the other end would attach to the main mezzanine I-beam that could be doubled, tripled or even be a super strong laminated wood or steel beam.
I'm not an engineer and I haven't stayed in a Holiday Inn Express so this might not be viable. My thought was that this mezzanine structure would be independent from the existing structure and not affect its strength or snow load rating.
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oldironfarmer
Well-known member
Bob makes some good points.
Another option is to make your handrail a deep truss spanning the length of the walkway, supported only at the ends. It would do double duty and support the load. Easy to make, double 2x6 top and bottom with 2x4angle braces sandwiched between. A few braces to the trusses to keep the top member from buckling.
Another option is to make your handrail a deep truss spanning the length of the walkway, supported only at the ends. It would do double duty and support the load. Easy to make, double 2x6 top and bottom with 2x4angle braces sandwiched between. A few braces to the trusses to keep the top member from buckling.
Grumblebum
Well-known member
Luckily I had just finished my first morning coffee mr H. LMAO
(ref to Pg 196-197 on Andy's thread)
Slim, forecast is +30C here today. I don't know how you function in those conditions.
Will be interesting to see the mezzanine come together.
GB
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slimpickins
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slimpickins
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drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: I'm sure you'll figure out how to either remodel your barn or build a new DREAM GARAGE and if you have any questions just ask and maybe one of us has some idea or help to offer.
I know you are somewhat prepared and maybe used to those temps, but OMG we are at 19 degrees here with a few inches of snow and ice on the ground and our town is at about 50% on the third day after the snow hit after maybe being 10% on the first day. STAY WARM!!
did you see why the temps are so low especially in the midwest of the USA that normally don't have your cold temps? the hot air is pushing the ARTIC AIR down from the north pole when the weather people down here talked about it. we had 50's in most of January and now teens and below freezing and snow in February.
take care.
I know you are somewhat prepared and maybe used to those temps, but OMG we are at 19 degrees here with a few inches of snow and ice on the ground and our town is at about 50% on the third day after the snow hit after maybe being 10% on the first day. STAY WARM!!
did you see why the temps are so low especially in the midwest of the USA that normally don't have your cold temps? the hot air is pushing the ARTIC AIR down from the north pole when the weather people down here talked about it. we had 50's in most of January and now teens and below freezing and snow in February.
take care.
oldironfarmer
Well-known member
When I reread your post a while back it was clear what you are planning.
You'll find the trusses are very strong even though they look light.
Regardless, your design looks sound, and if you install it and find you have some spring you don't like because the poles are flexing there's still time to brace from the trusses.
Calculate what weight you'll have on structure and load and we can look at the steel required.
You'll find the trusses are very strong even though they look light.
Regardless, your design looks sound, and if you install it and find you have some spring you don't like because the poles are flexing there's still time to brace from the trusses.
Calculate what weight you'll have on structure and load and we can look at the steel required.
OP
slimpickins
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drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: I hope you are staying inside and keeping warm. are you??
It snowed over a foot here in paradise the last 24 hours and as you know we are not set up for this. heck last year we didn't even have any snow.
my snow shovels are MIA so i'm shoveling with a 10 inch metal flat shovel and getting a lot of exercise. it looks like i'm making snow forts on the perimeter too.
it's about 70 degrees warmer here than where you are and i'm still cold.
cheers
It snowed over a foot here in paradise the last 24 hours and as you know we are not set up for this. heck last year we didn't even have any snow.
my snow shovels are MIA so i'm shoveling with a 10 inch metal flat shovel and getting a lot of exercise. it looks like i'm making snow forts on the perimeter too.
it's about 70 degrees warmer here than where you are and i'm still cold.
cheers
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In that temp range when someone asks "How cold is it?" the answer is Awful Damn.
I love your avatar. Years back Slim would bring some of his animals to the Oregon State Fair to show. I can remember passing him in one of the alleyways as he was leading two big bulls on halters to the show ring. He was a real cowboy, and a great actor worth watching.
lg
no neat sig line
I love your avatar. Years back Slim would bring some of his animals to the Oregon State Fair to show. I can remember passing him in one of the alleyways as he was leading two big bulls on halters to the show ring. He was a real cowboy, and a great actor worth watching.
lg
no neat sig line
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slimpickins
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slimpickins
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oldironfarmer
Well-known member
I just now saw the lights. Great job!
I assume you'll pour your floor in six or eight pads to avoid vacating it. Best do one this summer and see how easy it is.
Windy, when we get 65 mph it seems like it's blowing hard.
I assume you'll pour your floor in six or eight pads to avoid vacating it. Best do one this summer and see how easy it is.
Windy, when we get 65 mph it seems like it's blowing hard.
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slimpickins
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oldironfarmer
Well-known member
Other than logistics, an advantage of pouring in segments is the built-in expansion joints. Much easier to maintain concrete without cracks.
On the down side, you either need to put dowels through your formwork or drill and dowel the slabs to tie them together. An area with high water table might experience wet seams if you don't put a vapor barrier under the concrete. I'm always in favor of a vapor barrier anyway because it stops metal on the floor from rusting.
You also could do 4" slabs not to be driven on and thicker in heavy traffic areas.
But the main reason is it gets you off the gravel even if you only do one or two slabs this summer.
On the down side, you either need to put dowels through your formwork or drill and dowel the slabs to tie them together. An area with high water table might experience wet seams if you don't put a vapor barrier under the concrete. I'm always in favor of a vapor barrier anyway because it stops metal on the floor from rusting.
You also could do 4" slabs not to be driven on and thicker in heavy traffic areas.
But the main reason is it gets you off the gravel even if you only do one or two slabs this summer.
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slimpickins
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slimpickins
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slimpickins
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drivesitfar
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Slim: are you ready for a road trip with your trailer to the PNW and a summer drive across Canada? reason being i'm really thinking of just emptying my 20 x 20 storage unit and getting rid of stuff I don't need now. it has 8 12 foot by 4 foot wide/deep uprights in it with more than enough 8, 9 and 10 foot beams to make your shop's floor empty in now time by putting some of that stuff on shelves.
also with these huge racks you don't need a shelf on the floor so you can roll toolboxes, mowers, cars and anything to store under them so you can use the 13 feet of space in your garage more efficiently. then you might not even need to rebuild your old shed/garage.
or if you can find a business or warehouse closing up shop, moving or remodeling they sometimes sell this stuff for almost scrap prices even though new it's many thousands of dollars.
nice work on the door!!
sorry to see the dunebuggy go, but guessing your son wasn't using or needing it.
cheers and keep on doing a little progress as your weather should be pretty nice now and not 50 below.
take care
also with these huge racks you don't need a shelf on the floor so you can roll toolboxes, mowers, cars and anything to store under them so you can use the 13 feet of space in your garage more efficiently. then you might not even need to rebuild your old shed/garage.
or if you can find a business or warehouse closing up shop, moving or remodeling they sometimes sell this stuff for almost scrap prices even though new it's many thousands of dollars.
nice work on the door!!
sorry to see the dunebuggy go, but guessing your son wasn't using or needing it.
cheers and keep on doing a little progress as your weather should be pretty nice now and not 50 below.
take care
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slimpickins
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drivesitfar
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Slim: I should be around if you decide to take a trip to PARADISE. that said those clouds and your sunsets don't look too shabby from my chair.
I hear you about FSD and also about not throwing anything away.
speaking of which you should look at my thread and see the load I moved today when looking for a few 4x4x3's.
cheers and have a great weekend
I hear you about FSD and also about not throwing anything away.
speaking of which you should look at my thread and see the load I moved today when looking for a few 4x4x3's.
cheers and have a great weekend
drivesitfar
Well-known member
Slim: I (and we) are missing your posts especially since Andy is MIA cause his wife passed a few weeks ago (you might make a post on his thread cause he's still reading and just not posting much if at all).
ok your turn to tell me (us) what you've been up to!!!
did you find any racks for your new space?
ok your turn to tell me (us) what you've been up to!!!
did you find any racks for your new space?