Mill dolly / mobile base

[jxxxoxxxe]

So I am acquiring a Bridgeport Series II mill. I have been looking/wanting one for awhile, and although I was only looking at the Series I machines, this one happens to be free...

From reading the Series I weighs ~2200 lbs, the Series II ~5500 lbs. My problem is, I want this thing to be mobile, about as mobile as you can expect 5500 lbs to be.

I built a rolling base for my 20" Rockwell Delta Bandsaw that works quite well. I built it from 1/8" (I think) angle iron I had laying around. I then offset the casters to make the whole thing sit only about 1/2" off the ground...It works very well, it also only weighs ~700 lbs....

So what type of material should I be looking at to make something capable here? 1/4"? Angle or boxed? I've seen some casters rated at more than 3000 lbs per wheel, so that shouldn't be a problem...

Now one other thing i've been considering and seen done, since I wont be moving this thing that often, is to build a HD pallet from 4x4's and 2x4's, then use a pallet jack to move it whenever needed. I would have to borrow a pallet jack, but it wouldnt be that big of deal...The pallet idea sounds better for my VCT Floor...LoL...

Thoughts or ideas?

 

[larry_g]

I would check with the VCT people what the point load is that there floor will take. If you put this thing on steel wheels the point load may be way above 5000 psi. If using a urethane wheel the point load will drop some but not much. You would be much better off parking the mill and leaving it in one place. "on edit" I looked up armstrong VCT and it has 125 lb/sq in" rating so you would have to have some 40 plus sq inches of feet on the floor.
lg
no neat sig line

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

I would check with the VCT people what the point load is that there floor will take. If you put this thing on steel wheels the point load may be way above 5000 psi. If using a urethane wheel the point load will drop some but not much. You would be much better off parking the mill and leaving it in one place.
lg
no neat sig line

I'd definitely have to use a urethane wheel...

 

[Ign]

If you have to I'd use 1/4" wall square or rectangle tube, but I think the idea is ridiculous. If you really need a mobile machine then you don't need a Series II, even if it's free. That's like saying I want my 40x50 shop to be mobile on my property. A machine like that is sweet, and it's meant to be set in one place and left there. Plus if you can level it setup is so much easier. Level will change everytime you move it.

If you can justify that machine, you can justify concessions or additions to give it dedicated space. And if you can't...........for god's sake I'll give it a good home in a nice shop.

 

[Ign]

and speaking of mobile, what are you gonna do for power? Bolt a static converter to the side of it, or run an extension cord to an RPC?

I'm assuming you don't have 3ph from the power company given the nature of the thread.

 

[rsanter]

been there done that
I built a mobile base for my mill and it works great
I have limited space and need the mobility to be maintain a versitile work area

View media item 2676
mine is made from 3/8 thick 6x6 angle iron

also. if you look over on metal meet there is a member that several of his pieces of equipment mounted to pallets and uses a pallet jack to move them.
he uses regular and monified pallets to get the job done

bob

 

[Davo J]

There are a few on this page
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...ade-mobile-base-there-bridgeport-mill-154425/
Davo

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

been there done that
I built a mobile base for my mill and it works great
I have limited space and need the mobility to be maintain a versitile work area

View media item 2676
mine is made from 3/8 thick 6x6 angle iron

also. if you look over on metal meet there is a member that several of his pieces of equipment mounted to pallets and uses a pallet jack to move them.
he uses regular and monified pallets to get the job done

bob

Any close up pictures? I was thinking about offsetting the wheels so it sat lower to the ground...

 

[rsanter]

you can move the swivel wheels ourward but then you have a issue with the torque that is applied and you have to make the base that much stouter.

I used angle verses square to minimize the height. I was concetned about the addition of height bit it has turned out to be no issue at all

bob

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

Well, Im going to pick this thing up this afternoon...For now, I'm going to build a pallet like I said above to sit it on...

Then the next order of business with be some type of dollies for a ~3600 lb lathe

 

[babzog]

So I am acquiring a Bridgeport Series II mill ... this one happens to be free...

That earns you a big YOU ****!

 

[bimmer1980]

I hope you have a stout trailer and an awesome forklift to pick it off the trailer!!!! 5500 is a lot of weight to pick up and haul......

I built a couple of dollies for temporarily storing my lathe. I used 4- 700lb casters for each dollie. I have two dollies under the lathe--one on each end. Even with having over capacity, it is difficult to get a 2200 machine rolling. The casters are 4" and 5" steel wheels.........

best of luck!

post some pictures of the move!!

 

[rsanter]

Well, Im going to pick this thing up this afternoon...For now, I'm going to build a pallet like I said above to sit it on...

Then the next order of business with be some type of dollies for a ~3600 lb lathe

my big lathe is over 4000lbs
moved it several times using 3 2ton floor jacks as 'skates'
works great, espically if you have 3-4 people doing the job
one on each jack and one to help push and spot

bob

 

[Steve from Socal]

I would suggest a frame that allows a pallet jack to move the machine around. On a Series II machine the weight alone will require a massive frame. I have a K&T 2H that weights about 4500 and I would never consider a dolly type mobile base. Both my mill and lathe could be mounted on steel pallets that would serve as risers and allow a standard 6K pallet jack to move them around if I had the room. In my future plans I would have enough room to take advantage of this, right now they are in the only places that work in my garage. 2X4 rectangular tube min .187 wall preferred .250 wall would be my choice for the frame.

Steve

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

That earns you a big YOU ****!

I'll be picking up a Victor 1640 as soon as this is unloaded...LoL..

I hope you have a stout trailer and an awesome forklift to pick it off the trailer!!!! 5500 is a lot of weight to pick up and haul......

I built a couple of dollies for temporarily storing my lathe. I used 4- 700lb casters for each dollie. I have two dollies under the lathe--one on each end. Even with having over capacity, it is difficult to get a 2200 machine rolling. The casters are 4" and 5" steel wheels.........

best of luck!

post some pictures of the move!!

See below...

my big lathe is over 4000lbs
moved it several times using 3 2ton floor jacks as 'skates'
works great, espically if you have 3-4 people doing the job
one on each jack and one to help push and spot

bob

I'm definitely going to build dollies for the lathe...

I would suggest a frame that allows a pallet jack to move the machine around. On a Series II machine the weight alone will require a massive frame. I have a K&T 2H that weights about 4500 and I would never consider a dolly type mobile base. Both my mill and lathe could be mounted on steel pallets that would serve as risers and allow a standard 6K pallet jack to move them around if I had the room. In my future plans I would have enough room to take advantage of this, right now they are in the only places that work in my garage. 2X4 rectangular tube min .187 wall preferred .250 wall would be my choice for the frame.

Steve

I really think it might just end up sitting on a custom built pallet for awhile...






Here's some pics

Close might have been an understatement there. That's a 10' door, I thought I was going to have to let some air out of the tires...

Cleaned a little spot...It should clean up good, although I might repaint it to match other machines in the shop...

So far, its all been pretty easy. The drive home was about 20 miles, and had no problems. As you can see, there was 6 (I think) straps on it from every way...

I have the lift pads sitting on the area where we lifted it with the fork lift. I have about 3" of lift travel left, so i probably will have to let some air out of the trailer tires...The lift is rated for 11,000 lbs, so this is definitely going to be a test, and probably not good for it....

 

[A_Pmech]

Looks like you did well! Can't beat free.

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

Looks like you did well! Can't beat free.

Definitely not. I should be picking up the lathe Monday hopefully. Your DoAll Saw thread has inspired me to fix these old machines up, although probably nothing like you've done...




It's on the ground...I bought the wood to make the pallet today...I should have it moved on Sunday, if not, its in the way of unloading the lathe...I think it gave my lift about all it could handle...

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

Little update...the mill is setting on a pallet made of 4x4's and 2x4's. Even with a 6000 lb pallet jack, it takes 2 people to move...

The lathe is now sitting between my lift after being set off the trailer...its supposedly weighs 3200 lbs...I am building dollies for it..

I've started with 2" x 3" x 1/4" angle iron. I have both dollies welded up, but cant decide how to mount the wheels. I dont really want to mount them directly to the bottom, because it will add so much height...

I was thinking of something like this...

Thats my bandsaw dolly. It barely sits off the floor...

Here's the problem though...To make the weight requirements, I ended up with 4" casters, their overall height is actually about 5.5". Now, using the material that the dollies are made of with the idea above looks something like this...

I'm not sold that this is a good idea, or that it would work with that much of the caster plate hanging out. The caster plate is 1/4" though....Obviously that piece is just tacked to check fitment. If I were to do it this way, I'd run a piece down the whole side like the bandsaw dolly...

I've got some 2" 1/4" square tubing that I've though about using...

Ideas...???



Also, any welding experts...how's this look?

I dont feel like its penetrating enough. I'm pretty sure its the small machine I'm using, or is it? I've got it turned up all the way, but its just a 110v mig...

 

[A_Pmech]

Definitely not. I should be picking up the lathe Monday hopefully. Your DoAll Saw thread has inspired me to fix these old machines up, although probably nothing like you've done...

Cool! I'm sure you'll do fine.

The S2 is a nice machine although it is no longer supported by the mother ship. It was designed after a survey Bridgeport did in the late 60's or early 70's about the shortcomings of the ubiquitous S1 machine. Though, they never built very many because new they were at least 4X the cost of the S1.

NMTB-40 is a nice step up.

Personally, I would stick with the pallet jack and 4x4's. That's what I do with my smaller machines. They're proven and rated to carry the load and I think it would be annoying to have wheels under it when you're cranking handles.

That said, you might check out this thread for some ideas:

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...ade-mobile-base-there-bridgeport-mill-154425/

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

Cool! I'm sure you'll do fine.

The S2 is a nice machine although it is no longer supported by the mother ship. It was designed after a survey Bridgeport did in the late 60's or early 70's about the shortcomings of the ubiquitous S1 machine. Though, they never built very many because new they were at least 4X the cost of the S1.

NMTB-40 is a nice step up.

Personally, I would stick with the pallet jack and 4x4's. That's what I do with my smaller machines. They're proven and rated to carry the load and I think it would be annoying to have wheels under it when you're cranking handles.

That said, you might check out this thread for some ideas:

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...ade-mobile-base-there-bridgeport-mill-154425/

It seems very hard to find S2 info. Doing almost any google search give mostly results of ones for sale...

My RPC should be here Monday, so hopefully i can get them going to next week, then its time to start looking at tooling...

Did I see somewhere that you had a S2? I need to build a power drawbar setup for mine, since its on the pallet, its way too tall...Are there any quick change tooling setups that you'd recommend...?

 

[A_Pmech]

It seems very hard to find S2 info. Doing almost any google search give mostly results of ones for sale...

My RPC should be here Monday, so hopefully i can get them going to next week, then its time to start looking at tooling...

Did I see somewhere that you had a S2? I need to build a power drawbar setup for mine, since its on the pallet, its way too tall...Are there any quick change tooling setups that you'd recommend...?

There isn't a lot of information out there and even Bridgeport is fairly vague.

Sounds like you'll be running wire for a few days.

Yes, I also have an S2. There are several threads on PM about building power drawbars using modified 3/8" impact wrenches. Some guys have built really nice setups.

Mine is equipped with the Erickson quick-change system which uses slightly modified NMTB holders. It works very well from what I've seen. However, the changeover requires a completely new spindle assembly, IIRC. A used take-out S2 spindle is probably in the $1,000 range if you can find one, so I would go the route of a shop-built power drawbar.

 

[mike13u]

Great pictures and ideas. Question though: I have always been under the impression that lathes and mills must be shimmed and leveled to precision to be able to turn-out or mill precision parts. Doesnt having dollies and bases make it difficult to level the beds or tables?

 

[A_Pmech]

Great pictures and ideas. Question though: I have always been under the impression that lathes and mills must be shimmed and leveled to precision to be able to turn-out or mill precision parts. Doesnt having dollies and bases make it difficult to level the beds or tables?

In the case of lathes, planers and other long machines, they must be carefully leveled because of their long beds.

Knee mills, on the other hand, do not require leveling. Geometrically, they will perform just as well sitting on a dirt floor at a 45 degree angle as they will grouted into a concrete floor perfectly level. This is because the slideways of a knee mill are not affected by changes in the attitude of the machine as it rests on single relatively small base. Lathes, suffer from bed humps and valleys, in addition to bed torsion as they are relatively flexible machines and rest on multiple bases.

 

[mike13u]

A_Pmech: After thinking about the mill, you are absolutely right. The relation between the spindle and table wouldn't be effected by a tilted mill. Thank you. I guess all you would need to do is use a spindle square/ indicator to make sure the head is verticle to table (assuming you aren't trying to mill at angle).

 

[Steve from Socal]

Some lathes don't require precision leveling either like my 10EE; these machines sit on kinematic mounts. As a general rule you want a machine roughly level if for no other reason than the fluids are in the correct places. I do like to level mill tables in X and Y to aid in setting up parts on the machine. You also want to ensure that all the floor contact points are firmly planted, a light corner can induce vibration under some conditions.

Steve

 

[A_Pmech]

Some lathes don't require precision leveling either like my 10EE; these machines sit on kinematic mounts. As a general rule you want a machine roughly level if for no other reason than the fluids are in the correct places. I do like to level mill tables in X and Y to aid in setting up parts on the machine. You also want to ensure that all the floor contact points are firmly planted, a light corner can induce vibration under some conditions.

Steve

Good points!

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

so any better ideas for how to mount the wheels, but offset some height?

 

[rsanter]

you have the right idea about mounting the wheels, however
you need a way to brace the top of that bracket from the top.
either you need to use much thicker material or a frame that is strut based such
that it had an upper level.
it will look like a ladder on its side so there is a place to tie a brace to from the top of that wheel bracket.

another option
no wheels. see about buying some 'air dollies'
you mount to the bottom of the machine and hook up your compressor
the machine will float on a cousion of air similar to an air hockey table

bob

 

[MLM]

Maybe a little late on this...

I used 4 Mason Mounts (rubber padded leveling studs?) at the mounting holes in the mill. I can then level the mill if needed or at least stabalize on all 4 corners. To move the mill I use 2 axles made from 1" square steel. Turned down the ends round and use 3 6204 bearings at each end. Adjust the feet up a little and if your garage has some slope it will start to move on its own. The axles can be used to move other heavy equipment only about 13/8" clearance needed. To turn make the 2 axles non-parallel.

Mike

 

[Kjbakke2]

nice weld for a 110, to be honest i wouldn't trust it with that kind of weight. you cant get enough penetration with a 110 to really join that kind of real estate. that being said you do have a really steady hand and its clean and consistent.

 

[CAlhoon]

I just picked up a series 2 4j. I have it set up in the garage and it powers up but I have some wiring issues. I have the schematic for the quill and the 90 volt board but I can't find the general wiring diagram I will help you out with what I have can you help me with a wiriing schematic. Colin

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

I just picked up a series 2 4j. I have it set up in the garage and it powers up but I have some wiring issues. I have the schematic for the quill and the 90 volt board but I can't find the general wiring diagram I will help you out with what I have can you help me with a wiriing schematic. Colin

Email address...? I have a diagram, but not sure what type Series 2 it goes to...

Can you engage the motor by pushing in the contactors?

 

[CAlhoon]

I picked mine up for 500 at an auction . It was never used for anything other than aluminum bar but the electrical was a little butchered. The 90 volt motor from the Z feed is missing and I can only find one for 2 grand. The main motor is 460v 4 HP and runs great. To run it I have to hold the relay down. I am trying to draw up the circuits in order to find the problem but a Schematic would be great. [email protected]

 

[CAlhoon]

Took these while disassembling

 

[A_Pmech]

Joe had a problem with getting the spindle motor to start and it turned out to be something I had forgotten about: There is a float switch in the lube pump that will not allow the start circuit to complete unless the the lube pump has sufficient oil in the tank.

Failing that, your problem is likely either a tripped overload or an open in the contact maintaining circuit.

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

I picked mine up for 500 at an auction . It was never used for anything other than aluminum bar but the electrical was a little butchered. The 90 volt motor from the Z feed is missing and I can only find one for 2 grand. The main motor is 460v 4 HP and runs great. To run it I have to hold the relay down. I am trying to draw up the circuits in order to find the problem but a Schematic would be great. [email protected]

So I take it you have everything wired for 460? Including the transformer? Mine was setup for 460, although I was told it was setup for 230 when I brought it home, so I had to rewire the motor, and the transformer jumpers...


Email sent..

Joe had a problem with getting the spindle motor to start and it turned out to be something I had forgotten about: There is a float switch in the lube pump that will not allow the start circuit to complete unless the the lube pump has sufficient oil in the tank.

Failing that, your problem is likely either a tripped overload or an open in the contact maintaining circuit.

This is what I was going to suggest too.

Mine is a float made of cork, that must have a magnet in it somewhere that activates a reed switch..

 

[CAlhoon]

Mine is a Bijor oiler. I think I will take it apart and clean it up. I never would have thought of the oiler being in the circuit. My machine is wired 460 .

 

[jxxxoxxxe]

Mine is a Bijor oiler. I think I will take it apart and clean it up. I never would have thought of the oiler being in the circuit. My machine is wired 460 .

quickest way to tell is to see if there are wires running to the box...I believe mine had 3 wires....

 

[Heavy Metal Doctor]

Also, any welding experts...how's this look?

I dont feel like its penetrating enough. I'm pretty sure its the small machine I'm using, or is it? I've got it turned up all the way, but its just a 110v mig...

I'm no expert, just have a heck of a lot of practice.....I'm sure there are professional welders who could advise even better. I do tons of this work on machinery and have never had a come-back, but can only give my opinion: That weld in itself looks good, but it's too hard to tell by that pic if it's gonna hold it's share of the weight of the machine in question.....what thickness is that angle? I can't tell if that's about 3/8" bead or 1/4"....Also, the joint of those peices better be welded in more places than just that one bead - I'm assuming you stopped with that one to get advice before finishing.....My general rule of thumb for joining steel is that the welds are at least the size of the material in one good hot pass. And it should be joined in 2 directions. If in doubt, weld all the way around the the joint - inside and outside.

 

[CAlhoon]

The oiler has black, white and ground, it operates at 120 volts. There is no way it could trip out the spindle motor. I looked at the CNC Mazak I run at work. It has the same type of oiler but; downstream attached to the oil line there is a pressure switch that is wired into the ladder in the controls. The Bijor itself can't kill the operation of the machine, only the reading from the separate pressure switch can do that. I can't see anything like that on the old girl.