J H Williams vintage hand tools

[David Jackson]

On another subject today and so far I can't find any info;
JHW made a torque wrench. Any idea how a person goes about using it? I have seen some pics but can't see how a person would set the tension and how a person would know when the torque setting has been reached.

 

[Old Radar]

On another subject today and so far I can't find any info;
JHW made a torque wrench. Any idea how a person goes about using it? I have seen some pics but can't see how a person would set the tension and how a person would know when the torque setting has been reached.

H. Ford made a car. Can anyone tell me how to set the tension on the dumaflache adjuster without me letting them know which car I'm talking about?

 

[David Jackson]

Good point! I'll have to see if there is a way for me to find pics. I don't have one of these.
DJ

 

[Skooch]

This S wrench is a whale, weighing in at almost 8 lbs and length 13-3/4" tip to tail. The large oe is 2 inches. I'm not sure about the size of the other because its been altered, as you can see in the pics. It looks like it was used as a body dolly. If it wasn't, it sure could be.

 

[leg17]

...... It looks like it was used as a body dolly. If it wasn't, it sure could be.

EVERY tool is eventually a hammer.
Ask your wife.

But seriously, likely 'assigned' to some piece of equipment that needed regular adjustments.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I'm not sure about the size of the other because its been altered, .

Per catalog it was 1-5/8". I have a few of the 66X series (flat handled carbon steel "S" wrenches), but none that big. Nice.

 

[Skooch]

I knew someone would have that catalog handy, wtg Lugz.

 

[David Jackson]

Hey Old Radar, It's been a few days ...Good call about photos. I think I have managed to get photos of two of these, and it would appear that there may have been two models, an older, possibly and a later. One is on sale on ebay right now, about $100 including the shipping and it is a beautiful specimen. I am sorely tempted but it would most likely go better in someone's collection who is into the JHW sockets etc.
BTW the way of establishing the torque seems a little crude, the instruction sheet in the new one's box explains it pretty well.

 

[Old Radar]

Nice examples! I take it you've answered your own questions on how to use it. You can't "set the tension", you just stop when the edge gets to the value you want. On my super-high-tech Indestro Super you can set the little brass marker along the bar so you have something to aim for.

 

[bmwrd0]

And one more torque wrench for the road


Slightly different box.

 

[David Jackson]

Well Old Radar, I thought the boxed one is pretty neat; just went back to ebay and did not find it; maybe a fellow GJ person got it. I have one or two of the wire ones similar to your Indestro "high tech", but I never saw one with the "high tech" bead before. Neat.
BMWRDR, the one you have looks pretty nice as well! Kind of a rarity I expect, in the condition yours is in with the box and all.
I did see an inch-pound Measurerench on ebay just now, maybe you should get it for your collection.

 

[David Jackson]

Question for all the experts:

What does a cast in V mean in JHW wrenches? I think I read somewhere that in Craftsman it means Vlchek manufacture; does it mean that in JHW?
I ask because some of my double box wrenches have it and some don't the attached photo is a case in point; they are both oval shank # 8025; one has the V cast in and the other does not. In the case of these two the stamped markings appear the same both in size and placement on the shank itself; the finish is the same etc. etc. only difference is the cast in V. I searched AA for info but did not find it; maybe I missed something. The V is mentioned a time or two but not the rationale.

 

[Kev442]

Thanks for the thoughts.

Here they are reunited after 35+ years apart.
I have no idea why the picture rotated.

 

[David Jackson]

Well you found it! That must make you feel good! Now all you need is to maybe find the original (or its twin) socket to replace the ringer.

Best wishes to you in your time of trouble with your father.

David J.

 

[David Jackson]

Photo back to normal.

 

[David Jackson]

If nobody responds I may repost as a new thread ...
I got a couple of interesting JHW tools today,
one is Whitworth and it has traces of gray paint, just traces but they are there. Since it came to me from inside the US I doubt that it ever left our country. Were we working on English stuff here in the US? Were some of the wartime things we made done in Whitworth for the Brits? I bet someone knows!

And second group of photos: This wrench is not marked the way any other JHW tools I know of are marked. The only clue is the diamond W. It is not a round shank wrench and not an oval shank either. Was it made as a low cost item for some other company? Anybody know?

Last photo - some pretty brave guys up there; I saw this yesterday and they are using some tools, you bet!

 

[3baygarage]

Nice find on the Whitworth. Not one you see every day in the US.

Your diamond W wrench, not sure on the age but they did mark a lot of tools way back just like that, including socketry.


Here is a 1/2” dr. diamond W stamped socket I picked up recently, however it’s a special. I like to look for those different SPECIAL stamp items. This socket has the look of an industrial power socket of some type. 9/16”, with a bit of a different 6 point hex to it. Two open detent holes, and the top of the socket tapers down to a thin wall. Maybe for factory assembly line work.

Part # T-81296

 

[3baygarage]

This is the ratchet it’s on. A member posted the sale link to this lineman ratchet.

I cleaned it up some. Kind of neat, the red or orange grip. The last two photos show a lineman rat with no grip, or an S-52 with a lineman lever, whichever way to look at it.

 

[David Jackson]

Hi 3Bay,

I just couldn't resist the Whitworth. I have seen another but it's in England! It can stay there I think.

Lineman's ratchet - is the handle insulated from possible electric current passing into the hand of the operator? If so, one hopes he (or she, it is 2020 after all) doesn't change direction of the ratchet mechanism while it is on a live bolt! That ratchet direction changer is a neat addition, for gloved hands I expect. I have never seen anything like it before.

I have only seen one or two "Specail" marked tools, may well have to get one just so I can say I have one ... that's how it starts I guess.

I have seen on another thread a photo of a member's three offset boxes like mine with just a diamond W and no oval or round shank ... pretty plain which made the other member wonder, as I did, if that method of production was for some low cost variety made for some other distributor. William's low cost short offset boxes I have seen, and I have one, look just like regular JHW tools.

One responder to the other member's posting was to suggest a military contract. I take it that you might be suggesting a special factory contract with, say an auto manufacturer for use on an assembly line?

Mystery can be fun.

DJ

 

[misterbill]

Fighting the covid boredom by trying to put together a visual progression of Williams Midget ratchets. Aside from a 9/32" version (do they exist?), I think I'm only missing an M-51 with the stylized handle (ca. ~1955).

Bill

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Nice ratchet progression

 

[Da Beast]

Love 40's and 50's Williams. Although I only have 1 set it is the centerpiece of my collection. Got it off a former dealer and it was 100% unused, even had the cushion and original box.

If anyone has NOS Williams let me know.

 

[Kev442]

Holy Chit! Never thought I would see NOS.

 

[David Jackson]

Fighting the covid boredom by trying to put together a visual progression of Williams Midget ratchets. Aside from a 9/32" version (do they exist?), I think I'm only missing an M-51 with the stylized handle (ca. ~1955).

Bill

Neat Ratchet collection! Got any dates on those?

 

[David Jackson]

Love 40's and 50's Williams. Although I only have 1 set it is the centerpiece of my collection. Got it off a former dealer and it was 100% unused, even had the cushion and original box.

If anyone has NOS Williams let me know.

What a centerpiece! Are the tools to the sides of the box part of the original NOS that you got? Any sales brochures etc. etc. to go with the set?

What year would place that set at originally?

DJ

 

[3baygarage]

Nice old set.

Mr Bill, nice lineup. The tri-wing selector model is neat. There are a couple variations of the M52. I can't remember if there is a 9/32 ratchet. That said, I don't have one.

David, I don't know about the insulation. It isn't like some of the heavy insulated stuff out there. As for the socket, I was thinking perhaps some type of manufacturing line. Just a guess.

 

[misterbill]

The 1937 catalog does not show a 9/32" ratchet and the next available catalog is from 1941 and it has the 1/4" NM-51. So, I'm not sure there was a 9/32" drive ratchet.

The NM-51 1/4" would have become an M-51 somewhere around 1955 when Williams dropped the N prefix from their Midget tools. I believe that there are M-51s with the stylized handle like the NM-51.

The top M-52 with the mixed-case Williams name was from near the end during the TRW era - early 1980s?

Bill

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Aside from a 9/32" version (do they exist?),

The 1937 catalog does not show a 9/32" ratchet and the next available catalog is from 1941 and it has the 1/4" NM-51. So, I'm not sure there was a 9/32" drive ratchet.

I have a 1939 Williams Superrench pamphlet A-409. The M-series ("Midget Pattern") 9/32-inch drive tools and sets, presented on pages 2 and 3, do not include a ratchet. The Refrigeration tools and sets, presented on page 25, do include 9/32-inch drive sockets, a 9/32-inch to 1/4-inch adaptor, and a special ratchet with a 3/8-inch square male drive stud on one side and a 1/4-inch square female drive opening on the other side.

 

[WNYflyer]

The 1937 catalog does not show a 9/32" ratchet and the next available catalog is from 1941 and it has the 1/4" NM-51. So, I'm not sure there was a 9/32" drive ratchet.

The NM-51 1/4" would have become an M-51 somewhere around 1955 when Williams dropped the N prefix from their Midget tools. I believe that there are M-51s with the stylized handle like the NM-51.

The top M-52 with the mixed-case Williams name was from near the end during the TRW era - early 1980s?

Bill

Yup, I have a stylized handle 1/4" ratchet that is stamped M-51

 

[3baygarage]

I just ran into a couple M-51 examples here, with no guts, from that weird 1/4 Proto haul a while back. I skipped the pics for now.

Wanted to post these for David to see the diamond W 1/2” rat. Accompanied by a 3/8” Volume (different size but same ratchet basically). I don’t know much about the Volume stuff, or why the “S” 1/2” and “B” 3/8” Williams stuff without numbers.

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Even the volume set numbers are the same.

 

[ganymede]

Interesting that the 3/8" drive Volume doesnt have the set screw to retain the ball and spring like the 3/8" Williams branded version.

 

[3baygarage]

I’m not sure the 3/8 Williams in this style have it either.

Nice sets there. All the box sets on the page causing

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Interesting that the 3/8" drive Volume doesnt have the set screw to retain the ball and spring like the 3/8" Williams branded version.

Only the non reversible (b50 f50) have the set screw. The b51 is reversible and does not use set screw.

 

[3baygarage]

I took it Ganymede was referring to the screw under the head of the B-51’s, not the one on the side.

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Oh you mean this one

 

[3baygarage]

Yes. That hidden little ******.

 

[Oldtuleguy]

Sorry guys had my set screws crossed!

 

[ganymede]

Sorry guys had my set screws crossed!

As long as they arent cross threaded.

 

[ganymede]

I took it Ganymede was referring to the screw under the head of the B-51’s, not the one on the side.

Yessir.