Circuit breaker box mounting on power pole?

[Tr4ever]

Hi,

First I would like to thank you all for what you have posted. This is an incredibly informative forum.

I am not an electrician, but I plan on running power from the meter, mounted on the power pole (pole belongs to me, not the power co.), to the shop 200’ away. I have opted for direct bury.

I would like to install a disconnect at the pole. I realize I will have to also run a neutral after the disconnect.

My thought is that an outside breaker box with feed through lugs, would serve my purpose for a disconnect, and allow for a couple outside circuits in the future.

My question is am I ok to install that breaker box on the other side of the pole from the meter box? I would run out the lines from the side of the meter box to the side breaker box using two “LB” 90 degree elbows. The diameter of the pole is too small to run that horizontally, but I have room to move the breaker box up the pole, and keep it below the 6’7”. Sorry my sketch isn’t great, but maybe it’s better than my description.

Thank you,
Sean

 

[sparky 1971]

Yes you can. I think you meant take a ground, not neutral as a neutral is required in order to make 120 volt. If it were mine, since you are digging anyway, go underground between the meter and the pole. Back to back tv's are a ***** to get the wire in and look like ****. But, to each his own. If you want LB's, then LB's you can have.


EDIT: underground between the meter and the panel on the pole.

 

[mike93lx]

Any reason for not using a meter box with some built in breakers?

 

[jeepxj]

Any reason for not using a meter box with some built in breakers?

my poco provides the meter can. so that could be a reason why he can't.

 

[Norcal]

There may be issues with back to back equipment mounting impeding climbing the pole, check with PoCo rules and regulations before proceeding.

 

[mike93lx]

my poco provides the meter can. so that could be a reason why he can't.

Just provides or requires the use of?

 

[jeepxj]

Just provides or requires the use of?

requires you to use their supplied pan. you go pick it up from the local office. I wanted to do an outdoor main panel with 5 subpanels scattered around the house. they supply meter only cans. so not doing that.

 

[jeepxj]

There may be issues with back to back equipment mounting impeding climbing the pole, check with PoCo rules and regulations before proceeding.

they still climb such a small simple pole? around here they just bucket to nearly everything.

 

[mike93lx]

requires you to use their supplied pan. you go pick it up from the local office. I wanted to do an outdoor main panel with 5 subpanels scattered around the house. they supply meter only cans. so not doing that.

That's fair then. But I wouldn't say that is the norm

 

[jeepxj]

That's fair then. But I wouldn't say that is the norm

oh certainly not. i live in the land of regulation. im shocked they let me plug stuff into my outlets at home without a lineman here.

 

[mike93lx]

oh certainly not. i live in the land of regulation. im shocked they let me plug stuff into my outlets at home without a lineman here.

At least you got a permit and called 811 first though...right?!

 

[Bert_]

Does the meter box have a main? If it does then in my opinion there's no reason for an additional breaker to the new building.

 

[nadogail]

Can the Circuit Breaker Box be mounted on the same side of the pole under the Meter?

Feeding the Circuit Breaker Box from a Meter just above it should be easier and cheaper than using two LB Conduit bodies.

 

[sparky 1971]

Can the Circuit Breaker Box be mounted on the same side of the pole under the Meter?

Feeding the Circuit Breaker Box from a Meter just above it should be easier and cheaper than using two LB Conduit bodies.

The POCO's here have different requirements for mounting heights, but the most standard is between 4' and 6' above grade to the center of the glass. Even at 6', that is going to put the panel pretty low.

 

[Tr4ever]

Wow, thank you all.

Sparky 1971, Yes, sorry I did mean ground not neutral. The meter is on the same pole I would like to hang the breaker box on, so you are saying go down from the meter box, dig out enough room for a loop to the other side of the pole and come back up into the bottom of the box. I would be digging by hand, the rest of the trench is done. I rented a mini excavator to dig the 200+ foot trench. I get that it won’t be very pretty, but since I’m digging by hand do you still recomend the down around the pole and back up? The meter box is existing, and it appeared to me that I could adjust the breaker box up enough. I will take some more measurements tomorrow. If adjusting the breaker box up won’t work I guess it’s down, around, and back up.

Mike931x, The meter with breakers sounded like it would be more work and more expensive. But to be honest I didn’t investigate it very thoroughly. It certainly would be a cleaner installation though.

Jeep just, Our PUD/POCO doesn’t supply the meter box but they have a list of approved boxes you have to choose from.

I’ll call and make sure there are no issues with it impeding climbing the pole. They used a bucket when they connected to the mast at the top of the pole, but that doesn’t mean that there isn’t some rule about it.

Bert, The first disconnect/breaker is at the house main panel.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Does the meter box have a main? If it does then in my opinion there's no reason for an additional breaker to the new building.

he said its just a pan supplied by the poco so thats a negative batman

 

[mike93lx]

You have to run 3 wires from the meter to this panel on the pole then 4 wires from the panel to your building.

What wire are you using for the run to your building?

 

[sparky 1971]

Wow, thank you all.

Sparky 1971, Yes, sorry I did mean ground not neutral. The meter is on the same pole I would like to hang the breaker box on, so you are saying go down from the meter box, dig out enough room for a loop to the other side of the pole and come back up into the bottom of the box. I would be digging by hand, the rest of the trench is done. I rented a mini excavator to dig the 200+ foot trench. I get that it won’t be very pretty, but since I’m digging by hand do you still recomend the down around the pole and back up? The meter box is existing, and it appeared to me that I could adjust the breaker box up enough. I will take some more measurements tomorrow. If adjusting the breaker box up won’t work I guess it’s down, around, and back up.

Even if you have to dig it by hand, I would and have. The back to back LB's are going to look like ****. If you won't be able to see them, don't care, or just have that large of a phobia of shovels then go ahead and use the LB's. You could also look in the list of approved meter sockets, get a meter/main and be done with it.

 

[craigibc]

811 will only check for underground lines if it is near their utilities. If you are digging in a place that is away from their utilities you need to call a private company and pay them to check for underground lines. I tried this when I was putting 100 amp underground last year and the guy that showed up would not check anything that was not near the utilities at the road.

 

[sparky 1971]

he said its just a pan supplied by the poco so thats a negative batman

No he didn't. In typical GJ fashion, someone else posted that. Different poster, different utility. He has to provide a meter socket from an approved list, and it seems to me that he has already bought it.

Jeep just, Our PUD/POCO doesn’t supply the meter box but they have a list of approved boxes you have to choose from.

 

[Tr4ever]

I’ll be running 250 kcmil to the shop. Probably it’s over kill, but I just want to do this once.

Based on Sparky 1971’s response, I’m now leaning toward the “down, around the pole, and back up to the cb box”. I know how much work digging is, but I have no previous experience trying to push 250 kcmil through LB fittings.

811 won’t identify lines on my property. The house is a newer build, and we have pics of the house lines prior to them filling in the ditches. I will go slow and easy with a shovel around the existing conduit.

 

[mike93lx]

I’ll be running 250 kcmil to the shop. Probably it’s over kill, but I just want to do this once.

Based on Sparky 1971’s response, I’m now leaning toward the “down, around the pole, and back up to the cb box”. I know how much work digging is, but I have no previous experience trying to push 250 kcmil through LB fittings.

811 won’t identify lines on my property. The house is a newer build, and we have pics of the house lines prior to them filling in the ditches. I will go slow and easy with a shovel around the existing conduit.

If you are running URD, make sure you transition to a different wire before entering the building. It isn't allowed indoors at all.

And don't fall into the trap of trying t pool get wire in conduit that isn't fully glued up

 

[sparky 1971]

I’ll be running 250 kcmil to the shop. Probably it’s over kill, but I just want to do this once.

Based on Sparky 1971’s response, I’m now leaning toward the “down, around the pole, and back up to the cb box”. I know how much work digging is, but I have no previous experience trying to push 250 kcmil through LB fittings.

811 won’t identify lines on my property. The house is a newer build, and we have pics of the house lines prior to them filling in the ditches. I will go slow and easy with a shovel around the existing conduit.

It's not much of a dig. By the time you dig down 2' under the panel or meter, you're already darn near around the pole and under the other box. Unless it's a really rocky soil it's only going to take 20 minutes tops.

Just use some URD to go between them, throw some 2" schedule 80 on to protect it into the bottom of the cans and be done with it.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

No he didn't. In typical GJ fashion, someone else posted that. Different poster, different utility. He has to provide a meter socket from an approved list, and it seems to me that he has already bought it.

Jeep just, Our PUD/POCO doesn’t supply the meter box but they have a list of approved boxes you have to choose from.

oh whoops youre right

 

[Tr4ever]

The wire is dual rated as URD, and well something else that’s rated to go inside buildings. Lol sorry I don’t have my notes in front of me. The requirement was something I picked up from this forum, a discussion about URD entering a building, I asked the supply house specifically if the URD wire they had was dual rated with that spec.

Well I dug a bigger arc out from the pole and around to the other side. As this crosses the power line to the house is there a special separation I should be aware of? The house power line is in conduit, and right at 24” deep. I figured I would just dig it 10” deeper under the conduit and feed my line under it. I have about an 8” bed of sand in the ditch up to where I was digging today. That would allow for the sand bed and enough room that the two are not in direct contact.

Another couple questions, the supplier only has 250kcmil in a three wire bundle, and a separate single strand, I am assuming that it’s easiest to pull all 4 wires at one time rather than pulling the three wire bundle first and then the single wire. Is that correct? I also have to pull it through conduit under the driveway.

What is the anti chaffing fitting for where the wire exists the conduit underground called? I know I could use a male fitting and a nut (like entering a box), but I believe they make a single fitting for this too.

Ok this may be a stupid question, but two places the line crosses are tractor access to the back of the property. The line will be a little more than 24” deep, with 6-8” of sand below and above it. Would it be worthwhile to put it in conduit at those two places?

 

[sparky 1971]

The wire is dual rated as URD, and well something else that’s rated to go inside buildings. Lol sorry I don’t have my notes in front of me. The requirement was something I picked up from this forum, a discussion about URD entering a building, I asked the supply house specifically if the URD wire they had was dual rated with that spec.

Well I dug a bigger arc out from the pole and around to the other side. As this crosses the power line to the house is there a special separation I should be aware of? The house power line is in conduit, and right at 24” deep. I figured I would just dig it 10” deeper under the conduit and feed my line under it. I have about an 8” bed of sand in the ditch up to where I was digging today. That would allow for the sand bed and enough room that the two are not in direct contact.

Another couple questions, the supplier only has 250kcmil in a three wire bundle, and a separate single strand, I am assuming that it’s easiest to pull all 4 wires at one time rather than pulling the three wire bundle first and then the single wire. Is that correct? I also have to pull it through conduit under the driveway.


What is the anti chaffing fitting for where the wire exists the conduit underground called? I know I could use a male fitting and a nut (like entering a box), but I believe they make a single fitting for this too.

Ok this may be a stupid question, but two places the line crosses are tractor access to the back of the property. The line will be a little more than 24” deep, with 6-8” of sand below and above it. Would it be worthwhile to put it in conduit at those two places?

Don't worry about a separation, the lines cross all the time

Pull all the wires at once

For the fitting on the conduit, I and everyone I know or have worked for just use a male adapter with a plastic bushing on it. I've seen where others used a PVC coupling and left it at that.

It wouldn't hurt to sleeve the wires with a piece of PVC, but it probably isn't necessary unless there is a chance you will gravel it or pour concrete.

 

[mike93lx]

The wire is dual rated as URD, and well something else that’s rated to go inside buildings. Lol sorry I don’t have my notes in front of me. The requirement was something I picked up from this forum, a discussion about URD entering a building, I asked the supply house specifically if the URD wire they had was dual rated with that spec

I'm curious. Mobile home feeder is the only wire that I know of which would be considered dual rated. If it's something else, can you share the details? Having another wire type to recommend is always welcome.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

I'm curious. Mobile home feeder is the only wire that I know of which would be considered dual rated. If it's something else, can you share the details? Having another wire type to recommend is always welcome.

there is URD that has the RHH/RHW rating which is permitted indoors...

 

[mike93lx]

there is URD that has the RHH/RHW rating which is permitted indoors...

Thanks. Is that common now or somewhat rare? Regional?

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Thanks. Is that common now or somewhat rare? Regional?

nope been around for awhile now