Stubby ratcheting screwdrivers comparison
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CGarage
Well-known member
I like the Vessel TD-800 / stubby ratcheting screwdriver.
To me, that is the best there is.
To me, that is the best there is.
Shows how much error can be in these sorts of tests. Willing to bet the regular Snap On bits are made to a much higher quality standard, but a single one does not represent it properly especially if it is faulty.
Same as for the full size ratcheting screwdrivers, it feels biased from PF that he does not include the failure torque in the final result, while he does so in his other tests. E.g. the 1/4" ratchet test included them even though all the ratchets with the largest hex head socket would snap off a bolt before reaching their max torque.
Recently there was some controversity about LTT and how they handle stuff. It's not beyond anyone to do some shady stuff, and considering PF even admitted he received both screwdrivers before they were actually released - there is no doubt there was some behind-the-scenes agreement between LTT and PF to give out a video about the screwdriver right when they launch the product. No matter what they say, there had to be discussions between them, and at that point it is very easy for LTT to hand-pick the tightest screwdriver to send it for testing.
Also again, would be interesting to see the backdrag after the ratchet "breaks in" a bit, maybe spin it with a drill for a little. When assembled they probably squirt in grease and it isn't applied evenly until it sees some use... I know my 1/4" Nepros feels a lot lighter now after a couple months of occasional use, while it was quite stiff out of the box.
Don't want to spread conspiracies but both channels lost a lot of credibility in my eyes in the recent times.
LWB
Well-known member
A non ratcheting stubby has zero back drag for the win.
I'm happy with my Bahco which is the same as the Stahlwille. I have it in two lengths. I've thought about getting more just to compare them but that would just be curiosity.
Everyone rags on the Gearwrench version with the square drive shafts. I just used one to install the receptacles, switches, etc. in a finished basement project and it worked very well for that. I like the idea of changeable shaft length.
Everyone rags on the Gearwrench version with the square drive shafts. I just used one to install the receptacles, switches, etc. in a finished basement project and it worked very well for that. I like the idea of changeable shaft length.
I've never had a ton of use for ratcheting screwdrivers - maybe it's backdrag that has kept me from having them in my hand a lot. (it drives me crazy on ratchets)
I also kinda wonder if the PB Swiss, which is so good in every other way, develops less back drag once it is 'broken in' - my SK LP90 ratchet was pretty backdraggy (to maybe coin a term...) until I put a drill on the anvil and buzzed around at low speed in both directions for a bit. That worked really well.
I also kinda wonder if the PB Swiss, which is so good in every other way, develops less back drag once it is 'broken in' - my SK LP90 ratchet was pretty backdraggy (to maybe coin a term...) until I put a drill on the anvil and buzzed around at low speed in both directions for a bit. That worked really well.
Jeff
Well-known member
bwringer
Well-known member
I thought the Milwaukee did well for the money, and it's easily available at any Home Despot. I'm sure he's just buying everything from Amazon, but local availability counts for something too, I think.
And yeah, I'm surprised he didn't test a Vessel. Seems like Vessel should be included in any screwdriver discussion. Harbor Freight has a "Doyle" stubby ratchet that looks pretty good; seems like that would have been a little more interesting to test than the Amazon no-names.
In any case, I detest handheld bit holder screwdrivers of all sorts, ratcheting or no, stubby or long; they're a tool of uttermost last resort when you don't have access to a real driver or power driver. The wobbling drives me absolutely bonkers, and access to recessed fasteners is always poor. Personal taste, I guess.
As ever, I can't quite understand the value of deliberately breaking tools; you certainly don't learn anything useful. I guess people like carnage.
And yeah, I'm surprised he didn't test a Vessel. Seems like Vessel should be included in any screwdriver discussion. Harbor Freight has a "Doyle" stubby ratchet that looks pretty good; seems like that would have been a little more interesting to test than the Amazon no-names.
In any case, I detest handheld bit holder screwdrivers of all sorts, ratcheting or no, stubby or long; they're a tool of uttermost last resort when you don't have access to a real driver or power driver. The wobbling drives me absolutely bonkers, and access to recessed fasteners is always poor. Personal taste, I guess.
As ever, I can't quite understand the value of deliberately breaking tools; you certainly don't learn anything useful. I guess people like carnage.
a lot of those are not true "stubby" drivers, and it's weird that they are designed that way... 6" long with a proprietary bit and extender that can't be removed are medium sized drivers and IMO don't serve much purpose...
I've had the Wera one for years and the size and ratchet is nice, however it's too easy to accidentally switch directions. Usually when you actually need the stubby you're also dealing with a screw wanting to fall out while your hand is twisted in some awkward position, and that's usually when the switch gets knocked into reverse.
Sometimes it's easier to use a non-ratcheting stubby and get the fastener loose to finish with your fingers. Notice in the test when a lot of these ratcheting stubbies are "locked", they have like 1/2" of play? Super sloppy.
I've had the Wera one for years and the size and ratchet is nice, however it's too easy to accidentally switch directions. Usually when you actually need the stubby you're also dealing with a screw wanting to fall out while your hand is twisted in some awkward position, and that's usually when the switch gets knocked into reverse.
Sometimes it's easier to use a non-ratcheting stubby and get the fastener loose to finish with your fingers. Notice in the test when a lot of these ratcheting stubbies are "locked", they have like 1/2" of play? Super sloppy.
n8n
Well-known member
Have you compared with the Snap-On SSDMR1? That's been my standard for stubbies, but I have to admit that I got the Vessel regular ratcheting screwdriver set and if anything the ratchet feels even better than the SSDMR4. Finer ratchet and less backdrag, although there's a tiny bit of wobble that the Snap-On doesn't have. If I had to choose between the two I think I would have to test them for ultimate ratchet strength before making a decision. Another plus for the Vessel is that IMHO the Phillips (I suspect they are actually JIS) bits are better than even Snap-On for the work that I usually do (most of the time working on old stereo gear which is for the most part made in Japan)
Agree - at the point where he said this test was beyond their intended use, I stopped watching that part.
Bubba Fett
Well-known member
I have the Stanley stubby ratcheting driver. It's nothing special, at all. However, I bought it specifically for airline travel, since it is below the maximum length, and cheap enough that it gets confiscated, no big deal. To be honest, I rarely use it.
I'm not really a fan if stubby screwdrivers in the first place. If clearance it that much of an issue, then a bit ratchet makes more sense.
As far as full size ratcheting drivers, Megapro is my favorite. I have a Kobalt fine tooth driver that I like, but it is clearly not for heavier duty use. The LTT seems to be nice, but to me it's not worth the money, since it is based on a Megapro, but made in China. For that price, I'd just buy a Snap-on, or two Megapro drivers (which is what I did).
That Vessel driver looks interesting, though.
I'm not really a fan if stubby screwdrivers in the first place. If clearance it that much of an issue, then a bit ratchet makes more sense.
As far as full size ratcheting drivers, Megapro is my favorite. I have a Kobalt fine tooth driver that I like, but it is clearly not for heavier duty use. The LTT seems to be nice, but to me it's not worth the money, since it is based on a Megapro, but made in China. For that price, I'd just buy a Snap-on, or two Megapro drivers (which is what I did).
That Vessel driver looks interesting, though.
Hohn
Well-known member
I think I have a single ratcheting screwdriver/bit holder in the house somewhere and it almost never gets used. In my experience, these tools delivery theoretical value and not much actual value.
I have a small Tekton set in a blowmolded case with a not-very-stubby ratching handle that works just fine.
When I need a truly stubby driver, it's very rare and I can handle having it not be ratcheting.
If access is that limited, I'd rather have this:
I have a small Tekton set in a blowmolded case with a not-very-stubby ratching handle that works just fine.
When I need a truly stubby driver, it's very rare and I can handle having it not be ratcheting.
If access is that limited, I'd rather have this:
CGarage
Well-known member
No, not to the SSDMR1. But the standard Snap-On/Williams ratcheting screwdriver is nothing special and I vastly prefer the Vessel to it.
I also sprayed the Vessel ratchet mechanism with Amsoil MP Synthetic spray oil and it made it even smoother. I like the option of the longer shaft length on the Snap-On compared to the vessel, that is about it.
n8n
Well-known member
Good to know. Yes, I like the overall shape of the SO better, but comparing large to large: Pluses for Vessel: I like the feel of the Vessel better, it comes with 16 bits not 5, the Vessel JIS bits are better for most uses than the S-O ACR bits, and the Vessel kit costs about 1/3 of the Snap-On. Pluses for Snap-On: Overall form factor is the best, and it doesn't have the slight wobble between shaft and handle that my Vessel does.
So, I have both, but had I known about the Vessel before I bought the Snap-On many years ago (if it was even available then) I might have just bought the two Vessel screwdrivers and been done. As it is I may buy the Vessel stubby and put the two Snap-Ons in a safe place... I lent the SSDMR4 to my landlady one day while we were fixing stuff around the house and I realized just how stupid it was to be using a $80 (plus shipping!) screwdriver for around the house stuff. Granted, why have good stuff if you're not going to use it, but at Snap-On prices you start to get real protective of your tools.
n8n
Well-known member
I think I have a single ratcheting screwdriver/bit holder in the house somewhere and it almost never gets used. In my experience, these tools delivery theoretical value and not much actual value.
I have a small Tekton set in a blowmolded case with a not-very-stubby ratching handle that works just fine.
When I need a truly stubby driver, it's very rare and I can handle having it not be ratcheting.
If access is that limited, I'd rather have this:
I have the Lang version of these (they come in three different formats, flat and two different angles) and they are super handy.
If the other Vessel products I have are any indication, I bet this thing is great though.
However, I have to disagree with your assessment of usefulness. When I need a screwdriver, unless it's for a screw with the head recessed in a "tunnel" or something, I almost always reach for either my Snap-On SSDMR4 or my recently acquired Vessel TD-6816MG. For bits other than the S-O or Vessel, I have a $8 kit from Harbor Freight that does me fine. They can all be used with the aforementioned Lang drivers as well which is super handy. I don't even own a JIS #1 or #2 conventional screwdriver although that is probably something that I should rectify.
Hohn
Well-known member
I can't disagree with that. I didn't mean to suggest that just because my common tasks don't seem to benefit from them that nobody else's would. I'm sure there are kinds of uses for which these could be a real help.
Heck, I might get the Vessel just to see what I've been missing. After recently acquiring the Vessel impact drivers in JIS my eyes were opened!
CGarage
Well-known member
If you want the best in around the home / office screwdrivers, hard to go wrong with this set for ~ $15. I use it more than anything.
Vessel Famidora TD-800 - high praise from a man with 150+ screwdrivers...
Ever in search of the better mouse-trap, I have accumulated over 150 premium screwdrivers from all over... Wiha Germany? Both the red and blue handles. Witte Germany? Yep. Bahco? Been there, done that. Felo Germany? Yep. Love them. Good old German quality. Hazet Germany? Got a 6 piece set and...
www.garagejournal.com
n8n
Well-known member
I didn't say that to be argumentative, I agree with your point. We probably use tools in a very different way, and ratcheting is often useful to me and the extra diameter of a bit holder is not generally a hindrance. YM of course MV.
You have reminded me of one of my best, and least used tools... my Snap-On PIT120 impact driver. Currently that case has also some impact rated bit holders and Vessel brand JIS impact bits in it to round out its usefulness. The thing is, I've literally been playing hide and seek with it since I bought it 10 years ago, so every time I go to use it, it's missing. It's almost a joke, this little red plastic box is kicking my ****. I last saw it maybe 3 years ago when I bought the aforementioned Vessel bits and put them in the case. It's now apparently in a very safe place. And I've been really, really trying to be better about organization too...
BTL-A4
Well-known member
I didn't think much of ratcheting screwdrivers for the longest time. Then I used one once. I like them because they allow me to turn a screw one-handed without letting go of the handle. Sometimes my other hand is holding something (such as what I'm screwing on/off) or unavailable.
I would recommend getting a quality one, though: sloppy ones ****. I have a stubby Vessel, the cheap HF one and a Lutz I found in the HD parking lot on a rainy day. The Vessel is smooth and nice, the Lutz is a little big, but still works well and the HF one works fine, but does have a little slop in it.
I would recommend getting a quality one, though: sloppy ones ****. I have a stubby Vessel, the cheap HF one and a Lutz I found in the HD parking lot on a rainy day. The Vessel is smooth and nice, the Lutz is a little big, but still works well and the HF one works fine, but does have a little slop in it.
Schurkey
Well-known member
I bought a heap of Armstrong "gearless" reversible "ratcheting" screwdrivers from Cripe, in both stubby and full-size handles. Intended to give 'em away as presents, keeping a few for myself.
Fabulous idea for a screwdriver handle. Magnet secures the 1/4" hex bits.
Problem is, the "gearless" mechanism slips. Some worse than others. Makes them very aggravating to use.
Someday when I'm more motivated, I should see if a different lube in the mechanism would make them work better. If they were trustworthy, they'd be a go-to.
www.cripedistributing.com
There's a full-size handle version of this, but it's not on their web site now. Sold-out, or just waiting for more interest, I guess.
Fabulous idea for a screwdriver handle. Magnet secures the 1/4" hex bits.
Problem is, the "gearless" mechanism slips. Some worse than others. Makes them very aggravating to use.
Someday when I'm more motivated, I should see if a different lube in the mechanism would make them work better. If they were trustworthy, they'd be a go-to.
Armstrong Gearless Ratcheting Screwdriver Handle 2-3/16" Long USA 66-582
Armstrong 66-582 Gearless Ratcheting Screwdriver Handle, 2-3/16" Long 1/4" Female Hex Hole USA Magnetic No neutral gear Gearless (turns smoothly and silently, no teeth to make a clicking sound) Aeronca x 20 55weiser w7b1
www.cripedistributing.com
There's a full-size handle version of this, but it's not on their web site now. Sold-out, or just waiting for more interest, I guess.
neophyte
Well-known member
Did you try oiling the mechanism ?I bought a heap of Armstrong "gearless" reversible "ratcheting" screwdrivers from Cripe, in both stubby and full-size handles. Intended to give 'em away as presents, keeping a few for myself.
Fabulous idea for a screwdriver handle. Magnet secures the 1/4" hex bits.
Problem is, the "gearless" mechanism slips. Some worse than others. Makes them very aggravating to use.
Someday when I'm more motivated, I should see if a different lube in the mechanism would make them work better. If they were trustworthy, they'd be a go-to.
Armstrong Gearless Ratcheting Screwdriver Handle 2-3/16" Long USA 66-582
Armstrong 66-582 Gearless Ratcheting Screwdriver Handle, 2-3/16" Long 1/4" Female Hex Hole USA Magnetic No neutral gear Gearless (turns smoothly and silently, no teeth to make a clicking sound) Aeronca x 20 55weiser w7b1
There's a full-size handle version of this, but it's not on their web site now. Sold-out, or just waiting for more interest, I guess.
n8n
Well-known member
I would think that would be counterproductive if it's slipping, those gearless things rely on friction to work. But now I wanna try one, I have one gearless ratchet but no bit driver.
neophyte
Well-known member
I used sewing machine oil in a gearless Wiha “ratcheting” screwdriver.
The mechanism became smoother,.
It definitely helped.
I haven’t used the screwdriver for high torque applications, but it works well for regular tight screws.
I do get too high a “back drag” on really loose screws, but I’ve always presumed that has more to fo with a lack of extra bearings to make everything as smooth and spinny as possible.
Retroman
Well-known member
I always reach for my PB Swiss ratcheting driver (not stubby) first unless it requires a long skinny driver or a big beefy driver.
dallastide
Active member
The problem with the vessel is it doesn't fit regular bits very well and has no magnet. I have it and use it pretty often but it has its shortcomings.
The Wera is a nice compact driver but I've always been underwhelmed by their ratcheting mechanism.
The Snap On isn't as stubby as some others but you cannot beat the feel in the hand. It is just a joy to use.
I've been meaning to pickup the PB for comparison. I agree with the above that the PB and Snap On both could use shorter shafts to truly fall into the stubby category.
The Wera is a nice compact driver but I've always been underwhelmed by their ratcheting mechanism.
The Snap On isn't as stubby as some others but you cannot beat the feel in the hand. It is just a joy to use.
I've been meaning to pickup the PB for comparison. I agree with the above that the PB and Snap On both could use shorter shafts to truly fall into the stubby category.
Hytekrednek
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2015
- Messages
- 373
I have a few of these that I use often. I like them. No issues so far. For the price, they are great. So smooth. I plan to get a few more while I can for future use.I bought a heap of Armstrong "gearless" reversible "ratcheting" screwdrivers from Cripe, in both stubby and full-size handles. Intended to give 'em away as presents, keeping a few for myself.
Fabulous idea for a screwdriver handle. Magnet secures the 1/4" hex bits.
Problem is, the "gearless" mechanism slips. Some worse than others. Makes them very aggravating to use.
Someday when I'm more motivated, I should see if a different lube in the mechanism would make them work better. If they were trustworthy, they'd be a go-to.
Armstrong Gearless Ratcheting Screwdriver Handle 2-3/16" Long USA 66-582
Armstrong 66-582 Gearless Ratcheting Screwdriver Handle, 2-3/16" Long 1/4" Female Hex Hole USA Magnetic No neutral gear Gearless (turns smoothly and silently, no teeth to make a clicking sound) Aeronca x 20 55weiser w7b1
There's a full-size handle version of this, but it's not on their web site now. Sold-out, or just waiting for more interest, I guess.
cherrybomb
Well-known member
And don't forget, a hex to 1/4 adapter,you can put a socket on it,hose clamps is what I use mine for
Hytekrednek
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2015
- Messages
- 373
I have one of the armstrong 66-580 gearless ratcheting bit driver screwdrivers also, its blue. It has been great. No slipping yet, and very silky smooth.
n8n
Well-known member
So the end of the stubby (TD-6700) is not the same as the full size? (TD-6800) that is disappointing as I am growing to like the latter.
dallastide
Active member
n8n
Well-known member
Nope. I have them both and they are both nice drivers. Their ratcheting mechanisms and lockups are fantastic. But the stubby has a double ended bit with a ball detent instead of the regular bits and magnet that the full size version has.
well crappit, can someone who speaks Japanese get on the phone to the Vessel product development people...?
n8n
Well-known member
I'm pretty sure this is the same set that's sold at HF for $8-9, I don't expect these to stand up to high torque situations but it comes with the very adapter you mention and also just has a whole mess of useful bits. And if something breaks I stop on the way home from work and get another one.
Astro Pneumatic Professional Screwdriver Bit Set, 100pcs. 9448 | Zoro
Order Astro Pneumatic Professional Screwdriver Bit Set, 100pcs., 9448 at Zoro.com. Great prices & free shipping on orders over $50 when you sign in or sign up for an account.
www.zoro.com
I have Snap-On (flat blade and Phillips) Vessel (JIS) and PB Swiss (Pozidriv) bits for the hard jobs but reach for this kit for pretty much everything else.
webscrounger
Well-known member
Have the Vessel but I also like the ball-grip Anex. Pretty nice and compact with no slop.
Bubba Fett
Well-known member
Are the bits in those good quality? I've seen similar sets under every "brand" known to man.I'm pretty sure this is the same set that's sold at HF for $8-9, I don't expect these to stand up to high torque situations but it comes with the very adapter you mention and also just has a whole mess of useful bits. And if something breaks I stop on the way home from work and get another one.
Astro Pneumatic Professional Screwdriver Bit Set, 100pcs. 9448 | Zoro
Order Astro Pneumatic Professional Screwdriver Bit Set, 100pcs., 9448 at Zoro.com. Great prices & free shipping on orders over $50 when you sign in or sign up for an account.
I have Snap-On (flat blade and Phillips) Vessel (JIS) and PB Swiss (Pozidriv) bits for the hard jobs but reach for this kit for pretty much everything else.
n8n
Well-known member
I've never really torture tested them; if I have a challenging screw I'll use one of the better ones that I have (slotted, Philips, JIS, or Pozidriv) however I have used the Torx ones and haven't had any issues (Jeeps have lots of small Torx fasteners for some reason, as does some stereo gear surprisingly)
It's one of those things that I bought on the principle that it would allow me to remove/install screws that I couldn't before, and if I ended up disappointed in the quality then I'd know to upgrade. I haven't upgraded yet so that was $8 well spent.
Jeff
Well-known member
I just picked up another Vessel ratcheting driver. I gotta stay out of these threads!
Built-in stubby.
Built-in stubby.
I've wondered about these a few times. They accept 1/4" bits but the proprietary bits with half of the handle look really nifty.I just picked up another Vessel ratcheting driver. I gotta stay out of these threads!
Built-in stubby.
I guess that these have a lot more contact surface along the "shank" so they don't wobble much? And since you can grip by the bit-handle, it essentially has zero play when you're fine adjusting stuff?
Must resist, I DONT NEED MORE SCREWDRIVERS!