Ultimate Welding Table? (within reason of course)

tarbellb · Dec 30, 2012

Since I cant afford the Acorn tables, or the 3/4" solid slab welding tables ive seen floating around. AND have limited space (read 320sq/ft @ 8'x40'), I need to get clever on my welding table.

My work is custom furniture and architectural pieces, which often requires not only a welding table but a true, flat, square, and large one.

Here is my idea, thought I would share this. One for feedback and two as kind of a open source idea for others to pull off. Ive certainly taken ideas off othesr from this site.

Details:

_ TOP/SIDE
- 3/8" x 12" x 36" + 48" plate

_ FRAME
- 2" x 16g sq tube (bottom + verts)
- 2" x 3" 16g tube (rails)
- 3/8" x 1" flat bar (top/side slider guides)
- 3/8" x 2" flat bar (bot slider guides)

_ EXTENSIONS
- 3/8" x 12" x 48" plate
- 2" x 3" 16g tube (rails)
- 3/8" x 2" flat bar (sliders)

Total weight est - 425-450lbs! but also can break down in 50 pound parts.

The ORANGE represents moving parts.

I see the top plates bolting through the main frame, along with matching side plates for 90 degree clamping. Counter sunk holes of course.

This table is meant to be totally adjustable both in width and in downward clamping faces. Giving the user the option of clamping a piece down instead of up or sideways if needed?

Let me know what you think. Cheers!

Can hold full 4x8 sheets

Slider details

Compacted

Extended (shown with optional 36" extensions)

fourjeepin · Dec 30, 2012

Great drawings and an interesting concept for a welding table.

alan camby · Dec 31, 2012

I would think that the extension feature would tend to slightly fall as the table end is extended. Might want to have some kind of jack bolt on the bottom of the slide to adjust for any downward flex. Or, how about some turnbuckles that attaches at a 45degree angle from the leg to the bottom of the extension.

These are just some 2 min thoughts, so use at your own risk

tarbellb · Dec 31, 2012

Thanks guys. Like all good ideas, this one came to me right before bed. Also, I just read or maybe reread AMCguys post and noticed how similar his (real) table is. Well done.

I figure I can shim the main table plates between the frame and plate for near perfect flatness. As for the wing extensions I think I could get away with clamping the wing extension against the main frame and possibly putting a adj support under them if need be?

tarbellb · Nov 18, 2014

I think I will be building my welding table very soon. Found myself coming back to this idea and wondering if anybody has anymore feedback I should consider before building this?

Questions: Is there a steel grade that is common and available at local metal suppliers that runs more flat or true then standard carbon steel plate/bar? Im not looking to get surface finished or a blanchard grind.

Richard D · Nov 18, 2014

I did something similar, but with out the sliding feature. I used hot rolled flat bar; cold rolled would be more accurately sized and way more expensive.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=225206

I designed mine so I can remove the plates, and bolt them on in such a way to double the width. I also drilled and tapped 3/8-16 holes all over the frame to bolt table extensions, grinder hangers, etc. I really love the table.

sberry · Nov 18, 2014

tarbellb said:
I think I will be building my welding table very soon. Found myself coming back to this idea and wondering if anybody has anymore feedback I should consider before building this?

Questions: Is there a steel grade that is common and available at local metal suppliers that runs more flat or true then standard carbon steel plate/bar? Im not looking to get surface finished or a blanchard grind.

I have done this about half the ways they ever invented and seen most of the rest. About 3x5 plate with a simple frame with about 3 inches of overhang on the sides and 4 on the end. It works with 1/4 but 3/8 would be even better. Have a sawhorse or stand if you really need bigger. Forget all the other "features" to start with. Solid top keeps dirt, spills and splatter from falling to a shelf underneath which is great to toss rig ups and stuff out of the way. Drill a hole or 2 when you get to it vs trying to anticipate every possible scenario, this usually leaves a lot of investment/effort parked.
Some clamp and hammer hangers you need. This overhang allows for use with the most basic clamps vs specialty stuff that can be used one place. Invest in 11R and a couple 3 or 4 big screw clamps as well as a couple cheap pipe clamps.

sberry · Nov 18, 2014

With good design and some simple layout can be using the thing a couple hrs after bringing home materials, use it to finish itself.

sberry · Nov 18, 2014

3x5 with a can on to catch shate. Can toss a sheet on it if I needed to but its really been a while since I needed to handle a full sheet on a bench.

BD1 · Nov 18, 2014

tarbellb said:
I think I will be building my welding table very soon. Found myself coming back to this idea and wondering if anybody has anymore feedback I should consider before building this?

Questions: Is there a steel grade that is common and available at local metal suppliers that runs more flat or true then standard carbon steel plate/bar? Im not looking to get surface finished or a blanchard grind.

As for the sliding part, You could use 2 1/2'' square tube for the table front and rear. Then get 2'' square tube that will fit inside it. This will give you optional receiver attachments that will fit inside for vise, grinder, etc. Then use long 2'' square to make the table extension as long as you want. A couple of adjustable pipe stands could be used for additional support.
As for a flat top, you could bolt it instead of welding to remove any bow.

dr_clyde · Nov 18, 2014

I like the concept. There are some tweaks I would make. These are based on my experience building my table. I am a professional fabricator, and use my table every day. Linky to my build here if interested. http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=226411

Anyway, this is how I would go about building a table like yours.

Make the supporting tubing out of something more along the lines of 2.5" x 3/16" wall. This will be much more rigid than 16 ga wall tube, and the 2.5" has the benefit of receiving tooling on 2" square stock, much like a pickup truck hitch. Not to mention the walls wont distort with the through bolts for the vertical plates.

I like your wing extension idea. However, I would make the main table top horizontal rails out of square tubing, instead of flat bar, then telescope the wings inside that. This adds lateral stability in addition to vertical. Plus, when you're not using the wings, you can stick a vise or something into the tube. Height adjustment is a bolt from the underside to adjust up and down.

I would make your top plates out of 1018 cold rolled. It is dimensionally stable and has all the scale removed. Use bolts to attach, and you can shim it very flat. It is available in widths up to 14 inches in 3/8" thickness. Personally, I'd go thicker, but cost creeps up when doing that. Space them far enough apart to fit a c-clamp between them so the clamp's throat reaches somewhere close to the center of the plate. Like Sberry said, overhang is a must for clamping.

I would lose the casters in favor of leveling feet, unless you really need to roll it a lot. A welding table shouldn't move very easily. My table has receivers near the floor for casters, but I usually just use the forklift.

If you would rather, some skates and a floor jack can move many thousands of pounds easily.

This is just how I would do a slat table on a budget. YMMV. :thumbup:

tarbellb · Nov 19, 2014

Richard D, thanks for the response. I think your table came to mind when I was designing mine.

dr clyde- you my friend inspired me to get moving on my table. Yours is a piece of art practically, a excellent looking table. Youve also put me in search for a handheld belt grinder

I really like the idea of stepping up to 2.5" tubing for the frame, allowing me to use it as a receiver for other items. I agree the 16g is to thin, I use it a lot for furniture pieces but may be undersized for this application.
Cold rolled steel is a great idea for getting something more dimensionally accurate and beefier. If I remember correctly its about a 30% up charge at my local supplier.

Do you think this is a necessary step when doing individual plates like this?

I need to keep the footprint and weight within reason because the table does need to be moved often and will only be in a 320 sq/ft shop! So casters and floor locks have already been purchased.

dr_clyde · Nov 19, 2014

tarbellb said:
Richard D, thanks for the response. I think your table came to mind when I was designing mine.

dr clyde- you my friend inspired me to get moving on my table. Yours is a piece of art practically, a excellent looking table. Youve also put me in search for a handheld belt grinder

I really like the idea of stepping up to 2.5" tubing for the frame, allowing me to use it as a receiver for other items. I agree the 16g is to thin, I use it a lot for furniture pieces but may be undersized for this application.
Cold rolled steel is a great idea for getting something more dimensionally accurate and beefier. If I remember correctly its about a 30% up charge at my local supplier.

Do you think this is a necessary step when doing individual plates like this?

I need to keep the footprint and weight within reason because the table does need to be moved often and will only be in a 320 sq/ft shop! So castes and floor locks have already been purchased.

If nothing else, do the slats out of cold rolled. You won't be happy with a hot rolled plate. My table top is hot rolled, and boy do I wish it didn't have scale on it. It causes grounding issues, flakes off and looks like ****, and generally is not as nice. Totally worth the marginal increase in cost, IMO.

Lu-Max · Nov 19, 2014

You could buy HRS plate, acid bath it or use electrolysis to remove the mill scale and then keep it coated with Boeshield or similar to prevent future corrosion. After electrolysis HRS is about 90% as clean as CRS (IMOHO) and far cheaper. I do this all of the time but with smaller pieces, just get a plastic tub long enough for your plates and it should do the trick if you don't want scale on your table plates.

dr_clyde · Nov 19, 2014

Lu-Max said:
You could buy HRS plate, acid bath it or use electrolysis to remove the mill scale and then keep it coated with Boeshield or similar to prevent future corrosion. After electrolysis HRS is about 90% as clean as CRS (IMOHO) and far cheaper. I do this all of the time but with smaller pieces, just get a plastic tub long enough for your plates and it should do the trick if you don't want scale on your table plates.

Man, that sounds like a lot of work. OP only needs like, 3 lengths of steel. You guys talk like its mild vs stainless or something.

Lu-Max · Nov 19, 2014

Actually electrolysis could not be easier: immerse in a tub with water a+ soda, hook up a battery charger to some re-bar in the tub, then wait. Also, I count 7 top plates in his schematic above.

dr_clyde · Nov 19, 2014

Well, for someone with the space and time to deal with the electrolysis, it will get the scale off. I personally can't justify the time and floor space for the marginal increase in material cost. It won't however, square up the edges and make it more dimensionally consistent. CRS is much more pleasant to machine and fabricate with.

And I did forget about the vertical plate, my bad. Cold rolled steel comes in 10 foot bars. 3 bars cut to length, =6 top plates. So OP is looking at 4 pieces, or 3 plus a drop if he's lucky.

Lu-Max · Nov 19, 2014

Yep nothing like CRS, especially for TIG.

tarbellb · Nov 20, 2014

Thanks for the heads up about the scale. Its not a lot of material, I could almost just take a flap disc and remove the scale manually.

I will be checking with several suppliers tomorrow on pricing. I may be way off on my estimate for cost.

What is your average cost difference in CRS vs HRS steel clyde/ Lu Max?

dr_clyde · Nov 20, 2014

It is more money for CRS, for sure. I just value my shop space and time enough that I won't spend the time to dink around with HRS when what I want is commercially available.

I buy steel in quantities that are more than what most guys want to by at once and as the tonnage goes up, the price drops. I forget that sometimes when I'm on this board, and open my mouth too soon. :lol_hitti

If you have more time than money for this project, then absolutely get the HRS and save some money. I just prefer to bleed a little more up front and have a product i'm happy with in the long term versus cutting some corners during the build. :thumbup:

tarbellb · Nov 20, 2014

dr_clyde said:
It is more money for CRS, for sure. I just value my shop space and time enough that I won't spend the time to dink around with HRS when what I want is commercially available.

I buy steel in quantities that are more than what most guys want to by at once and as the tonnage goes up, the price drops. I forget that sometimes when I'm on this board, and open my mouth too soon.

If you have more time than money for this project, then absolutely get the HRS and save some money. I just prefer to bleed a little more up front and have a product i'm happy with in the long term versus cutting some corners during the build.

I approach most my jobs/projects like that as well. I have learned the age old lesson of you pay for it one way or the other.

Still, it would be interesting to know what your price difference dr clyde. Any chance you can dig up some #s and give me a general % gap between the two?

Lu-Max · Nov 20, 2014

You can probably get some rough numbers yourself online. Try Metal Supermarkets website and just select HRS or CRS and your sizes.

Richard D · Nov 21, 2014

Lu-Max said:
You can probably get some rough numbers yourself online. Try Metal Supermarkets website and just select HRS or CRS and your sizes.

Those places are way overpriced, plus shipping costs. I'd just call a local steel supplier and ask prices, and they will probably deliver for free.

kazlx · Nov 21, 2014

Around here, HRS isn't much cheaper than CRS....it's not worth the hassle. And once you get to 500lbs the price drops to almost half of what it is for less than 500. I try to order all my steel at once for projects and jobs. Plus, like Richard D says...they deliver for free, I think any order over $250, which isn't hard to hit.

dr_clyde · Nov 21, 2014

Without actually having it quoted, I want to say hot rolled is generally about a third of the price of cold rolled.

But, add up a your grinding consumables, time and the resulting mess, and you're money ahead just buying cold rolled. Hot rolled mill scale is murder on abrasives. I wouldn't be surprised if you went through two dozen flap discs to get all that down to bare metal. And I bet it would take the better part of an afternoon. Plus, when you're done, it looks like someone attacked your table with a grinder, and that just looks ******.

Electrolysis would work better for removing scale. This is true. But I still don't have the motivation to set it all up when Alro only needs an email and boom. Steel delivered next day.

ez-duzit · Nov 21, 2014

sberry said:
...About 3x5 plate with a simple frame with about 3 inches of overhang on the sides and 4 on the end. It works with 1/4 but 3/8 would be even better. Have a sawhorse or stand if you really need bigger. Forget all the other "features" to start with. Solid top keeps dirt, spills and splatter from falling to a shelf underneath which is great to toss rig ups and stuff out of the way. Drill a hole or 2 when you get to it vs trying to anticipate every possible scenario, this usually leaves a lot of investment/effort parked...

sberry said:
With good design and some simple layout can be using the thing a couple hrs after bringing home materials, use it to finish itself.

Some excellent advice, here.

Keep it simple.

bobx · Nov 21, 2014

great thread. looking forward to seeing what the OP builds.

tarbellb · Nov 21, 2014

Got a quote from a CRS/ specialty metal supplier here in Denver. My order would be small since I really dont see myself using CRS for anything else at this moment.

3/8" x 8" x 120" qty 2 @ $434+tax! Yes, it would get cheaper with 500+ lbs but not much. About 10%.

My other local place with HRS quoted me $135+tax for the same length.

Looks like I will likely be using HRS for this build. It is my first table and like most things, I like to make a stab at if first then revise down the line after learning what I do and dont like about it.

motofool33 · Nov 21, 2014

have yiou thought about buying one plate and having it plasma cut or water jetted to your specs drilling the holes in that plate *****

ez-duzit · Nov 21, 2014

If you're going to water jet it, you might as well have them do the holes, too, if you really must have them.

tarbellb · Nov 22, 2014

Im not really feeling the holes style. Yes I think it is a good solution, but im heavily invested in F-clamps already and would like to keep using those. No need to invest in hold downs designed for holes.

Thats why im going with the slate table. Leaving about 1.5" in between so I can drop my clamps in. That and the ability to adjust each plate individually allowing me to fine tune the flatness of my top without having to buy a 3/4"+ plate.

sberry · Nov 22, 2014

What is it you are going to do on this table? What type of welding? All this ruins a nice piece of plate,,, hahaha

tarbellb · Nov 23, 2014

I do a lot of high end furniture building and various other jobs. My work generally needs me to be within 1/32" or 1/16" of a inch over 8'. Square, flat, etc....

A giant 1" plate with CAD spec'd H2O jet layout holes would be amazing, just not in the budget this time around. Ive been studying all the different tables out there and think the slate style is the best dollar to function.

Ultimate Welding Table? (within reason of course)

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