A New Low For Craftsman

[Hannibal Selector]

Well the other day I decided I should flesh out my
home wrencher tool collection a bit. At Craftsman.com
I was surprised and delighted to find a set of US MADE
std. depth metric impact sockets in 1/2" dr. for about $50.00.
The set was very clearly depicted in multiple ways as US
MADE, zoom-in photos and all. So I ordered a set, and -
wait for it - yep, they sent me a steaming pile of Chinese
$#*t WITH THE SAME ITEM AND MODEL NUMBER. So
apparently, it's now OK at SMEARS to start playing BAIT
AND SWITCH with their customers. I'm in the process of
supposedly getting a refund, but I thought I should share this.
So if you're a home wrencher on a budget trying to Keep It
American, be very leary of socket set model #15885.
It's bad enough that they make it like pulling teeth just
to discover WTH a given item's COO is, now they're going
to straight-up bait and switch tactics on at least some
items.

 

[purplezr2]

Haha you think they care about us vs chicom?

 

[dede2897234]

Hannibal Selector,

Your situation with receiving a Chinese Craftsman hand tool set when expecting an American made equivalent via Sears.com is nothing new. Please check out this GJ thread about the Craftsman 20 pc stubby wrench set deal experience here: LINK.


Dave

 

[Hannibal Selector]

They can sell as many Chinese rust-magnets as they can
find buyers for, but when they start flat-out LYING about
COO, that's taking it to a whole new level. And no, they
don't care.

 

[Askme42]

They can sell as many Chinese rust-magnets as they can
find buyers for, but when they start flat-out LYING about
COO, that's taking it to a whole new level. And no, they
don't care.

Should of come here first. We could of told you most craftsman switched to China a few years ago. Only old stock is USA.

 

[CJM8515]

Why did you even bother? The tools are **** anyways.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

Oh I know about the offshoring at Smears, been watching
that devo-lution for a lonnng time.
Haven't bought C-M in years, then did just recently grab the
SAE/metric pinless impact socket set in 3/8", and that I'm happy
with. Actual US-made and a great fit for my needs. I bought
the 1/2" impacts just to flesh things out a little (I got by for
years w. deep only), and the page I was looking displayed the
#15885 set so prominently as US made, I just figured maybe
some old stock turned up (hey, it happens)...
What galls me here is the level of dishonesty. If they want to
be coy about COO, that's one thing, but to straight up misrepresent
COO, that is thoroughly messed up, even for Craftsman.

 

[Negen]

Here are some sets I would look into if my wife knew what I was buying.

http://www.zoro.com/proto-impact-socket-set-12-in-dr-10-pc-j74202/i/G7463102/

http://www.zoro.com/proto-impact-socket-set-sae-and-metric-12-pcs-j74242/i/G8520005/

These blackhawk sets are nice but you may want to look further into the COO. I have bought some singles for work from grainger that are usa made but I think I heard once that some blackhawk is made in taiwan.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005YSWZTM/?tag=atomicindus08-20

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005YSX2HG/?tag=atomicindus08-20

I use 3/8" for personal use just because they are much cheaper to get usa made in that size.

I have a set similar to this one that was usa made the years ago I bought 20$ like 7 years ago.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005YSWVQ4/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[paulsomlo]

I'm not so sure that it's intentional misrepresentation - I think they just don't bother changing the pictures on the website.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

Paulsom, I think you're half right - in that if there was a
page up that cost them a buck, they'd have it cleaned
up in a New York heartbeat.

 

[jcfields]

.

 

[Old_Buick]

honestly i thought it was a given that nothing was made in the US anymore and you actually had to luck out finding something in the store that said made in USA!?

 

[Hannibal Selector]

Thanks for the links, Negen. I looked into B'Hawk @ WWG
some time ago, lost patience trying to nail down COO
with it.

I have a long-standing prejudice against Proto
(long story).

I'm thinking either truck brand used/demo/
overstock (scored some nice deals that way recently), or
SK new, maybe here:
http://www.mytoolstore.com/sk/catalog.html
or if I go Chinese, I'll be going for full-on bang for the buck -
right now I can score an insane deal on a Sunex set. If I do,
it will be the first offshore tools in my (ahem) Blue
Point roll cart . (Scored for $200.00 used & in VG+
condition).

 

[AceofSpad3s]

What galls me here is the level of dishonesty. If they want to
be coy about COO, that's one thing, but to straight up misrepresent
COO, that is thoroughly messed up, even for Craftsman.

Their website is absolutely horrific and never updated. I doubt it was malicious, knowing sears it is just sheer incompetence/laziness. Hell, I once saw a sk 1/2 drive socket set that was $30 and was out of stock for literally 10 years on their site recently that was still up. up

honestly i thought it was a given that nothing was made in the US anymore and you actually had to luck out finding something in the store that said made in USA!?

There is still a decent (using this term very loosely) amount of USA stuff there. The hammers are still usa for the most part, made by Vaughn. The screwdrivers and pliers are still usa, Western forge makes em.

 

[paulsomlo]

There is still a decent (using this term very loosely) amount of USA stuff there.

Adjustable wrenches and open stock sockets were still USA, last time I looked.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

"I'm not so sure that it's intentional misrepresentation -
I think they just don't bother changing the pictures on
the website."

"Yeah, I think "bait and switch" is giving Sears too much
credit..."
----------------------------------------------------------------
You guys could well be right. I was pretty steamed when
I started this. It still amounts to a bait & switch to the
buyer though, intentional or otherwise.

It's just one more thing to be aware of for the DIY wrenchers
who try to round out their tool set while staying domestic
or at least workable quality, without breaking the bank.

Strangely enough, I've managed over the years to score 100%
US-made C-M, what I have of it.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

10 years out of stock? DAYUMM!!! I guess
that drives the point home, Ace. I don't expect much
from Smears and I know there's some FUBAR websites
out there, but wow.

Anyway, I lied about my 100% US C-M. I've got a
couple Chicom C-M combo wrenches that I Had To Have
Right Now for duplicates, from a couple years back.
I just noticed the other day that they're already starting to
rust, unlike my US made C-M stuff, some of which is 20 to
30 years old. Funny how that works.

 

[Jeremy77]

I have found that if you have a Sears Hometown store nearby that the chance of finding NOS is much better vs. a full line Sears. I found a 22pc. 1/2in. drive set this past weekend at the one in Foley AL. It was the 60 tooth low profile ratchet with metric sockets and a 3" extension for $29.99. U.S. made. They also had the same set in SAE. I really didn't need another 1/2 ratchet ( already have a Proto 5449, Armstrong 12-972, CM RP and CM round head Industrial) or the sockets but iv'e heard good things about that ratchet and the price was just too good to pass up. It'll be a good set for one of my trucks.

 

[Flivver250]

Try Wright tool. Better than Sears ever was and US made. SK tool is reputable also.

 

[AceofSpad3s]

Adjustable wrenches and open stock sockets were still USA, last time I looked.

Yeah, the adjustables are made by Western forge as well. USA sockets are nos, if your store sells a lot of singles than they are probably chinese now. There are some other odds and ends that are USA that I cannot recall at the moment. I think the plastic socket rails are USA too, I have some that I got with points. The prybars might be still USA but I think they got outsourced.

10 years out of stock? DAYUMM!!! I guess
that drives the point home, Ace. I don't expect much
from Smears and I know there's some FUBAR websites
out there, but wow.

I think it was a third party seller on sears website, but I still think it sums their site up pretty well. Also why in the **** do they let people sell on their website besides them, just plain old dumb.

 

[bcradio]

Try Wright tool. Better than Sears ever was and US made. SK tool is reputable also.

mmmm debatable.

If you are talking the basics like wrenches and sockets then yes, but other stuff like Craftsman pro pry bars, pinless impact swivels, vaughn made hammers, etc then no Craftsman is better there.

 

[hangfirew8]

If you're shopping old stock, be careful what you ask for. The last couple years of US Craftsman production was awful.

I just pulled out a 3/8 Raised Panel socket set I bought 2-3 years ago just because the Chinese stuff was replacing it. The sockets look OK but the ratchet (USA) has a bunch of irregular dings, flashing and poor chrome, and don't get me started about the feel of the ratcheting and the selector. Maybe the ratcheting mechanism will break-in, but that is one ugly, ugly tool.

Like bcradio said, there are a few good refugees in the Craftsman lineup: Nupla made dead blow 1,2,3 lb hammers for example, and you can pay top dollar for the old-style Raised Panel wrenches in oddball sizes in the Craftsman Industrial line. I got the hammers (with lots of free SYW points of course) and passed on the wrenches.

 

[Titanium Steel]

I am not defending Sears at all, but this is to be expected from them these days. I doubt they update their site often and they just don't seem to care about anything but profit. Honesty, ethics and compassion towards others is worthless to them, as this doesn't make them any money.

I remember two or so years ago, their website listed their Craftsman locking pliers as American made and the image showed this as well. Knowing full well that their hasn't been any 100% USA made locking pliers since 2001, I figured I'd call my local Sears and inquire about this. I was told he grabbed these locking pliers off the shelf were still proudly made in USA and this associate gave me his name.

So I go to my local Sears and to no surprise, all of the locking pliers are made in China. So I pick up a pair and see about locating the associate. I found him, chatting with a young female cashier for a good five minutes before he acknowledged my presence. I asked him why he told me these locking pliers were American made when these were made in China and he me that wasn't true and he never lies.

Long story short, I don't trust big box store website descriptions or their most of their employees.

 

[franzdom]

Well the other day I decided I should flesh out my
home wrencher tool collection a bit. At Craftsman.com
I was surprised and delighted to find a set of US MADE
std. depth metric impact sockets in 1/2" dr. for about $50.00.
The set was very clearly depicted in multiple ways as US
MADE, zoom-in photos and all. So I ordered a set, and -
wait for it - yep, they sent me a steaming pile of Chinese
$#*t WITH THE SAME ITEM AND MODEL NUMBER. So
apparently, it's now OK at SMEARS to start playing BAIT
AND SWITCH with their customers. I'm in the process of
supposedly getting a refund, but I thought I should share this.
So if you're a home wrencher on a budget trying to Keep It
American, be very leary of socket set model #15885.
It's bad enough that they make it like pulling teeth just
to discover WTH a given item's COO is, now they're going
to straight-up bait and switch tactics on at least some
items.

This is not new, it has been going on for a VERY long time. I would say it goes back at least to the 80's.

 

[kdmoore]

This was my entertainment for today ... I glanced at the title and thought it said "a new LOVE for craftsman" ... ehehehehe ..... Of course I opened it immediately.

I've noticed a LOT of this going on in today's world of business. Businesses that used to be good, build a reputation ... new leadership comes in, does substandard work and doesn't pay a price for driving the company down. All because it takes a while to rust, for things to brake, etc. So customers keep coming. The substandard way of doing things is cheaper (often) and so the new leadership is actually rewarded .... it will take a generation of "****" to really hit their bottom line...

I grew up with the craftsman replacing all broken tool commercials. I was very proud of my first large craftsman set .... now I'm happy to buy other value options this board is very good about sharing .... starting with HF but my new decision maker is bang/buck.

I'm off my soap box now ...

 

[blackwire]

Try Wright tool. Better than Sears ever was and US made. SK tool is reputable also.

Yes and no. Wright sockets are about 1/3 taller than the USA Craftsman. In tight spaces, the Craftsman is better. The Wright sockets have better chrome and feel solid, but they are bigger.

 

[Richard D]

Harry Epstien lists the COO of everything they sell, they try hard to get lots of USA stuff.

 

[finn]

Yeah, the adjustables are made by Western forge as well. USA sockets are nos, if your store sells a lot of singles than they are probably chinese now. There are some other odds and ends that are USA that I cannot recall at the moment. I think the plastic socket rails are USA too, I have some that I got with points. The prybars might be still USA but I think they got outsourced.



I think it was a third party seller on sears website, but I still think it sums their site up pretty well. Also why in the **** do they let people sell on their website besides them, just plain old dumb.

IfAmazon and WalMart let third parties sell on their websites, why should Sears be held to different standards??

 

[mmack66]

honestly i thought it was a given that nothing was made in the US anymore and you actually had to luck out finding something in the store that said made in USA!?

Nope.

 

[redbarron57]

Well the other day I decided I should flesh out my
home wrencher tool collection a bit. At Craftsman.com
I was surprised and delighted to find a set of US MADE
std. depth metric impact sockets in 1/2" dr. for about $50.00.
The set was very clearly depicted in multiple ways as US
MADE, zoom-in photos and all. So I ordered a set, and -
wait for it - yep, they sent me a steaming pile of Chinese
$#*t WITH THE SAME ITEM AND MODEL NUMBER. So
apparently, it's now OK at SMEARS to start playing BAIT
AND SWITCH with their customers. I'm in the process of
supposedly getting a refund, but I thought I should share this.
So if you're a home wrencher on a budget trying to Keep It
American, be very leary of socket set model #15885.
It's bad enough that they make it like pulling teeth just
to discover WTH a given item's COO is, now they're going
to straight-up bait and switch tactics on at least some
items.

My advise to you is to make sure and read the entire product description and reviews. The first review on the page said," great product but made in china." in this case the information was there. However that is not always the case with online tool retailets. Furthermore i advise you to find a brand you trust. For instance i love and trust SK tools. They have never let mr down and i use them every day. I am willing to pay a little mote for the quality i know.

 

[redbarron57]

Ps. Never ever buy something base on the product photo, i know more people that have been burned like this

 

[mrvm]

Better get used to the new Sears.....its getting a bit tougher to pick up any deals on NOS or clearanced out CM hand tools but some deals remain. Work the SYWR/suprise points to make the purchase real ez on the wallet. Returns are never a problem at my local Sears.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

"Their website is absolutely horrific and never updated."

Yeah, I'm starting to get that. The shipping notice
they sent me was littered with broken links, functional
links to broken PAGES, zero option to email questions...
Oh, and even the tracking number was broken.
Talk about omens...

 

[Hannibal Selector]

"Better get used to the new Sears..."

No I don't.

I'll go back to avoiding them like the plague the way
I did for years. I got their pinless 3/8" USA swivel
impact set, learned a lesson about their web-shite,
and now time to move on.

I did recently get a bunch of NOS, US-made C-M
chrome & one set of impacts, from Ebay sellers that
seem to specialize in tracking that stuff down - and
then reselling it for about what Smears would ask for
it. ANNND what they show is what you
get. What a concept!

Anyway, that's all just for stuff I won't use or abuse
much (I don't wrench for paycheck, just DIY) - for
everything else, I've got mostly Mac, S-K, Snap-On,
and a bit of NOS US-made Williams.

 

[Cato]

Should of come here first. We could of told you most craftsman switched to China a few years ago. Only old stock is USA.

Even old stock Craftsman USA is drying up. I tried to put together a hex socket set from loose stock since the sets are all Chinese. I could only get about 75% of the sockets at Sears; I had to go to OSH to find the rest old loose stock Craftsman USA.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

From hangfirew8:
"Like bcradio said, there are a few good refugees in the
Craftsman lineup: Nupla made dead blow 1,2,3 lb hammers
for example..."

I did try a dead-blow mallet (urethane face, IIRC) at a Sears
store the other day; didn't know the brand, but it was THE
deadest hammer I've EVER tried. I could have gotten more
bounce-back from flinging a ball of wet clay at a stone wall.
I have to say, it was impressive.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

" I tried to put together a hex socket set from loose
stock since the sets are all Chinese. I could only get
about 75% of the sockets at Sears..."

I'm amazed you got that far. You must have the persistence
of a pit-bull. I tried that once, got to maybe the 30%
mark, then gave up in disgust.

 

[Titanium Steel]

Assuming you are serious, if you really want to support American jobs, this is going to take dedication, time and sometimes willing to pay more.

Home Depot, Sears, Ace, Lowes and most big box stores often don't stock much American made tools anymore, as the average joe wants cheap tools. They don't give a darn about COO, they just want to pay Harbor Freight and pawn shop prices. Granted, this is their money, this wasn't always the case.

Some items just aren't made in America anymore, so I completely understand why you'd want USA made versions of those. But as for other items that are still made here, buying new old stock items/vintage tools doesn't support modern American jobs at all. Naturally isn't always cheaper, but is the best way to support Americans.

If you are really looking for quality tools, I'd check out SK, Wright, Proto just to name a few. Sure not everything from Proto is USA made, but some are and others are made in USA of global components. Same non Wright sourced items as well, but those are from different manufacturers.

I'd check out Harry J Epstein, Fastental, Grainger and shockingly even Amazon for suppliers.

 

[Hannibal Selector]

"...I'd check out Harry J Epstein, Fastental, Grainger and shockingly
even Amazon for suppliers."

Yep, Amazon can be great. Scored some NOS, US-made Williams
stuff there, for example. (Hmm, maybe I shoulda kept quiet
about that.)

Haven't done business with Fastenall for tools, but I do know it's
wise to keep a beady eye on their shipping charges, JS.

 

[Cato]

Yeah, this has been known for some time.