*********** a Retail Store

[rocketman]

I'll check out the Menard stories about management/ownership...

If true, I'll never set foot in one again! That is a complete horsesh!t way to treat the management. Fines for shopping carts... give me a freakin break!

 

[jumpyg]

I love Sears--my shop is FULL of Craftsman tools. I go into Sears, get what I want, and then check out. Sure, the experience isn't perfect, but you can get annoyed at any store if you're wound too tight. I go for the tools, not the service.

 

[MisterCMK]

Up here in the mid-West, we're lucky to have this thing called Menard's. Family owned competitor to HD and Lowe's. Exact opposite of everything you're describing, except the last line regarding the staff's product knowledge - a little hit and miss there, but the kids will do their best to help.

Growing chain, they're doing it right, their tool selection is a litte more entry level, but it's not painful to shop there like aSears, HD, or Lowe's.

Menards is horrible towards contractors or vendors. We have done work for a Menards and they use and abuse people. Not as great as you think....

 

[SportFury59]

Where I live Home Depot is just down the street from Menards. I prefer Menards (even if John M is a ....... ) I'm building garage and have gotten all materials there because of price and availability. At least two guys in the lumber dept are former carpenters. They work there now because of economy. When I was in initial stage of garage building they answered a lot of my questions and gave good advice. Menards parking lot is always pretty full compared to HD.

 

[Identaltech]

here is my experience with menards
when roofing my dads house we went to menards.
paid for the shingle first then pulled around to pick them up.
waited for someone who could run the fork lift.
nobody in back could fo after waiting 20 minutes I got on the lift and loaded the trailer myself.
The kids didnt know what to do. they just sat there and watched.
when we did my roof we went to lowes and had a one arm man load the trailer faster than I could pay.
He was probably new and had been retrained.
customer service is dead at a lot of places thats why they are hurting.
who thought selfcheck out was a service to the customer.
give me a 10% discont for doing your work they maybe I would use them.
take care of the customer and they will take care of you.

 

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

who thought selfcheck out was a service to the customer.
give me a 10% discont for doing your work they maybe I would use them.
take care of the customer and they will take care of you.

I agree about self checkout, but usually I would rather go through self check out than a manned (or womanned) cashier checkout.

Why? Because it's usually easier to do so, such is the state of competence of your average cashier.

 

[J.A.F.E.]

I refuse to use self checkout. They want to sell me something that's their job. I'm supposed to fetch the cart from the lot for them, check myself out for them. Why not have me stock the shelves, answer other customers questions and maybe mop the floor too while I'm there.

They purposely understaff the registers so people will use the self service check out - but there's no discount for doing the work but who's responsible if you make a mistake? For me if the check out line is too full I'll just set my purchases down or leave it in the cart and walk out. It may not be nice but IMO if enough people did it they'd get the message.

But for an eye opening example of bad customer service try Fryes. I don't think they are outside California but it is appauling. No one is trained, no one can answer a question correctly if you can get someones attention - although that doesn't seem to stop them if you can, the managers are immune to complaints, the checkout line is horrible, returns worse and the door nazis harass you on the way out.

 

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

I refuse to use self checkout. They want to sell me something that's their job. I'm supposed to fetch the cart from the lot for them, check myself out for them. Why not have me stock the shelves, answer other customers questions and maybe mop the floor too while I'm there.

I totally get that, believe me. But the usual situation is this...only one or two lanes open at the nearby Lowe's...with about 3-4 people in line...I'm not going to wait for that, when I can go right over to the self checkout and be outta there in two minutes. If you're going to patronize these businesses, you gotta make the best of it.

At Walmart last year, I was in one of the Express lines, late at night. No self checkouts at this particular store. I had been waiting in line for awhile, understaffed as usual, and was finally next in line. Then a cashier walks over and tells me she can take me in her line. Instinctively, I follow her, then see there's ALREADY 3 PEOPLE IN HER LINE! I was so f/k/g pissed. I left the f/k/g cart right there with my f/k/g groceries and f/k/g walked out!

 

[J.A.F.E.]

I totally get that, believe me. But the usual situation is this...only one or two lanes open at the nearby Lowe's...with about 3-4 people in line...I'm not going to wait for that, when I can go right over to the self checkout and be outta there in two minutes. If you're going to patronize these businesses, you gotta make the best of it...

I understand that. Truthfully part of me wants to be that be that flexible it would make life easier sometimes. If my wife is with me she just hates when I do that and all the way in the car whever we go next I have to hear about it. I can't say she's wrong either. My locksmith friend always uses the self checkout he just likes it.

For me I guess it's just equal parts stubborness and principle.

 

[Vinko]

- Staff the sales floor with people who know nothing about the products on sale.

This seems to be the norm nowadays. Part of it might be a generational thing, I don't know. Part of it, it seems to me (as an employer who tries to pay a living wage), is that since people aren't paid much, they aren't motivated to do anything. But I'm probably wrong.

 

[south pier garage]

i refuse to bag my own groceries. but, hell, i'm old enough to remember when the nice young man WITH a shirt and tie, would bring them out to the car and put 'em in the trunk.

and, NO tip was expected. he was doing his job.

please don't make me start a "does the 'tip cup' piss you off?" thread!

 

[Vinko]

I love Sears [ . . . .] you can get annoyed at any store if you're wound too tight. I go for the tools, not the service.

Agreed.

I went to Sears today to by a hedge trimmer. The guy said all these garden equipment was newer and better. I thought to myself, newer yes. Better no.

 

[Vinko]

sears is Kmart like it or not that is what it is now.

HD got rid of the bad top management that was driving them under to Chrysler, now HD is on the rise again.

Lowes is headed to the bargain bin segment of big box stores .

Very few restaurant and big box stores employ auditors for CC and customer/ retail service this is what some are headed for a major downfall.

Maybe you're right, but it seems to me that all we have left in this country is "customer service." What we need is people who actually know what the f*ck they're doing. No one knows sh*t anymore. If they do, you're paying a hell of a lot for it.

 

[Vinko]

But for an eye opening example of bad customer service try Fryes. I don't think they are outside California but it is appauling. No one is trained, no one can answer a question correctly if you can get someones attention - although that doesn't seem to stop them if you can, the managers are immune to complaints, the checkout line is horrible, returns worse and the door nazis harass you on the way out.

Again, no one knows anything. I know it all falls under the larger umbrella of "customer service," but it's a knowledge thing. No one wants to learn anything about their jobs either. They just want to remain stupid. Dumb kids everywhere.

Door people: I love the way they check your receipt and inform you that it's because they want to make sure you're not being charged a price higher than what the item is listed at. Thanks. Glad you're looking out for me.

 

[norry]

about a month ago I start to get calls from a debt collector wanting almost $700 that I 'owe' to sears.
...
they tell me that I owe this untill I pay them and we will continue to hit your credit untill you pay us.
you cant do that!
we can and we will!

They may do it, but they legally can't - so know your rights! Here are the rules, which I learnt when a crook attempted to use a collection agency to steal $1200 from me.

1. You are entitled to proof that you owe the debt. No proof = no debt.
2. You are entitled to be left alone. One written request by you = no harassment. Continued harassment after that is illegal.
3. You are entitled to be left alone, part 2. No calls to the employer, no calls at strange hours of the day, no harassment of relatives, no threats to sue unless they intend to do so, etc.
4. The collection agencies report to the credit bureaus. The credit bureaus have a strained, at best, relationship with the Federal Trade Commission who basically have the power of life and death over them. This was the breakthrough for me.

So my experience went like this:

- Crook submits bogus debt to low-rent collection agency
- Low-rent collection agency has a conversation with me ending in "It's YOUR credit"
- I pull my free credit report later
- Crook's collection agency shows up on the credit report with an unpaid $1200 "debt" that "customer refuses to pay" and a note that "consumer disputes this"
- I call Equifax who refuse to help
- I call the FTC and file a formal complaint
- Officer Friendly from the FTC has a little chat with Equifax
- I get a letter from Equifax notifying me that the false negative has been removed and we're sorry for the inconvenience, SIR!
- Crook never did get the money he tried to steal
- My credit turned out fine

 

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

This seems to be the norm nowadays. Part of it might be a generational thing, I don't know. Part of it, it seems to me (as an employer who tries to pay a living wage), is that since people aren't paid much, they aren't motivated to do anything. But I'm probably wrong.

I don't think that's really the case. If the average, no-nothing, do-nothing employee at your local big box retailer was all the sudden making an extra $5 an hour, would that make them a better, more motivated employee? I doubt it.

Even people that are only being paid minimum wage working fast food, they're still being paid to do a job. They may not like that job, that job may ****, but they're still being paid to do that job. I try to give people in **** jobs a little slack when it comes to service, but I still expect a minimum level of service. I don't expect to be standing somewhere, waiting to be helped while someone is yakking it up with his buddies until he decides to do his job.

 

[Joelfke]

This seems to be the norm nowadays. Part of it might be a generational thing, I don't know. Part of it, it seems to me (as an employer who tries to pay a living wage), is that since people aren't paid much, they aren't motivated to do anything. But I'm probably wrong.

i hear that. If i was paid 12.00 an hour instead of 7.50 an hour at retail stores maybe id give enough of a **** to go search for that item in the back or find that different color item or umm DO my job...

 

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

i hear that. If i was paid 12.00 an hour instead of 7.50 an hour at retail stores maybe id give enough of a **** to go search for that item in the back or find that different color item or umm DO my job...

I sure as hell wouldn't hire anyone with an attitude like that.

You either take pride in your work, or you're a leech.

 

[Stuey]

I have seen a manager taken away in cuffs because a costumer spilled a bottle of Armorall.
I have seen stores closed because they were too close to a building that had asbestos. Not the dangerous fiber, the sheet rock. Once the idiot’s think they know something, it is impossible to educate them.
I have seen lawsuits lost for millions of dollars because over zealous OSHA inspectors made simple mistakes. I mean ***** simple.
Legal fees on one where the (OSHA )guy contaminated some milk cost 16 million before the judge tossed it out.
The idiot contaminated it himself, wasn’t bright enough, or probably, didn’t care enough, to learn to do the test. Shut down a distribution center for a year. Once the government gets in action it takes congressional intervention to stop it.
Been there.
This is California.
Regulations?
You have no idea unless you run a business here. Or why do you think places like California have record unemployment?
Read up a little.

Yikes! Thatis pretty terrible. Still, all those issues were the result of individuals, not the organizations themselves. No organization or company are immune from idiot employees.


As for self-checkout, I usually have no problems with it. Well, that's not true. I get frustrated there are customers causing delays due to infamiliarity or confusion as to how the register works.

I have seen three types of employees. The first does as least amount of work as possible and drags their feet. The second type does what's required of them, and gets by doing an adequate job. The thired type goes beyond what is required of them and goes the extra mile always with a smile on their face. Blaming this on minimum wage is BS b/c this type of three-tier classification applies to most people in any industry.

 

[theamcguy]

All of the problems above can be solved via Mail/Toll Free/Internet Order. No hassles, search for the lowest price, delivered to the door. Sure you pay shipping, but how much is your time and gas worth? Plus the majority of the purchases are tax free. I plan ahead and do all my big ticket purchases via the net. Sure I may go to Lowes, HD for a real emergency (expendible supplies) but other than that the net for me. Sears only go there for a real Craftsman Club deal. Last time there got the Cross Force Sets for 50% off when it was all done. Yeah, I'll stand in line that.

 

[sammerdog]

...waited for someone who could run the fork lift.
nobody in back could fo after waiting 20 minutes I got on the lift and loaded the trailer myself.....

Love it! Done that also to get down better looking bunks of lumber from above. The stock kids will come running around the corner suddenly, but heck once I'm under a load, I ain't stopping then.

Three years ago, I was grabbing a bunk of 2x somethings with their hi-lo, another customer asked if I could help him get down some patio blocks - sure thing! Got my wood down and then drove out and helped the guy. He didn't have a clue, but I think his buddy picked up on the fact that I wasn't an employee and started laughing. Stinkin lumber yard kids followed me out like ducklings behind their momma duck!

 

[kythri]

My Dad worked for Sears for over 45 years. Once Kmart bought them out (after Sears bought Kmart) things went down the tubes. He was lucky to retire when he did (He actually took an early out). Even He said that things went really bad with the change of ownership. They were even planning on selling the Sears tower (to Mitsubishi I believe)....

Sears sold the Sears Tower in 1994 or 1995, about 10 years before they merged with (or were acquired by) K-Mart. They maintained naming rights until 2003, but the name never changed. Stay tuned to the media, it's changing in June.

 

[south pier garage]

....either take pride in your work, or you're a leech.

learned that a LONG time ago!!!!

retail tales for sunday:

called Boaters World (they are going out of business and deserve it) and asked if they had a 36" x 60" American flag - "we're busy; you have to come in and look". so i went to West Marine and bought it.

went to Starbucks. got a mocha frappaccino & lemon cake. one bite, lemon cake was stale. walked back in got banana cake. one bite, banana cake was stale. walked back in, got refund. different girl at the register offered me $$$ for 2 pieces of cake and a coupon for the next time i came in. gave her half the money back and the coupon - "i don't think i'll come back again". by the time i got into the car, the frapaccino was melted . . . .

went to the supermarket and spent $169.00. got home and put everything away and realized my sunscreen was not in the bags. called the customer service desk and the customer service person said i need a receit (which i never take because it is too much paperwork with which to deal). so i asked to speak with the manager - "stop ant the service desk next time you come in and tell them 'Jim' okayed the replacement".

i'm going to sit out in the yard now and have a beer.

 

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

I have seen three types of employees. The first does as least amount of work as possible and drags their feet. The second type does what's required of them, and gets by doing an adequate job. The thired type goes beyond what is required of them and goes the extra mile always with a smile on their face. Blaming this on minimum wage is BS b/c this type of three-tier classification applies to most people in any industry.

Agreed.

All of the problems above can be solved via Mail/Toll Free/Internet Order. No hassles, search for the lowest price, delivered to the door. Sure you pay shipping, but how much is your time and gas worth? Plus the majority of the purchases are tax free. I plan ahead and do all my big ticket purchases via the net. Sure I may go to Lowes, HD for a real emergency (expendible supplies) but other than that the net for me. Sears only go there for a real Craftsman Club deal. Last time there got the Cross Force Sets for 50% off when it was all done. Yeah, I'll stand in line that.

I don't buy big ticket purchases that often. Usually I'm running up to HD or Lowes for lumber, shingles, nails, whatever. This afternoon I'll be stopping by to pick up some sanding discs. Even if I'm buying a lawnmower or something like that, I'm not going to have it shipped when I can be at the store in 20 minutes, looking at it in person, and picking it up and have it home in about an hour.

What happens when that big ticket purchase you order online arrives and there's something wrong with it? There's a crack in it, something is chipped, it doesn't work right. Talk about a hassle. You could easily spend ten times as much time on the phone talking to people, trying to get stuff resolved than if you had just went down to the store in the first place.

 

[kwhitelaw]

learned that a LONG time ago!!!!

retail tales for sunday:

called Boaters World (they are going out of business and deserve it) and asked if they had a 36" x 60" American flag - "we're busy; you have to come in and look". so i went to West Marine and bought it.

went to Starbucks. got a mocha frappaccino & lemon cake. one bite, lemon cake was stale. walked back in got banana cake. one bite, banana cake was stale. walked back in, got refund. different girl at the register offered me $$$ for 2 pieces of cake and a coupon for the next time i came in. gave her half the money back and the coupon - "i don't think i'll come back again". by the time i got into the car, the frapaccino was melted . . . .

went to the supermarket and spent $169.00. got home and put everything away and realized my sunscreen was not in the bags. called the customer service desk and the customer service person said i need a receit (which i never take because it is too much paperwork with which to deal). so i asked to speak with the manager - "stop ant the service desk next time you come in and tell them 'Jim' okayed the replacement".

as for starbucks...**** happens. it sounds like the one girl tried to satisfy you with an incentive at more cake and a coupon and you turned her down. I BET they would have replaced your overpriced coffee also.



i'm going to sit out in the yard now and have a beer.

if Boaters world has already begun the transition to shutting down, I can totally understand why they didnt have time to do a stock check. have you ever stopped in at a store closing and asked them to call another store to see if anythings in stock? good luck.. their main goal is taking care of the customers that are there.., not the customer on the phone who might come in to get something (not saying you personally).

 

[flamewerks]

I have had the same experiences a couple times at sears. I see something I need and I take it but I can't find a cashier anywhere, so after 3 minutes of looking for one I change my mind to keep looking elsewhere for the product and put it back.

 

[krooser]

I haven't been in a Menard's in years. Most of the stock is Chinese... the lumber, until HD and Lowe's moved in, was terrible quality. I used to deliver to their headquarters in Eau Claire.... slow to get the freight off my truck, poorly managed and inefficient.

I vote with my wallet and Menard's doesn't make the cut.

 

[south pier garage]

if Boaters world has already begun the transition to shutting down, I can totally understand why they didnt have time to do a stock check. have you ever stopped in at a store closing and asked them to call another store to see if anythings in stock? good luck.. their main goal is taking care of the customers that are there.., not the customer on the phone who might come in to get something (not saying you personally).

i don't disagree. but historically their service wasn't that good and i can understand why they're going "belly up".

i worked retail after school & saturdays when i was in high school, but there was always someone with more experience i could ask when i had questions. now it seems "management" has no problem turning over the keys to a 17 year old with no clue regarding the product of which he is 'in charge'.

i thank the good spirits whatever form they may take for inventing the internet. so much less aggravation - even when things don't go smoothly- than 1 on 1 retail sales. good riddence i say.....

 

[stroked93]

Self checkout, i once went to the local 24hour grocery store for childrens tylenol ant 3 am. walked in.... nobody around, went to pharmacy section still nobody got the tylenol, went to checkout and paid and left without once seeing anybody.

 

[Lookin4'67Galaxieconv]

Self checkout, i once went to the local 24hour grocery store for childrens tylenol ant 3 am. walked in.... nobody around, went to pharmacy section still nobody got the tylenol, went to checkout and paid and left without once seeing anybody.

Sounds like the plot to a Twilight Zone episode!

 

[Vinko]

You either take pride in your work, or you're a leech.

I hear ya. I've certainly think I've given my all when I've worked for someone else. By the same token, you either pay a guy a decent wage, or your a leech.

 

[Shocker]

learned that a LONG time ago!!!!

went to Starbucks. got a mocha frappaccino & lemon cake. one bite, lemon cake was stale. walked back in got banana cake. one bite, banana cake was stale. walked back in, got refund. different girl at the register offered me $$$ for 2 pieces of cake and a coupon for the next time i came in. gave her half the money back and the coupon - "i don't think i'll come back again". by the time i got into the car, the frapaccino was melted . . . .
.

So, you thought that you got bad customer service at SB? The product was not good, you were offered a full refund and a coupon to help make up for it. Seemed like they did a good job to me.

 

[gatewaysysop]

So, you thought that you got bad customer service at SB? The product was not good, you were offered a full refund and a coupon to help make up for it. Seemed like they did a good job to me.

I've actually seen similar things happen at restaurants where I've called to complain about the lousy service to a manager or owner. It takes a LOT to get me that peeved, usually I just blow it off, so these cases are few and far between, but it seems to happen more and more these days.

I think the point is not the refund or the coupon, but the underlying service. Yeah it's nice that you offer feebies to entice the customer to come back another time, but the fact that you screwed them twice (three times, if you count the drink) because of your lousy product is the part being missed here. Frankly, if I were the in the same situation, I wouldn't go back either.

I don't count it as good customer service when you offer me bad food twice in a row and then your solution to the problem is throwing money or coupons my way so I can come back another time to what will likely be the same crappy product.

Real customer service would have been to never let this happen in the first place. A sincere apology and chucking out all the bad food in front of the customer wouldn't have been a bad idea either. The fact that they didn't do anything to fix the problem, just something to pacify the customer, is what would have annoyed me in that situation.

As a case in point, almost all of the establishments where I've had this kind of 'we'll throw free sh_t at you if you come back!' attitude went out of business REAL quick. Giving away free **** instead of cleaning up your act is a cardinal mistake and is not, in any way shape or form, customer service.

Just my $.02

 

[south pier garage]

my point 'xactly. how in the world does a coffee shop stay in business selling stale pastry? "oh; pick me!" maybe some people are resigned to accept ****? the robots behind the counter don't care; it's minimum wage job and they're jockeying to wait on 'the cute boy' in line and their other friends. the customers are so thrilled to be a part of the Starstruck experience and go about their busy day doing important things and are so jaded that spending five bucks for a bad treat has no impact either way.

maybe that's why i'm a Chock Full of Nuts guy?

 

[DustyandLefty]

I've been in retail for awhile now. I once read that "employees are overhead, customers are profit." I try and remember that...stocking shelves, sweeping up, etc is important, but the profit only occurs when somebody actually buys something.

D&L

 

[south pier garage]

i think it is false economy to drop more experienced sales associates (the implication here is that they know product and how to handle people) in favor of keeping newer, less experienced but lower paid, employees.

"a new broom sweeps clean, but an old broom knows the corners...."

 

[RbrtAWhyt]

I
Menards, with more than 200 stores in 11 states, has $6.6 billion in annual sales. John Menard, who launched the business in Eau Claire in 1962, has an estimated net worth of $5.2 billion, making him the richest person in Wisconsin. Yet he apparently gives little to foundations or charitable organizations. A letter writer to Milwaukee Magazine told of how the store refused to even donate lumber to an employee Eagle Scout's project, to build bird houses for a local nature preserve.

Where is it written that a man should take his hard-earned money and donate it to charity? I don't blame the guy a bit.

 

[RbrtAWhyt]

I sure as hell wouldn't hire anyone with an attitude like that.

You either take pride in your work, or you're a leech.

Very well said.

 

[gatewaysysop]

I've been in retail for awhile now. I once read that "employees are overhead, customers are profit." I try and remember that...stocking shelves, sweeping up, etc is important, but the profit only occurs when somebody actually buys something.

D&L

One must remember the other side, that people (at least IMHO) don't tend to shop in dirty, unkept, poorly stocked establishments.

It's kept me out of the local ACE for some time now. FWIW, the store is currently "right sizing" and giving up half its floorspace. They claim they're not going out of business, but judging by how empty it was the few times I've been in there, I think they're just in denial. Should give you some idea of how well they've been profiting from being poorly stocked the last four years.

 

[south pier garage]

employees can make or break a company. bad employees can drive business away, and good ones can make is prosper.