AC Dilemma

[CJM8515]

I was away for work for a week, came home and was greeted by the most awful smell. I thought at first I forgot to throw the trash out before I left, turns out it was the smell of a moldy living room rug. While I was away the AC handler in my attic decided to clog up in the condensation drain line. the pan over flowed because the drain line was not properly set up (how does something drain if you dont have it sloping downwards to you know drain out???) and now I have a 6ft W x 10ft L area I tore insulation and drywall out of my living room ceiling

Anyways, I called my HVAC guys as Im not well versed with HVAC stuff and they came and got line cleaned out. But now the issue is the following items (keep in mind my unit is mounted sideways for some stupid reason):

-Residual water that backed up in the unit and the insulation inside the unit is saturated to say the least. im not quite sure what to do other than mop it up. its NASTY and unless I take apart the unit and or cut the stuff out I cant remove it. Do they sell this insulation somewhere, maybe a similar product I could get? The HVAC guys are great, but they will only do so much I feel and replacing the insulation is a bit more than id like to pay them to do when its likely simple

-The drain pan frankly is junk. Im not sure why the ***** whom installed it, it it the way they did. The pan has a perfectly good hole in the side, but they put the hole in the center and hung the pan off the unit - again the handlers mounted sideways. I was thinking about getting a new pan, but then again the a/c shouldnt be leaking

I have the HVAC guys coming tomorrow to mount a shut off valve on there in case of a clog, but the insulation in the air handler i doubt is ever gonna dry now or will take forever. I was thinking to leave the unit off during the day as the attic gets very hot and open the side and maybe let it air dry. I cant put a fan there with no one home to monitor it just in case as Im at work all day

Thoughts?

 

[DGersic]

What kind of insulation is in your unit?

I'd want to remove it, by any means necessary. Either dry it out, or replace it. If you dry it, hit it with dilute bleach to kill any mold.

 

[CJM8515]

its some kinda 1/4 thick foil backed insulation.

i was up there this morning drying it out, 3 rolls of paper towels later.. its mostly dry. I can see why it overflowed, theres a drip pan inside the unit and it likely overflowed b/c the drain was clogged.

After looking it over, i cant easily remove it. Seems the insulation was attached to the panels before they installed everything in there and there is a 12x12 drip tray under the coils that i cant easily or possibly remove at all without taking it apart. I could cut out approx 1/2 of it maybe and replace it, but that might not be worth it.

I might be able to pull bottom of the unit fully off by itself, Ill have to see. otherwise I think Im gonna have to dry it out and spray with diluted bleach like you suggested @DGersic

 

[karoc]

As mention it will dry out by running fan/cooling

 

[American Locomotive]

There is no need to put a fan on it. Your unit has a built-in fan. Just set your thermostat to "Fan Only" or whatever, and the fan will run. It will dry out.

 

[whateg01]

The HVAC guys will do whatever you want if you are willing to pay for it. I'm this case they will probably also tell you to just let it dry on its own. You said that you could replace the pan but it shouldn't be leaking. It's not leaking. It's condensation from the a coil that has to go somewhere. You want it to "leak" that stuff. I've found that the condensate line doesn't always get installed with a proper slope. Mine just hangs level-ish from the bottom of the floor joists. It's not generally a problem but I do blow it out at the end of the year to keep whatever from clogging.

 

[fitter30]

Need a safety switch in the overflow pan to shut down the unit.

https://www.supplyhouse.com/RCT-Technologies-AG-3175E-Plenum-Rated-Primary-Pan-Sensor-w-Time-Delay?utm_source=google_ad&utm_medium=Shopping_tm&utm_campaign=Shopping_TM_New_users&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjwnqK1BhBvEiwAi7o0X-XG9gE9cWliHuyPUOiecaaTfc9gxURyv2ArCtBkTet3EA3PwCUg1hoCBGgQAvD_BwE

 

[75gmck25]

All A/C units in the attic will generate moisture, and most new installations will have a drip pan with two drains.

- The primary drain usually runs to somewhere that is not very visible, maybe even to one of the vent stacks for the plumbing (depends on local code). If all works well it will drain there and you never see the condensate.
- The secondary drain is usually installed just a little higher in the side of the pan, and it runs out to the soffit, or somewhere else that the dripping water would be visible. If you see water coming out there (mine used to drain onto the driveway on the front of the house), you know the primary drain is plugged, so you need to clean it out.
- There are also small, inexpensive water alarms that install on the side of the pan. They are wired inline with the thermostat wiring that calls for A/C, so if the alarm is tripped by standing water, the A/C will not come on. My alarm also has a buzzer on it, but it's really not loud enough to get your attention unless you are standing in the hall right below the A/C unit.

 

[OccupantRJ]

AC drains are notorious for accumulating a slime buildup in them and clogging. That is one reason I prefer a package unit on my home. I can reach down, pull the trap off and sling it clear, then stick it back on and keep walking. My drain trap is made from pvc fittings not glued to the male adapter at the unit for easy twist off removal.

 

[ybnormal]

when we replaced the attic a/c, I said "how come the pan is no longer hooked up to the drain?" "oh no sir, we don't do that anymore. we have these trip floats that shut the unit off if it gets full, so you know it's overflowing" .... sure enough, I have to go up there about once a summer, drain 6 gals out of the pan using a siphon tube, then carefully carry that water down the ladder and pour outside. PITA. I literally told them to hook it back up and they refused. the drain line from the condenser drops down to the bathroom sink below and ties into the sink drain. like @OccupantRJ said, slime build up causes a backup. and it's a few feet down the line from the P-trap so can't be reached. bleach or Draino is the only way. I did say PITA, right?

 

[OccupantRJ]

when we replaced the attic a/c, I said "how come the pan is no longer hooked up to the drain?" "oh no sir, we don't do that anymore. we have these trip floats that shut the unit off if it gets full, so you know it's overflowing" .... sure enough, I have to go up there about once a summer, drain 6 gals out of the pan using a siphon tube, then carefully carry that water down the ladder and pour outside. PITA. I literally told them to hook it back up and they refused. the drain line from the condenser drops down to the bathroom sink below and ties into the sink drain. like @OccupantRJ said, slime build up causes a backup. and it's a few feet down the line from the P-trap so can't be reached. bleach or Draino is the only way. I did say PITA, right?

Is the unit in a position to get a wet vac with a long hose to the drain pan to empty it, then roll it outside?

 

[danski0224]

drain 6 gals out of the pan using a siphon tube,

Install a "wet switch" instead of the float switch, and the unit will shut down as soon as it gets even a hint of water.

Of course, make sure that the pan is pitched properly and put the switch in the low spot.

 

[Dig Doug]

Add a 2nd drain line as an over flow JIC

I have 2 completely separate lines on my pan

 

[CJM8515]

update

HVAC guys came, installed wet switch and adjusted the pitch. They also charged the outside unit as it was a bit low. They surmise its possible during this very bad heatwave we had the past week that maybe the coils froze due to low charge but couldnt say for sure.

Now with the switch-if the pan inside the unit gets water high enough to trip the switch she is shutting off. I managed to drain the pan out again after spending all morning mopping up the mess in there that was from this whole incident (it was still leaking out of the unit). till they repaired it i had ran it sparingly to try to make sure i wasnt coming home to another mess. I then mopped it out again as once they installed that switch more water escaped obviously.

im really just paranoid now and rightfully so. im no hvac guy but the abomination of a drain pan and lines, the original installer should be taken out back and shot. im going to maybe see about the pan and re-do it if I feel like it. I was searching online and a pan the size I need is about 100 bucks or i can go the plumbing supply Im sure.

overall, i shoulda known better as I was up there like a week earlier for something and the pan was a bit wet-but not being well versed in this sorta thing I figured it would drain and was fine.

 

[CJM8515]

the saga continues

ac was working great, no leaks out of the unit. but it was a bit mild last day or so. Go up there when i got home at 5 today, the entire bottom of the unit is wet inside.. freaking pan is cracked inside the unit itself. lord knows how old it is or when it was installed as the stickers are all faded, yellow and nasty.

hvac guys know im pretty handy, they can come tomorrow but without a pan best they could offer was to seal it with silicone. i told them i would seal it and we shall see. got me some rtv right stuff and laid it thick over the crack. hoping they can find me a new pan in the meantime while i sweat waiting for that stuff to be sure its 100% dry. if they cant find a pan, it might be time to just call it a day and buy a new air handler. but that means moving ducts, getting it up in the attic, etc. i dont wanna know what its gonna cost if i gotta do that

 

[Wrench97]

If you are going away for a week shut off the A/C when leaving.

My prodigal son recently went to Denver for a week on business. forgot to take the trash out before he left and to empty the fridge of old lunch meat, milk, left overs ......

 

[DGersic]

the saga continues

ac was working great, no leaks out of the unit. but it was a bit mild last day or so. Go up there when i got home at 5 today, the entire bottom of the unit is wet inside.. freaking pan is cracked inside the unit itself. lord knows how old it is or when it was installed as the stickers are all faded, yellow and nasty.

hvac guys know im pretty handy, they can come tomorrow but without a pan best they could offer was to seal it with silicone. i told them i would seal it and we shall see. got me some rtv right stuff and laid it thick over the crack. hoping they can find me a new pan in the meantime while i sweat waiting for that stuff to be sure its 100% dry. if they cant find a pan, it might be time to just call it a day and buy a new air handler. but that means moving ducts, getting it up in the attic, etc. i dont wanna know what its gonna cost if i gotta do that

Without seeing what you’re working on, if the pan can be replaced, take it out, get some sheet metal, and bend up a new one.

 

[CJM8515]

i put the gasket maker on there and let dry overnight. its on now. gonna check in a few hours to see where we are

the HVAC guys are trying to source the part if possible, but the label is so old and nasty we cant really see the model number. best case they find a pan, which according to them means they have to remove the coil to install it-it just doesnt sit in there. if it did just slide in Id have fixed it better or figured out something else. worst case we cant get a pan, it leaks and i gotta replace the air handler, which id rather not have to do but such as the way it may go

 

[whateg01]

i put the gasket maker on there and let dry overnight. its on now. gonna check in a few hours to see where we are

the HVAC guys are trying to source the part if possible, but the label is so old and nasty we cant really see the model number. best case they find a pan, which according to them means they have to remove the coil to install it-it just doesnt sit in there. if it did just slide in Id have fixed it better or figured out something else. worst case we cant get a pan, it leaks and i gotta replace the air handler, which id rather not have to do but such as the way it may go

Sure seems like a simple thing to make a replacement for vs replacing the air handler.

 

[CJM8515]

Sure seems like a simple thing to make a replacement for vs replacing the air handler.

the way its fitted in there they explained to me is its exactly meant to sandwich into a certain spot and other parts fit over it. it just doesnt sit there like you would think unfortunately.

 

[whateg01]

the way its fitted in there they explained to me is its exactly meant to sandwich into a certain spot and other parts fit over it. it just doesnt sit there like you would think unfortunately.

It's still a part that was made. Something similar enough to work can also be made if you want to avoid replacing the air handler badly enough.

 

[Wrench97]

It's not a part the normally breaks after the unit is installed, you have to step on or trip over the condensate line or remove the coil to break it.

 

[CJM8515]

^ agreed, but the unit is likely 30 years old and i watched them-they didnt remove it. plastic does get brittle over time

they are coming again tomorrow, we shall see the result. maybe they can bandaid it enough to last thru the summer. but even if they can, before next summer im gonna have to shell out for a new unit and actual outside a/c as my unit doesnt use the newer freon they have now

either way looks like the pan might not be 100% the issue. its not leaking from my patch job.. but the condensation its throwing is crazy and it aint draining. im sitting here in 82F heat cause i shut it off

 

[danski0224]

Too much fan on a horizontal A coil will cause water to be blown off and drip where it isn't supposed to. Some larger capacity models also require a splash shield to catch the water.

A "P trap" is also required, especially if the evaporator coil is on the suction side of the fan. The condensate will not drain if there isn't a trap.

 

[CJM8515]

p trap is there.. i agree the pitch might be a bit much. BUT none of that matters b/c the pan is cracked. now, oddly enough its cracked where they put in the overflow switch.. the plastic is brittle so its entirely possible its only partially their fault..but still. OR the way the drain lines are attached and where they are located perhaps I or they stepped on them or bumped them too much. see the only way to get up there is to go up the fold down stairs and to the left..where the drain pipes are.. good job who ever installed that..

i only saw part of the crack obviously... cause it was still in there when i attempted to rtv it. even if they can fix it, the unit is so old and undersized for the house anyways i may just replace it in the spring because i dont trust it.

fun times

 

[danski0224]

If you got that pan out, then Flex Seal it and be done... for now.

I'd probably rivet a piece of thin metal or plastic inside.

 

[CJM8515]

they got the pan out, coming tomorrow to put it back in as they flex sealed it and waiting to dry. like i said, im limping it along for the rest of the summer and int he spring ill buy a new unit. i dont see myself leaving for another 5-7 years. housing prices in NJ are nuts

 

[CJM8515]

welp lets see how it goes. they repaired the pan.. considering the outside unit is from 2004 and we think the air handler is older than that..this is a last ditch effort. it dont work im gonna have to get a new system. planning on a new system regardless this spring

 

[ybnormal]

Without seeing what you’re working on, if the pan can be replaced, take it out, get some sheet metal, and bend up a new one.

was that in the birth control aisle? asking for a friend who does "movies". maybe you know him? @PelicanPines

 

[dcg9381]

I've seen many, many failure variations on the "pan" situation. Either the pan has failed, the drain wasn't properly sloped, the aux drain was clogged, or the pan-to-PVC connection leaks. Any new AC system I get, one of the first things I'm going to do is pour a gallon of water in the pan and see what happens... AC guys don't test it and they'll get the 12 months they need out of it so it's not a warranty issue.

I'm adding a "float switch" to our pan this month, which in addition to the two drain paths, should cover pretty much everything short of a pan failure.

The worst design that I commonly see here is connecting the primary AC drain to to a plumbing drain in a bathroom sink... So when the gunk that gums up an AC eventually gums up that sink, the sink overflows and the secondary drain (our air handlers are usually in the attic) never get used.. How this is "to code" still baffles me.

 

[CJM8515]

it was a nice combination of stuff

whomever installed it honestly was an idiot. im no hvac tech but even i coulda done better.
-sloped the handler wrong
-did a crappy job with the ducts
-put drain lines in with an upward slope
-put the drain lines in a place where you have to step over them to access the attic. really coulda flipped the unit the other way or put it in a different spot
-ignored the pre-drilled hole for the secondary drain pan and instead made their own in the center of the pan... one woulda thought you would put it in the corner where ya know you SLOPE the pan? why they ignored the actual pre-drilled hole idk
-drilled THRU the drain pan to make brackets to connect to the unit as the unit is hung sideways off the joists. thankfully they globbed silicone caulk on it so no leaks.

the list goes on and on and on and on and on.. i could strangle the people who put it in

i just spent the last 2 hours cutting out the drywall so its as square as possible. thankfully all i need to do is 1 full sheet wide and then 1/2 sheet long. still very very annoying.

 

[CJM8515]

sign and it STILL leaks lol... its so minute ill just watch it.

im thinking about putting one of my security cams up there to check it anytime i want lol.. guess ill be saving for a new unit, thank god summer is almost over

i wish i could shove my foot up the *** of the person who installed this thing..