ADA bathroom spec?

[ericm]

A downside to getting an ag exemption to build my shop is that the county considers it commercial. When I was in the planning dept getting the permit they said that the toilet room has to meet ADA specs. The sink's going to be outside the toilet room so its easier to use to wash up.

I can find a lot of info about ADA bathrooms with toilet and sink. But not so much about just a toilet room. The best I can find is that it needs to be 3' wide by 5'6" long, on the inside, and at least a 34" door opening. Is that right, and do I need anything else? Like blocking for hard rails?

 

[kyrbz]

What year building codes has your county adopted? My county recently adopted the 2018 Building Codes which are much stricter than the previous 2015 codes. Most of the changes are energy efficiency and fire related, not so much ADA. I could look up requirements in my 2021 Commercial Building Codes Manual tomorrow. One obvious thing I'd mention that you didn't is an ADA height toilet. It will need handrail that has a specified strength. Blocking may not be required if you anchor into studs with the hand rail.

 

[carlaisle]

Has the planning department signed off on the sink outside the bathroom? That's an unusual arrangement and may not be deemed acceptable.

 

[Jay H 237]

I'm sure you will have to have a wall mounted sink in the bathroom, so that a wheelchair can fit under it. So I think you'll be putting in two sinks.

The other requirement is the fall alarm. The string on a pull switch with the alarm above the door outside.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Ag exemption makes it commercial? I would have thought the Ag exemption requires very little.

 

[loganb]

Assuming this is a personal use, non commercial shop, having to meet ADA is very strange.

But you're going to have some googling ahead of you. i like this site for common references

U.S. Access Board - ADA Accessibility Standards

The U.S. Access Board is a federal agency that promotes equality for people with disabilities through leadership in accessible design and the development of accessibility guidelines and standards for the built environment, transportation, communication, medical diagnostic equipment, and...

www.access-board.gov

Toilet will need to be far enough off the wall for the turning radius, hand rails, roll under sink, the bathroom will probably have to be at least 75% larger then it would likely be without it due to the turning radius requirement

 

[larry_g]

A downside to getting an ag exemption to build my shop is that the county considers it commercial. When I was in the planning dept getting the permit they said that the toilet room has to meet ADA specs. The sink's going to be outside the toilet room so its easier to use to wash up.

I can find a lot of info about ADA bathrooms with toilet and sink. But not so much about just a toilet room. The best I can find is that it needs to be 3' wide by 5'6" long, on the inside, and at least a 34" door opening. Is that right, and do I need anything else? Like blocking for hard rails?

Some years back when I built I was cautioned to not call it a shop but a barn. That changed some of the rules. So build your self a barn. It's not a mezzanine, it's a hayloft. So check out what language you need to use to get what you want.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[four.cycle]

A downside to getting an ag exemption to build my shop is that the county considers it commercial.

By what metric does the county "consider" it to be "commercial"?
Is it zoned C-1 commercial?
or.... ?
Is this building going to be the home of a business of some sort?

To make a toilet room ADA compliant, you have to make it large enough to turn a wheelchair around inside it. Has to have hand rails ("grab bars"). Has to have that "fall alarm switch". May also have to have a wall-mounted button to open the door (both inside and outside the room.) All really spendy stuff.

I would explore your options. If there's any way to get around "commercial" - if you do not intend to operate a business out of the structure - I would most certainly be exploring other options.

 

[no704]

Some years back when I built I was cautioned to not call it a shop but a barn. That changed some of the rules. So build your self a barn. It's not a mezzanine, it's a hayloft. So check out what language you need to use to get what you want.

lg
no neat sig line

And if you want a flat level floor it’s a hobby shop not a garage.

 

[Hank11]

You (everyone) could take this as a lesson in participating in your county’s decisions. The constant adoption of ever more restrictive building regulations is choking the economy and in particular your use of your property. A large portion of new codes regulations are not compatible with enjoying the bounty of your property, and at the same time, offering no real advantage to the government. Hard to get stupider than that. But its easy — just vote for the whole new code as if anyone on the council read it. And everyone suffers.

 

[billconner]

ICC A117.1 is likely the standard your building department would use, but I don't know which edition. Probably 2009 but maybe 2017. You might get away with this:


Tell me which edition - ask your department - and bug me and I'll get you the necessary dimensions. I don't know offhand if 5' x 5' or if it will have to be 5' x 8'. I'm on the committee that writes the standard for over 20 years.

 

[ericm]

In Oregon if you're on land zoned for farming, you have automatic approval for a farm shop. In a farm shop the farmer and their family can maintain farm equipment and personal vehicles. The ag exemption means that the building didn't need engineering (though the pole barn company's engineers designed it) and there's no final inspection. That seemed the way to go, so in all my dealings with the county it's been a farm shop. It's too late to change now when it's nearly done.

What I can't do is have the public in there. If I turn it into say a wine tasting facility, I'll have to get engineering approval for the structure. That's fine with me, we have no plans for anything like that.

The ADA bathroom was an aside from someone at the planning dept the last time I was there. I didn't pay too much attention but I'm getting ready to get the bathroom built and figure I'd better make sure. I will have a visit with the planning dept next time I'm there and ask exactly what I'm expected to do.

The plumbing got inspected before the slab was poured, so the inspector saw that I was going to have a sink outside the bathroom. I assume that if that was a problem they'd have mentioned it. Or the plumber would have told me.

 

[ericm]

I'm on the committee that writes the standard for over 20 years.

Awesome! Thank you!

 

[kyrbz]

My understanding is that California and Oregon have adopted the 2018 International Building Codes. The following pics are from the 2018 IBC Manual. Disregard the excessive hi-lighting as it is the remnants from my taking the commercial building code test when my county adopted the 2018 building codes. My 2 cents is it sounds like your bathroom is for private use not open to the public. This exempts you from many of the ADA requirements that apply to bathrooms that are open to the public or employees.



I think to be on the safe side, I would adhere to the clear floor space specifications



There are also minimum ceiling height and room dimensions that might apply. Based on paragraph 1207.1 your bathroom may need to have a minimum dimension 7'x7'





Grab bar specifications



Bottom line, if you have an ADA approved toilet, grab bar, ADA approved sink, and the specified clear floor space, I don't think an inspector is going to give you much trouble for a private bathroom. I don't see the sink outside the bathroom being an issue as long as its an ADA compliant installation.

I recently kinda went through an ADA bathroom situation with my city regarding a commercially zoned property I'm renovating and plan on living at. At first the city was telling me that because the property was commercially zoned, the bathroom in my private residence would have to be ADA compliant. After much wrangling it was determined that even though it was commercially zoned, it has an R3 occupancy designation and that I would not have to comply with ADA requirements due to it being my private residence and not open to public or employees.

 

[PCustoms]

In Oregon if you're on land zoned for farming, you have automatic approval for a farm shop. In a farm shop the farmer and their family can maintain farm equipment and personal vehicles. The ag exemption means that the building didn't need engineering (though the pole barn company's engineers designed it) and there's no final inspection. That seemed the way to go, so in all my dealings with the county it's been a farm shop. It's too late to change now when it's nearly done.

What I can't do is have the public in there. If I turn it into say a wine tasting facility, I'll have to get engineering approval for the structure. That's fine with me, we have no plans for anything like that.

The ADA bathroom was an aside from someone at the planning dept the last time I was there.

Then why care of someone making an offhand comment about ADA compliance?

 

[jblnut]

Reading through this stuff it seems my shop bathroom is mostly ADA compliant as it’s large enough to turn a wheel chair around in, has the correct sink and toilet already as well as some grab bars in mostly the right places. I built the bathroom larger than needed so I could use it as a clean storage room of sorts so that’s always an option if space allows. Build it large enough to meet whatever you need to and put shelves up after the fact.

 

[Sumboodie]

The other requirement is the fall alarm. The string on a pull switch with the alarm above the door outside.

I've never seen that in any bathroom aside from SOME hospital rooms... like ICU rooms.

 

[billconner]

Reading through this stuff it seems my shop bathroom is mostly ADA compliant as it’s large enough to turn a wheel chair around in, has the correct sink and toilet already as well as some grab bars in mostly the right places. I built the bathroom larger than needed so I could use it as a clean storage room of sorts so that’s always an option if space allows. Build it large enough to meet whatever you need to and put shelves up after the fact.

Good points but key to accessibility is the ability to transfer from a wheelchair to the toilet. That means besides just turning around (60" diameter previously but 67" in 2017 edition - which is not widely adopted yet) you have to have space to one side of the toilet.

FWIW, I'm trying to answer the OPs question of what is required to make it comply with accessibility requirements. I tend to think the building official requiring it to be overreach, but can't help with that.

 

[Hank11]

In Oregon if you're on land zoned for farming, you have automatic approval for a farm shop. In a farm shop the farmer and their family can maintain farm equipment and personal vehicles. The ag exemption means that the building didn't need engineering (though the pole barn company's engineers designed it) and there's no final inspection. That seemed the way to go, so in all my dealings with the county it's been a farm shop. It's too late to change now when it's nearly done.

What I can't do is have the public in there. If I turn it into say a wine tasting facility, I'll have to get engineering approval for the structure. That's fine with me, we have no plans for anything like that.

The ADA bathroom was an aside from someone at the planning dept the last time I was there. I didn't pay too much attention but I'm getting ready to get the bathroom built and figure I'd better make sure. I will have a visit with the planning dept next time I'm there and ask exactly what I'm expected to do.

The plumbing got inspected before the slab was poured, so the inspector saw that I was going to have a sink outside the bathroom. I assume that if that was a problem they'd have mentioned it. Or the plumber would have told me.

I think you don’t have a problem if there is no further inspection and you’re not using the building in a way that negates its status as a “farm shop”. The plumbing inspector likely had no idea about your floorplan.

 

[mike93lx]

I'm sure you will have to have a wall mounted sink in the bathroom, so that a wheelchair can fit under it. So I think you'll be putting in two sinks.

The other requirement is the fall alarm. The string on a pull switch with the alarm above the door outside.

Why would a sink be required inside the bathroom? How is this different than a stall in a commercial bathroom?

Or are you saying two based on the outside sink likely not being Ada compliant?

 

[ericm]

There's supposed to be a mechanical inspection to check the toilet room fan. I heard from one of the contractors that an inspector already came out to check it, unasked for. They probably thought the build was proceeding at a faster rate than it is. It would be going a lot faster if I was living there, but the house isn't done yet.

I'm going at least find out what I'm supposed to do. I can always decide not to do it. But, I'm a new comer to the area and it's a fairly small rural metro where people know each other and word gets around. I don't want to get a reputation for cutting corners or being difficult.

We built the house's bathrooms to, if not exactly ADA spec, be a little more spacious with the realization that we're already getting up there in age. Doing something similar with the shop isn't all that bad an idea even if it isn't required.

 

[Jay H 237]

Why would a sink be required inside the bathroom? How is this different than a stall in a commercial bathroom?

Or are you saying two based on the outside sink likely not being Ada compliant?

Two sinks, doesn't matter if the one outside is ADA or not. Stalls are different as they're in the same room as the sinks.

They may need water to help 'clean up' if they have an accident being disabled and don't have to leave the 'room' and go outside than staying in the privacy of the bathroom even if they have to leave a stall.

I should also mention there's a larger minimum doorway requirement too.

 

[Hank11]

Sounds like you have a contractor building this? Figuring out things like this is his job.

 

[ericm]

Sounds like you have a contractor building this? Figuring out things like this is his job.

There's a GC for the house but I'm doing it myself for the shop.

 

[logical]

Ask the inspection department for a copy of exactly what they will hold you to...after asking if a private room, not open to the public, really even needs to comply. This could be a lot of fuss over something completely wrong blurted out by someone with no authority.

 

[kbuhagiar]

Ask the inspection department for a copy of exactly what they will hold you to...after asking if a private room, not open to the public, really even needs to comply. This could be a lot of fuss over something completely wrong blurted out by someone with no authority.

I can personally attest to this, happened to me on a shed (SHED!) construction project. Held me up for three months for nothing. Make sure you obtain a copy of the rules/regulations/restrictions before you go any further.

 

[dcg9381]

Ag exemption makes it commercial? I would have thought the Ag exemption requires very little.

We just got an exemption to build a barn up on property that is zoned "residential/agricultural". They had been telling me I can't build a barn on the lot without building a 950 sqft residence.. Blocked us for years. Yesterday I found a "loophole" that allows us to build a "barn" for "agricultural storage / processing" - by digging into the ordinances and zoning confirmed (verbal) approval so I can submit a plan for formal.

If I said I was doing "processing" that's "commercial" here and that's why the OP is getting stuck with a requirement like that. I'd encourage the OP to read the zoning regs very carefully, as commercial can often require things like fire suppression systems and ADA parking, and ADA baths.

Here they wanted to know that we'd be doing the lumber production locally and not importing materials (even though this is not stated in regulations). We harvest lumber (sometimes) - it's not really commercial. They wanted to know if we were running a business.

My learnings on building things like this:

1) Do not trust "word of mouth" of the authority. If you're doing some thing that isn't in their day to day they may be wrong. Read the ordinances and know 'em. Bring them copies of their ordinances when asking questions.

2) Don't trust contractors either unless they are VERY familiar with building in your area and are offering to do the permitting.

3) Look for similar structures within the boundaries of the authority. Here I can lookup their permits and you can get a LOT of useful information.

4) If they "require" something politely ask them to show you where such a requirement exists.

There's a GC for the house but I'm doing it myself for the shop.

Try designating this as an "accessory building". There may be ways to get around ADA if there is a residence going up. Typically you can't mix "commercial" and residential construction (there are exceptions). You aren't commercial, this building is an "accessory" to the main house and shouldn't have to comply with commercial specs in most areas... Not saying your area isn't different as they are ALL different.

 

[ericm]

I talked to the building dept. Oregon building code adopts ANSI A117.1 from 2017. I know (thanks to previous posts and my own research) what size I need to make the toilet room to meet that. It's not terribly large or going to be in the way, so I'm just going to do that.

If I absolutely hate it or find that I need that few feet of space I can tear it out and do it again.

 

[bwringer]

I talked to the building dept. Oregon building code adopts ANSI A117.1 from 2017. I know (thanks to previous posts and my own research) what size I need to make the toilet room to meet that. It's not terribly large or going to be in the way, so I'm just going to do that.

If I absolutely hate it or find that I need that few feet of space I can tear it out and do it again.

Yup, nuttin' wrong with a little more room around the crapper.

People get so, so worked up about ADA stuff, but honestly a lot of it makes things more usable and pleasant for everyone, not just folks in wheelchairs. ADA toilets, for example, are just nice for everyone. And besides, what if you get injured and need a walker or scooter someday?

That said, the main problem is the fact that the regs and their application are so incredibly opaque, not to mention so many people have assorted weird unfounded beliefs about what works and what doesn't (and some of these are employed as inspectors). Once you actually figure out what to build, it ain't that hard.