I am closing on a house in August the first thing I plan on doing is building a deck just a simple 15 foot wide by 30 foot long deck with a pergola over head. I checked the local code and the frost line here in the northland is deep so they require you to go at least 5 feet deep for the footings. I am no carpenter I have no professional skills other than copying what I see on youtube. Has anyone else here built one or have any advise or tips and tricks that you learned while you built your deck? Thanks for your help
Advice for building a deck
- Thread starter Northman
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Kaizen
Well-known member
That size don't think it will be simple. Pergola requires adds forethought. How high off the ground?
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MushCreek
Well-known member
If any part of the deck will be more than 30" off of the ground, it becomes a real game-changer. The rules on elevated decks have become pretty tough due to catastrophic failures over the years. Find out what code your area follows, then look it up.
cdestuck
Well-known member
Plenty of good books that have great info of deck building. Lowes has a nice selection. Worth the 15-20 bucks for a learning and idea guide
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
The biggest mistake most people make is bolting the beams to the SIDE of the posts. They should be notched into or placed ON TOP of the posts.
ford33
Well-known member
That's a large deck for a first timer with no previous experience. I suggest you consider a carpenter to build the basic deck and you do the finish work like the railing, lattice and trim.
Also make sure the deck is securely attached to the building and that flashing is used so water is directed away from this attachment point.
Also make sure the deck is securely attached to the building and that flashing is used so water is directed away from this attachment point.
aandpdan
Well-known member
Start here: http://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standards/publications/dca/AWC-DCA62012-DeckGuide-1405.pdf
That will give you some idea of what is required to build to code. You should then talk to your local building department.
That will give you some idea of what is required to build to code. You should then talk to your local building department.
That's no simple deck -- especially for a first timer. There are so many variables -- proceed with caution.
Also, measure it out .... make sure you don't want/ need more than 15' depending on the doors and steps .. a foot can make a huge difference.
Also, measure it out .... make sure you don't want/ need more than 15' depending on the doors and steps .. a foot can make a huge difference.
Pineracer
Member
When I built my first deck I subscribed to this website which gave me invaluable info on beam size, snow loads etc. It was worth the every penny and when I was done I had a beautiful deck. The local inspector commented it was "one heck of a nice deck"".
https://www.bestdecksite.com/default.htm
https://www.bestdecksite.com/default.htm
LB-1911
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Take the previously supplied information to heart - There are several questions you'll need to get answered.
Congratulations on the purchase of your home and good luck w/ your project.
Denwood
Well-known member
If the deck is not attached to the house, you don't need footings...you can float it on pads. Keeping it under 2" makes this game simpler too. I did a similar project two yrs back. After two yrs with temps dipping to -35C in winter, this floating deck hasn't moved at all.
Detailed here from demolition onward:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=263351&page=26
..after the new deck, HardieBoard siding, and brick painting:
Detailed here from demolition onward:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=263351&page=26
..after the new deck, HardieBoard siding, and brick painting:
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first answer the how high question. That's critical as it governs a lot of things, even railing type.
IMO, if you can build without attaching to the house structure it will make it much easier. Attachment requires penetration which creates water entry/diversion probability. Depending on local code you may not need to go below the frost line if not attached. However, the pergola part may dictate that you do in order to wind-proof the structure.
IMO, if you can build without attaching to the house structure it will make it much easier. Attachment requires penetration which creates water entry/diversion probability. Depending on local code you may not need to go below the frost line if not attached. However, the pergola part may dictate that you do in order to wind-proof the structure.
Firebrick43
Well-known member
I would do anything to avoid a deck. Wild animals crawl under them to live (and die, worst are skunks), they are constant maintence (unless you use high dollar composites or brasiallian epe) and they are rarely attached and flashed right to the house doing serious water damage over time to the rim joist. Also be very considerate of deck loadings. Many have died or been injured when a party full of people overload the deck and collapse.
If you can I would suggest a concrete patio or pavers, or pavers over concrete.
If you can I would suggest a concrete patio or pavers, or pavers over concrete.
Ryanbabz71
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 24, 2016
- Messages
- 492
Plan it out. Come up drawings to map out post locations and determine materials required
Ryan B.
Ryan B.
1.Biscuits, not deck screws. Deck screws **** and nothing cheapens your work like those exposed screws.
2.Hire a pro.
When the inspector makes you tear it out the second time, you'll have wished you paid the labor.
Inspector:did you put the footings on a hay bed?
You:that sounds silly
Inspector:tear them out
I had never heard of such silliness until recently when I saw a set of plans with a
Add straw
Cloud.
2.Hire a pro.
When the inspector makes you tear it out the second time, you'll have wished you paid the labor.
Inspector:did you put the footings on a hay bed?
You:that sounds silly
Inspector:tear them out
I had never heard of such silliness until recently when I saw a set of plans with a
Add straw
Cloud.
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Falcon67
Well-known member
We need a deck on the back and I've already decided that when I do it, the frame will be steel and not wood. The height in part of it will be ground level so it's not anything up in the air. No frost line here, but it'll be way easier IMHO to build and level a steel frame that sits on a few concrete piers. I can them put any sort of deck material on it that can be removed and replaced without damage to the framework. The posts supporting the roof can be clad with cedar or some such to look like posts. If I had to go 5' down for footers I'd for sure consider steel over anything else.
Jeff95TA
Well-known member
This is a good guide and will help you with determining proper sizing and layout:
http://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standards/publications/dca/AWC-DCA62012-DeckGuide-1405.pdf
It will give you a lot of info on how to attach a beam to posts, joist & beam spans, hangers, etc.
Check with your municipality on rules, permits, inspections, etc. It varies a lot. Following the International Residential Code (IRC) is a good start. I recently did a 40x30 ipe deck around my pool, and submitted a binder of drawings and ledger/beam/joist/post/soil calculations to the inspector ahead of time. They stamped the drawings, and there were no problems during construction. Overplanning is your friend!
After you read through the document, I'd be glad to try to answer any questions.
http://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standards/publications/dca/AWC-DCA62012-DeckGuide-1405.pdf
It will give you a lot of info on how to attach a beam to posts, joist & beam spans, hangers, etc.
Check with your municipality on rules, permits, inspections, etc. It varies a lot. Following the International Residential Code (IRC) is a good start. I recently did a 40x30 ipe deck around my pool, and submitted a binder of drawings and ledger/beam/joist/post/soil calculations to the inspector ahead of time. They stamped the drawings, and there were no problems during construction. Overplanning is your friend!
After you read through the document, I'd be glad to try to answer any questions.
Attachments
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Todd.Brock
Well-known member
Not sure of your skill level in reality, so it would help to have a guiding voice on site to walk you the logistics of the deck frame, connecting to a rim joist, etc.
Get a permit. Read the span tables to know what you can and can not do.
Assuming you have some carpentry skills , experience on some smaller projects, or just really hell bent on doing this yourself, keep asking questions and read the materials you get with the permit for what is required. That will guide you on what to do, not necessarily how to do it. May not be able to pick that up from You tube.
My serious recommendation is to be honest with your skills, tools, etc. it ain't totally rocket science, but you do need to have some clue.
Good luck and keep asking questions
And you will have a hell of time getting a 5ft deep hole!
Get a permit. Read the span tables to know what you can and can not do.
Assuming you have some carpentry skills , experience on some smaller projects, or just really hell bent on doing this yourself, keep asking questions and read the materials you get with the permit for what is required. That will guide you on what to do, not necessarily how to do it. May not be able to pick that up from You tube.
My serious recommendation is to be honest with your skills, tools, etc. it ain't totally rocket science, but you do need to have some clue.
Good luck and keep asking questions
And you will have a hell of time getting a 5ft deep hole!
Camo and Kreg both make jigs so you can install fasteners at an angle into the beams for a nice concealed sturdy installation.
Maybe hire a carpenter to act as the lead, and you can be the assistant and you will learn a lot. Hopefully you can get a discount on his or her labor rate, since you're helping.
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Jeff95TA
Well-known member
Depending on the decking material this is also an option that gaps the boards (if you have grooved boards):
https://www.ipeclip.com/
https://www.ipeclip.com/
TractorJeff
Well-known member
Post hole drill the piers for footings (rent a skid steer with a post hole drill).
I built a 16x32 foot Deck 12 feet off the ground with a roof 10 feet off the deck with 6x6 and 4x12 framing timbers. Took 2 years working on weekends and nights. Well planned drawings approved by your Local Inspector will take the headaches! Work with the Inspector if you question anything in the least as the Internet will give you their local opinion, not the whim of your local Inspector!
I built a 16x32 foot Deck 12 feet off the ground with a roof 10 feet off the deck with 6x6 and 4x12 framing timbers. Took 2 years working on weekends and nights. Well planned drawings approved by your Local Inspector will take the headaches! Work with the Inspector if you question anything in the least as the Internet will give you their local opinion, not the whim of your local Inspector!
73RR
Blank Email
A lot of good information but we still haven't heard from the OP as to the height of the deck. Everything hinges on that one detail.
The mention of using steel as the main framing members would certainly offer greater long term stability-longevity in an elevated design but, again, here the assembly is dependent on the OP's skill set.
Items not mentioned are budget and timeline. OP?
....so many questions......
The mention of using steel as the main framing members would certainly offer greater long term stability-longevity in an elevated design but, again, here the assembly is dependent on the OP's skill set.
Items not mentioned are budget and timeline. OP?
....so many questions......
Denwood
Well-known member
further to my previous post...I won't use wood on horizontal surfaces outside again. These pics also detail flashing the pressure treated supports, which will extend their life much, much longer as rot almost always starts topside where moisture sits. The clips and composite decking are self explanatory. My wife and girls do yoga / work out etc. all the time on this surface which as no fasteners exposed, and zero splinter risk 
toolmiser
Well-known member
Why the hurry for building a deck, with any luck you will be in the house for many years. Usually there are tons of little things to do to a house that will be new to you. Also if you wait a while you might come up with a better design, or meet a neighbor who is a retired carpenter.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
Not if the deck (or floor of a shed) is high enough to provide light and ventilation. A couple inches of ground and you are asking for residents ! (My son had a dead possum under his !)
More money for sure but it will be there FOREVER ! You can DIY a raised paver patio without concrete ! You need the proper garden wall block for the height and lots and lots of fill, preferably sand or sharp gravel. It must be compacted every 3-6". The final lift (layer) should be stone dust/"slag"/decomposed granite. Make sure there is a small amount of pitch AWAY from the house.
Todd.Brock
Well-known member
I don't really think the principles change if you are talking 2'6 vs 4 ft. 30" is the magic number for hand rails, and then trying to explain stair stringer math/framing square stops.
The AHJ should dictate it cross bracing or corner bracing is required over s certain height, but thats doesn't change the core principles of building with a footer, beam, ledger, joistss, etc.
Stuart in MN
Well-known member
I thought code these days was 42" high for hand rails? In any case the original poster needs to check local regulations for decks.
42" is for guardrails on a raised deck ( 6'+) below 6' the guard height is 36"
30 -36 is height for handrails on stairs but these heights vary slightly with your area/jurisdiction correct terminology will help with what you are discussing
30 -36 is height for handrails on stairs but these heights vary slightly with your area/jurisdiction correct terminology will help with what you are discussing
Todd.Brock
Well-known member
In our area a handrail is not required if deck surface is less than 30" from the ground, height to grade, I think my inspector called it. That's what I was referring to.
ard
Well-known member
Fine Homebuilding just had a recent article on Steel Deck Framing... Seemed interesting
Did like the idea of a deck that is NOT attached to the structure to avoid a frost proof footing. Choose your wood (or composite) decking with care. Understand the maintenance requirements and real world life expectancy based on where you live.
As has been said, that is a big project.
Too big for a first timer.
Check out the books and ads for design ideas and call a pro.
The OT hours spent to pay them will be well spent.
One of the most important things a DIY guy can learn is when not to DIY.
Too big for a first timer.
Check out the books and ads for design ideas and call a pro.
The OT hours spent to pay them will be well spent.
One of the most important things a DIY guy can learn is when not to DIY.
SH7mi
Well-known member
Do not drop your support posts (wood) into the dirt. Bring your concrete footers above the ground level and set your posts on top. Wood, no matter the species, will rot in dirt or concrete.
Jeff95TA
Well-known member
Haven't heard back from the OP. Hope there wasn't an industrial accident!
ard
Well-known member
Personally I don't like clips or biscuits or whatever that sit between the boards, EXACTLY where you want clean, open air. And not debris and moisture.
I've used deck master rails. More work, to be sure. Apply the rails then all decking screwed from below. But for me, labor is cheap.
Once decking is installed, the space between deck boards is open, can be power washed, blown out, cleaned with a scraper, etc. Not an issue here, but water then ice cannot get into that joint either.
I **DO** like the idea of a moisture barrier on the top of the joists, as you described. Even with PY lumber.
Here are some desk master brackets installed- lay boards on top, screw up. Two screws per board, easy to reposition if needed. I had a 12" pony clamp to hold them when son was in school (his job was to 'stand here')
Stowe Boy
Member
If the deck is not attached to the house, you don't need footings...you can float it on pads. Keeping it under 2" makes this game simpler too. I did a similar project two yrs back. After two yrs with temps dipping to -35C in winter, this floating deck hasn't moved at all.
Detailed here from demolition onward:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=263351&page=26
..after the new deck, HardieBoard siding, and brick painting:
Love those steps/stairs.
Interested in seeing/learning more about them. Are they basically platforms, as opposed to stringers?
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Stowe Boy
Member
Straw? Now you have my interest. Cannot tell where you live from your profile.
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Denwood
Well-known member
Personally I don't like clips or biscuits or whatever that sit between the boards, EXACTLY where you want clean, open air. And not debris and moisture.
I've used deck master rails. More work, to be sure. Apply the rails then all decking screwed from below. But for me, labor is cheap.
Once decking is installed, the space between deck boards is open, can be power washed, blown out, cleaned with a scraper, etc. Not an issue here, but water then ice cannot get into that joint either.
I **DO** like the idea of a moisture barrier on the top of the joists, as you described. Even with PY lumber.
Ard, the Moistureshield composite I used is rated for water submersion..so no worries there. The Mantis clips maintain controlled spacing between the boards (about 1/8") and also elevate the boards off the joists, so maintaining an air gap under. They are not inexpensive..but they are the best solution I've used yet
Denwood
Well-known member
Stowe boy, these are pulled from my thread around page 30 or so. I cantilevered the main support beams out a bit which more or less support the two stair/platforms. The deck has worked out pretty awesome. We've got winters here with temps down to -35C, and a forested yard that dumps a lot of organic material on the deck. Other than sweeping, there's been no maintenance to do. More or less my first composite deck..so no claims of expertise in that department.
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