AM CO Anthol Mass. #22 vise

[Bungler]

Good evening
This is my first post. Hopefully it is the right category.
My neighbor left this old vise out by the road for anyone to pick up like she does with a lot things she would like to recycle.
This was my first vise that I have tried to restore. I don’t know if I done it correctly but it is a far sight better than when it was picked up
I would like to know if anyone can give me any history and maybe a valuation. I figured it’s American made so its got to be better than those Chinese ones that are flooding the market. Or maybe I should just give it to the wife while she is swimming. Only fooling.
Hopefully I can post some pictures now.

Some more info. Weight 65.5lbs. ( on wife’s scale so may have been tampered with)
Jaw width 4.5 inches
Jaw opening width 10.5 inches


I have one more pict to post of the swivel handle. Looks like I run out of spaces aloted

 

[rusty65]

Awesome vise! Fantastic save.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Rileysan]

Good evening
This is my first post. Hopefully it is the right category.
My neighbor left this old vise out by the road for anyone to pick up like she does with a lot things she would like to recycle.
This was my first vise that I have tried to restore. I don’t know if I done it correctly but it is a far sight better than when it was picked up
I would like to know if anyone can give me any history and maybe a valuation. I figured it’s American made so its got to be better than those Chinese ones that are flooding the market. Or maybe I should just give it to the wife while she is swimming. Only fooling.
Hopefully I can post some pictures now.

Welcome to GJ!

You found a really high quality vise and it's worth $100 as it sits. One thing that's a no-no is painting the slide of the dynamic jaw. It should be bare metal and lightly oiled to allow easy operation.

Brian

 

[Shelbylex]

Great save!

 

[jusridin]

Welcome to the Journal!
Nice vise you have there. My first restore was also an Athol. Extremely solid vise that will last a long time. My first restore I also painted everything and then I found one of the many vice threads on this site and seen all the slides were bare metal. Made sense after seeing them and reading through all the threads. After that I took a wire wheel and cleaned up the slide and put a light coat of oil on her. It was amazing how smoothly it worked from that point forward.

 

[Fierljeppen]

I've never seen an Athol vise model no.22 before! It looks like it might be a Simpson patent swivel. I could only find an Athol model no. 22 in a pre-1900 parts breakdown. Does it have a hole for the swivel pin in the back, like the 1890's illustration below?

Either way, it's a great find! As far as value, you'd do real well selling it to an Athol collector. Just the handle alone is worth $80-$100. Would love to see more higher resolution photos, if possible. Welcome to the GarageJournal.

 

[Bungler]

Well I guess I will get the wire wheel back out again. I did leave the bottom edges of the dynamic jaw bare figuring that is where most of the friction would occur. I used never sieze grease on the slide but probably that would have been better with oil. Thanks for the new word for my vocabulary (dynamic jaw).
Could the paint be left on the sides and just clean up the top and bottom of the jaw?
It was so rusty when I got it and when I finally got it cleaned I just painted almost everything so she would not show the rust again.

 

[larry_g]

Well I guess I will get the wire wheel back out again. I did leave the bottom edges of the dynamic jaw bare figuring that is where most of the friction would occur. I used never sieze grease on the slide but probably that would have been better with oil. Thanks for the new word for my vocabulary (dynamic jaw).
Could the paint be left on the sides and just clean up the top and bottom of the jaw?
It was so rusty when I got it and when I finally got it cleaned I just painted almost everything so she would not show the rust again.

I would suggest that you study the vise and determine where the bearing surfaces are. If the whole side is in contact with the frame then it should probably not have paint on it. However if the frame has a raised portion where it only bears on the corners of the slide then some paint on the slide may be ok.

I'd suggest that you offer to help the lady next door clean up her place so that no other treasures get missed.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Rileysan]

Well I guess I will get the wire wheel back out again. I did leave the bottom edges of the dynamic jaw bare figuring that is where most of the friction would occur. I used never sieze grease on the slide but probably that would have been better with oil. Thanks for the new word for my vocabulary (dynamic jaw).
Could the paint be left on the sides and just clean up the top and bottom of the jaw?
It was so rusty when I got it and when I finally got it cleaned I just painted almost everything so she would not show the rust again.

That's entirely up to you, of course, but I think you'll find the paint will (lightly) bind up the dynamic when opening and closing, and the paint will start scratching off soon after you begin using it.

Never-seize is ok but I can't use the stuff without getting it all over the place so I stick to light oil that can easily be wiped off and reapplied.

Brian

 

[Roberts210]

You should get on your knees and bow down to the neighbor lady. Buy her a cuppa coffee. Mow her lawn a few times next summer. That's a great vise.

 

[RTM]

Looks like you might want to add it to this thread too, not listed.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=8265976

 

[KMScott]

Looks like you might want to add it to this thread too, not listed.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=8265976

Found it and if B could add some spec:s like weight and jaw width then we would have it documented.

 

[Bungler]

Maybe I can get the last picture of swivel handle in here.
I updated my first post with some better resolution pictures.
I also cleaned the paint off the dynamic jaw and only oiled it.
This has become a very interesting project for me. Thanks for your comments.

 

[drivesitfar]

Bungler: very nice looking vise!! there hasn't been any mention of the swiveling jaw yet. have you tried to free it or use it or is it most likely rusted shut? Like Larry mentioned if you don't have any friction on the slide cause it it over 100 years old maybe the paint wouldn't have scraped, but clean and oiled is still a better look in my opinion.

WELCOME TO GJ and nice work so far.

FJ: thanks again for pulling out pics from your what be a HUGE VISE DATABASE.

 

[Bungler]

OK this is all new to me. I know the vise base will swivel,but are you saying the rear jaw is supposed to swivel to? I know Fierljeppen posted a pic with a pin in the rear jaw,but there is no pin in mine,just the hole.What should the jaw do?Lift and turn or something like that when the pin is pulled out?
Probably a dumb question but why would the jaw swivel?
Like I said before this project gets more interesting all the time.
Thanks Bungler

 

[wrenchguy]

Here's a search of "Double Swiveler Vises", which urs is. Study up.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/search.php?searchid=41598362

 

[Bungler]

Sorry wrench guy but your link would not open for me.Comes up as no matches found.
Does anyone know how you are supposed to operate the rear jaw swivel?I would like to start to try and free it up but it would be good to know how it actually operated first. I haven't even looked to see if the pin is broke off inside the body or not.Thankyou for any guidance you can provide.

 

[drivesitfar]

Bungler: sorry I don't own an Athol swivel jaw vise that looks like it works a bit different than my Reed, Prentiss, Rock Island and maybe a few others. that said maybe my pictures of my Reed 404.5 might help until a member posts up some pictures of their Athol swivel jaw, but I'm not sure there are many so what you have might be pretty rare. yep a great find on the curb that is for certain.

I can tell you that a lot of these vises do come either without pins (it might be on your neighbor's bench if you ask to take a look for it) or stuck pins that are either rusted in place from lack of use or hit in cause some past owner or thier friends or kids hit it with a hammer.

yes you guessed it the rear jaw swivels to allow for the user to put in odd shaped items and grip them tight.

if you have more questions just ask.

 

[Bungler]

Thank you Driveitfar.Like I said earlier I did not have a clue that the rear jaw swiveled.I thought that the rear jaw was made separate from the main casting so it could be replaced if needed.There is a pin that goes through the main casting that looks like it holds the jaw to the main body.I don't want to tamper with that unless it is the only thing I can do the get it apart.I would like to keep it as original as possible.I will check the hole for the swivel pin to see if it broke off or just missing.Do know if there would have been a spring on that pin?
Thanks again for the pics.Bungler

 

[drivesitfar]

Bungler: all of the pins in the swivel jaw vises i own just drop in place and pull out when used regularly. i've seen some other members have pins that were threaded and i think Wilton did that with thier swivel jaw vises, but i bet a few handy prior owner might have tapped their holes and threaded their pins to keep from losing them and some have put chains on their pins and attached to the main body of their vises too.

more than likely your pin is missing if you can't see it and post up a few more pictures of the pin you are mentioning which might just hold the swivel jaw on the back of the vise.

good luck!!

 

[Bungler]

Hello Drivesitfar. I took a drive down to the lake today to get some measurements for our shed and took a couple of pics again of the vise. One will show you the contour of the swivel jaw and the end of the pin I was mentioning. There is a identical pin on the opposite side. I don’t know if it goes completely through the vise body or if there is one on each side.
The other pic was taken through the throat of the static jaw where I think you may be able to see the pin of the swivel jaw.
Bungler

 

[drivesitfar]

Bungler: if that is the bottom of the pin sometimes you can just push it out from underneath with a small bolt. that said it's no guarantee that the jaw will start to swivel especially since you already put a coat of paint on it cause you didn't know your vise was SPECIAL.

there are many ways to remove a stuck pin if you actually have one, but from the catalog picture it looks like your swivel jaw's pin should come in the back side.

post up pics and your questions over on the vise repair 101 thread that I started years ago for issues just like this and since it's a fairly popular thread there should be a little more help there than just this little thread that you just started.

here's the link: https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=252830

don't hammer or punch on it too hard cause at worst case now it looks like you have a working vise and if you can free it up without breaking it the value should at least double if you ever decide to sell it.

good luck!!!

 

[Bungler]

Actually the pin you are talking about is in the rear just like in the picture that Fierljeppen posted.I did stick a awl in that hole today and it went in about a inch.It felt like there was a point inside.You could move the awl from one side to the other with a high spot in the middle.I am suspecting it may be broken in there.Strange you would not think it would break off inside that far in unless it was siezed and someone tried to twist it out.
The pin I was talking about inside the vise throat is the one that the jaw is attached to and swivels on.
I guess if worse comes to worse I can strip or wire wheel off the paint again.
What about putting heat to with a oxcy acetlelene torch?
This has become a real challenge and I really would like to see it working again.
I really wished I knew for sure if that jaw just twisted left or right,but if you look at the lines where the jaw meets the body ,everything looks like straight lines,nothing tapered so it would twist.
Thankyou Bungler

 

[larry_g]

Hello Drivesitfar. I took a drive down to the lake today to get some measurements for our shed and took a couple of pics again of the vise. One will show you the contour of the swivel jaw and the end of the pin I was mentioning. There is a identical pin on the opposite side. I don’t know if it goes completely through the vise body or if there is one on each side.
The other pic was taken through the throat of the static jaw where I think you may be able to see the pin of the swivel jaw.
Bungler

On your first picture, Is that cross section in the hole a broken tap? May be that some one was trying to modify things to have a bolt from the side lock the swivel jaw.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[Bungler]

I am not sure.To me it looks like a pin that has been sort of squished outwards somehow to stop it from coming out.Sort of peening a rivet but from the inside out .The one on the other side is identical.

 

[drivesitfar]

Bungler: some of the old guys hated the swivel jaw option so they welded them, drove in the pins and never used that feature.

sorta looks like the pin going thru from side to side is like another member's small Parker swivel jaw vise. here's a few pics that might help you out. your pin is supposed to be in the back like in the catalog pic and i've never seen one busted off inside so i'm still guessing it's missing. can you get a close up picture to post of the inside of that hole?

i'd probably drill out or maybe you can free up the pin going from side to side and punch it out or maybe pull it out.

I know the paint can be removed, but let's see if we can free up the swivel jaw without doing that first.

if you have more questions it's easier for us to help if you post more pictures of anything you think that might help us. like I mentioned you have a rare vise so not many if any of us have one or have seen one other than a catalog page so take your time cause it might be a keeper for you for a long time.

good luck

 

[wrenchguy]

On your first picture, Is that cross section in the hole a broken tap? May be that some one was trying to modify things to have a bolt from the side lock the swivel jaw.

lg
no neat sig line

looks like it, this piece needs a master machinist help to get that swivel sorted out.

 

[Bungler]

I got some more pics on the weekend. Let’s see if this may give us some more clues.
The left pic is of which I think is the pin holds the spindle of the rear swivel jaw to the vise body. It does look like a broken tap but up close it is some kind of a crimp.
The middle photo is the vise turned upside down looking at the bottom of the swivel jaw. The green circle is the bottom of the spindle of the swivel jaw and red circle looks like a pin that drops into a hole from above. I don’t know if it for lining up the jaw or if somehow you tilt the jaw after pulling the rear pin out. Any ideas?
The right pic is the hole at the rear of rear of the vise for locking or unlocking the swivel jaw. I can’t tell if the pin is broken off flush with block of the swivel jaw or not.Maybe you may be able to tell. I did try to drill it but it seemed very very hard.
Any suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks Bungler

 

[drivesitfar]

Bungler: Like I mentioned i've never seen an Athol swivel jaw vise like yours before, but I'll still try to help you if I can until maybe another member that has one can maybe find your posts and this thread. can you also post up the pictures and your questions over on the Vise Repair 101 thread? since you are a new member and you can see this thread doesn't have many views the 101 thread I think has nearly 700,000 views. also while you are waiting for an answer you might look at some of the other swivel pin vises in that thread. here's the link:

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=252830

it looks like your pin you are trying to drill out might have threads? some pins were threaded from the factory and some might have been tapped and threaded by a former user, but most pins just set in the holes.

the pin going horizontal that looks like it was smashed on the end can you drill that out or punch it out from the other side? can you also post up pics from the other side. also when you are taking pics the close up pics are great, but can you also take and post pics from a bit farther away showing more of the vise cause even with your descriptions it's hard to tell exactly what i'm looking at?

keep at it slow and steady and maybe we'll figure this out so you can have the vise's swivel jaw working again like it should.

good luck

 

[Bungler]

Thankyou Drives
I will try to soak the jaw and spindle the best I can with penitrating oil this weekend and see where I can go from there.
I will try and keep that pin intact. I think it is a factory crimp on both sides as they are identical.
I will try to post some pics on 101 this weekend

 

[wrenchguy]

Can u expand ur meaning of "factory crimp"? There is suppose 2b a pin running clear across internally left 2 right to retain the s-jaw tower 2 the static body.

The pin u describe in the second photo and its function ur guessing dosen't make sense. The broke rear pin aligns and keeps the s-tower from swiveling.

 

[Fierljeppen]

FYI, Athol was famous for having threaded swivel jaw pins. Wish you had a local machinist who could take some interest in the vise.

Your vise is certainly worthy of whatever it takes to make it a usable swivel jaw again.

 

[Bungler]

Wrenchguy thanks for your response. I can't make sense of the pin with the Red circle either. I was just throwing a idea up hoping someone may recognize it and what it does.
I am sure you are correct about the pin with what I describe as the one with the factory crimp. The shape of the crimp that you see is identical on the opposite side. I am just using the word crimp because I don't know how else to describe it.
By drilling that pin out,would it devalue the vise by taking away some of its originalality?

 

[wrenchguy]

By drilling that pin out,would it devalue the vise by taking away some of its originalality?

I wouldn't go at it with a Holeshooter.
IMHO For maximum collector value it needs examined, gameplaned and setup/indexed by a machinist OR leave it, use it maybe unload it.
Can u tell if the rear bore is tapered?

 

[drivesitfar]

Wrench: if you look close at one of Bungler's pics it looks like the pin has broken off inside the hole at the back of the static and there are threads in there. can you see that?

FJ: since you have all these catalog pages and a great knowledge of some of these old vises have you seen an Athol swivel jaw vise like this one before? it's hard to see in your first catalog page if the pin that is holding the swivel jaw on is there much less crimped, but aren't most of those just push thru pins?

i think your latest picture showing a threaded pin on an Athol is great.

thanks again for all your help!!

Bungler: drilling out that old pin might not be easy so wondering if it might come out with an EASY OUT. 100 year old steel on some of these old vises is VERY HARD and not sure how to remove that pin, but maybe the machinists here might have a way.

 

[wrenchguy]

Wrench: if you look close at one of Bungler's pics it looks like the pin has broken off inside the hole at the back of the static and there are threads in there. can you see that?

yea, thats why i asked if he can tell from whats left of the bore if its tapered.

 

[Bungler]

OK Drives you hit it on the head.
Had a friend over today and asked if would like to look at the vise. I told him the problem we are having and first checked under the swivel head at that pin I had circled in red.Like you figured it didn’t make sense to him. Closer inspection on the anvil of the static jaw he could see one then two very slight indents in the paint.Low and behold someone like you said didn’t like the swivel and there was two bolts through the vise and cut off. That wasn’t a pin dropping through the swivel but the bottom of the bolt. There is one beside it to,but it came through almost flush.
What would you do now?Drill the bolts out and fill the holes with weld,or just leave it.This is the best chance to get the swivel working again.
This sure has taken a lot of the originalality away.

 

[drivesitfar]

Bungler: well now you are at a decision point. no matter how much time you spend fixing this 100+ year old vise you probably won't be able to sell it to pay for your time. that said you do have a RARE vise so who knows someone might hand you some cash or trade you a nice vise for it as is or repaired.

I know of a great machinist that has a shop in London Ontario if that might be close to you and if you'd like to talk to him just send me a PM and i'll give you his name. or maybe you know or are one?

here's the list of items I see in your path:

1) it's swivel mechanism is controlled by drilling a hole in a bench and running a bolt in to the bottom of the vise and then tightening up the vise to the bench from underneath with a huge wing nut. do you have the bolt and big wing nut that should be sorta like my old REED i'm posting a picture of.

2) you'll need to drill out those bolts and either fill with weld or JB Weld or Tecton or some other method

3) you've got a pin busted off in the hole in the back holding the swivel jaw in place that might have threads on it that needs to come out

4) you need to remove the pin that is holding the swivel jaw on

once you get that all done you'll have a very old and very unique Athol #22 swivel jaw vise OR trade it to a local guy that has a few extra vises that might give you a nice old working one for your AS IS Athol #22.

if you are still wanting to fix your Athol #22 can you move this over to the Vise Repair 101 thread for a couple reasons. 1 there are a few more members that watch that thread that haven't seen this one AND I (we'd) like to have your fix on a thread we can find later cause these great small threads seem to die after the work is completed and are hard to find.

good luck in any direction you go!!

 

[wrenchguy]

Its screwed as a swivler, done when no one cared about originality. Use it and chalk it up as a learning blip. Someone went to alot effort installing clinching bolts, not sure why if it was locked up.

 

[Bungler]

Boy!Lunch break let down.
I really can’t use this vise properly became my work bench is not open underneath.Drawers and cupboards.
There is a picture of the swivel locking handle in post #13
I realize if I pour any more money into it now I am just peeing into the wind.
Any idea what a Athol collector may pay for it in this condition?It would be nice to get something for it being as unique as it is.
Thanks everyone for all your help.Bungler