joel63
Well-known member
That's the one that's in the wife's SUV.Normally I just use an impact, but if I have to be quiet, this works really well.
Anyone use a breaker bar for lug nuts?
- Thread starter Badgerstate
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2ndGearRubber
Well-known member
If I'm at work, I only use a breaker bar if a gun fails to remove them. Usually it's an issue with poor fitting/swollen lugs so must of the impact energy is wasted. At home all I have is a breaker bar.
nbpt100
Well-known member
My Battery impact is so much more convenient and faster. The only time I use a breaker is when the impact is not powerfull enough after a tire Monkey over torqued them with an air impact. I have had studs and lugs damaged from such incompetence, laziness and carelessness. I think a small amount of mechanics overtighten becasue they do not want to make it easy on some home gamer to change their own tire with cheap tools. They do the same with oil filters. Yea!!!! I am cynical today. Bottom line, Use what ever works best for you. There is no one right way.
oldtractors
Well-known member
anyone still use a four-way?
Sure do. Ive got one behind the seat in my pickup. I'll grab it most of the time if I need to change a car or pickup tire.
Fedwrench
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Nope. I have the Ko-Ken pictured above.
ThePostman
Well-known member
I put the expandable 1/2" ratchet from harbor freight, with appropriate socket, a cheapo tire plug set, and a $25 husky 12v inflator in each car. At work I have Wright 6425, I prefer it to lugging the 1” drive impact to wherever, and I've had a 4 foot piece of 1" schedule 40 on it. The perfect cheater bar I might add, use an air file and grind down the inner seam, and ream it out just a bit in general.
ThePostman
Well-known member
That hf expandable I used daily for a long time, on cars. It will stand up for any home gamer. The Icon 1/2” flex head has seen much use, with it's own mated piece of schedule 40 on it, I haven't broken it yet. I wish it came in 24".
andyvh1959
Well-known member
Normally don't need a breaker bar. Back in 2012 I bought my company car out of the lease so the maintenance was now mine. All the oil changes, tire rotations, etc had previously been done by the, um, "technicians" at the local Ford dealer quick service shop. I recall every time they rotated the tires it sounded like a NASCAR pit stop as they ran the lug nuts on with air impact wrenches in record time. I said "technicians" when actually tire monkeys is a more apt name for them.
When I got around to doing tire rotation/brake work, I had to use my 3/4" drive breaker bar to continue to LOOSEN the lug nuts AFTER I had broken them loose with the breaker bar AND a length of pipe. The lug nuts screeched as I loosened them, and four wheel studs broke off while I turned them loose CCW. The friggin tire monkeys at the quick service shop would just jam the lug nuts on with an impact wrench after barely starting them onto the studs, cross threading them. I replaced four studs, and had to chase all the others with a die, and tap into the lug nuts to get it back together. If I had needed to fix a flat on the road there would have been NO way I could have gotten a single lug nut loose. Since that time I've serviced the brakes twice on that car, done tire rotations, with no issues, especially since I use a proper torque wrench to tighten the lug nuts..
When I got around to doing tire rotation/brake work, I had to use my 3/4" drive breaker bar to continue to LOOSEN the lug nuts AFTER I had broken them loose with the breaker bar AND a length of pipe. The lug nuts screeched as I loosened them, and four wheel studs broke off while I turned them loose CCW. The friggin tire monkeys at the quick service shop would just jam the lug nuts on with an impact wrench after barely starting them onto the studs, cross threading them. I replaced four studs, and had to chase all the others with a die, and tap into the lug nuts to get it back together. If I had needed to fix a flat on the road there would have been NO way I could have gotten a single lug nut loose. Since that time I've serviced the brakes twice on that car, done tire rotations, with no issues, especially since I use a proper torque wrench to tighten the lug nuts..
I have one in the trailer and one of my cars.
cvairwerks
Well-known member
Have bent both a 4 way and a 3/4 break bar getting lugs off one of my trucks. Took a diamond wheel on a pencil grinder to get a couple more.
Coach James
Well-known member
Yes, many times. High dollar ones as well as no name ones.
Coach
Coach
Jweebothee
Well-known member
Since getting a cordless impact, i have not used a breaker, it’s just faster, esp on a cold rainy/windy/snowy night on the side of the road. I’ll still keep and use a torque wrench in the trunk, plus a full size spare, (most of my flats seem to happen on a back road to my reservation or my wife’s reservation, where there is ZERO cell service) also keep a set of flip sockets not only for my car but in case I find someone else in need in the middle of no where that needs help
Lassen Forge
Well-known member
I have a breaker bar and the appropriate 1/2" drive socket IN each of my vehicles, and most have an inexpensive (tho accurate) torque wrench, also in 1/2"... If it has a ******* hack, er, scissor jack that takes a certain size socket, I also have that and a speed wrench with an extension. My DeWalt 1/2" super battery ugga-chugga whang whang wrench is in the tool box if needed... and it has proven itself up to the removal tasks if I'm in a haul *** hurry - but ONLY for removal, never for tightening.
Indexmill
Well-known member
Why wouldn't you use a breaker bar? Why is this a question?
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
Impact. Always my impact. When else am I going to get an opportunity to pull out my high-torque Milwaukee and actually have enough room to use it?
HenryAZ
MEMBER EMERITUS
I do the same, only spin them off with an impact screwdriver, fitted with the right adapters to accept a 1/2"drive socket. I spin them back on the same way. The impact screwdriver gets them reasonably tight enough to hold well, then torque them down with a torque wrench. I use the impact screwdriver for spinning anything that has lots of threads.
The tire shop guys' joke is to install them with an impact, "supposedly" set to a low torque below spec, and then final torque them with a preset clicker. The clicker will always click if it is overtorqued. I usually need the breaker bar to get them loose back at home, where they are properly torqued.
Yes!
When my wife's Volkswagen got 're-tired', I checked how tight they had run the nuts on and couldn't break them with my 4-way. I looked at the supplied lug wrench and found that it had a handle about 6"-8" long! I bought a 1/2" 24" breaker and the correct size socket and it remains in the trunk. I did not want her stranded because no one could change a tire.
I also loosen and re-tighten the nuts after her car is serviced and/or tires rotated.
When my wife's Volkswagen got 're-tired', I checked how tight they had run the nuts on and couldn't break them with my 4-way. I looked at the supplied lug wrench and found that it had a handle about 6"-8" long! I bought a 1/2" 24" breaker and the correct size socket and it remains in the trunk. I did not want her stranded because no one could change a tire.
I also loosen and re-tighten the nuts after her car is serviced and/or tires rotated.
nbpt100
Well-known member
Why are these stories so prevalent?
Because you have something better to use. Better meaning, easier and or faster.
cmandp
Well-known member
I usually use a breaker bar honestly, probably 80% of the time. Its sad though, I have an IR cordless 1/2" impact which is really a professional level tool. But I have yet to buy impact sockets so I only use it if I want to be quick or a bolt is very stubborn.
toddmorr
Well-known member
no
bassJAM
Well-known member
I don't know about your car, but my truck's spec for the lug nut is 150 ft lbs and that's what I keep them at. My last truck's spec was 100 ft lbs. Why would I bother digging out the roadside emergency tool from behind the seat and adding wear and tear to it when I can just grab a breaker bar and 6pt socket and quickly bust them loose?
dnschmidt
Well-known member
Then your Bosch is wimpy. I changed a tire for my neighbor who has a Chevy Colorado truck (22mm lug nuts) whos lug nuts are also suppose to be torqued to 130 ft-lb and my second generation little M18 impact took them off. It had to ugga-dugga for about four seconds each but after that they came right off. Naturally, having the world's largest collection of torque wrenches I retorqued the replacement to 130 ft-lb as any civilized man would. I was surprised at how much I had to work to achieve 130 ft-lb. Maybe 1/2" torque wrenches that are suppose to go up to 300 ft-lb are too short. Or, I'm just getting too damn old for this ****. I did have to have my neighbor lift the tire onto the studs as I couldn't.
No argument from me. And all my vehicles lug nuts are properly torqued by yours truly.
Yes, aging is better left to the young.
theoldwizard1
Well-known member
I have used a HF 25" breaker bar to "crack" some over tightened out nuts.
anndel
Well-known member
In all cases now, my cordless or air impacts will remove lug nuts no problem. Prior to the impacts, yes, I used a 30" 1/2" SK breaker bar.
I use my 1/2” drive, 24” Carlyle breaker bar along with my 19mm GearWrench wheel protector impact socket to bust them loose on my Acura. Occasionally I’ll use the impact to zip them off the rest of the way. I then thread them back on by hand and torque them down with my GearWrench 1/2” torque wrench and the same wheel protector socket.
Not enough gets done to hold shops responsible for the damage they cause, so they don't care. Often, they get paid to fix what they broke, so bonus! There's also an education issue, lots of techs don't understand how a torque wrench actually works, so they put liugs on with a gun, and the 'check' with a torque wrench. It of course clicks instantly, so they think it's good. It'll will continue happening until logging torque wrenches are mandated, sadly.
"Techs" don't understand the basics of a torque wrench???
WTF are they teaching in trade school?When I got new tires I watched the "techs" through the window. They used a impast/torque stick but followed up with a torque wrench, that moved the lug nuts before they clicked. Maybe they used one value less (of a torque stick) than what's called for, which would make perfect sense.
2ndGearRubber
Well-known member
Because that's the "Policy" management wants. FAST and doesn't use those pesky shop-supplies management doesn't buy to clean all the nasty hub corrosion."Techs" don't understand the basics of a torque wrench???
When I got new tires I watched the "techs" through the window. They used a impast/torque stick but followed up with a torque wrench, that moved the lug nuts before they clicked. Maybe they used one value less (of a torque stick) than what's called for, which would make perfect sense.
If a tech follows the procedure, and a wheel falls off, they lose their job. Business will refuse to take responsibility for their mediocre torque policies. Corrosion on wheel hubs/wheels is the number one issue. Wheel isn't flush, and you can torque it all day long and it will still fall off. When techs brap-brap them they KNOW the wheel isn't coming off, because they're crushing the corrosion down. The guys know how a wrench works, they'll tell you they're checking minimum torque when bouncing the wrench on the lugs.
I can take the lugs off my cars with the supplied wrench, after installing with my 2235. When management takes responsibility for wheels flying off when their polices are used, guys might change their habits. Torque sticks also have a strategy for use. Just sticking one on and going nuts for 5 seconds per lug isn't going to meet the torque spec. Bent torque sticks, wallowed out sockets, etc all play a role.
Your "techs" quotation is pretty accurate though. Although they generally aren't from trade schools, not that trade schools are worth a ton IMO. Most tire/oil-change guys are making less than fast-food wages. Feel free to have the master tech do your tires. $20/tire for install and balance ain't happening.
So what's the excuse on the non-rustbelt parts of the country?
2ndGearRubber
Well-known member
No clue - aluminum wheels and ferrous rotors don't crustify outside the rust belt? Here the center hub holes get pitted so bad they aren't hub centeric anymore. I take a wire wheel cup to them usually to take off 1/16 worth of brown/white crust from the mounting services. After cleaning all that up, you don't have to beat the wheels off with dead blows anymore. At least until the crust returns. To be fair, I don't clean every one, I have a "this is bad enough" scale. Since I pay for the grinder and wire wheels, I make the call. Shop always wants to SEND IT, because the customer gotta-go, no time to make things safe.
I never assume that a guy working on a car is a real tech who went to trade school.
And... I never assume that a trade school is teaching much more than 'rithmatic.
Not sayin' either is always true, or mostly true, but if it's my car, i take responsibility for the safety systems being in good order and check their work.
And... I never assume that a trade school is teaching much more than 'rithmatic.
Not sayin' either is always true, or mostly true, but if it's my car, i take responsibility for the safety systems being in good order and check their work.
I can understand if they cross thread the lug nut and/or it rusts on there but how tight can anyone get lug nuts without snapping the stud? Years ago, when I got my used Snap-On 3850, my buddy thought it was a toy and snapped off the first stud on my car like nothing. I believe it was 9/16" with a 13/16" socket and the studs were in good shape.
Right. But most here on GJ WOULD say that.
But for the rest of the real world, they're at the mercy of crappy/lazy "techs". My BIL, right after I met my now wife, hand a front wheel come off his truck while driving down the highway (he had just had it in for clutch service). Lucky nobody was killed.