Basic Backyard Shed - Design stage

[LeeG]

I am planning on building a shed in my backyard this summer. I have several things to consider when building.
1. Small yard (less than 30x50 for the entire back yard)
2. No vehicle access. Only access is through a 36" wide gate.
3. Yard is enclosed with 6' block wall on 3 sides and house on other.
4. I can build without a permit if I keep it under 120 sq ft with no permanent electrical.
5. It can't be visible from the street due, which basically limits me to about a 7' peak.

My current shop is my garage, which I have been primarily using for woodworking, but other interests and things are crowding my space.

My goals are:
1. Get all of my 'house related' stuff out of my garage shop (sprayers, trimmers, etc)
2. Move my 'construction type' tools to the shed.
3. Have a safer environment for doing welding (oxy+acetylene and Mig)

The area around the shed will be all crushed gravel. Concrete would be better, but its not in the budget. I plan on having an awning over the front of the shed to provide a shaded work area if I can't work directly in the shed.

Here is an initial plan I threw together in Sketchup (minus the door). This is about 8' x 15' with a 7' peak. I am in Phoenix, so snow load shouldn't be a concern. I'd appreciate any thoughts, concerns, or feedback.

 

[Nowater]

Very similar to my 10 by 14, the max for my area without a permit. I put the door in the 10' side to house my riding lawn mower, which results in the mower using most of the space. The door in the long side like you have it would have been better for me.

I assume you are using pressure treated lumber for the floor. Make sure it is rated for ground contact, or direct burial, which is better.

Your sketch shows what would be called collar ties on your roof members (if this was a house.) You may want to use a ridge beam instead, as the 15' length is not unreasonable. If so, support the roof load at each end of the shed with studs down to the floor or foundations.Or, you could drop your planned collar ties down to on top of the walls. Their function there is to hold the walls from splaying out from any load placed on the roof, including wind load. Then you could build the roof's basic A shape flat on the floor and lift them all into place, like a truss. The lowered collar ties now may be more properly called a ceiling joist whether you put in a ceiling or not, and you can place them next to the roof joists and nail through and through from roof joist to ceiling joist and connect them to the walls with inexpensive Simpson straps, rather than worry about putting them in exactly the same plane, flat like the letter A using truss mending plates.

I am thinking you placed the collar ties higher to allow more head room, and I understand, but collar ties should go no further than 1/3 the way up the height of the roof because the forces spreading the walls apart (from a downward load on the roof) become overly leveraged as the collar ties are placed higher on the roof joist.

In either case, allow some extra material for connecting the roof members together as you construct the shed. You will want a 2 x 4 (or cutoffs) running perpendicular to the roof line and connecting each roof member together as you build. You can remove these later or leave them in to help with any attic storage you develop later.

The four 2 x 4 members in each corner seams to be a bit of overkill. Are you wanting to install a backup-nailer inside as one would do for drywall?

Even if you do not need a permit, find out the expected maximum wind speed for your area. A lot of wind loads translate into uplift on buildings so you may want to include provisions to hold your shed down, despite conventional wisdom about holding buildings up!

You may want to use OSB to sheathe your shed and then cover that with something like Hardie Panel concrete panels. Make sure you nail the OSB well.

I hope this helps.

 

[The Frisco Kid]

It's not as popular, but I'd really like the door to be offset to one side to allow for more covered room on solid walls (for mounting lawn equipment & bikes) but it really just depends on what you're going to use it to hold. Keep us updated on your progress!

*structural ideas above are all solid.

 

[kbs2244]

Go to your local big box home improvment store and find the book rack.
It will have 4 or 5 books on shed PICs and build plans.

 

[964haus]

As others suggested above.
I built a 10x16 just recently with a ridge beam instead of collar ties - gave me extra space in the roof area to hang other stuff.
I pushed the door near to one end to allow the most continuous wall area as possible. I also did a set of carriage doors to the lane.

The only thing i'd add to your design would be gable end overhang - I did about 12" (all round) and the overhang really make it less 'shed like' if that's a factor....

Here's my build...
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=163328

Matthew.

 

[04fivefour]

Subscribed. I'm getting ready to either redo my current shed or start from scratch. and i'm always looking for ideas.

 

[78Bird]

My suggestion is make it 'barn style'. I built a 10x10 kit from Lowes, and while it wasn't the best everywhere it had a big shelf that gave me ~33% more useable flat space. Since the thing is tall, the shelf lets me stack a layer of stuff up there and get much better use of my 10x10 plot.

Make it tall enough and you get a lot more storage per square footage of land used.

 

[readhead]

Use a ridge. A single 2x10 will work fine. Put studs at 2' oc, use a single top plate and place the rafters over the studs.

 

[LeeG]

Thanks for all the input. I'll redo my design incorporating a lot of the suggestions you guys have provided and post up another drawing. I am planning on PT lumber for the floor joists. Should I go with 2x6 or will 2x4 be adequate for this size? It won't be setting on a concrete pad. I was planning on having 6 or 8 blocks sunk for corner/mid wall support sitting slightly proud from the ground.

 

[bczygan]

Thanks for all the input. I'll redo my design incorporating a lot of the suggestions you guys have provided and post up another drawing. I am planning on PT lumber for the floor joists. Should I go with 2x6 or will 2x4 be adequate for this size? It won't be setting on a concrete pad. I was planning on having 6 or 8 blocks sunk for corner/mid wall support sitting slightly proud from the ground.

Read your rules carefully. They probably say "up to and including 120SF without a permit". So you can go 10x12.

If you have 7' at the peak, with a sloped roof design, as you show, and collar ties, and say a 2x4 floor, right on grade, it will be 5' from the top of floor to the top of the walls inside.

If you want the most cubic space possible do this. Put it on a slab. That keeps the floor level low, so it is easier to roll things in and out too.

Then to get the most height possible, use a flat roof. By flat, I mean a slope of 1/4"/FT minimum. This means it will have to be covered with rubber roofing to be water tight. If you need the look of a shingle covered roof, extend a mansard from your top of roof height, down the wall a ways and that will make the wall look less tall and imposing without losing any height inside. Make the roof rafters as shallow as you can, based on the span. 4" for the slab, plus 6" for the roof structure, leaves you 6'+ clear inside. How tall are you?That means you will need to space them closer, say 2x4's 12"o.c. Do you need insulation? What is the code for fences? If you can put up an 8' fence, then you can go 8' with the top of roof. If there is an existing fence, add a lattice portion to the top.
And an overhang all around will get water away from the walls and slab.

While you are at it, do extend the roof on at least one side to create a covered area. Support it with a couple of posts and a beam. Here again, height is a problem unless you want to hit your head on the beam. Use joist hangers so the beam doesn't hang down much lower than the joists.

Install at least one large door for access with bulky items like lawnmowers etc. 4' wide at least.

Get some light into it. Skylights, a window in the door, or regular windows. If worried about security, install shutters, lockable from the inside.

 

[crazytrain]

+1 On the barn style (Gambrel roof) my shed is 10x12 and has a gambrel roof. I added a loft over half and use it to store alot of stuff up out of the way. I don't have a garage and the shed is used like one. It houses my workbench and tools so space is at a premium in there the loft really helps.

Here's the link to my shed.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=161213

 

[sophijo]

You might consider a rolling barn door for one whole side of shed. The rail cantilevers past the ends of the shed some but you can expose most of the interior...no jostling around!

 

[kenfath]

Do a Google search on "free shed plans" and you will find many plans and they will have some great ideas.

I'd suggest rethinking the concrete pad, unless your shed can't be permanent. Two yards of concrete, tie-down bolts, form lumber has a cost comparable to the flooring and joists. You could also get a small concrete pad in front of the door from the two yards. A pad of this size is a do-it-yourself with one helper project. That small quantity of concrete wheelbarrows quickly.

 

[78Bird]

Someone on here had built one on a pad of heavy duty plastic pallets.

I thought this was genius. Especially if you take the time to bolt them together into a solid plastic foundation.

no rot, and it spreads the weight across the whole area of the shed, so it should be fine as long as you level a spot for it. No serious prep needed to support the weight.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Since you're in Phoenix, make sure it have plenty of ventilation. I'd also make sure your door is wide enough for "whatever."

 

[kazlx]

Eerily familiar. Mine is a 9x14.

http://garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=173900

Like suggested, I would pour a slab. I don't think it would be that much more. I had an existing slab that I used and extended. I mixed and poured about a 9x4 by hand. That sucked.

We have small houses here, so I finished mine out to make it more attractive when we go to sell. I didn't want an obvious shed sitting out back. I wanted something that fit the landscape.

 

[petee_c]

10*16' shed. Borrowed a book from the public library on sheds. Learned how to use a rafter square. All good.

It sits on 4 patio stones in each corner. I should of added some support in the field.

http://blog.pjbj.ca/search/label/shed?m=0

 

[LeeG]

I talked with one of the inspectors for my city, and he gave me some additional information. I don't have a city specified height restriction, just an HOA one, so I can go a little higher. I don't have to worry about setback due to my yard being fenced in and the small size of the shed. I have decided to go ahead with a concrete slab (4") and change to a single pitch roof (this has more to do with my HOA than anything else. With a single pitch roof, I can get some extra height and still keep it basically not visible from the street). Same basic size as before, but the front wall is 8' and the back wall is 6'. All lumber is 2x4's

Some additional questions: With only a 3/12 slope, will a double layer of tar paper will suffice under the shingles?

Do I need PT lumber for the bottom plates on the wall? How much space should I have between the ground and the top of the slab? (Keep in mind, we don't get much rain, but we do get some heavy rain).

Any more thoughts or suggestions are welcome.

Thanks,
Lee

 

[bczygan]

Try to slope the grade away from the slab and keep it as far away from the wood framing or wall sheathing as possible. 8" minimum is ideal, but you may end up with 4". Bottom plate pressure treated and set it on sill seal. You COULD run a course of 4" block around the perimeter and start your wall on that. Just a thought. I don't like shingles on roof slopes under 12 and 12. Use a glue down rubber roof.

Give yourself at least a 6" overhang on the sides. A ladder frame will accomplish that.

Make that access door wider or a double door.

Think about throwing a piece of clear Plexiglas on the roof in a couple of places. 2'x4' pieces. Frame for it and just let it lap over, and sit on, the roof sheathing by an inch on all sides. Bed it in silicone and then glue the rubber roof to it. A cheap and dirty skylight.

Door can be a simple home made one with a 2x4's on the flat frame, skinned with plywood and painted. Don't forget a couple of 2x6's with OSB spacer for a header for up to a 4' rough opening.

No need for soffits. Just leave the rafters exposed, but use 2x4 blocking between them above the top plates.

Still thinking about extending the paving in front and also the roof for some usable outdoor workspace? If so, you could make the peak at the front wall and start back down, until the clearance reached 6' 6".

Other than that, it's looking good.

 

[bczygan]

I don't like shingles on roof slopes under 12 and 12. Use a glue down rubber roof.

I know...it's a quirk of mine. I REALLY don't like shingles when approaching 3 and 12. They are NOT a seal, nor is any underlayment perfect. So 12 and 12 sheds water, ice and snow better. Below that I like metal roofing or a membrane.

I also think shingles aren't warrantied under a certain slope. But it's just bad practice IMHO, to use them at 3 and 12 or less. But here's the disclaimer. Where he is, if rain is seldom, and comes straight down with little driven sideways by wind, they should work.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Bczygan, he lives in Phoenix ! He could get away with bare plywood for roofing !!


Nothing wrong with gravel. I some ways I like it better. You want to get the floor joists up on concrete blocks/piers at least 8-12" off the ground.

 

[bczygan]

Bczygan, he lives in Phoenix ! He could get away with bare plywood for roofing !!


Nothing wrong with gravel. I some ways I like it better. You want to get the floor joists up on concrete blocks/piers at least 8-12" off the ground.

I agree on the roofing, for that location. He's probably fine with shingles at 3/12 slope if he uses 30# felt (or 2 layers of 15#) or covers it all with ice and water shield for backup insurance to prevent driven rain that gets up under the shingles from penetrating to the roof decking.
For the floor, he has limited total height available, so piers and wood floor won't work. He's going with a slab.

 

[LeeG]

This took way longer than I had planned, but other things took priority. I got my slab poured this past weekend, and will be building it in the next couple of weeks.

As an overview, I primarily do woodworking, but I also am getting into welding and do quite a lot of volunteer work covering most of the trades. The main purpose is to allow me to have a convenient location to store all of my non-woodworking tools and supplies (as well as my lumber storage).

Here is a Sketchup of what I am currently planning. The overall size is 10' x 12' with the bottoms of the rafters just over 7' high. To get the (very minimal) slope on the roof, I am cutting 14' 2x8's at an angle to give me 3.5" of drop and will be using sealed rubber roofing.

The plates are PT 2x4, anchored to the 4" slab with 1/2" expansion anchors. Its not shown on the plan, but I will be taking bczygan's idea and using plexiglass for a cheap skylight. For a door, I am going to use a standard 36" wide external prehung door (outswing). The walls will be sheathed with OSB and covered with Hardie board (or something similar).

I am going to use the foam sill liner between the plate and the slab. I'll put blocking between the rafters and maybe a soffit. I am extending the roof out on all sides and plan on using the outside wall to hang shovels, rakes, and stuff like that. I have 3' between the shed and each of the 3 walls surrounding it so there is room to get around it. The ground outside the slab will be quarter minus.

For anyone interested, here is the result of my debut at landscaping (last summer/fall project). The shed will go on the far side of the trellis.

As usual, any comments or criticisms are welcome.
Lee

 

[sophijo]

....a couple of suggestions; from experience!

> Double the door opening, barn door style

> Research, thoroughly, skylight install procedures. They are prone to leak unless done right!

> It's too small