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Beginner Needs Tool Advice

wacomme

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Colorado Springs, CO
I'm not a mechanic or mechanically adept. However, I need a few home tools and tools to work on my bicycle. I have bike-specific tools, but I'm wanting a small but quality set of general tools for around the house, etc.

I have a small tool box, but most of the tools are cheap or worn out. I guess I could just by Craftsmen, and that would probably suffice for lifelong tools, but I'm just wanting something better quality - (snobbish, since I don't use tools daily). Please recommend some quality tools:

1) Ratcheting screwdriver - thinking rotating Snap-on.
2) Small "electrical type" screwdrivers (most of the screws I use tend to be small)
3) Ratchet and metric sockets (I'm thinking Snap-on rotating 1/4 drive ratchet). Most everything I use is metric.
4) Hex bits and t-handles (I use these a lot for my bike)
5) Good "metric" tape measure
6) 48" level (I use this for my bike)
7) Torque wrenches (for bicycle - carbon fiber). My biggest use is 4-10NM, but I also need higher. I might go cheap with two beam style wrenches (light and heavier), but I will use the low settings a lot, so I might want something better than the beam.
8) Wire cutter (the one I have is pathetic).
9) Needle-nose pliers
10) Other?

Thanks for your help.

Michael
 
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jeffmoss26

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1) I love the Snap-On ratcheting screwdrivers...I have a few of them and they are great.
2) I have a wide mix of these, a lot are just the cheap pocket clip ones but also some Craftsman
3) I do not wrench much so Craftsman is sufficient for me
4) Eklind is good stuff and US made
5) Starrett makes some nice ones, they use them here at work
6) I believe Johnson levels are still US made (someone correct me if not)
7) don't have any experience with them
8-9-10) Klein or Channellock for any and all pliers
 

kippieland

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First, welcome to the board. This place is very addictive! I am like you and have hobby that isn't very tool demanding. My hobby is MX and you can take a whole bike a part, down to the frame with 10 sockets! But my tool box has grown as I start to work on my car (cause I am broke!) and that I have found some tools will help me with my bike.

Second, I have found Amazon has a fanatastic tool collection...everything from High end to cheap Chines. Also, check out Tooltopia.com..also great. I am sure there are lots places that I am missing. Beware, you will get a lot of highend opions as well!

1. I love Wiha and Wera (German)...very nice an affordable...Amazon.com
2. Wiha again...though I have a set of Craftsman that are fine.
3. If you don't want to spend big $ I would go with SK 1/4 ratchet. I have a long-handled 1/4 that is fanatastic and tough. Plus not near the money. If you want to go big, I would go with Snap-on TL72 or Matco 88. I have both (different sizes) and I think they are both great. I would look on Ebay or the Classifieds here, instead off the truck. I got both of my So and Matco for $45 off of the CL's here. For sockets, either Cmans or SK. Why spend the bucks! SK will be a little more.
4. I highly recommend Bondus T-handled hex. I just ordered a bunch from Amazon and they are fantastic. Little bit price buy very nice. Also a set of Screw driver hex http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0006O4ADI/?tag=atomicindus08-20 Same for the bits, but Cmans are fine as well as SK.
5. Good luck...I prefer MM tapes but have only found CM tapes. Easy to convert though. I have a Stanley from Lowes.
6. I just have a Irwin level from Home Depot...works fine.
7. This is where I think you need to find a bike specific torque wrench or a very specific wrench for low NM. I would look at Precision Instruments or CDI.
9-10. Klien or Channellocks...good quality and easy to find. But if you want super high-end..Knipex or NWS. I have a pair of Knipex needle-nose bent pliers. Smoothest of them all (I have Klien and Channellocks as well) and skinny as well. But they are pricey compared to the others. I don't have an NWS pair but they are highly recommended by the board.
 
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Jwrightkustomz

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Sounds like Harbor Freight will be your friend. Don't get me wrong if you've got money to kill buy the Snap-On stuff, if you are trying to be frugal go to HF or Sears get what you need. It's cheap enough that it will pay for itself and you can buy "better" ones later if the don't suffice. If USA is a preference try your luck at Sears. I recently received a large shipment of Sears and almost nothing was china, at my local Sears I haven't seen anything that is china either.
 

iroc409

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Empire levels and so forth are US made and readily available--Home Depot.

I understand wanting good quality, but if you're not mechanically inclined why worry about being "snobbish" about the tools? Get reasonable quality and readily available stuff. Craftsman, or any of the decent big box stuff should be fine.
 

buco

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I think you are pretty smart to start off like this. When i first started i bought a bunch of lower end stuff, and am now am upgrading. I really wish i would have bought quality tools at the beginning, then you're done. I'd like to leave a fantastic set of tools behind me.

4 - pb Swiss makes awesome keys.

5 - Starrett still makes 100% made in US tape meausures.

6 - the best levels are made by Stabila in Germany. I had a awesome Starrett one and then i broke it and the new Starrett replacement was made in the Dominican.

8 & 10 - pliers - klein, Knipex, or nws
 
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plung

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I wouldn't go the HF route. Sounds like you want to invest in quality stuff now. I'm currently replacing all of my Craftsman and other cheap hand tools with better ones.

Do you need a ratchet wrench and sockets for a bicycle? How about a ratcheting screwdriver with nut drivers? They also have shafts for screwdrivers and bits. I have a complete set.

GearDriver™ Screwdriver Sets# 8909
8909.jpg
 
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wacomme

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I wouldn't go the HF route. Sounds like you want to invest in quality stuff now. I'm currently replacing all of my Craftsman and other cheap hand tools with better ones.

Do you need a ratchet wrench and sockets for a bicycle? How about a ratcheting screwdriver with nut drivers? They also have shafts for screwdrivers and bits. I have a complete set.

GearDriver™ Screwdriver Sets# 8909
8909.jpg
Wow! Fantastic advice. Thanks so much everyone!!!

Perhaps I don't need a ratchet wrench and socket. Are there ratcheting screwdrivers with 1/4" heads and handles that can deliver my torque than a regular screwdriver handle? Also, are there find-toothed screwdriver ratchets?
 

SINISTER

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Ok going from a beginning tech to a master tech in an auto shop, and then from a freight hoist mechanic to a professional construction management engineer. I have a lot of recommendations.

From an economical stand point, its great you want some better tools. I admire that, but you really want to look at things in life from an economical stand point. You want to have the cheapest tool that will work for what you need it to do for the longest amount of time. Life cycle.

Number one, you said you don't work in a shop, and you are not mechanically adept. So honestly that means to me you wouldn't know the difference between a craftsman wrench and a snap-on wrench if there was no logos engraved on them.

Second, if you do buy snap-on, or Matco, or mac, or even sk you will pay big money for them. Go take a look on the snap on website at hand tools, something that craftsman charges for a complete set snap-on charges for one wrench. General if you speak to a snap on truck dealer you can get snap-on tools for slightly less than what they charge on their website.

Third, if you aren't making money with these tools. There is zero pay back period, and very minimal time constraints to complete a job if any. General speaking a better quality dual80 ratchet from Snap-On will be able to get the same job done a little quicker than a 32 or less tooth bottom line from Craftsman. In the end the same job will be done regardless. So ask yourself, do you need to get jobs done quicker, with less hassle? Will there be a payback period to pay for your tools?

Fourth, is my recommendation. Seems to me as you wouldnt know or ever have the need to know/feel the difference between a fine high quality tool like a snap-on compared to a mid-high end tool like Craftsman PRO or SK. So thats where I will weigh my recommendations, more towards mid-high end tools. Not low end regular Craftsman, HF, Duralast, ect. But the next step up, Craftsman PRO, GearWrench, SK...

1) Ratcheting screwdriver - thinking rotating Snap-on. (Gear Wrench makes a comparable model for less money)

2) Small "electrical type" screwdrivers (Craftsman makes a NEXTEC impact driver that is less $ and beats all competition in performance. This can be used across the board as a drill/driver combo)

3) Ratchet and metric sockets (For ratchet I usually don't use anything other than snap-on, but a 1/4 ratchet will cost you over 100$. In your case stay away from the raised panel **** from craftsman and go with a Craftsman PRO or NextGen.) You will need a 1/4" standard size 3/8" standard and 3/8" long handle or breaker bar. Craftsman 6pt laser etched sockets will be perfectly fine for you, as they are fine for me. If you run into 12pt heads you want 12pt sockets, if you don't there's no reason to have them

4) Hex bits and t-handles (I use these a lot for my bike) Hex bits are also another thing I myself would never get anywhere but snap on but I am a mechanic and my tools very very much abused everyday. My 1/4" set alone was $215 then I also have a 3/8" and 1/2" Impact set.( I though have a back up set from NEIKO off of amazon. Its a master set of hex bits has every size you will need and its only 60$. I have had no problems with them to date, I also use them to lend.)

5) Good "metric" tape measure (okay as a construction manager I probably have the most pull here. By far the best tape measures I use are Stanley fat max and husky Model # 007-674-HKY you want at lease one 25') Then you can use any brand for your small stuff. EDIT: if you are measuring small pipes, bolts, hex heads ect you want a digital caliper. It would be foolish to use a tape for something to tiny and exact. HF has some decent calipers for cheap. I have had them for years and they work.

6) 48" level (I use this for my bike) Lowes has quite the selection of levels. You want an aluminum level with high strength magnets the circular type not the crappy strip.

7) Torque wrenches (for bicycle - carbon fiber). My biggest use is 4-10NM, but I also need higher. I might go cheap with two beam style wrenches (light and heavier), but I will use the low settings a lot, so I might want something better than the beam. (cant go wrong with the craftsman beam torque wrenches they work fine.) Husky though has a lifetime warrenty unlike any other TQ wrench, I think they would be good for you.)

If you want tighter accuracy with low settings your gonna need to go with digital 1/4" snap-on, though you will be spending over $200-300 for one single wrench.

Most if not all TQ wrenches are only accurate within the mid-high range of their actual advertised range. So if a wrench is advert. for 15-125lbs is most likely will be weighted more accurate from maybe 30-40lbs to around 110-115lbs


8) Wire cutter (the one I have is pathetic). Wire cutters ahh, same deal as the needle nose pliers. Go on amazon and go crazy with the channel lock brand they are IMO the best.( Lineman's pliers, the best is Klein tools I have been in the buisness and know this) Neither will break bank.

9) Needle-nose pliers (see above)

10) Other? (Yes of course. You will need a good set of pliers. Real pliers. Knipex makes THE BEST pliers on the market called cobras. Ask any tool freak. but they are about 60$ a piece. Luckily for you Knipex re-branded the cobra pliers for craftsman and you can get a nice 2 plier set for under $40.)

(Also you want a set of turbo sockets or bolt extractors. SK makes an awesome set which I own for around 100-130$) Nothing beats a bolt extractor when you need to get a stripped bolt out.

Wrenches! you mentioned nothing about wrenches. Snap-on makes the best wrenches period IMO. For 350$ a set I don't know if that makes much sense here, that would be silly. Craftsman PRO has a great metric set that I use at home. Awesome quality, full polished, not that base line raised panel **** from craftsman. $99.00

Gear wrenches, you should have a stubby set and a standard set. Gear-wrench brand is go-to for this area they are awesome, less money than snap on which most of the time is just re-branded gear-wrench , strong, and 100x better than the crappy gearwrenches with the craftsman logo.
 
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jjjrmx5

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I currently own 9 bicycles ranging from TT and ex-olympic road bikes to half a dozen or so mountain bikes and do all my own repairs along with fixing friends and family bikes as well.

I suggest a mid-range socket set in 1/4" and 3/8" (and 1/2") if you can afford it. Craftsman or Duralast is often adequate, but S-K is a nice step up.

If you want high end ratchets, I personally suggest the Snap_on 80 tooth ratchets.

For pliers, get a 10" Knipex plierwrench (for working on headsets, bottom brackets, etc), a 10" Knipex Cobra and the 8" Knipex mini bolt cutter for cutting stainless braided brake and derauiller cabes and they even cut spokes (cutting the cables with std. diag. cutters can damage all but the best cutters out there). All 3 of the above can be found at your local Sears or Lowes stores.

I use a Snap-On ratcheting screwdriver all the time fitted with the 1/4" bit hex to 1/4" or 3/8" drive adaptors and then just use regular socktes insted of buying all the indiviual nut drivers. Also using a bit driver allows me to use bits down to P00 vs. the mini screwdriver set. If money is scare , look for a used ratcheting unit or pick up the Williams driver on amazon.com for half the price.

For hex stuff I use Craftsman t-handles and then have a full bit set for torx, sae hex and metric hex from OEM out of Taiwan.

For torque wrenchs, I suggest a Pi , or scour your local pawn shops and see if they have any at a discount (I've seen several Snap-On's at local pawn shops in the last year).

Outside of those above and bike tools, I can do most any work with the exception of combonation wrenchs in both sae and metric.

Just my $.02 from a GJ member who cycles daily.
 
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richfinn

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Carbon framed bike, I would be looking at "park tools" for cycle specific stuff

Snap on/stahlwille/hazet/gedore/facom for sockets/ratchets/extensions/wrenches.

Wiha for screwdrivers/hex keys/hex bits.

I like knipex for pliers

try "motion pro" for T handled drivers and nut runners
 

plung

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Wow! Fantastic advice. Thanks so much everyone!!!

Perhaps I don't need a ratchet wrench and socket. Are there ratcheting screwdrivers with 1/4" heads and handles that can deliver my torque than a regular screwdriver handle? Also, are there find-toothed screwdriver ratchets?

Actually, you will need sockets. You will be using a torque wrench so sockets will are needed.
 
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wacomme

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Everyone, your help has been invaluable. Here are my current thoughts and questions:

1) T- hex: I'm thinking Bondus 13189 from Amazon for $25.

2) Ratcheting Screwdriver: Possible Snap-On, but which model? There's a set from Gear Wrench at Sears for $35. I saw the box last night at the store, but the sales guy wouldn't let me open it up to see how it feels. How does the Gear Wrench screwdriver compare to Snap-On? Also, seeing all of the sockets and hexes I can use with the screwdriver, I'm wondering if I need a "real" socket wrench. With a T-handle style grip, I might be able to apply sufficient torque without the need for a ratchet and sockets. Thoughts?

3) 48" Level: Likely an Empire model at Home Depot.

4) If I do get a ratchet, is 1/4" or 3/8" more useful? I know this depends on use, but generally, which size is more useful? I can only buy one. If I go Snap-on, I'll probably look for used. But, as mentioned in #2 above, is a ratchet and sockets really necessary if I have a good ratcheting screwdriver?

5) Pliers: The Knipex 10" pliers at Sears are $45. For pliers, are these the ones to get? Should I consider Klein for needle nose? Straight or bent?

6) Wire Cutter: The Knipex Mini Bolt Cutter seems good at $36.

7) Wrenches: Sorry for the naive question, but why would I need wrenches if I have a ratchet and sockets, or even the ratcheting screwdriver with hex and sockets?

8) Torque Wrench: Since most of my critical bicycle bolts require 5 N/M, I think I'll buy the Williams Pro Torq Bicycle Tool for $25. I might need another torque wrench for higher torques too, perhaps the Park TW-2.

9) Screwdrivers (Regular): ????

10) I also have a need for a small digital level. Suggestions?


Thanks again.

Michael
 

mypov

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Wonderful to have all those tools...don't know how many times I've needed a socket set for working on the house. If you already have the tools required for your bike/hobby work. I would invest in some house friendly tools.
1. good hammer
1.5 makita, dewalt, ridgid, or milwakee drill and impact driver (seriously, have used my drills and impact drivers more than my hammers around the house).
2. plumbers wrench
3. good tape measure, square, framing triangle, levels
3.5 good pouch or bag/tool box for your tools
4. decent set of screw drivers, robertson 1 and 2, couple different phillips and flat blade
5. nice construction grade razor knife
6. compound mitre saw
7. table saw

The list goes on and on depending on how much work you want to do around your house. The way I've collected tools is pick a job, find out what tools are needed for that job. Borrow/rent the ones you figure you will not use again and purchase the ones that will offer continued use.
No race for this, the more time passes the more tools you will collect, then you'll run into the problem of needing a place for your tools.
Enjoy.
 
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wacomme

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I'm trying to cut back a little. I already have a hammer, impact drill/driver, and a small tool chest. A good tape measure is needed (wanting to find metric only; I have an old imperial one). I've never had the need for a square or framing triangle, nor mitre and table saws. I good knife would be nice to have, though. I've never needed a plumbers wrench either; I'd call a plumber.

However, I do need to turn various metric hex nuts and bolts. Good screwdrivers are needed too, especially small ones. Pliers are needed as well, especially a small needle-nose type. Oh, and a good wire cutter is essential.
Wonderful to have all those tools...don't know how many times I've needed a socket set for working on the house. If you already have the tools required for your bike/hobby work. I would invest in some house friendly tools.
1. good hammer
1.5 makita, dewalt, ridgid, or milwakee drill and impact driver (seriously, have used my drills and impact drivers more than my hammers around the house).
2. plumbers wrench
3. good tape measure, square, framing triangle, levels
3.5 good pouch or bag/tool box for your tools
4. decent set of screw drivers, robertson 1 and 2, couple different phillips and flat blade
5. nice construction grade razor knife
6. compound mitre saw
7. table saw

The list goes on and on depending on how much work you want to do around your house. The way I've collected tools is pick a job, find out what tools are needed for that job. Borrow/rent the ones you figure you will not use again and purchase the ones that will offer continued use.
No race for this, the more time passes the more tools you will collect, then you'll run into the problem of needing a place for your tools.
Enjoy.
 
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volunteers

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Everyone, your help has been invaluable. Here are my current thoughts and questions:

2) Ratcheting Screwdriver: Possible Snap-On, but which model? There's a set from Gear Wrench at Sears for $35. I saw the box last night at the store, but the sales guy wouldn't let me open it up to see how it feels. How does the Gear Wrench screwdriver compare to Snap-On? Also, seeing all of the sockets and hexes I can use with the screwdriver, I'm wondering if I need a "real" socket wrench. With a T-handle style grip, I might be able to apply sufficient torque without the need for a ratchet and sockets. Thoughts?


Michael
For your 2) Ratcheting Screwdriver, I have that gearwrench set and it works great. It has very similar design with Snapons, but with more bits, extensions, etc. If you can wait, Sears has it on sale several times a year for about $19.99.
I bought the set last year with $17.49 + tax. It is a very good choice with this price range.
 
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shoturtle

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I think you might just want to get a craftsmen or kolboth tool set and pick up a torque wrench and a ratchet screw driver and T set and call it a day. Going the snap on route to will give you very high end tool, but will also pads the bill allot. You did say you do not use you tools for a living.

I would start with something like this, and build form that.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_338514-2232...d_nbr|0||p_product_quantity_sold|1&facetInfo=

http://www.lowes.com/pd_239446-1687.../pl__0__s?Ntt=ratchet+screw+driver&facetInfo=
 
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Squankum

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Metric tape measures are definitely available. Use the search function here, or google to get into here. I wound up with a nice Starrett that's all metric, and a "window" tape measure by Festool (that's actually kinda cheap and plasticy and not really Festool, but hey, still got a window, and window tape measures can be kewl.)

Finding tapes that are purely metric is a little harder. Finding some that are part English, part metric, not so hard, Stanley and the like do make them.

For bike work, you definitely need calipers, and $30 gets you a nice plastic digital Mitutoyo from Enco. Seat posts and stems and handlebars.

I used 3/8" drive Sears CMan metric hex bits for many years on bikes, purchased in 90's, excellent quality, great value at $30. Alas, word on the street is that these aren't as good as they used to be. Check out the Stanley version of this at Wal-Mart, they're a great value and people say they're okay, too.

Also bought a $10 Chinese T-handle hex set at the flea market in the 90's that has been ... amazingly decent.
 
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wacomme

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Thank you. However, I'd much rather have a few very nice tools than a large set of mediocre tools. As I get older, now age 50, I'm downsizing and getting rid of a lot of junk and stuff. What I do own, and use, is top quality. In fact, this weekend I'll be going through my tool chest and getting rid of half of it (the garbage tools). I just don't want to store and keep track of them.
I think you might just want to get a craftsmen or kolboth tool set and pick up a torque wrench and a ratchet screw driver and T set and call it a day. Going the snap on route to will give you very high end tool, but will also pads the bill allot. You did say you do not use you tools for a living.

I would start with something like this, and build form that.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_338514-2232...d_nbr|0||p_product_quantity_sold|1&facetInfo=

http://www.lowes.com/pd_239446-1687.../pl__0__s?Ntt=ratchet+screw+driver&facetInfo=
 
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wacomme

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Why do I need calipers for my bike?
Metric tape measures are definitely available. Use the search function here, or google to get into here. I wound up with a nice Starrett that's all metric, and a "window" tape measure by Festool (that's actually kinda cheap and plasticy and not really Festool, but hey, still got a window, and window tape measures can be kewl.)

Finding tapes that are purely metric is a little harder. Finding some that are part English, part metric, not so hard, Stanley and the like do make them.

For bike work, you definitely need calipers, and $30 gets you a nice plastic digital Mitutoyo from Enco. Seat posts and stems and handlebars.

I used 3/8" drive Sears CMan metric hex bits for many years on bikes, purchased in 90's, excellent quality, great value at $30. Alas, word on the street is that these aren't as good as they used to be. Check out the Stanley version of this at Wal-Mart, they're a great value and people say they're okay, too.

Also bought a $10 Chinese T-handle hex set at the flea market in the 90's that has been ... amazingly decent.
 
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shoturtle

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Thank you. However, I'd much rather have a few very nice tools than a large set of mediocre tools. As I get older, now age 50, I'm downsizing and getting rid of a lot of junk and stuff. What I do own, and use, is top quality. In fact, this weekend I'll be going through my tool chest and getting rid of half of it (the garbage tools). I just don't want to store and keep track of them.

Actually the kolbolt stuff are pretty good. I would go with a smaller ratchet set form them in that case that covers 1/4 and 3/8 drive. They are actually nicer then the Craftsmen ratchet set. Color coded and have much finder teeth. 72 vs 36 so is good for tight area.

But I hear were you are coming form. I do not used my tools as much as I uses to for work. And the stuff I buy now are mostly US or EU made tools.

I would look at the wera tools, they have some nice stuff. This is a great ratcheting screw driver.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004VMWYCU/?tag=atomicindus08-20

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004VMWZ0Q/?tag=atomicindus08-20
 
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kippieland

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Kobalt is made by the same people that make Craftsman tools. I have a small 1/4 drive set that I got for $9.99 and it quite nice. The ratchet has 72 teeth...but is made in Taiwan. I like your list so far. I think you need to look at this to places for Knipex pliers. Much cheaper then Sears. I really like my Klien pliers and are a lot cheaper then Knipex, but Knipex are the best. Just hard for me to justify the extra expense when Klien are US made and do the job great.

http://chadstoolbox.com/

As for which drive is better it depends on your application. For me, 3/8 is preferred because of the higher torque settings of most bolts, but since you are working with very low torque stuff, a 1/4 is what I would use.

Since you are not that mechanically inclined, I do agree with some of the posts that you maybe overkilling it a bit. For over 11 years, my Craftsman RP ratchets (cheap and not that nice) worked great. Now I choose to upgrade with used stuff because the truck brands new are to much for DIY'er like me to spend. Brands like Armstrong, SK, Proto, and Williams are much cheaper and same in quality. They are just harder to find. That being said, the HF pro ratchet (all sizes and made in Taiwan) are really good for the money...a lot nicer then the Craftsman RP. Most MX guys do not have very nice tools and have zero problems...my friend has a set from HD that he loves and works fine.

At the same time, I understand your desire to have nice tools....which there are a lot of them out there...Just remember that Truck brands are the top on this board BUT they are also the top in price because of their name. The brands I meantioned above are as nice and share some of the same internals as the truck brands....such as the Armstrong 10-992 and the Matco 88....but at less then half the cost. For me, when I was new here, it helped to read the posts here for awhile and then I was able to get a broader picture of which tools to get.

But so far your list is great and filled with top quality stuff and they will never let you down.

Have fun shopping!:thumbup:
 

kythri

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Lebanon, OR
Thank you. However, I'd much rather have a few very nice tools than a large set of mediocre tools. As I get older, now age 50, I'm downsizing and getting rid of a lot of junk and stuff. What I do own, and use, is top quality. In fact, this weekend I'll be going through my tool chest and getting rid of half of it (the garbage tools). I just don't want to store and keep track of them.

The thing is, if you buy one of the comprehensive Craftsman sets, you're not spending much per tool at all.

Quite honestly, it's cheaper to buy the big set, throw in the trash what you really don't want, and replace with the supposedly "better" stuff, than it would be to piecemeal it all together from the start.

Further, the big thing you have to realize is that "very nice" and "mediocre" are completely subjective.

For all the bashing that the raised panel ratchets from Craftsman get (in this thread and elsewhere), you need to realize that there are likely millions of people using them without issue, and some of those people are here on this very board, and have confirmed that they've got no issues. They're not perfect, but for most folks, they get the job done, and they don't explode/automatically reverse/slip/jam/whatever.

For all the fawning over Snap-on ratchets in this thread and elsewhere, there are people that don't think that they're the Second Coming. Personally, I think they're uncomfortable as hell, with their machined-in lip/ring around the handle. I won't go so far as to call them a pile of ****, but the F80 is definitely something I won't use unless I'm wearing a Mechanix glove, which, ultimately, makes it a bad tool.

If there's a comprehensive set from Craftsman, or Kobalt, or someone else that's not considered "premium" that meets your overall needs, and is priced right, give it and the denigrated tools a chance.
 

kippieland

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Joined
Oct 22, 2011
Messages
1,123
Location
Western Washington
Kythri: Great point. I bought a 170 piece C-man socket set this fall for WAY cheaper then if I would have pieced the set. It was .85 cents per socket. HF can't even touch that!

I do however, disagree with you on the F80...but everyone can have opinions on things and after all....its still just a ratchet! They all take things on and off!
 
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shoturtle

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Jan 15, 2012
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Frankfurt AM
I think for what the OP is using it for a F80 is a bit of a overkill. I am also not a fan of the F80 handle. I much prefer cushion handles on hazet, gadora, matador and wera.
 

Everett

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Jan 16, 2012
Messages
81
Location
Des Moine. Iowa
First welcome, i'm new too, but heres a bit advice, no matter what brand of tool you buy, is only gonna last as long as you matain them, and care for them, second i don't know your age nor care too, i'm 55 myself, but neverless, what ever you buy , make sure you save all reciepts, the cops peek in your garage and you got 5 snap -on rollaways full of tools and your only 17 , hum, just saying,:3gears:
 
OP
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wacomme

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Feb 1, 2012
Messages
152
Location
Colorado Springs, CO
First welcome, i'm new too, but heres a bit advice, no matter what brand of tool you buy, is only gonna last as long as you matain them, and care for them, second i don't know your age nor care too, i'm 55 myself, but neverless, what ever you buy , make sure you save all reciepts, the cops peek in your garage and you got 5 snap -on rollaways full of tools and your only 17 , hum, just saying,:3gears:

Nice advice for a thief. However, I'm age 50 (not that it matters), and I'm not stealing tools for a collection. I'm seeking to buy new and/or used tools.

Saving receipts may be useful (or not) for warranty issues, but I'm not the least bit concerned about having cops look in my garage . . . well, I would be concerned it they looked - why would they want to look?
 
OP
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wacomme

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Feb 1, 2012
Messages
152
Location
Colorado Springs, CO
Again, thanks for all of your advice. If anything, the discussion helps me rethink what I really need before I go out and buy things. Here's my whittled down changes/questions since yesterday:

1) T-Hex: Most likely Bondus 13189 metric set. Do Wera or Wiha make better sets?

2) 3/8" ratchet: the more I think about the more I probably need one, if nothing else than for my bicycle. I'll try to find a used Snap-on one to keep the cost down. I think a ratcheting screwdriver will suffice for lower torque applications, thus the want for a 3/8" ratchet instead of 1/4" (for those higher leverage applications).

3) Ratcheting Screwdriver: Ack! I'm still undecided. The 5 position Snap-on seems nice, but some people seem to have problems with it moving about in use, and the 1/4 twist cap oftentimes become inadvertently undone. So, the straight version might be better. Then again, the Wiha Topra Set seems quite interesting too. Thoughts on the Snap-on vs. the Wiha Topra, or even the Wera?

4) These NWS pliers seem quite interesting. But are the Knipex 10" pliers more useful overall?

Other: From my previous post, I don't mean to lambast Craftsman, and I was draconic with my "mediocre" label. However, I don't want to buy Craftsman. Craftsman tools take me back to my youth when my father made me help him repair the family car, etc. The memories are not pleasant, and the visual of Craftsman ratchets and sockets is distasteful. The experience is also why I've avoided mechanical work most of my life. In fact, my wife was flummoxed when I fixed a broken electrical fixture many years ago when we were first married. "How did you do that?" she asked. "I know how to fix things," I replied. "I just don't like to do it." Only now am I beginning to separate from the past on this issue and come into my own. The tools need to be mine, not my fathers. While I won't be working on cars (I have a wonderful mechanic), I am beginning to use tools more often than before.
 
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brimorga

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Feb 16, 2009
Messages
256
Location
Bay Area, Ca
Actually the kolbolt stuff are pretty good. I would go with a smaller ratchet set form them in that case that covers 1/4 and 3/8 drive. They are actually nicer then the Craftsmen ratchet set. Color coded and have much finder teeth. 72 vs 36 so is good for tight area.

But I hear were you are coming form. I do not used my tools as much as I uses to for work. And the stuff I buy now are mostly US or EU made tools.

I would look at the wera tools, they have some nice stuff. This is a great ratcheting screw driver.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004VMWYCU/?tag=atomicindus08-20

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004VMWZ0Q/?tag=atomicindus08-20

That Wera is very popular and so is this Williams one.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002NI1LZK/?tag=atomicindus08-20
 

kippieland

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Joined
Oct 22, 2011
Messages
1,123
Location
Western Washington
Wera is on par with Williams...Wera looks cooler.:lol: Your list is looking great. I think you could really use both size ratchets. The more you grow the more you will use them. I can understand your desire to stay away from Craftsman. There are alot of different ratchets out there that are high quality...if you like the Wera, they make an awesome one!:dunno:


Wiha and Wera are on the same level as Bondus...Amazon is having some good deals on them right now.

Here a link on t-handles I did a while ago...might help

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126167

Heres on Ratchts:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=124489

I like Wiha anything and I think you should compromise on the pliers...Get both!:thumbup:

List is looking great....going to have bitchin little set.
 
OP
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wacomme

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Joined
Feb 1, 2012
Messages
152
Location
Colorado Springs, CO
Wera is on par with Williams...Wera looks cooler.:lol: Your list is looking great. I think you could really use both size ratchets. The more you grow the more you will use them. I can understand your desire to stay away from Craftsman. There are alot of different ratchets out there that are high quality...if you like the Wera, they make an awesome one!:dunno:


Wiha and Wera are on the same level as Bondus...Amazon is having some good deals on them right now.

Here a link on t-handles I did a while ago...might help

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126167

Heres on Ratchts:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=124489

I like Wiha anything and I think you should compromise on the pliers...Get both!:thumbup:

List is looking great....going to have bitchin little set.
This set?

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002S0O9MK/?tag=atomicindus08-20
 
OP
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wacomme

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Joined
Feb 1, 2012
Messages
152
Location
Colorado Springs, CO
Current Purchase List:

1) Fastcap PMMR-TRUE32 PMMR True32 5m, Metric/Metric Reverse measuring tape: $8.53, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000GFHABG/?tag=atomicindus08-20
2) Wiha 33496 8-Piece Soft Grip T-Handle Ball End Hex Metric, $36.18, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B002S0O9MK/?tag=atomicindus08-20
3) Wera KK 25 7-In-1 Bitholding Screwdriver with Removable Bayonet Blade (SL/PH), $34.25, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B001HSNHM2/?tag=atomicindus08-20
4) J.H. Williams CDI Pro Torq Bicycle Tool, $25.05, http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004XG5YIA/?tag=atomicindus08-20
5) Three NWS pliers/cutters from http://www.german-hand-tools.com/index.html, 138-69-200, 1096-69-200, and 140-69-205.
6) Used Snap-On 3/8” ratchet. Prefer the one with a grip, unsure about flex-head.
7) Misc. Wera or Wiha tips and sockets as needed.
8) 48” Level (Empire?) from Home Depot.

Thoughts/comments?
 

shoturtle

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Joined
Jan 15, 2012
Messages
4,395
Location
Frankfurt AM
How does this Wera set compare to the Williams or the other Wera sets listed above? Which one is preferred?

I have that ratchet and love it, it is made in Czech. The tooling is very proccise for the socket. The Williams are the same as the blue point. They are made in Taiwan. Very good quality. But I think they are about the same as kolbolt.

Wiha or wera, the hex wiha are better, ratcheting screw driver wera.
 
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