Best battery for back up sump pump

[hd54kh]

Just installing a Wayne ESP25 12 Volt back up sump pump. Now it is battery purchase time. I want to go with the 75 amp hour choice and can be up to a 27 frame size.

Any suggestions on what and where to purchase? Looking for the longest life and run time.

Also I can't seem to find any specs on the motor but anyone have an idea about how much run time a back up sump can run on battery power?

Terry

 

[LB-1911]

Current thread concerning AGM Batteries @
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=294121


Deka 8A27 (8A27M) AGM Battery
http://www.dcbattery.com/deka_8a27.html


NSB-AGM-27M Battery
http://buy.northstarbattery.com/p/nsb-agm-27m-battery

 

[steve308]

If you have city water look into a 'hydraulically driven' back up sump pump. Runs on city water pressure thru float activation - for every gallon of city water that drives the impeller they pump 8-12 gallons - even the best battery will go dead after an extended outage. If your on a well -- check your battery often - change yearly if you are in an area of constant electrical outage.

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Battery size & cycling frequency determine run time. If you have longer outages and no generator, it won't do much for you. Most will run long enough to get a portable genny set up and running. Also, keep in mind DC battery back up pumps only move about 1/2 the volume of water the AC main pump moves.

Tommy

 

[hd54kh]

Ok, Wayne specs sealed lead battery, will their charger also be compatable for AGM?

I was hoping to stay on the budget of 100-125.00 bucks some of the AGMs get up there in cost.

I'm on a well, and fairly reliable power. I am gone sometimes a few months at a time and have family/friends/neighbors checking daily on the house and collecting mail, yard maintenance.......

Being in a rock ledge enviorment water creeps in sometimes but not always, I'm sealed up pretty good.

I do get some water intrusion but the existing pedestal pump keeps up with it. The basement is just 12'x12' and is just for the house services only, with critical equipment set up on a 4 inch higher slab than the lower section with the sump pump pit at the lowest area.

With the exception of a monumental storm the existing pump will see service if we get a sudden spring thaw or a week +- of heavy rain. and will not continuously run but it is needed.

I rarely see power outages for more than a few minutes to maybe an hour or so. If we were expecting anything worse than normal I would return home and have the generator ready and all will be under my control.

The back up is for the minor unattended events.

I'm never more than 12 hours away so it hopefully can buy me some time if all else fails.

Oh and where I am for local shopping I am limited to Advance Auto, NAPA, Lowes, HD and Wally Mart.

Not much more around here.

Terry

 

[Tdbo]

Use a marine battery in mine from Advance Auto.
Be sure to purchase on line and use discount code for the best price.

 

[kbs2244]

You are looking at slow recharge after slow discharge.
Classic marine description of duty cycle
Go with the largest lead/acid marine you can afford
It will be heavy but once in place you will never move it.
Your pump should have come with a charger?
If it is a submerged pump it's duty cycle is going to be pretty long as it is water cooled.
WallyWorld or a big box sporting store will be your best be money wise.

 

[hd54kh]

Thanks for the input.

It seems Advance Auto has a deep cycle marine in stock with on line discount store pick up right around 96.00. Thanks for the heads up Tdbo.

It is the 550 CCA size 24 one that would give me the 75ah spec.

kbs2244 - I didn't think of the sporting goods box store, got to see what they have to offer.

I am a bit weary of the Wally Mart stuff sometimes, not sure if their low pricing is quantity or a lower spec for similar items.

Terry

 

[theoldwizard1]

Ok, Wayne specs sealed lead battery, ...

Unless there are some other components (electronics) in the battery box, there is no need for it to be sealed. The major advantage of an AGM is it won't spill if it is knocked over.

Go to Costco and buy a marine battery. I think Costco has switched from Kirland (house) brand to Interstate. Best bang for the buck. You do need to check the water level once a month.

Plug the charger into a cheap mechanical lamp timer set to only run the charge about 1 hour per day. This will maximize battery life.



(Personally, if you have not bought the unit yet, I would buy a battery box that hold 2 GC-1 6V golf cart batteries and a Battery Tender Jr. Still connect it to a lamp timer. Much longer run time and the charger is made by a company that specialize in charger, not one that make pumps.)

 

[hd54kh]

Hi theoldwizard1, I already had bought the pump sometime ago on a really good deal. I know what you mean about a pump company making a charger. I know the BT I use on my other equipment is well designed and I believe it is not a parasitic draw with no AC with the cables hooked up. The one from Wayne I don't know.

The area is small 12'x12' with an under 6' ceiling. only equipment is the power, communication, water tanks and furnace. No inside access only an exterior bulkhead door. Maybe small enough area to be concerned with gasses from charging. Built in 1840 I have it as sealed up as much as possible but not air tight.

No Costco in this area we just got an Advance Auto a few months ago the other box stores are 15-20 miles. The only other chain in our area is a McDonalds near an interstate exchange. Not much around.

I am putting the house on the market in the next year or two, sounds funny but it is getting too busy around here. I travel between here and the new place so I can be gone for a month or six.

Terry

 

[Showkey]

I also have had trouble with the charger that come with the backup pump "boiling" the water out of the battery. Ditched the stock charger and replaced it with Schmaucher battery maintainer / charger with a "float charge" never had problem after that. Not sure how a sealed battery would have responded to that constant over charge. Obviously a timer on the stock charger would also solve the charging issue if it really is a problem in your case. Also obvious having a fully charged battery would be important if and when the power goes out.

If your not there they have little value .......but the $8.00 water alarms are real handy at the well entrance, water softener, water heater, sump pump , floor drains and wash machine areas.

Where ever you buy the battery.......look at the date codes and try to get one that's not been on the shelf for a year.

 

[Crazy68Dart]

I am using an AGM if I remember correctly the mfg is "Discover".

This is my setup.

I actually have two sumps at my place. I ran a dedicated circuit to the other sump with the same backup setup. Both share the battery. I don't have major water issues (the sumps don't run that often, spring melt, and if we get a lot of rain). I was going to add an additional battery in parallel, but never did. The battery was close to 300.00 I think.

I think this is it:

http://www.harrisbattery.com/products/battery/agm/battery-12v35ah

 

[theoldwizard1]

The area is small 12'x12' with an under 6' ceiling. only equipment is the power, communication, water tanks and furnace. No inside access only an exterior bulkhead door. Maybe small enough area to be concerned with gasses from charging.

It can't be "sealed". If it was, you would not be able to have a furnace in there.

It you are that concerned, add a small vent to the door.

 

[Wamerjamer]

You might look into the "basement watchdog" batteries at lowes or HD.You have to fill em yourself. I've had good service with them,but mine is used with the system charger and water sensor. It should work ok with a decent charger/tender.
Randy

 

[LS6 Tommy]

I'm never more than 12 hours away so it hopefully can buy me some time if all else fails.

Terry

There's no way a battery pump will cover that unless you have a rack full of batteries.

Tommy

 

[Wamerjamer]

There's no way a battery pump will cover that unless you have a rack full of batteries.

Tommy

If the pump runs continually,then you are right. On mine it just runs maybe once a minute maybe twice,at that rate the battery'll last for days,YMMV.
Randy

 

[LS6 Tommy]

If the pump runs continually,then you are right. On mine it just runs maybe once a minute maybe twice,at that rate the battery'll last for days,YMMV.
Randy

Maybe. 2 cycles a minute, 72 minutes in 12 hours, ** amp/minute draw, 75AH battery...

My cousin's sump pump runs at about that & his backup killed the battery in less than 6 hours. Didn't matter anyway. It couldn't move enough water to stay ahead once the primary 120VAC pump lost power. Of course, that doesn't mean it's sized properly. I've never looked into it. His "Service Provider" and I don't exactly see eye-to-eye, so I stay out of those things. In the past I've called him out on a couple of things he did wrong and then had the balls to charge my cousin a second time to make them correct. Little things like no condensate drain on the HVAC, the trap on his slop sink was 90 sideways, so it didn't do anything...


Tommy

 

[77thor]

Just be aware that those batteries only last 4-5 years before replacing...

I recently did some work in my basement which required moving electrical and my pump switched over to the battery... the backup pump ran, BUT the battery did not have enough power to get the pump to raise the water 8 feet up the discharge pipe to get it outside... That battery was just over 4 years old!!!
I called Wayne customer service and they told me that 4-5 years was the expected life.

 

[Wamerjamer]

Damn Tommy,put that maff away. I shoud have just said my power has failed and the back-up has did it's job for " many" hours serveral times at my house before.
Can't get away with nothin round here.
Randy

 

[LS6 Tommy]

Damn Tommy,put that maff away. I shoud have just said my power has failed and the back-up has did it's job for " many" hours serveral times at my house before.
Can't get away with nothin round here.
Randy

Maff. As long as it works for ya!
Tommy

 

[theoldwizard1]

Longer run time = 2 6v golf cart batteries.

If you want AGM, Trojan Batteries now has AGM 6V golf cart batteries.

 

[hd54kh]

Still on the fence about the battery purchase, so far the Advance Auto deal seems the best.

Historically if I had an event say like Irene, Sandy or Lee my existing pump would cycle thru several times a minute. A heavy rain event after a normal winter it can cycle a couple of times a minute. A normal heavy rain for a few days it might cycle every few minutes if at all.

If a major storm was predicted I would be here and prepared, a heavy rain even maybe not.

Another thing in my favor is the back up pump is rated to pump more water than my primary. The discharge pipe rises about 5 feet from the bottom of the pit to the point of exit, than it slopes down hill to a point lower than the basement about 20 feet away and I do get a syphoning effect.

I'm not too concearned over to battery life as I hopefully will sell this place before I need a new set.

I figure run time is only good on paper the state of charge, battery age, battery maintenance will all make a difference.

I've been here for 34 years and twice the water got away from me. Once my first spring thaw, next was just a few years ago the motor on my sump pump burnt out.

Terry

 

[hd54kh]

Lots of battery choices here. More reading........

Terry

 

[theoldwizard1]

Historically if I had an event say like Irene, Sandy or Lee my existing pump would cycle thru several times a minute.

So I hope your second backup is a generator !

 

[Crazy68Dart]

My battery was expensive. Maybe it was a good salesman and I wasted my money but they claimed it will last 8-10 years.

 

[Todd.Brock]

I will second , third and fourth the Basement Watchdog batteries from Home Depot. I put one at my house in 2009, and then out 2 at my parents house ( 2 separate sump crocks). We sold the house in 2014 with no ill effects. I had to add water to moms 1x or 2x. mom's are still chugging along. They get used more often from the main pump (zoeller) float switch sticking and not activating. Happened to her zoeller pump this past spring. I had the same thing happen at my old house. Battery back up save our finished basement 3x because of that. I finally replaced my zoeller pump and never had an issue again. No idea why. Zoeller is top shelf and had issues with floats sticking on two pumps.


Point is- the three Home Depot batts I used work fine. I did by the larger capacity batteries on the shelf , no idea what size.

At our new house- I am looking at water powered back up so it would be easier.

Good luck!

 

[hd54kh]

Hi Todd.Brock, from what I see HD carries Wayne and will only order batteries for home or store delivery. Lowes has the Basement Watchdog batteries in stock on the shelf. The Basement Watchdog I think is a standard wet cell battery and is purchased dry and the acid is sold separately, no big deal.

Preventative maintenance for me is no issue so an occasional top off is ok.

IIRC the 75ah BasementWatchdog runs about 130.00 and maybe 25.00 for the acid. The same rating battery at Advanced is about 96.00.

So really for me around a 50.00 difference for reliability is minor, but 50.00 difference for the same performance...........

Terry

 

[Todd.Brock]

Here is the battery that I used.

http://m.homedepot.com/p/Basement-Watchdog-7-1-2-Hour-Battery-30HDC140S/100054931/

I'm sure there is better out there. This looks like a 25 amp hour battery, per the specs.

It didn't even cross my mind to look at higher capacity batteries, I just bought the kit, battery and acid all in the same aisle.

Good luck!

 

[Crazy68Dart]

FWIW, I also have one of these on my battery.

Could be gimmick, but I did a fair amount of research, and for the money I was willing to give it a shot.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004I6QREK/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[hd54kh]

Well bit the bullet. I needed to get some brake fluid and checked the local Advance Auto. Went on line and got the DC-1 Deep Cycle Marine Maintenance Free for 88.00 out the door. It is the same rating of 75ah I needed. Now time will tell.

That was cheap using their online discount,thanks for the suggestion Tdbo.

Total cost for the additional pump, check valve and battery came in around 250.00. The pump I got from a guy that buys lots of open/damage lots from the big box stores.

Cheap insurance (if it works as should) for maybe not being 100% available to address a flood and knowing my neighbor will not have to lose sleep worring.
I am always poised to return in the event of an expected issue.

Thanks for all your help, suggestions and input. Hope I can contribute as much as other here do.

Terry

 

[mp23]

I actually run two watchdogs in series. will run for days depending on how much rain in coming in.

 

[CKS1955]

Good Afternoon,
Any update on the deep cycle battery?

Currently we have two sumps (one mounted higher than the other) and a high water alarm monitored by our alarm company. The sump that we will be replacing is 12 years old and will be replaced by the Watchdog Big Combo. We will keep the other sump in the hole as it is only 5 years old. So we will end up with a total of three pumps: primary pump, backup pump and the battery backup pump.

I just picked up a Watchdog Big Combo and now I am in the battery research mode. For me this is more of an belt and suspenders approach. We have the house on a standby generator from Generac, but need additional assurance that the house will be protected in the event the of generator failure. Plus I like the feature that the sumps are tested weekly. Right now I go down there once a month to test both sumps and the alarm.

So now onto the battery:

-I have looked into the Watchdog supplied battery flooded lead acid design (requires maintenance)(the one that you add the acid) 12 month warranty for $129 + $22 for acid. The reviews of this battery in this thread are positive, but the reviews on Amazon are not very good. I think it is rated a 2-1/2 star. http://www.amazon.com/Basement-Watc...mmary?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1&sortBy=helpful . Although I wonder if the negative reviews were the result of not monitoring the fluid level in the battery?

The following three appear to be the same battery made by the same manufacturer and based on the specs:
-Battery Plus has a Duracell flooded lead acid design (requires maintenance) with a 12 month warranty for $120. https://www.batteriesplus.com/replacement/battery/watchdog/30hdc140s/sli31mdc

-Sam's Club has Duracell flooded lead acid design (requires maintenance) with a 12 month warranty for $95. http://www.samsclub.com/sams/duracell-marine-battery-group-size-29hm/prod3590216.ip

-Napa has a deep cell flooded lead acid design (requires maintenance) battery with a 30 month warranty for $140. http://www.napaonline.com/napa/en/p/NBP8231/NBP8231


-Walmart has the Maxx EverStart (Maxx-29DC) by Johnson Controls Battery Group, 24 month warranty for $100. But the reviews seem mixed. http://www.walmart.com/ip/EverStart-Maxx-Group-Size-29-Marine-Battery/20531539

-Advance Auto has an AutoCraft maintenance free, 12 month warranty for $90. http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/...chTerm=battery+marine+&+deep+cycle#fragment-2

-Auto Zone has an Duralast maintenance free, 12 month warranty for $105. http://www.autozone.com/miscellaneo...last-marine-battery/315062_0_0/?checkfit=true

Any input on the batteries above or others would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Jay

 

[kbs2244]

When I worked at Bass Pro selling trolling motor batteries we kept have anything other than the old fashioned acid flooded lead batteries coming back.
One mark for proven technology.

I also learned there are only two battery factories that make them left in the US.
They supply everybody from Interstate to Wally's
One mark for the EPA.

I would suggest you get the lowest cost battery with the highest specs.
The only differences are the label and the warranty.
(And the warranty is a marketing dept. numbers game.)

 

[nadogail]

When I worked at Bass Pro selling trolling motor batteries we kept have anything other than the old fashioned acid flooded lead batteries coming back.
One mark for proven technology.

I also learned there are only two battery factories that make them left in the US.
They supply everybody from Interstate to Wally's
One mark for the EPA.

I would suggest you get the lowest cost battery with the highest specs.
The only differences are the label and the warranty.
(And the warranty is a marketing dept. numbers game.)

my generator has a Walmart marine battery with a Harbor Freight maintainer.

My advice is worth exactly what you pay for it, and it comes with a Money Back Guarantee.

 

[reader2580]

Old thread, but my experience with AGM batteries has been very positive. They allow higher draw down without damage and hold a charge longer when sitting unused. They also handle abuse like being left in a low voltage situation much better.

I recall that Sam's Club has AGM deep cycle batteries that are pretty reasonable.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Best bang for the buck are old fashioned flooded (liquid electrolyte) batteries.

Whatever battery maintainer you are using, plug it into a cheap, mechanical lamp and set it to charge only 1-3 hours per day.

 

[reader2580]

Best bang for the buck are old fashioned flooded (liquid electrolyte) batteries.

Whatever battery maintainer you are using, plug it into a cheap, mechanical lamp and set it to charge only 1-3 hours per day.

I use Battery Tender battery chargers and they only charge as necessary by monitoring voltage. No issues with batteries with them. I periodically look at the charger and it almost always shows not charging because the battery doesn't need charging.

I used a Schumacher battery maintainer a dozen years ago and it overcharged the battery. I have also seen the same charger used elsewhere with the same issue of overcharging.

 

[bushmechanic]

Current thread concerning AGM Batteries @
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=294121


Deka 8A27 (8A27M) AGM Battery
http://www.dcbattery.com/deka_8a27.html


NSB-AGM-27M Battery
http://buy.northstarbattery.com/p/nsb-agm-27m-battery

Well, he said best... I take that to mean cost is no object.

Northstar is indeed the best; hands down. End of story. Period.

You simply cannot buy a better battery.

 

[bushmechanic]

I use Battery Tender battery chargers and they only charge as necessary by monitoring voltage. No issues with batteries with them. I periodically look at the charger and it almost always shows not charging because the battery doesn't need charging.

I used a Schumacher battery maintainer a dozen years and it overcharged the battery. I have also seen the same charger used elsewhere with the same issue of overcharging.

You know, those things would be a hell of a lot better if they included a power switch.

 

[Altarocks]

Hi all. Just ran across this old thread and I'm hoping someone might know what I need. Have a Wayne ESP25 and I'm tired of replacing batteries. I replaced my last 12v deep cycle with 2 6v golf cart batteries. I'd like to use a Schumacher maintainer while also keeping the loss-of-power alarm horn built into the Wayne controller. If I don't connect the Wayne charger to AC power the horn sounds. Wayne's controller runs all wiring through a single circuit board.

Is there a way I can do this?

Edit: nevermind. I forgot the horn only sounds for a minute or so. I'll just leave the built-in charger unplugged.

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