Between 485 & 705 SQ/FT British Garage planned

[bazzateer]

I've been on here a few months now and loving the builds, especially the huge US ones! You guys are soooo lucky to have so much space to play with.

After a divorce 3 years ago I'm finally a homeowner again. I have a small back garden in which I hope to build a garage to house my classic Rootes cars, a 1967 Singer Vogue saloon, a 1972 Sunbeam Imp Sport and a 1972 Commer PB Campervan.

The back garden is just 22 feet wide and has vehicular access via an alley. Most of my neighbours have built full width garages giving maximum space and total security. The previous owners of my place left a hole in the fence, an old shed and a pile of ****. I intend to clear the entire bottom 30 feet of the garden and build a 22x30 garage which should just fit the three cars side-by-side with plenty of room behind for workbenches, shelves and room to work.

I have a good local builder who will be coming round to look at the land and discuss my plans. My budget is severely limited and as such, the build may have to be done in stages. The biggest problem is likely to be getting sufficient headroom for the Commer.

Anyway, I know you all like pics so I'll load a few in the next post..........

 

[bazzateer]

Looking from the house towards the bottom of the garden:

The gap between neighbours' garages that I plan to fill:

and from the other angle:

The crappy old shed:

The pile of **** left behind:

 

[bazzateer]

These are the beasts waiting for a new home:

1967 Singer Vogue:

1972 Sunbeam Imp Sport:

1972 Commer PB Highwayman Campervan:

I also have this in a lock-up which will be my son's car when he's a bit older:

As you can see, they all need a fair bit of work hence the need for the garage/workshop space. The Sunbeam and the Commer are both street legal though so I can still enjoy driving them.

This build is likely to take a fair while and I'll only update it when I have something concrete to add (excuse the pun!).

Baz

 

[bazzateer]

I have some plans I drew up on excel of what I want the garage to look like but my computer skills aren't good enough to transfer the excel spreadsheet onto here! Any ideas guys?

Baz

 

[bazzateer]

Just realised I could take a photo of the excel sheet so here's the basic plans for my garage, not great quality but...................:

Front and rear elevations. Small double doors on house side are to allow my trailer-tent to be stored in the garden rather than clutter up the garage (also means a car can be driven through and into the garden if necessary). These doors will also be the pedestrian access to the garage.

This is the basic floor-plan. Each square represents 6"x6". Three vehicles parked by the alley door with room behind for another car if necessary.

 

[ZRX61]

As you're limited to 22ft width I'd try & go for 40ft length

 

[Stuart in MN]

Some neat cars we don't see in the US! I really like the Imp. However, if all three are parked side by side it looks like you better be pretty skinny to walk between them but I guess you need to work with the available space.

 

[bazzateer]

As you're limited to 22ft width I'd try & go for 40ft length

If only I could. Over here you cannot build on more than half the garden, the garden is 70 feet so the most I can do is 35 feet but I also want to put a small conservatory on the back of the house to act as a laundry/mud room so 30 feet is my limit.

 

[bazzateer]

Some neat cars we don't see in the US! I really like the Imp. However, if all three are parked side by side it looks like you better be pretty skinny to walk between them but I guess you need to work with the available space.

I plan to utilise 'dollys' so the cars can be pushed right up to the walls (the walls will have foam pads to prevent damage) to give as much space as possible. The extra space at the back will enable me to move any project to the back leaving the front for parking.

Also, the plans are just roughed out, I've over estimated the car sizes and assumed 6" thick walls, they may only be 4" thick which gives me a 4" win! As we know, there ain't no substitute for (cubic) inches!

 

[Shug]

If you can get a bit extra height you could use a lift and store one car up, one under.

 

[chevazon]

Baz - got to look after Peggy after her epic journey !

 

[mikeyr]

well since you have a Singer I guess I have to speak up, since anyone with a Singer is a good guy in my book. Although your Singer is a little bit on the new side and not a proper Singer

When I had one too many Singer's in my life, my wonderful wife suggested a 4-post lift to store the cars, I did not have enough height to store modern cars and work on them while standing up below them but I had enough height to store 2 Singer's on the lift to give me room to work on the 3rd Singer.

With your space limitations, its going to be very tight in that garage with all those cars, I would seriously look at a lift, not to work on them but store them and it will come in handy when working too. You will have to put most of your tools on casters to move them out which in the UK is a problem with the near constant rain, when I had my small garage all my tools and even workbench was on casters and I would move it to work in the sunshine or make space for working in the garage, you will have to do the same. A lift for storage AND with your small cars, you do not need a tall ceiling like you would for working on a car. In your plan, you will not have enough room to open the doors and get out, you need more than 6" in between cars, so I would plan on one car being in your "extra work space" area most of the time.

I had 3 Singer's in my 24x20 garage and restored one in that garage, it was tight, I hated working in that garage sometimes but I did it, so can you.

 

[bazzateer]

Thanks for the comments and suggestions guys. I want to avoid having to apply for planning permission (costs/time/objections from neighbours/probably won't get it) so must stay within the permitted development limits, this means the roof, if flat, cannot be higher than 3 metres or if pitched the ridge must not exceed 4 metres. I will be building with the aim of having a lift in the centre bay although I'm not sure when this will be. The likely staged build will probably mean a flat roof initially being replaced a few years later by a ridged one which will allow a lift to be added.

 

[bazzateer]

Just got news of a small boost to the budget, I'm having to work Christmas Day, Boxing Day and New Year's day - no fun but lots of overtime.

 

[landark]

Just got news of a small boost to the budget, I'm having to work Christmas Day, Boxing Day and New Year's day - no fun but lots of overtime.

That's awesome, I too just got word that we may be expecting snow on Christmas so I may be getting some overtime too (holidays pay double time!).

 

[bazzateer]

The snow's already here, got to be in work for 8am and it's going to be fun!

This was an hour or so ago. It's supposed to snow all night.

 

[nonhog]

1972 Sunbeam Imp Sport Awesome! 1972 Commer PB Highwayman Campervan Also Awesome !
Good luck with the build !

 

[Curt_pnw]

Bazz, are you on the Retrorides forum? Those guys would love all your cars, especially the Commer.
I personally love the Imp. I would love to own one of those someday, but they are rare as hell stateside.

 

[Brookesy]

Havnt seen an Imp in years. My old man used to rally imps many years ago loved the little car when he used to take me for a spin in it. In fact i think i got the factory workshop manuals in my attic.

 

[MG David]

Curt, its good you like the Imp as you live in a place called Lynnwood.
Imps were made in Linwood!

 

[bazzateer]

Baz - got to look after Peggy after her epic journey !

Cheers Chev!

 

[bazzateer]

1972 Sunbeam Imp Sport Awesome! 1972 Commer PB Highwayman Campervan Also Awesome !
Good luck with the build !

Awesome indeed, and very cheap compared to the rivals

 

[bazzateer]

Bazz, are you on the Retrorides forum? Those guys would love all your cars, especially the Commer.
I personally love the Imp. I would love to own one of those someday, but they are rare as hell stateside.

Indeed I am, all my cars are on there in the Readers Rides section - same name on there too.

 

[bazzateer]

Havnt seen an Imp in years. My old man used to rally imps many years ago loved the little car when he used to take me for a spin in it. In fact i think i got the factory workshop manuals in my attic.

If you'd been near Reading in August you would have seen over 200 of the little buggers in one place.

 

[milkovich]

I'm loving the commer, that looks like the perfect "race weekend" camper... all it needs is a 7 liter diesel so it can pull a race car in an enclosed trailer.

If you're planning on a lift in the center of the bay, make sure you calculate the space that the garage door will be taking up in the "open" position.

I learned the hard way and had to re-hang the garage door once the lift was installed, thank God I had the extra ceiling height to play with.

 

[73super]

I love the Imps. Brit's are so cool! Smaller, cooler cars... Precise, understated engineering... not over bearing like we yanks.. yankers. Lordy.. I think I want to move across the pond! Cheery-o!

Love the plans.. you're going to be very excited when it goes up and you actually have a place to tinker. Nothing ... nothing a guy needs more than a place to unwind and connect with his creative side.

I'll be anxious to see the progress shots! Pip - pip!

 

[bazzateer]

I'm loving the commer, that looks like the perfect "race weekend" camper... all it needs is a 7 liter diesel so it can pull a race car in an enclosed trailer.

If you're planning on a lift in the center of the bay, make sure you calculate the space that the garage door will be taking up in the "open" position.

I learned the hard way and had to re-hang the garage door once the lift was installed, thank God I had the extra ceiling height to play with.

The lift will be a much later addition and is probably going to be a scissor-lift so the door shouldn't be an issue - all to do with keeping the overall height within limits.

 

[bazzateer]

I love the Imps. Brit's are so cool! Smaller, cooler cars... Precise, understated engineering... not over bearing like we yanks.. yankers. Lordy.. I think I want to move across the pond! Cheery-o!

Love the plans.. you're going to be very excited when it goes up and you actually have a place to tinker. Nothing ... nothing a guy needs more than a place to unwind and connect with his creative side.

I'll be anxious to see the progress shots! Pip - pip!

Progress will be very slow due to available budget but I will post photos when appropriate.

Don't move over the pond, this country is going down the pan at the moment, we desperately need a new government.

To be honest my whole house is my man-cave at the moment. I live here alone so can do what the F I want whenever I want to, very relaxing and liberating. After 10 yrs of marriage it's like being released from a life sentence.

I am looking forward to being able to walk to the garage and shut myself away to tinker, man-fridge already to go, fully stocked!

 

[Curt_pnw]

Curt, its good you like the Imp as you live in a place called Lynnwood.
Imps were made in Linwood!

Indeed I am, all my cars are on there in the Readers Rides section - same name on there too.

aha! I knew it. I used to be on there a lot. Good group of guys on there. I should get back on there. Maybe it'll give me some inspiration to do some work on my project.

I am looking forward to being able to walk to the garage and shut myself away to tinker, man-fridge already to go, fully stocked!

That's the life we all live for.

 

[Charles (in GA)]

Don't move over the pond, this country is going down the pan at the moment, we desperately need a new government.

Sounding more familiar by the day.

Charles

 

[bazzateer]

I had the builder round last week to take a look at my plans and the site. He's happy to do it in stages and has suggested a few things to save money. Having a pitched roof is likely to be cheaper than a flat roof as the trusses can be built from stock sized timber whereas a flat roof with a single span of 22' will require oversized/engineered beams which are not a stock size and therefore expensive to have made. Also, the trusses can be built in a capital 'A' shape giving some extra height above the eaves.

One major issue (as I suspected) is the eaves height to get my camper in. Looks like I will have to apply for planning permission (variance) to get the eaves about 50cm over permitted development limits.

An architect friend is hopefully going to draw up the plans for me for 'mates rates'. These will hopefully suffice for both planning permission and building control with a total cost of the paperwork coming in at around £1,000. Money I'd rather spend on the build itself.

Also I am going to go with 2 x 9'x9' doors to give clearance for the camper. This is not a stock size in the UK so the cheapest option is to have roller doors fitted - I've been quoted £3,000 for this but that is way above what I can afford at the moment.

Anyway, this whole project is going to take a long time as I need to keep costs down and fit everything in around work/homelife/available funds. I'll update as and when......

 

[Grizz1963]

Hey Baz, Just found and read your thread.

Couple of ideas while you have not built, and also seeing as it is not my garage.

How about the largest windows you can fit maybe at bench height ? Recycled shopfront type stuff.
What about dropping the floor ramp by 50cm at the entrance, and adding in either a board that slips into a grooves below the door, that way you can get the Commer into the building, and if the trusses are tall inside, you can have the rest at normal height.
Alternately, drop the floor at the entrance with a short inner ramp, just to get the Commer in, but add a taller door that will drop into the compensated space. This will also work well for cars with ridiculously lowered suspensions.

Hope that makes sense.

#The other thing to check is just how much different the cost will be if you have the roof trussed structured in such a way that you have some "loft " space up top that you can use once boarded out for pannels and other light bulky items.

Cheers,

Rian

 

[bazzateer]

Cheers Rian!

There is currently a 'ramp' going up from the alley into the garden and we will be digging the garden out to level up with the alley to hopefully gain a few inches. This will entail fitting a drain across the front of the garage though as the alley is on a slope and becomes a river during rain - don't want it running into my garage! We are not alowed drains/gutters etc to empty into the alley so the drain will have to feed a pipe running under/alongside the footings to a soakaway in the back garden, as will the roof gutters. I may get a floor drain put in as well to feed into this drain.

Already looking on eBay for cheap double-glazed units to fit as windows. If I supply the windows the builder will fit them. The money I save on bricks will pay for the extra time it takes for framing, lintels etc so the cost is about the same.

If we go for the 'A' shaped trusses I aim to board across some of the horizontal bits to create large shelves for storage. I also intend to insulate (cheaply ) the spaces between the trusses and board over them to create a 'finished' ceiling which can be painted white to reflect light.

Need to discuss my plans with the neighbours before I get plans drawn up etc to hopefully avoid any issues later.

Are you definitely getting that house with the luvverly garage?

 

[Grizz1963]

Cheers Rian!

There is currently a 'ramp' going up from the alley into the garden and we will be digging the garden out to level up with the alley to hopefully gain a few inches. This will entail fitting a drain across the front of the garage though as the alley is on a slope and becomes a river during rain - don't want it running into my garage! We are not alowed drains/gutters etc to empty into the alley so the drain will have to feed a pipe running under/alongside the footings to a soakaway in the back garden, as will the roof gutters. I may get a floor drain put in as well to feed into this drain.

Already looking on eBay for cheap double-glazed units to fit as windows. If I supply the windows the builder will fit them. The money I save on bricks will pay for the extra time it takes for framing, lintels etc so the cost is about the same.

If we go for the 'A' shaped trusses I aim to board across some of the horizontal bits to create large shelves for storage. I also intend to insulate (cheaply ) the spaces between the trusses and board over them to create a 'finished' ceiling which can be painted white to reflect light.

Need to discuss my plans with the neighbours before I get plans drawn up etc to hopefully avoid any issues later.

Are you definitely getting that house with the luvverly garage?

Hi Baz, PM me your mobile number, then I will call you and chat more.

Yes, we are getting the house, subject to loads of stuff, including deciding if we sell one house and keep one as a pension etc. Also exchange is a potential issue, as it is all aimed at the 30th July.

There are a couple of houses in Nicola's area that have been stagnant in the market, but right now is a buyers market, and there is going to be a 10-15k bath for each of us, which is why we want to keep one house.
Remeber though, the seller had a valuation for the house we want to buy 2 years ago for 375k, now we are to pay 310, plus the 3% stamp duty.


What about sneaking a spare pipe into your mains water refuse pipe, to get rid of some water.
Also , as long as you keep to a sensible 20-30cm above the alley water level, even with a small dropped ramp section, you should be OK.

Right, another thing, make contact with a couple of glazing firms who do either insurance or refurb work, and ask for a couple of cast off frames and glass, it may just be worth trying.

Right, back to Retro Rides and JohnnySomerset's new Nissan Rasheen thread.

 

[51rider]

Bazz,
Have you thought about using SIP's? (Structually Insulated Panels) to build the garage? These would do away with the need for roof trusses and give you increased ceiling height. You could still have the option to create storage at either end of the building.
You would save on the costs of a brickie and can finish in a variety of styles from timber cladding to render & brick slips. The building would be far more thermally efficient than a traditional build. You might get a result on the foundations too. With the building being so light, you might not have to go down as deep with the foundations /footings. The cost saving here on the excavations, spoil removal and concrete volume for the foundations could be quite significant.

If it's not too late, at least do mention it to your architect.

The other thing to consider is some of these Oak framed garages-yes, I did say Oak! really!
Given the size of your plot, you may only be looking at £3-4K for the kit but it's still way cheaper than a double skinned wall with insulated void. You could get the basic framework up & then insulate & plasterboard out the internal as funds become available.
Run a google search on Timber frame garages-restrict the search to the UK & I am sure you'll be surprised with the results.

 

[bazzateer]

Nice idea but the walls cannot be made from timber due to the proximity to the property line. If I went with wood it could only be about 15-16' wide! No good for me.

 

[rasputin]

I almost forgot how little space you guys have over there. If I did not know any better I'd swear I was looking at the set of "Keeping up Appearances".

But seriously, looks like it's gonna be pretty cool. Having an MG myself, I find it takes up VERY VERY little space. I could probably fit 3 of them in my 2 car garage.

 

[bazzateer]

A US 2 car garage probably equates to a UK 3 car garage so yes, 3 MGs would fit no problem.

The weather here has put a stop to any garage-related work so I've made a start on decorating the bedroom for my 6 yr old son for when he comes for 'sleepovers' with his old Dad. When I spoke on the phone to tell him I'd started on his room he went quiet then said "I've got the biggest smile in the world Daddy!" Made my day!

 

[Grizz1963]

A US 2 car garage probably equates to a UK 3 car garage so yes, 3 MGs would fit no problem.

The weather here has put a stop to any garage-related work so I've made a start on decorating the bedroom for my 6 yr old son for when he comes for 'sleepovers' with his old Dad. When I spoke on the phone to tell him I'd started on his room he went quiet then said "I've got the biggest smile in the world Daddy!" Made my day!

 

[bazzateer]

About time for an update. No real news other than to say my architect friend has not been able to spare the time to come round so I'm going to call another one in. It'll probably cost me more but I can't start anything without plans being drawn up. This other guy is apparently a classic car fan himself so he should at least understand my requirements.

Lack of overtime at work and other issues mean my budget is forever constricting. I think I'll only be able to get the plans done, permission applied for and eventually the footings and concrete base laid before the money runs out. Then it'll be a case of working as much overtime as possible (we currently have a ban on overtime) and selling off a few bits to raise enough to get the walls built. May even have to look at selling the Commer to fund the garage