Brown / Yellow Spots on 3 month old Epoxy Full Flake Floor

[94runner]

Hi all. You folks always provide great advice, so got a question...

I had an installer apply an epoxy garage floor in Sept 2021...vapor barrier, a pigmented epoxy, full broadcast flakes, and a UV resistant top coat. Brand was Elite Crete 100% solids. I really haven't used the garage at all since, and haven't put my cars in it since the floor was applied, as I has some other work to do (need to repaint walls and waiting for the spring). i.e. nothing's been on the floor. Also, I live in NY and it's an unheated garage.

A few months after install I started to see yellowish / brown spots...pics below. They brush off easily when scrubbing with just water, but seem to come back after a few weeks in the similar spots. When I scrub with water, it almost looks soapy / bubbly as it's being removed. It's now six months and same issue. I also see some yellowish patches, but not the typical epoxy sunlight spots, as these patches don't see direct sunlight. I have in the past mopped the floor with diluted ammonia, but nothing else.

Any thoughts of what this could be? The installer isn't sure. I can keep scrubbing every now and then, but wondering what's going on Also, is diluted ammonia the best thing to clean epoxy floors with? Or maybe Simple Green?

Thanks!

Steve

 

[Bucko]

The two things that come to mind is critter urine or if the garage ceiling is not drywalled could it be from lumber above or a leak?

 

[94runner]

Bucko...tks! The drywall above is finished with no leaks, so that's not it. I didn't think of the critter. Have never seen one, but will pay more attention now.

 

[94runner]

Mopped with diluted ammonia (per Shea's recipe on his all garage floor website). Everything came off...now gotta keep an eye to see if I get brown in the same spots

 

[Garage Flooring]

Is it possible to keep stuff off that area so you know if it is from something you are placing in the garage? Maybe put some cardboard down under vehicles and equipment to see if you can start eliminating things

 

[94runner]

Justin.....tks for the response! I actually haven't put my car in the garage since I had the coating done, and nothing has been near the spots.

I'm gonna put a cardboard box over some of the spots (propped up so doens't touch) anyway and see if anything comes back after the ammonia clean.

I have to say, the floor does look great after it's cleaned!

Steve

 

[Garage Flooring]

Justin.....tks for the response! I actually haven't put my car in the garage since I had the coating done, and nothing has been near the spots.

I'm gonna put a cardboard box over some of the spots (propped up so doens't touch) anyway and see if anything comes back after the ammonia clean.

I have to say, the floor does look great after it's cleaned!

Steve

Wha is just above the stain in the first picture. I am getting old and cant tell and my computer is not letting me zoom in

 

[94runner]

I wish I had my young eyes back! Just above the stain part of an old leaf that got into the pic. But in general not many leaves in the garage.
It's been 4 days since I cleaned the floor, and starting to see spots come back already! Pic below. It's almost like a soft gel in some spots, which I can only describe as a growth. Also the same spots in the floor from last time, and entire garage is empty. I can't see anywhere else in the garage where this is coming from..ceiling is totally dry with no spots, and no leaks anywhere.

Could somehow there be a reaction with certain spots in the poly and something in the air ?

 

[Garage Flooring]

Never say never but I

I wish I had my young eyes back! Just above the stain part of an old leaf that got into the pic. But in general not many leaves in the garage.
It's been 4 days since I cleaned the floor, and starting to see spots come back already! Pic below. It's almost like a soft gel in some spots, which I can only describe as a growth. Also the same spots in the floor from last time, and entire garage is empty. I can't see anywhere else in the garage where this is coming from..ceiling is totally dry with no spots, and no leaks anywhere.

Could somehow there be a reaction with certain spots in the poly and something in the air ?

Never say never but I do not think so. The reason I asked about the leaf is we have a tree in front of our driveway. My wife loves it because of the shade, but we have had to remove several branches that were dropping something that looked like this. I thought perhaps it was being dragged on somehow.

 

[94runner]

Hi. So it's been about 10 days now since I cleaned the garage floor, and have had nothing in the garage, and spots coming back all over the place. Going to try to reach out to my installer again, who seems not to want to be bothered by this If that doesn't work, will reach out to the manufacturer, Elite Crete Epoxy. But always open to thoughts from thee group to explain what can be going on!

 

[haugy]

The spots are moving location? I'm going with a critter or bugs in the attic. Believe it or not, spider **** can make a serious mess.
When you clean a spot, does it ever come back in the exact same spot?

 

[Garage Flooring]

If you have not pulled a vehicle on the floor and the stains come up, IMHO it is not the floor you should be looking at. Need to identify the source. Animal...leak..... Something is getting on the floor

 

[Jayman17]

Any chance that could be grease dropping from your garage door opener track?

 

[BillK]

Did it come back under the cardboard box ???

 

[94runner]

All...thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts...really appreciate it!

1. It did comeback under the box. However I'm gonna do another experiment with a larger box, marking the exact location of the box, to assure I don't have any doubts if the box moved.
2. Thinking also of dropping some paper towel over sectors of the floor after I clean, and see if they spots it the towels first or anything under.
3. They do come back in the general area, but not always the exact same spot.
4. The spots are beyond where the door opens above.
5. I've seen the occasional centipede, but only maybe one every few weeks. Unless some party is happening overnight I don't know about

THANKS!!!! Steve

 

[BillK]

Just above the stain part of an old leaf

Any chance something like that got blown in while they were doing the floor and got caught under the coating and now its bleeding through ?

 

[94runner]

All...I did some more searching tonight...the pic in this post looks exactly like what I'm seeing!

Weeping spot in concrete floor - after epoxy

My garage floor has always had two small spots that weeped water up from below the surface. Just a small amount. It's weird, it happens mainly in spring and early summer. When I had my floor epoxied this spring, I pointed these two spots out to the epoxy installer. He indicated he could...

www.garagejournal.com

Could this be what's happening? Rust from the concrete rebar weeping though the epoxy? Not even sure if the floor has rebars..built in 1955, on Long Island, NY. I never saw any marks on the floor prior to the applying the epoxy. My installer did apply a vapor barrier as the first coat, but I don't recall him taking moisture measurements.

 

[tncatadjuster]

In my four decades in the business I have had it happen a dozen times at most. High probability that this is water coming through the slab, it is always that color.

 

[94runner]

@tncatadjuster Thanks for your thoughts based on your experience! I apprecaite it! Guess I am like one of those dozen

Two questions if you have a min...
1. I assume nothing I can really do now to stop the water? Guessing the vapor barrier applied prior to the epoxy wasn't sufficient
2. In the cases you've seen, does the epoxy eventually blister up, or is this more of a cosmetic thing I just need to clean every now and then?

Also...great website and pics!

THANKS! Steve

 

[tncatadjuster]

As far as I know it continues, in one instance it was seasonal and would come and go. Funny you mentioned the web site, it goes away for good next month due to my retirement, time to ride motorcycles.

Good luck with your floor.

 

[94runner]

Hi all. Mystery solved! I finally spoke to the epoxy manufacturer, who said the brown spots are oil from the garage concrete slab forcing it's way up through the epoxy. Although my cars don't leak, my house is 70 years old and likely oil in the concrete from years of leaks from previous owners. And now with the epoxy there, the pressure causes the oil to push up. The rep said that's better than it being trapped and causing blisters, but time will tell. He offered to work with my contractor should I run into issues down the line, so nice response! He mentioned a a special oil primer / barrier that could have been applied, but he said that was normally reserved for commercial shops and such where it's obvious there were tons of oil leaks over the year, and not usually residential garages.

Not sure if anyone here would disagree?

Thanks again to all for their help!

Steve

 

[Armorpoxy]

This sounds like a reasonable explanation. We do carry Oil Stop Epoxy Primer for floors that have residual petroleum products in them.

 

[egdede]

I just don't buy that the 'pressure' of an epoxy floor is causing the oil to appear. What does a layer of epoxy weigh? It's not that much 'pressure'

 

[94runner]

@egdede Thanks for the reply...appreciate it! Maybe pressure isn't the the right word. I guess what the epoxy rep meant was that with the floor sealed the oil would build up and push through the epoxy. Where before the epoxy, there was not the same build up.

I can't say I understand it all to be able to say the explanation is accurate. But it's all I have to go off of for now

Open to any other thoughts!!!!

Thanks!!!!

 

[Garage Flooring]

@egdede Thanks for the reply...appreciate it! Maybe pressure isn't the the right word. I guess what the epoxy rep meant was that with the floor sealed the oil would build up and push through the epoxy. Where before the epoxy, there was not the same build up.

I can't say I understand it all to be able to say the explanation is accurate. But it's all I have to go off of for now

Open to any other thoughts!!!!

Thanks!!!!

I guess I would follow up with them and make sure they are aware that the stain is on top and when cleaned there is no discoloration below -- at least that is how I read your posts

 

[tncatadjuster]

Do you have before and after photos? I have never installed a floor that looks like the photos, I was mainly involved in industry and they did not use that finish. In my experience I could never tell why it was always the same color, it contained mainly water little oil and sometimes a hint of resin.

 

[finn]

I just don't buy that the 'pressure' of an epoxy floor is causing the oil to appear. What does a layer of epoxy weigh? It's not that much 'pressure'

Probably an osmosis type of reaction, or capillary “creep” of the oil in the slab.

Having a temperature differential could impact it, and, being that old, it’s unlikely there’s a vapor barrier under the slab. I don’t see how a vapor barrier applied to the upper surface of the slab would be effective.

 

[haugy]

Is epoxy porous enough to allow oil to creep through it?

 

[tncatadjuster]

Sometimes if it is not done properly. My areas were usually where someting was dropped and the divot weeped.

 

[Blips17]

I have this same exact thing in my garage in central jersey. Moved into the house a year ago and had this same epoxy put in the garage. Didn’t start happening until summer.

 

[Jsf721]

Is it sticky ? If so I had that it was water mixed with rust from the rebar a pushed up with hydrostatic pressure. I sure hope that’s not what you have.

It stated by me thinking my car was leaking but then it started in places where the car didn’t park.

 

[Blips17]

It’s oily feeling and then dries hard. We don’t park the car in the garage. Nothing leaking from the ceiling or any equipment. It’s definitely coming up from the ground.

 

[Port]

I have the exact same problem. Picture attached. My installer seems just as perplexed. Definitely coming up from underneath. Maybe same epoxy used?

 

[Port]

I have the exact same problem. Picture attached. My installer seems just as perplexed. Definitely coming up from underneath. Maybe same epoxy used?

 

[94runner]

Hi @Port Sorry for the delay in responding...was out of town. I used a product called Elite Crete. As I mentioned above, the Manufacturer Client Rep said this can happen if you have moisture / oil under the garage floor cement slab, even with a standard vapor barrier. However it's not just epoxy. My neighbor had a similar polyaspartic coating applied and has the same exact issue. His installer drilled a few small holes to try to relieve the pressure, but didn't seem to help. We both have a black/gray/white flake floor, and even some of the white flakes are starting to discolor (and this part of the garage doesn't ever get sunlight).

At this point nothing really to do but keep cleaning, or tear the whole thing up and apply a stronger vapor barrier. But I already tore up the floor once due to a previous install issue, so not gonna do that again.

Steve

 

[Paul Baldo]

Whats goíng on guys ? has anyone ever seen this before? its in a finished garage. Ceiling are perfect. We've cleaned it and its still keeps coming back up through the floor.

 

[94runner]

Hey Paul. Looks very very similar to my floor. I have spoken to many folks, and the thought is a moisture issue in the concrete slab which is pushing it's way up through the epoxy. Or could be oil in the concerete slab pushing it's way up. Either way, no real good fix other. I wish I would have known to check the moisture in the concrete before having the epoxy applied, but I didn't know, and my floor contractor (who has vanished) never mentioned to me. He claims to have put down a moisture barrier, but either it failed or wasn't proprrpery applied, or just sufficient for my concrete floor. More discussion on this in another thread of mine (see below).

Steve

Lingering Smell - My Experiences, but still questions

Hi all! I've been going through another lingering odor issue the past two months and wanted to share with the community and get any thoughts on my current status. I have traded some emails on the first part of my story with Scotty, Shea, Denali, 88carrera, and thank them all for their previous...

www.garagejournal.com

 

[Paul Baldo]

This floor was ground down, barrier put in then base coat, flake and 2 more top coats. We have no idea whats goíng on.

 

[Armorpoxy]

We have seen this. Rare,but normally from moisture reactingwith the salts in the floor and causing pop outs.

 

[Paul Baldo]

We have seen this. Rare,but normally from moisture reactingwith the salts in the floor and causing pop outs.

How do you fix it ? Also has water under the coating