Builders / framers ignoring foundation bolts

[dockdoc]

Building a 26*28 2 car garage with a second story. It’s framed up and slab is poured. Waiting on windows for trim and siding.

I noticed the framers put the sill plate down (brick and block foundation) but didn’t tighten down the j bolts. On some there isn’t even a nut/washer. That’s ridiculous right? I’ve asked the GC a half dozen times to make sure they take care of it and they’re just blowing me off now. Just go buy some nuts and washers and do it myself I guess?

Furthermore the framing package came with hurricane clips that they didn’t bother installing. Are they important? Should I throw them on myself too? I should note we’re not in a hurricane area and local code doesn’t require them.

 

[The Cobbler]

is it being inspected? point out the deficiencies the the inspector . now you have some ammo to go after the contractor

 

[dockdoc]

It is being inspected yes. Not sure how I do that though as I’m probably at work when they come. Would you expect the inspector to find that sort of thing on his own? It’s not exactly hidden.

 

[The Cobbler]

a call to the inspectors office with a question, or tip off would help

 

[driftpin]

Building code is usually a 'minimum prescriptive ' code. Are they required? If not, and you have them, why wouldn't you want them? Here in Florida, in HVHZ (high velocity hurricane zone) areas, the roof joists require straps over each side of the rafter, fastened to the header beam pour (concrete) or to the header wood beam. Sheathing clips are a minimum way of helping keep the roof sheathing secured. If you want to build above and beyond the code, and you can afford to do it. it sounds like a good idea to-me.

Here's an example of what your efforts can achieve, in an extreme circumstance. Mexico Beach FL.

 

[dockdoc]

Building code is usually a 'minimum prescriptive ' code. Are they required? If not, and you have them, why wouldn't you want them? Here in Florida, in HVHZ (high velocity hurricane zone) areas, the roof joists require straps over each side of the rafter, fastened to the header beam pour (concrete) or to the header wood beam. Sheathing clips are a minimum way of helping keep the roof sheathing secured. If you want to build above and beyond the code, and you can afford to do it. it sounds like a good idea to-me.

Yeah I agree with you - I’m assuming the builders aren’t going to install them because they’re not in the plans. But seems worth it to go do it myself for good measure.

 

[rburke65]

All the build inspector and ask.

 

[dockdoc]

All the build inspector and ask.

Ask if they require hurricane ties? I know it’s not in the code. Maybe I’ll call anyway and use it as an excuse to tip them off about the foundation bolts too.

 

[steaks&anvils]

You get tornadoes there? Install the hurricane clips.

Call the inspector and ask/discuss it.

Tell the builder to stop work. Flat out tell him what you want done and that he is going to do it. Give him a time frame, say TODAY? Make him understand this is important to you and also give him a chance to make it right. Tell him in person and follow it up in writing (email).

Money talks. What does your contract say? Check to see what options you have if you are not happy with the quality or progress etc.

BUT if you do this, he might just walk away from the job and leave it unfinished. Can you deal with that? again, look at the contract.

Good luck.

 

[matt_i]

You don't need uplift protection until you need it, and at that point in time its too late. It doesn't need to even be a tornado, the right microburst or derecho can do your structure in.

Imo such minimal work to maintain an uplift force path all the way to the foundation....it boggles on why any would neglect it.

 

[Hobby_Man22]

I found lots of loose bolts on my metal building. Makes me wonder what these inspectors do.....They sure don't hop in a boom lift to take a look at those things. Luckily the main bolts that held the beams together were tight. It was just the secondary braces that were loose here and there.

 

[Craneboy]

You know, it's not right to blame loose bolts or other issues on the inspector - he or she didn't install it wrong. It would be good if they could catch all problems, but the inspector can't look at absolutely everything. In my opinion, it's the fault of the tradesperson who did the install wrong.

 

[Jlbc212]

The nuts on the bolts will loosen within the first couple of months of construction as the lumber shrinks and the added weight of the building compresses the sill gasket (if the builder installed a sill gasket). If the nuts are still on the bolts it should still hold the sill plates in place if the building does get subjected to a severe windstorm.

I live in New England where over the years a hurricane and the occasional random tornado or micro-burst will blow through. In light of present day building code requirements for wind upheaval and wind shear I'm amazed to still see centuries old houses and barns built on dry laid (no mortar) stone foundations that are still standing.

 

[PCustoms]

Yeah I agree with you - I’m assuming the builders aren’t going to install them because they’re not in the plans. But seems worth it to go do it myself for good measure.

This is your problem right here.

They quoted to a set of plans, your contract is going to reference building to the plans.

While it seems odd, bolts and Ties are "extra". Ask the lead nice if they can put them in, if they don't do it take care of it yourself when they leave.

 

[46MGTC]

If you are actually in the Charlotte area you may want to search for hurricane Hugo in 1989. Came up from SC right over Charlotte and made a big mess. We are in a hurricane zone. Maybe not Florida level but if a Hugo came over your garage you'll wish you had those clips.
I'm north of Charlotte by 50 miles and built our house in 2009. Clips were required by our local code.

Remembering Hurricane Hugo: Charlotte's wake-up call

If you lived in Charlotte in 1989, chances are you have a Hurricane Hugo story.

www.wcnc.com

 

[jack stand]

Is your builder done and gone? Freshly placed concrete needs a week before the anchors in the slab should be tightened, and often the concrete guys may have left a bag of washers and nuts there but they've "disappeared" by the time the carpenters arrived and it's on his "punch list".
The hurricane clips are a 20 minute job that may have been overlooked, then he may have switched to the screws that go through both top plates and into the truss or rafter from the bottom. Much faster for the contractor and imho, better. Look for a screw head under each truss before you embarrass yourself and don't go against him with the same "tone" as your post above. A position of being curious or inquisitive is going to be much more productive for your concerns.

 

[gunguy]

If the ties are not required by code or called out in the contract, a simple change order to the contract may be in order if you want them to do it. Expect to pay a little extra though.

The loose/missing hardware indicates to me there may be an issue of sloppy workmanship. Do you see signs of this elsewhere? For one example, are all gaps and penetrations filled as required? A periodic walk-through with the GC may be helpful. State your expectations clearly to your GC and back it up in writing. Business is business. And don't assume or expect the inspector will catch everything.

Jim

 

[racecougar]

I'm sure the effort level of building inspectors varies from person to person and area to area, but in my case, the inspector never even left his truck on the foundation inspection (the crew handed him the permit to sign off on). There was a short cursory glance done during the framing inspection, but he wouldn't have caught anything that wasn't glaring. Just saying that I wouldn't rely on the inspector to catch a flaw for you.

 

[Neggy]

Clips .... I am seeing them required in places where a tornado or hurricane is a 100 year event, you can bet your Insurance company will be asking about them.

In Florida there is a huge difference in rates for houses with clips vs those without.

Home Inspectors do a "wind mitigation" inspection on request, and it is given to your insurer or prospective insurer to get the rates down.

 

[ddawg16]

You should see some of the bolts and straps in my house and garage. If we have the 'big one', my house will be one of the few standing.....

No complaints on my end about all the hardware I had to put in.

To the OP....he might be waiting to do it at the last min. If they start do do drywall and it's not done...stop work

 

[WisJim]

Not sure what building code is in effect for you, if any, but any code should override the plans, especially if it's code requirements. I'm lucky to have building inspectors that are thorough, honest, AND easy to work with

 

[TRWham]

Ask if they require hurricane ties? I know it’s not in the code. Maybe I’ll call anyway and use it as an excuse to tip them off about the foundation bolts too.

I have not done any residential work in Charlotte, but the AHJs we work with down here would likely catch the bolts as an issue, at least with regard to the number and spacing. We always use H clips on roof decking and hurricane ties on rafters/trusses and I think many contractors do despite the lack of requirement to do so in many locations.

 

[wssix99]

You get tornadoes there? Install the hurricane clips.

+1 It's a simple thing. If not in the plans/specs and not in the code, then I would work out a way to pay extra to have them installed.


I recommend having the contractor properly install the nuts. Don't do it yourself. You are paying the bills. They are supposed to do the work and do it correctly. If you take care of all the details for them, they are going to continue to take short cuts, take advantage of you, and put you at risk.

If you are going to fire them - then fire them and then clean up their mess yourself.

If you are going to pay them - make sure they do it right before you cut them the check and make it clear that you are watching and will withhold payment until things are done correctly.

 

[ScottsGT]

I remember when Hugo paid a visit to Charlotte. Put them on.

 

[Larryjones]

You didn't make the final payment yet did you? Before you do have your own inspector go over the building looking for what is wrong.

 

[zak77]

As others have said, contact the Building Dept and voice your concerns to them since it's their job to make sure the building is constructed to code. Most inspectors dont check for minor things such as sill plate bolts since they assume they're tightened properly. The only time they're checked is during a "foundation inspection" here in Mass, but typically not checked after that. When i was around 18-19 years old i had a job as a helper building a house and the boss had us cut off the sill plate bolts once the foundation inspection was done to save time and we just shot nails into the sill plate. He was known for very crappy work.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Do you have a contract ?

What do the plans call for ?

Fire off an email to the inspection dept, with some issues you see.

If code requires the hurricane clips and not in the plans, the contractor should eat the cost of them. He should know better, he's (or she) is supposed to be the knowledgeable party. If they are not in the plans, in the code or contract, add them after he is gone unless you are having them finish the interior.

 

[nadogail]

Your Inspector may have been deceived by an assumption that the requirements were met.

 

[joes169]

If the foundation is block, it could be that they used mortar or weak grout for the block fill around the anchor bolts and they're waiting as long as they can to tighten them down? If you end up putting nuts and washers on yourself, look to see if the anchor bolts are hot dipped galvanized. You will need galv. nuts, as regular zinc probably won't spin on freely.

The hurricane straps are ridiculous to skip, they're required by code here in Wisconsin, and aren't a step worth skipping.

 

[duneslider]

If the local code doesn't call for these items, they aren't on the plans, the engineer didn't spec them, I am not sure how you can expect the contractor to do it as part of what he quoted? I will say it seems bizarre to me that the code, plans, engineer, didn't call anchor bolts and hurricane ties out? I even used hurricane ties on my kids playhouse in the backyard cause I was worried about it and we don't get tornados or hurricanes.

If none of that was in the quote then just do it yourself, isn't hard to do. I still find it shocking none of it is required? Maybe it isn't required because it is an out building and not a residence?

 

[Hamball44]

I'm sure the effort level of building inspectors varies from person to person and area to area, but in my case, the inspector never even left his truck on the foundation inspection (the crew handed him the permit to sign off on). There was a short cursory glance done during the framing inspection, but he wouldn't have caught anything that wasn't glaring. Just saying that I wouldn't rely on the inspector to catch a flaw for you.

This! I had the same experience on my pole barn, inspector came out for a foundation inspection and a final inspection. I think he spent a total of 5-10 minutes on site between both inspections, never even looked at the plans other than to sign off.

 

[dockdoc]

Appreciate all the suggestions. The builder reassured me they're going to tighten down all the hardware before inspection, made a point to tell me that so I'm tentatively believing him...

I started messing with the hurricane straps today but I don't think they fit since the sheathing is already up. Not really sure what I can do about that. I'll probably just mention it to the builder at this point and say I want them installed one way or another.

 

[ddawg16]

This is what you want to be using

Seismic and Hurricane Ties

<p>Seismic and hurricane ties are metal connectors with various configurations. These connectors are engineered to resist increased loads due to high-wind or seismic events, and are available for both wood and steel applications.</p>

www.strongtie.com

This is one of several versions



They are not required in CA....but I used them in places anyway

 

[acer66]

When I build in WNC both hurricane ties and j bolts were required by code.

I forgot to install the hurricane ties out side but they accepted them being installed on the inside.
If I would build again I would ditch the ties all together and use the proper tie down screws instead.

 

[NUTTSGT]

I started messing with the hurricane straps today but I don't think they fit since the sheathing is already up. Not really sure what I can do about that. I'll probably just mention it to the builder at this point and say I want them installed one way or another.

Were you putting them inside or outside ? If you are trying to put them up outside, move inside.

 

[dockdoc]

Were you putting them inside or outside ? If you are trying to put them up outside, move inside.

Outside. Inside is inaccessible.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Outside. Inside is inaccessible.

Already finished the interior ?

 

[dockdoc]

Already finished the interior ?

No - there’s a ceiling joist blocking access to the inside of the rafter / rim board connection.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Just saw the other thread now.