Compressor Help Please

[Vettman]

I have an Ingersol Rand 5 HP. single stage, 60 gallon tank compressor that I bought in 1987. It's seen average use over the years. Lately it seemes to take longer to fill the tank. I timed it from 30 lbs. to 60 lbs. and it took 1 1/2 minutes (seemed long) . Anyway, I pulled the top off and looked at the reeds. They seemed to have lost a little of their "spring". Can someone tell me what I should be looking for here? I cleaned them up and reversed them. It seemed to make them seal better but I'm wondering if the metal reeds are a serviceable part? I called Ingersol Rand svc. they said parts are obsolete through them.
Thanks, Rich

 

[1967marti]

It sounds like your rings are wore/wearing out.
This is a natural thing. Cars do it, piston compressors do it...
You can use thicker oil in the short term. Or pull the pistons, dingle-hone the cylinders to break the glaze and put new rings on.

This is all dependant on nothing else being bad. But I’m betting it’s just your rings.

 

[930dreamer]

What model is the pump?

http://www.compressorpartsstore.com/category-s/56.htm

 

[larry_g]

Have you cleaned or replaced your inlet filter?

lg
no neat sig line

 

[1967marti]

Now that i think about it you might want to hand lap your valves while you are in there. If your valves arnt sealing correctly you may have some pressure-loss during the compression cycle on the pump.

 

[Vettman]

I decided to see how much air pressure I could accumulate. It gets to 80 psi and keeps running without gaining anything. Assuming the rings and bore are in good shape, does that leave the reed valves responsible? I finally found out that only the valve plates are available w/ gaskets for $130.00. The reeds themselves are not available. What would you do? Repair or replace?? I bought this compressor in 1987

 

[930dreamer]

I decided to see how much air pressure I could accumulate. It gets to 80 psi and keeps running without gaining anything. Assuming the rings and bore are in good shape, does that leave the reed valves responsible? I finally found out that only the valve plates are available w/ gaskets for $130.00. The reeds themselves are not available. What would you do? Repair or replace?? I bought this compressor in 1987

I would think most of the parts are available.

 

[Vettman]

I would think most of the parts are available.

I was just wondering if $130.00 for two reed plates was considered an expensive fix? I'd buy a whole new pump, but replacements I've seen were cheaply made (Chinese) Guess I'll have to weigh out a new pump (or entirely new compressor) or hope the new reed plates fix the problem..

 

[1967marti]

If you can i would get a "new" pump...
that way you will have a better preforming pump and parts will be availiable.
By "new" im thinking something 5 years old or less. You can find them on CL all-day long for unter 200 bucks, and most of the time you can get them to toss in a tank for a few bucks more. I'd get a new pump and tank then attach a hose/pipe between your two tanks and have more air storage and a new pump...

I wish there was an easy and cheep fix for your pump but without looking at it in person it sounds like a ring problem. Textbook lack of compression.

 

[TAMPAGT07]

Harbor freight 5HP pump ($149)...That's what I have on my IR....

 

[930dreamer]

If I had the pump model number I could search for parts.

 

[kruzin]

There should be a check valve between the compressor and tank. This is what holds air in the tank not the reed valves. If it is leaking thats what happens. Seen it several times.

 

[Vettman]

If I had the pump model number I could search for parts.

The compressor is an Ingersoll Rand IR5E6VA. I can't locate any numbers on the pump itself. I unscrewed the oil filler cap to see if there's any crank case pressure (or suction) when it's running. There's not. Is this normal? The bores and piston look to be good, as I've changed the crank case oil regularly.

 

[1967marti]

even if your check valve is leaking the pump should still be able to get you up to the 120-150 range. Then if the check valve were leaking it would bleed pressure after the pump has stopped running.
The fact that your pump tops off at 80psi and will run forever means it is not building pressure. AKA it can hold pressure but only untill the 80psi is enough to force it's way out.

Your oil case and by proxy oil breather cap should not have any pressure behind them. Now that being said, the case will see a little pressure and thats why the case has a vented cap, to allow that pressure to escape.
But during operation you should not see any pressure behind the oil vent cap.


I would try a thicker oil and see if you get any pressure rise.
You can dump out the thicker oil and refil with normal compressor oil after the test with no ill effects.

 

[1967marti]

After the compressor gets to 80 psi, if you turn off the pump can you hear any air hissing?

 

[Vettman]

It seems the pump is either a CAC 40-29 or a D22-6239. I guess they were sourced from DeVilsbiss. Everyone's listing the parts on back order, or not available. If I could find a good pump I'd gladly replace it, but I (don't want a Harbor Freight pump, at least not yet). What I'd like to find is a reed and gasket set. If that doesn't solve the problem I'm only out $30-$40.00 dollars.

 

[Vettman]

After the compressor gets to 80 psi, if you turn off the pump can you hear any air hissing?

Nothing, in fact it holds 80 lbs. overnight. It just won't pump beyond 80#, motor just keeps running with no greater increase in air pressure.

 

[waltfraz]

you can get a pump from many on line dealers,where are you located? the problem with your compressor is on the high pressure side if it is 2 stage one small piston and one large piston.One of the better relacement pumps for your unit is a puma pump.what is your motor rpm 1800or 3450 that will determine what pump you can use.back to your problem let me know if it is 2 stage or 1 stage its sounds like valve problem.De villbiss did not make pump the bought thier pumps from 3 diffrent manufactures.

 

[Vettman]

It's a single stage pump 3450 rpm. motor. I live near Sacto. Ca. I took it apart again, reversed and cleaned the reeds, lapped the head, torqued it back down and it pumped to 90# so I'm heading in the right direction! I think a reed and gasket set might quite possibly solve my problem, but then again, it is 25 yrs. old. I don't know if that's old in compressor years? I've painted a few cars with it and done some "weekend warrior" stuff, It's been well cared for but It's cost in 1987 was $469.00 from Pay & Pak. I'd just buy another and may have to, but I hate to see this one die if I can repair it.

 

[Davefr]

What's the model of your compressor? Is it an aluminum pump?

Did you notice if the head bolts were tight when you pulled the head? How was the head gasket?

I have a similar vintage IR compressor and it had the same problems. The first thing that happened was a reed valve broke off.

Apparently IR had a quality problem with the original valve assemblies and I had to order a "new and improved" valve assembly kit.

Years later the unit wouldn't come up to pressure and I found out that it blew a head gasket because the head bolts came loose. IR wanted >$100 for a gasket so I made my own and it's been fine.

Mine is a model T21 (5 HP, 60 gallon) with aluminum pump.

The bottom line is that I'd inspect the valves very closely and then check the gasket and head bolt torque. (There was one part of the gasket on mine that separated cylinders and it wasn't very wide.)

I also suspect that the head bolts get loose over time so I'd make sure they are re-torqued periodically.

I'd never buy another IR compressor.

P.S.
Here's my original thread:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78213

 

[Vettman]

The compressor is an IR5E6VA Ingersoll Rand. I heard the pump may have been Italian? This morning I spoke with someone and they said the pumps were Devilbiss, possibly a CAC40-29 or a D22-629. Mine is an all aluminum pump with 6 allen bolts securing the head. They were very tight when I removed them. The reeds look to be very replaceable, but Ive had one dealer tell me it's sold only as a complete reed plate (s) assy. for around $135.00. That's IF he can find them.

 

[Davefr]

The compressor is an IR5E6VA Ingersoll Rand. I heard the pump may have been Italian? This morning I spoke with someone and they said the pumps were Devilbiss, possibly a CAC40-29 or a D22-629. Mine is an all aluminum pump with 6 allen bolts securing the head. They were very tight when I removed them. The reeds look to be very replaceable, but Ive had one dealer tell me it's sold only as a complete reed plate (s) assy. for around $135.00. That's IF he can find them.

I'd pay the $135 as long as it's complete with the gaskets. Just make sure the cylinder looks good and you keep the head bolts torqued correctly.

 

[Vettman]

I'd pay the $135 as long as it's complete with the gaskets. Just make sure the cylinder looks good and you keep the head bolts torqued correctly.

I'd like to be damn sure that's going to fix it! All things seem to point that way but I'd like to be absolutely positive.

 

[kruzin]

If the check valve is leaking it will draw air back into the pump from the tank and not build pressure.

 

[Vettman]

If the check valve is leaking it will draw air back into the pump from the tank and not build pressure.

Check valve seems to be OK. Doesn't leak down from the tank, just slow to build pressure.

 

[jdperk]

Harbor freight 5HP pump ($149)...That's what I have on my IR....

What motor do you have on your air compressor?

Mine is an IR5E6VA 60 gal tank single stage 5HP 230V/1PH at 3450rpm/15 amps, I purchased it around 1987. The pump will not go past 80lbs and the crankcase is being pressurized so rings must be bad, reeds are second set and still look good. The motor pulley is 6" diameter and the pump pulley is 11". What pump brand did you purchase from harbor freight? What did you have too modify to mount the pump?

My pump mounting holes are 5-5/8" front to back and 7-1/2" left to right looking at the pulley.

 

[Vettman]

Re: Compressor Help Please UPDATE

I found the new and improved valve plate and gaskets from Industrial Air Power. I'm surprised they had the parts as I was told the pump was made in Italy in (1987). Anyway it works like brand new again

 

[axeman807]

I have the exact same compressor and the exact same problem. Was using it tonight and it stops building pressure at exactly eighty pounds. Do you have a part number and price that you paid for the valve plate ???

Thanks.

 

[brucer]

The time you have spent chasing a parts source, and then the prices you have found, you could have already bought a new pump from harbor freight cheaper than you can rebuild your old one...

Some of the Harbor Freight pumps are actually decent pumps, seems like I seen one on display and it was actually an Eaton (probably Eaton via China?).. The compressor pumps are also on sale right now, you can get the 5hp 145psi pump for $185..

http://www.harborfreight.com/145-psi-5-hp-twin-cylinder-air-compressor-pump-67698.html


I had an old craftsman 6.5hp 60 gal. oilless compressor I bought in the 80's get real weak on me last year, would take a long time to get to 100psi... I found a rebuild kit for $120 (new rod bearings, cylinder sleeves and teflon wipers).. The rebuild made the compressor run smoother and quieter than it ever has. At first I was going to buy a new pump and use the existing motor, but I found the rebuild kit to be more economical in my situation.

I got my rebuild kit from some place in Illinois, found it on ebay, then called them and purchased over the phone.

 

[Jtcrep]

I ordered all the parts to rebuild my IR from ecompressedair.com. Great folks, give em a call ask for any discounts. I saved 15% over the internet price. I would replace everything and get another 25 years from it.

 

[pop pop]

Looks to be an ABAC, IMC compressor pump. It is Italian origin.

 

[axeman807]

I was hoping vetteman would reply with some information on the parts he purchased from Industrial Air Power. I have sent them an email requesting information on price and availability. Thanks everyone for the responses.

 

[Vettman]

Here's the info. #32281412 Valve Plate $121.05 + shipping. Note: this is a one piece valve plate that replaces the old design 2 piece plate.
From Industrial Air Power Muskego Wi. phone # 414-1717
Good Luck! Mines running like brand new!

 

[Don_P]

Please see my next post.

 

[Don_P]

I may be the King of Thread Resurrection here but here goes.

IR5E6VA is discontinued as are parts by Ingersol-Rand, However.

You can still get the improved Reed Valve plate for $198.45 from:
store.industrialairpower.com/32281412-valve-plate.html

Better yet, DeVilbiss also used the same Reed valve and keepers in their model ABP-9007003 Pump.

You can buy just the reed Valves and keepers for $4.38 and $2.31 respectively from:
add "3w's." to this: allpartsinc.com/reed-valve-intake-and-exhaust-abp-9007003.html
add "3w's." to this: allpartsinc.com/valve-retainer-clip-2236102973-abp-9008006.html

This was hours and hours of investigations and searches, I hope it helps you. If it does, let us know here. They won't let me post links here so please modify the almost links