Smokeshow69
Well-known member
I mis-stated the rpms…it was correctly stated in the post following mine. But glad to help steer you away from the wrong purchase
Craftsman Drill Press
- Thread starter FrankLee
- Start date
67carl
Well-known member
Thanks, I'll check out your thread. There's currently a 1/2 horse 1725 rpm motor on it but it's not the 115.6963. I like the looks of the original and would like to find one, however I haven't been able to locate one. I checked ebay and did a global Craigslist search and no bueno. I'm not in a hurry so I imagine I'll find one eventually. This is the Atlas that's on there now with the external motor start capacitor. Crappy pic of the spec plate that needs to be cleaned up...67carl, Smokeshow69 is correct. You need a 1725 or 1750 rpm motor. Something less than 1800 rpm. Most of us use 1/2 HP but as little as 1/3 HP will do most of what you most likely want to do. I prefer the 115.6962 motor for its looks, ease of finding one, and replaceable ball bearings. There are several later split phase ½ HP motors that came on later models 150 machines and these have end frame bearings. Its not what I like but they are also fairly common.
I have a Craftsman motor thread that you can check out to see some of the motor differences.
The Vintage Craftsman GP Motor Thread
I was requested to outline some of my comparison information about Vintage Craftsman General Purpose Motors by a fellow GJ member. Most of this information was available on the forum prior to the 2021 forum update but has been lost or difficult to locate ever since. I am not an electrician and...www.garagejournal.com
I hope this helps.
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gp916
New member
Craftsman Model 103 - Belt Help for a newbie.
This is my first foray into vintage machinery so please bear with me. I picked up a model 103.23640 a few weeks ago for $45. Learned a ton taking apart and giving her a good cleaning. Now I want to get a new belt. The manual lists part # X-1460 V-Belt 1/2 x 41. When I searched Fremont for that part # the description says it has an outside length of 43" -- "Aftermarket replacement for Sears Craftsman X-1460 V-Belt. 1/2" wide, 43" outside length. For use on 103-23141 drill press". -- Stumbling around I found this A39 4L410 Jason type A V-Belt. 1/2" wide, 41" outside length, that matches the manual. Just hoping to get some clarification of which I should buy. The belt that is currently on there is also only 3/8" wide, figure that was just the previous owners choice.
Thank you for any and all assistance. I look forward to this new hobby.
This is my first foray into vintage machinery so please bear with me. I picked up a model 103.23640 a few weeks ago for $45. Learned a ton taking apart and giving her a good cleaning. Now I want to get a new belt. The manual lists part # X-1460 V-Belt 1/2 x 41. When I searched Fremont for that part # the description says it has an outside length of 43" -- "Aftermarket replacement for Sears Craftsman X-1460 V-Belt. 1/2" wide, 43" outside length. For use on 103-23141 drill press". -- Stumbling around I found this A39 4L410 Jason type A V-Belt. 1/2" wide, 41" outside length, that matches the manual. Just hoping to get some clarification of which I should buy. The belt that is currently on there is also only 3/8" wide, figure that was just the previous owners choice.
Thank you for any and all assistance. I look forward to this new hobby.
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gp916
New member
67carl
Well-known member
Nice DP - same model as mine! I'm also in Sac. Where did you find that for $45? Great price! I look at Craigslist periodically but haven't seen one in some time. Welcome to GJ. Lot of great info on the King-Seeley drill presses on this site, a lot of it by Frank.
gp916
New member
Fab Forties estate sale in East Sac. The garage was a pile of 50 years of stuff. I actually went to pick up a disc sander and saw it sitting in the corner. Truly lucky find
Hoorn
Well-known member
For those of us who run across the power bronze colored 100/150s and are looking to restore it, here is a part from a 1957 12" Craftsman disc sander (Double A Products) with much of it's original power bronze paint, matched up with my 1958 100 I painted champagne mist. I have found this to be as close as it's going to get.
Hoorn
Well-known member
11b, the closest I have found so far, is Ace hardware machinery grey. It's an "okay" match, but not a great match.
Here it is on the base and end caps of a Craftsman motor I had refurbished.
Here it is again on a lift, and having been sprayed with matte clear coat after. To my eyes There is almost more blue than grey in that Craftsman color and the ace hardware version is the "bluest" grey I have found so far. I have probably experimented with at least 10 other blue or grey spray paints in an effort to match that color and this one was closest.
Here is another color I think is a dead ringer. Montana gold shock dark brown. Besides the paint and paint sprayer itself being the best I have ever used, it comes out with a matte finish so no need to knock down gloss. It is indistinguishable from the dark brown Craftsman used on their 115 motors as a complimentary color to the power bronze. The motor band in this pic is original power bronze, the head frame is champagne mist.
Here it is on the base and end caps of a Craftsman motor I had refurbished.
Here it is again on a lift, and having been sprayed with matte clear coat after. To my eyes There is almost more blue than grey in that Craftsman color and the ace hardware version is the "bluest" grey I have found so far. I have probably experimented with at least 10 other blue or grey spray paints in an effort to match that color and this one was closest.
Here is another color I think is a dead ringer. Montana gold shock dark brown. Besides the paint and paint sprayer itself being the best I have ever used, it comes out with a matte finish so no need to knock down gloss. It is indistinguishable from the dark brown Craftsman used on their 115 motors as a complimentary color to the power bronze. The motor band in this pic is original power bronze, the head frame is champagne mist.
Hello all,
I am looking for a new drill press, and one of these table top craftsmans will be perfect. I had a couple questions before I purchase though.
One, are Frank Lees pictures not showing up for people, or is it just me?
Pictures are of one local to me, looks very clean, except for a light mount and switch that are drilled into the side. List price is $200, which is fine by me for a clean example. I feel I would prefer the 3 handled models instead of this 2 handle though. Does anyone feel 2 handles aren't quite enough for specific drill depths?
Cheers,
I am looking for a new drill press, and one of these table top craftsmans will be perfect. I had a couple questions before I purchase though.
One, are Frank Lees pictures not showing up for people, or is it just me?
Pictures are of one local to me, looks very clean, except for a light mount and switch that are drilled into the side. List price is $200, which is fine by me for a clean example. I feel I would prefer the 3 handled models instead of this 2 handle though. Does anyone feel 2 handles aren't quite enough for specific drill depths?
Cheers,
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Cruzan80
Well-known member
The biggest thing behind the two handles (if it is original), is that they have less depth than the 3-handle versions. The Pinion is swappable, so I would confirm the distance from the center column to the chuck. For me, that seems overpriced. The motor belt isn't flat, meaning the bearings or pullys are seeing some rubbing action. Motor should be lower.
Hoorn
Well-known member
72h, many of the pictures on this thread were lost when GJ went to the new format.
The difference between a "2 handle" and "3 handle" is the 2 is a 13 1/2 Craftsman Model 80, the other being a full sized 15 1/2" Craftsman 100/150. Those measurements are in terms of "swing", which is defined as twice the throat distance (the distance from the center of the spindle to the closest edge of the column or post). ... This means a 13 1/2-inch drill press would be capable of drilling a hole in the center of a 13 1/2-inch disk.
I've seen that drill press you're looking at, I believe it's in the city of Orange. It's not a terrible price with the stand, but I would pass unless you can wrangle it down significantly -like half or close to it. Some very clean 100/150s pop up often in So Cal for $100/150. For $200 I'd want a very clean floor model with an original era correct Craftsman vise or something similar, and no dorky receptacle screwed on the side, original paint, clean motor w pristine engine turned band, etc. Obviously a lift or MSA pulley would command more.
There is always the "but I just want it" factor us men have to deal with also, so make your decision accordingly.
The difference between a "2 handle" and "3 handle" is the 2 is a 13 1/2 Craftsman Model 80, the other being a full sized 15 1/2" Craftsman 100/150. Those measurements are in terms of "swing", which is defined as twice the throat distance (the distance from the center of the spindle to the closest edge of the column or post). ... This means a 13 1/2-inch drill press would be capable of drilling a hole in the center of a 13 1/2-inch disk.
I've seen that drill press you're looking at, I believe it's in the city of Orange. It's not a terrible price with the stand, but I would pass unless you can wrangle it down significantly -like half or close to it. Some very clean 100/150s pop up often in So Cal for $100/150. For $200 I'd want a very clean floor model with an original era correct Craftsman vise or something similar, and no dorky receptacle screwed on the side, original paint, clean motor w pristine engine turned band, etc. Obviously a lift or MSA pulley would command more.
There is always the "but I just want it" factor us men have to deal with also, so make your decision accordingly.
Smokeshow69
Well-known member
I agree with what others have said. $200 is too much for this one given it’s condition. Drill press value/ going rate varies based on geographical location but I would not spend over $100 tops for this one. I paid $100 for a good original paint early 100 model(13.5) without a motor and that was because it was so nice with no arc of shame under all the sawdust. Even that may have been too much but you have to decide if it is worth it to you? This one doesn’t have any rare accessories like a light or 3rd pulley so I would pass
67carl
Well-known member
I can't speak to cost and availability of these in your area, but in mine they rarely come up. The few I've seen relatively recently have been more than what that one is asking. I have the same model listed in the ad and it works well. Heavy, solid machine. If the $200 price works for you then it's a good price and I think you can feel good about it.
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67carl
Well-known member
I would guess, based on the limited visibility of the pics, the owner flipped the pulley up or down to adjust speed but didn't realign the belt so it's in the same horizontal plane. But I could be wrong. Often am!
Edit to add - looking at mine it does appear the motor in the add is mounted a bit high, but I have an Atlas motor which is different than that one... Is the motor height adjustable?
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72highboy, actually that 80 series looks to be complete to me. Depending on what the table looks like under that vice, anything under 200 would be a fair price. I would not pay more than 100 but I pick my purchases carefully. Hoorn says he sees better deals pop up in SoCal so I would roll with his recommendations unless you just have to have it.
I also would recommend a 15.5” 150 series over an 80 series unless that is the size you are restricted to based on space available. A 150 machine will also have a tilting motor mount which I have found to be an absolute must for me. I change speeds often and a tilting mount makes that a breeze.
BTW guys, I built a new thread (yes, another thread) for new owners of these drill presses with information about belts bearings etc… Feel free to chime in.
www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/craftsman-drill-press-information-belts-bearings-chucks-keys-etc-1946-1984.489080/
I also would recommend a 15.5” 150 series over an 80 series unless that is the size you are restricted to based on space available. A 150 machine will also have a tilting motor mount which I have found to be an absolute must for me. I change speeds often and a tilting mount makes that a breeze.
BTW guys, I built a new thread (yes, another thread) for new owners of these drill presses with information about belts bearings etc… Feel free to chime in.
www.garagejournal.com/forum/threads/craftsman-drill-press-information-belts-bearings-chucks-keys-etc-1946-1984.489080/
Thank you all for the feedback. Sounds like I need to sit back and wait till a better price comes along. I like the condition and there is said to be no arc of shame, but can't quite get over the light screwed in the side..
11b, I have been reviewing your threads, and the new one looks like a great consolidation of a lot of this info.
General question, if anyone has a benchtop model, what is the bench height that it's mounted on? I have a really nice 17" wide vidmar style cabinet, that is what I had in mind for the mounting location of my future drill press. That height is right about 38" though, with castors. I feel it may be pushing the working height of the press too high.
11b, I have been reviewing your threads, and the new one looks like a great consolidation of a lot of this info.
General question, if anyone has a benchtop model, what is the bench height that it's mounted on? I have a really nice 17" wide vidmar style cabinet, that is what I had in mind for the mounting location of my future drill press. That height is right about 38" though, with castors. I feel it may be pushing the working height of the press too high.
Hoorn
Well-known member
Did you receive the message I sent you regarding the power bronze Craftsman 150 in good condition for $50?
Outlawmws
Well-known member
72 HB from hr deck to the center of the pinon on a bench 100, is 25" (some variability you CAN move the head on the col....)
My Rockwell floor press is at 56"
38+25 puts you at 63 - How tall are you?
My Rockwell floor press is at 56"
38+25 puts you at 63 - How tall are you?
ViceRoy2030
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 12, 2021
- Messages
- 142
Cleaned up pretty well, all original. Rubbing alcohol and a Brillo pad. February 1954New to me!!! Garage sale find today. (blue tape was his "asking" price) Run's and looks in perfect condition with what I believe to be the original motor). Time for a good cleaning and someday, restoration.
Hoorn
Well-known member
ViseRoy, that came out nice! In particular your feed hub and handles look brand spankin' new.
Prospecter
Well-known member
Epsteins has these.If you want an alternative, look at Martin, part # 0472, this one fits the collars very well.
Of course if you really want to get fancy, you could also find a Williams 472 that has a larger pin that fits in the chuck body (note: it will not fit the collar like the Martin), so that you can hold it stationary while you use the other wrench to loosen the collar:
Outlawmws
Well-known member
That came out very nice Roy!
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72highboy, The light screw hole or other holes from switch boxes etc. are very common. I would not be put off by these holes. I believe all of my classic DPs have additional holes except one. As for height, I believe Outlawmws hit it on the head. I hope the one DP Hoorn messaged you about works out. He has a great eye for these machines.
As for the bench size, one thing to keep in mind is that the motor is projecting off the back of the DP. You really need about a 3’ deep bench, I do not recall the exact measurement but keep in mind that you will want to push the motor away from the dp to set belt tension. This should also prompt you to realize that you will need access to the sides and top of the head to properly operate the dp.
ViceRoy2030, Just Wow! that came out amazing.
Prospecter, thanks for the heads up.
Frank, as always, thank you for sharing the knowledge. I also like the tool you made for removing the drive screws from the data panels. My makeshift holding a small Allen key inside a set of very small vise grips to get into tight areas is more frustration than effective as a tool.
As for the bench size, one thing to keep in mind is that the motor is projecting off the back of the DP. You really need about a 3’ deep bench, I do not recall the exact measurement but keep in mind that you will want to push the motor away from the dp to set belt tension. This should also prompt you to realize that you will need access to the sides and top of the head to properly operate the dp.
ViceRoy2030, Just Wow! that came out amazing.
Prospecter, thanks for the heads up.
Frank, as always, thank you for sharing the knowledge. I also like the tool you made for removing the drive screws from the data panels. My makeshift holding a small Allen key inside a set of very small vise grips to get into tight areas is more frustration than effective as a tool.
I wanted to mention a few things before we eat some Turkey.
First, 72highboy as I previously said, holes in the head are very common. If you plan on repainting, then I have a method that I use from time to time.
PC-7 is a two-part epoxy paste that bods to almost anything. Typically, when working with cast iron most people who can weld will use some sort of gas welding with special rods. I only have a stick welder, so this is not really an option for me. Filling voids with stick welding is difficult and often looks bad (when I do it). I have successfully used PC-7 on many of my projects and there are several pros to using it.
PC-7 is cheap and you can get it from Ace, Amazon, Grainger etc.. in several sizes. You mix the 2-parts equally and apply it to the project. It has a long work time and takes about 24 hours to cure. You can smooth the PC-7 after application with wet fingers.
PC-7 is sandable, paintable, and machinable.
s
This is an end cap neck from a Wilton C-0 vise I repaired with PC-7. There were sever broken off parts around the edge. I applied PC-7 then smoothed it, then after a few hours I tapped the PC-7 with some 100-grit sandpaper to give it a similar (cast iron grain).
Once cured, it was primed and painted with the rest of the vise and you cannot tell the difference and its structurally sound.
I would not suggest this method for something that needed to be very string (like a vice jaw) but for a surface issue like holes in the side of a headstock, this stuff works wonders.
On a completely different note:
Does anyone know if this modification was something offered by Craftsman or (more likely) was this something the owner fabricated as a modification? That increased belt length is insane.
That is one big belt sander.
Anyway, happy thanksgiving everyone.
First, 72highboy as I previously said, holes in the head are very common. If you plan on repainting, then I have a method that I use from time to time.
PC-7 is a two-part epoxy paste that bods to almost anything. Typically, when working with cast iron most people who can weld will use some sort of gas welding with special rods. I only have a stick welder, so this is not really an option for me. Filling voids with stick welding is difficult and often looks bad (when I do it). I have successfully used PC-7 on many of my projects and there are several pros to using it.
PC-7 is cheap and you can get it from Ace, Amazon, Grainger etc.. in several sizes. You mix the 2-parts equally and apply it to the project. It has a long work time and takes about 24 hours to cure. You can smooth the PC-7 after application with wet fingers.
PC-7 is sandable, paintable, and machinable.
This is an end cap neck from a Wilton C-0 vise I repaired with PC-7. There were sever broken off parts around the edge. I applied PC-7 then smoothed it, then after a few hours I tapped the PC-7 with some 100-grit sandpaper to give it a similar (cast iron grain).
Once cured, it was primed and painted with the rest of the vise and you cannot tell the difference and its structurally sound.
I would not suggest this method for something that needed to be very string (like a vice jaw) but for a surface issue like holes in the side of a headstock, this stuff works wonders.
On a completely different note:
Does anyone know if this modification was something offered by Craftsman or (more likely) was this something the owner fabricated as a modification? That increased belt length is insane.
That is one big belt sander.
Anyway, happy thanksgiving everyone.
y'sguy
Well-known member
Damn, that is one big best on that Craftsman. Looks like owner modified. That price is right as well. Altho too far for me to travel or ship to make worth it.
Happy Thanksgiving!
Happy Thanksgiving!
Hi all, got a question I have been in the process of restoring my dp for a while now. I started when the pandemic started and had to put it aside because my wife was in delivery. Haven't had the time until now to start it back up again. My question is back then the site was a little different. I believe Franklee had a post where there was hyperlinks links on how to disassemble etc etc. It would jump to that specific thread. I cannot find it unfortunately can anyone help?
Hoorn
Well-known member
I responded to this ad a few days ago:
The PO accepted my offer of $100 and I drove out. His location was a good hour from my home. We had a fantastic visit, he had antiques all over his 3.5 acres, including rail track and real ore carts on them.
I've been lucky, this is my fourth Atlas head and table lift this year, and each of them have been slightly different as regards shades of blue. This one was colored "rust". By far this one was the hardest to get apart. I had to open the top gearbox and remove the gears. Both collars had to slide up simultaneously with the table. Once off, the top collar came apart easily and cleaned up nicely, the bottom took 3 days of PB blaster and force.
I finally had to get a rubber hammer and start banging on the collar to get some movement. You can see once I rotated it down towards the end, the area where it was stuck. 3 days of PB blaster still did not penetrate that center area where the rust is still dry. It was very tough sledding getting this thing off.
All the lifts had the same "Nice bearing" from Philadelphia. As FrankLee had indicated, for all of you who use your lift primarily just to raise and lower the table and not the head, it is more mechanically sound to mount this on top of the upper cast iron collar where it will support the most load. Then, put the jam nuts on top, but locked to each other and not torqued down onto the bearing.
These are the exact same markings as the lift currently on my Craftsman 100. "W76-1" with the letter "C" below. This marking can also be found on the lower collar.
The PO accepted my offer of $100 and I drove out. His location was a good hour from my home. We had a fantastic visit, he had antiques all over his 3.5 acres, including rail track and real ore carts on them.
I've been lucky, this is my fourth Atlas head and table lift this year, and each of them have been slightly different as regards shades of blue. This one was colored "rust". By far this one was the hardest to get apart. I had to open the top gearbox and remove the gears. Both collars had to slide up simultaneously with the table. Once off, the top collar came apart easily and cleaned up nicely, the bottom took 3 days of PB blaster and force.
I finally had to get a rubber hammer and start banging on the collar to get some movement. You can see once I rotated it down towards the end, the area where it was stuck. 3 days of PB blaster still did not penetrate that center area where the rust is still dry. It was very tough sledding getting this thing off.
All the lifts had the same "Nice bearing" from Philadelphia. As FrankLee had indicated, for all of you who use your lift primarily just to raise and lower the table and not the head, it is more mechanically sound to mount this on top of the upper cast iron collar where it will support the most load. Then, put the jam nuts on top, but locked to each other and not torqued down onto the bearing.
These are the exact same markings as the lift currently on my Craftsman 100. "W76-1" with the letter "C" below. This marking can also be found on the lower collar.
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Outlawmws
Well-known member
Dang you **** hoon!
Y’sguy, yep, I could not find any mention of an OEM extension for the belt disc sander. I really don’t have a need for a runway sized sander but it very cool.
VerkWerx, you are not seeing things. The forum did an upgrade back around May and it killed all of Frank’s hyperlinks. Frank still pops in from time to time and will respond if you send him PMs or emails. Frank spent a lot of time developing this thread and it has been extremely helpful to many people.
Currently you can contact him if you have questions, or you can ask them here in this thread and he or one of us with some experience will try to answer them.
Hoorn, Outlawmws is right. You ****. Nice find brother and it cleaned up nicely.
VerkWerx, you are not seeing things. The forum did an upgrade back around May and it killed all of Frank’s hyperlinks. Frank still pops in from time to time and will respond if you send him PMs or emails. Frank spent a lot of time developing this thread and it has been extremely helpful to many people.
Currently you can contact him if you have questions, or you can ask them here in this thread and he or one of us with some experience will try to answer them.
Hoorn, Outlawmws is right. You ****. Nice find brother and it cleaned up nicely.
Hoorn
Well-known member
Here are some "after" pics. I went with Ace hardware Machinery Grey. After cleaning, gears were in great condition. I packed the thrust bearing with red grease before installing.
DaveT
Well-known member
Wow, YOU ****!
The PO accepted my offer of $100 and I drove out. His location was a good hour from my home. We had a fantastic visit, he had antiques all over his 3.5 acres, including rail track and real ore carts on them.
I've been lucky, this is my fourth Atlas head and table lift this year,
Incredible finds and fantastic job restoring them.
Hi all, thanks for this astonishingly helpful thread. Shame about the missing pictures and broken links - that was quite a loss. I just finished overhauling a 150. Photos attached. I replaced the quill, spindle, and motor bearings, cleaned everything up and reassembled. I'm getting a strange, buzzing vibration when turning the machine on. Interestingly, the vibration occurs even without a belt installed, but it's not coming from the motor, which runs smoothly and quietly. I looked at the replies to post 3090 and suspect there's something wrong with my spindle pulley assembly. The spindle pulley bearing retaining screws are replacements (8-32 x 3/4" socket cap) and their heads hit the head casting before the threaded ends touch anything. Should they be in contact with a bearing outer race? If so, I may not have seated the bearings correctly. I also notice a slight bit of play in the quill when I fully extend it and try to move it from side to side. Can anyone point me to a pulley assembly checklist or re-assembly write-up?
