You're talking about spider gears in the differential? Or on heavy equipment, an axle shaft will have one splined end and one geared end. The spline end meets the spider gears and the (sun) geared end that meets three planetary gears.
Dual 80 Destruction
- Thread starter seth_man
- Start date
You're talking about spider gears in the differential? Or on heavy equipment, an axle shaft will have one splined end and one geared end. The spline end meets the spider gears and the (sun) geared end that meets three planetary gears.
Shipfittin
Well-known member
chickenhauler
Well-known member
GirlnAgarage
Well-known member
The ratchet broke. Fans will get wadded over it. It happens here for any brand.
Next time any other brand tool breaks the very first thing that should be surmised is tool misuse/abuse.
Next time any other brand tool breaks the very first thing that should be surmised is tool misuse/abuse.
ibedayank
Well-known member
OHH SO A 80 TOOTH 1/4 DRIVE RATCHET WILL BE STRONGER THAN A 1 INCH DRIVE 36 TOOTH RATCHET...
I don't think so.....
I broke my Snap On T72 1/4 ratchet taking off coil packs on a ford f250 LOL. It was repaired without question but made me laugh as I have never broken any of my cheap *** Mastercraft 1/4 inch ratchets.
No doubt that the Snap On is an absolute cadillac in terms of size and swing and a joy to use, but sometimes they **** up.
No doubt that the Snap On is an absolute cadillac in terms of size and swing and a joy to use, but sometimes they **** up.
mrholeshot
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Another thread going to **** after page 3, lol
Any ratchet can break. Snap-On is no exception. It's how the warranty gets handled that makes the differance.
Any ratchet can break. Snap-On is no exception. It's how the warranty gets handled that makes the differance.
bigdummy30
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next i guess youre gonna try and tell me a ton of feathers weighs the same as a ton of bricks
Because for some reason people think that the "Snap On" Stamp means the Tool is Unbreakable and when it does happen its Front page News. With that said, I can only remember a handfull of "Broken" Snap on ratchet threads in my time here, Most people just hand it to there dealer and move on. I cant really comment on other brands but i suspect they all have similar Warranty issues, I mean HF would have never changed there warranty policy to include "Proof of Purchase" if they werent having Warranty claims walking thru the door.
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scott37300
Well-known member
This analogy has nothing to do with a ratchet. In the offroad world an axle spline has 100% contact all the way around. In the ratchet world only part of the 80 teeth are in contact with the pawls. All 80(or 72) aren't in contact at one time. Take the cover off of a ratchet and you will see. So more teeth in a ratchet doesn't necessarily make it stronger.
Buckgnarly
Well-known member
The whole splines and axle shaft strength analogy also depends on the diameter of shaft as well as what the shaft is made of.....spline count itself is not an indicator of strength.
ibedayank
Well-known member
next i guess youre gonna try and tell me a ton of feathers weighs the same as a ton of bricks
2000 pounds is 2000 pounds no matter if its bricks lead feathers or wood...
now a ton of GOLD will weigh less as a pound of gold is 12 ounces not 16
Your confusing "Troy pound" versus "pound". A pound of gold is still 16 ounces, just not the measurement used in the market place.
bigdummy30
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3/8 ratchet to 3/8 ratchet ..36 to 72 tooth ,the 72 is stronger all day....and yes not all 72 teeth are engaged at once but there is more surface area contacted overall at one time....and im sure a 3/4 ratchet is stronger than any 1/4 ratchet and 2 tons of bricks weighs more than 1 ton of feathers....
bigdummy30
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the more teeth it has the more surface area that is in contact at one time....i used axles as an example ...i wasnt directly comparing an axle to a ratchet....
This spline count analogy has to refer to a situation where the diameter of the shafts and the type of steel is the same. In this controlled environment the finer spline design would be stronger. Just like a fine threaded bolt is stronger than a coarse thread bolt. (A coarse thread bolt has less threads though so it goes on and off faster so it's a better choice if optimum strength isn't required.)
In the case of the ratchet the teeth only contact the pawl, not the entire circumference of the body so the contact area is far different than a drive shaft or a splined shaft and can't be compared.
I'm not a ratchet expert but the 1" ratchet I had apart recently had only one tooth on the pawl whereas I understand a dual 80 has 7 contact teeth. To compare strength of a 36 tooth ratchet and a dual 80 you would need to compare the length of the pawl and the number of teeth on it. I would think the goal of SO in the design of the dual 80 was to maintain strength and decrease the arc of the handle required to re-grip and advance the fastener.
In the case of the ratchet the teeth only contact the pawl, not the entire circumference of the body so the contact area is far different than a drive shaft or a splined shaft and can't be compared.
I'm not a ratchet expert but the 1" ratchet I had apart recently had only one tooth on the pawl whereas I understand a dual 80 has 7 contact teeth. To compare strength of a 36 tooth ratchet and a dual 80 you would need to compare the length of the pawl and the number of teeth on it. I would think the goal of SO in the design of the dual 80 was to maintain strength and decrease the arc of the handle required to re-grip and advance the fastener.
Moose-LandTran
Well-known member
The spline analogy makes me want to tear my eyeballs out. 
It broke at the damn joint!
It broke at the damn joint!
Expansion is expansion, the inside of a nut expands just as the outside does. If the nut swelled up like a wet noodle then the inside would get smaller but this isn't the case. The entire nut expands everywhere and none of it shrinks in size.
Many mechanical things are heat shrunk into place for an interference fit during operating temperatures. Valve guides and cylinder liners come to mind. Heat the head or the block and freeze the guide or liner then quickly press them into place (try and get them out later).
The important thing is to heat the nut fast so you don't end up heating the stud or bolt too. I agree the heating process does break up the bond from rust or corrosion as well but the expansion from heat is the key ingredient.
Moose-LandTran
Well-known member
wrong drive for the job, I would've stuck a 1/2 impact on there and just took the sucker off. I don't know what you're thinking trying to remove a 19mm control arm bolt with a 3/8 ratchet.... I wouldn't even use a 3/8 ratchet for a caliper bracket
William Payne
Well-known member
I wonder the same thing, I often wonder that for how many snap-on failure threads there are how many other brand failures are there that you don't hear about. I think brand expectation has alot to do with it, some brands have a more accepted failure rate then others.
Lt CHEG
Well-known member
I think some of it is due to the popularity of Snap On Tools. In this area there are probably twice as many Snap On guys as there are Matco guys and 4 or 5 times more Snap On guys than there are MAC guys. I'm told by a friend that works in the industry that there is 1 Cornwell guy in the area as well. Snap On seems to be the biggest dog in the industry right now so the sheer volume of Snap On customers means that there will be more of their tools out there. Assuming that Snap On and Matco for example have the same percentage of their tools break, then if Snap On sells more tools then they will have more tools break even though on a percentage basis Snap On tools don't fail at a rate any higher than Matco. I also think that some people don't like Snap On for whatever reason, or for their purposes lower cost tools are more appropriate so they love to show a broken Snap On tool (or for that matter any truck brand) as evidence that even the high quality truck brands fail. I don't think there is anything more to it than that.
redwrench60
Well-known member
When you're on top, everybody wants to push you down. It's just more proof that openly or secretly, nearly everybody thinks Snap On is the best. In my experience they are, others may disagree. I'm assuming most of us use tools professionally.We fix broke for a living, are we really surprised a man made device broke?
Wakefield
Well-known member
Do the tool companies think that they need to make stuff as small and slender as possible to fit tight spaces such as the tiny cramped quarters on today's cars with their crammed to the gills spaces?
Perhaps the ratchet mechanisms have become stronger than the flex joints on the handles. The hinge handle might be intended more for access to tight areas where a ratchet head won't fit than for strength. (When the handle is part of a breaker bar not a ratchet)
I think the tool companies should make some breaker bars for strength rather than being slender and compact for people needing strength where access is not a problem. Perhaps a choice of two 1/2" drive bars from companies such as Snap On. Or else they want people to buy more 3/4" stuff? Otherwise is a long handle ratchet almost as strong as a breaker bar of the same drive size?
Perhaps the ratchet mechanisms have become stronger than the flex joints on the handles. The hinge handle might be intended more for access to tight areas where a ratchet head won't fit than for strength. (When the handle is part of a breaker bar not a ratchet)
I think the tool companies should make some breaker bars for strength rather than being slender and compact for people needing strength where access is not a problem. Perhaps a choice of two 1/2" drive bars from companies such as Snap On. Or else they want people to buy more 3/4" stuff? Otherwise is a long handle ratchet almost as strong as a breaker bar of the same drive size?
GoBlue
Well-known member
Guys i think this was honestly a defective tool. Snap on ratchets are very strong. I use a flex head long handled Craftsman RP 3/8 for caliber brackets and heavy duty stuff all the time and its never failed. I KNOW snap on ratchets are stronger than RPs. I once in a fit of rage but a 5 foot bar on a snappy 3/8 and jumped on it and the ratchet still didnt break. One bad apple...everyone makes a lemon from time to time.
HF fanboy that I am, I will readily admit that SO is the best or is, at the very least, among the very best.
I do not, however, believe that they are worth anywhere near half the price of retail. Not with all the decent quality alternatives that are available these days.
At any rate, that broken ratchet in the OP may have been defective. Combine that with what appears to be the result of excessive force and you end up with a broken tool. That's what warranties are for.
Thanks I actually learned something by reason this thread besides any tools can break.
05CarbonDRZ
Well-known member
HF fanboy that I am, I will readily admit that SO is the best or is, at the very least, among the very best.
I do not, however, believe that they are worth anywhere near half the price of retail. Not with all the decent quality alternatives that are available these days.
At any rate, that broken ratchet in the OP may have been defective. Combine that with what appears to be the result of excessive force and you end up with a broken tool. That's what warranties are for.
That's why you by gently used snap-on tools from here,About the same price as new Crapsman junk.
CaseyJoes.
Well-known member
Why would anybody post up a thread every time they broke a HF tool? The entire forum would be full of nothing but that if everybody (who owns HF and actually uses them) did that. Not to mention, 90% of the people on here would just see the thread title and just scroll past (oh wow a HF tool broke? you dont say!)
RobertMo1988
Well-known member
ive never been in a harbor freight
WRX/Z28
Well-known member
I know! Check out all the chinese dude's making them here: (sarcasm laid on heavy)
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?deskto...e.com/watch?v=N_GUDMVWVss&v=N_GUDMVWVss&gl=US
Amazing the stupidity that occupies the internet... LOL
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LawnDart79
Well-known member
Now wait, I've never in my life heard of a Harbor Freight tool breaking. Everything there is built to standards so high that it can be handed down to your grandchildren.
WRX/Z28
Well-known member
Now wait, I've never in my life heard of a Harbor Freight tool breaking. Everything there is built to standards so high that it can be handed down to your grandchildren.
Ahhh... I see sarcasm works well for you too... lol
HF ratchets will likely be useful as scrap metal when your children get them...